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Thread: New Rules to Cool Property Market

  1. #211
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    Yup...so gahmen push out a figure...saying they can supply this large number of units (and I'm sure they can do it), and the market stabilises because of all these other measures....gahmen rolls these out in stages to test mkt again...if response not good, then they can always postpone release of other units, thereby controlling pricing...




    Quote Originally Posted by devilplate
    remember...all these supply controls by the govt....if the current BTO falls short of 70% allotment, will govt so silly to push out more and more BTO????

    govt can always adjust their supply.....but the problem with housing is: it takes 3yrs to build....there is always a imperfection in timing and also info(no live trading data unlike stocks)

    so if we tok about the REAL huge supply of resale flats....it will be 3yrs construction+5yrs MOP=8yrs time

  2. #212
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    These measures will cause the mass market private properties and MM units to go up even more I think, while having a negative impact on mid to high end private properties.

    - More price sensitive HDB owners thinking of upgrading will now go for mass market and MM units, now than middle end units are priced out of their reach by the higher cash component required and lower LTV loan given.

    - Private property owners aiming for HDB as investment properties now have to increase their budgets a bit and go for mass market/MM Units.

    - The seller's stamp duty is a form of capital gains tax and this will whack the middle and high end units hard.

  3. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by OLY99
    agree. these measures will make HDB scarce and the price & COV will not drop
    u forgot to use the word 'resale HDB', kena shoot by others .

  4. #214
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    My friend who owns no property just asked me a question: He plans to marry his fiancee soon and she co-owns a private property with her brother left behind by her late parent. With the new rule, Must she sells her private property within 6 months once they buy a resale HDB to start a family?

    My friend told me his fiancee can't sell as her brother family is currently living in it.

    So how to start a family?

  5. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by flxcat
    With the new ruling, pte owner wanted to buy HDB definitely got killed.
    Just wonder, the high COV for HDB is it really due to this group of pte buyers? Or is it PR in need of a house urgently r willing to pay high COV to secure their house?
    MBT mentioned 10% of transaction are Pte buying resale HDB, half hold & half resell, so 5% is pte speculating it. The other 90% is made up of?

  6. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by TOP
    My friend who owns no property just asked me a question: He plans to marry his fiancee soon and she co-owns a private property with her brother left behind by her late parent. With the new rule, Must she sells her private property within 6 months once they buy a resale HDB to start a family?

    My friend told me his fiancee can't sell as her brother family is currently living in it.

    So how to start a family?
    wah...big headache....tats the problem with co-own....

    bo pian liao..buy mass market pte

  7. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by TOP
    My friend who owns no property just asked me a question: He plans to marry his fiancee soon and she co-owns a private property with her brother left behind by her late parent. With the new rule, Must she sells her private property within 6 months once they buy a resale HDB to start a family?

    My friend told me his fiancee can't sell as her brother family is currently living in it.

    So how to start a family?
    one option is to ask brother pay her half the mkt value & withdraw her name.

  8. #218
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    Quote Originally Posted by maisonjai
    one option is to ask brother pay her half the mkt value & withdraw her name.
    nid to pay in cash leh....how to....unless her bro cash rich....cannot owe somemore if she use CPF as part of the financing

    persuade her bro to sell and both family buy HDB!!!

  9. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by TOP
    Are you sure about this, where is your source?
    From HDB website. http://www.hdb.gov.sg/fi10/fi10326p....s?OpenDocument

    Even if their parents live apart and have their own homes, they will need to fork out the 10% cash and 20% from CPF as the property for their children will be considered a second property under their name. Check-mate by the govt.

  10. #220
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    Quote Originally Posted by teddybear
    Difficult to find fire-sales in future! But remember, Govt says they want sustainable property market appreciation, not to crash the property prices. That means they believe without these new measures they are afraid property prices will shoot up too fast and become unsustainable! Those still waiting to buy can kiss goodbye to their search for fire-sale, but one consolidation - the price rise will be slower for now (but for a more sustainable period => have to wait long long liao)!
    Quote Originally Posted by devilplate
    BUT i remain my main point: impossible to time market oredi and much harder to grab free fall durians in next GSS(probably only hope for developer's GSS sale)
    The sentiments expressed by the two property veterans above can be best summarised by the blue curve below.


  11. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by TOP
    My friend who owns no property just asked me a question: He plans to marry his fiancee soon and she co-owns a private property with her brother left behind by her late parent. With the new rule, Must she sells her private property within 6 months once they buy a resale HDB to start a family?

    My friend told me his fiancee can't sell as her brother family is currently living in it.

    So how to start a family?
    Yes, if she is an occupier of the new flat according to the new HDB rules.
    It is stated that the "Proposed occupiers must not have an interest in any private property. Proposed occupiers can however be ex-owners of private property (including HUDC Phase 1 and 2 flats and pre-war flats)."

    Not if "ex-owners" mean that they have to dispose of the pte ppty or transfer the name to someone else.

  12. #222
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    Good one. Unfortunately, none of the "experts" will read it that way. They will just analyse on the surface & conclude without much thought that HDB will collapse and mass market will collapse. They did not realise the rules is intended to wipe out the investors and speculators. And these are the most dominant in condos with high tenancy rate which is usually mid to high end. Most mass market condos are for self-stay. Go to those condos with a lot of foreigners. These are the "investor" condos that will be hit as lower LTV means the investment becomes less lucrative. Not forgetting interest rate can increase any time in the future. So why tie up your monies on something that may have limited upside when u do not intend to stay there? If you have $500-$600k to spare, bond market will be infinitely more lucrative than SG properties. Those small (2 bedders and below) condos around the $1.5m range dominated by tenants will be the most hit, e.g. Newton/Novena and River Valley.


    Quote Originally Posted by laidback
    These measures will cause the mass market private properties and MM units to go up even more I think, while having a negative impact on mid to high end private properties.

    - More price sensitive HDB owners thinking of upgrading will now go for mass market and MM units, now than middle end units are priced out of their reach by the higher cash component required and lower LTV loan given.

    - Private property owners aiming for HDB as investment properties now have to increase their budgets a bit and go for mass market/MM Units.

    - The seller's stamp duty is a form of capital gains tax and this will whack the middle and high end units hard.

  13. #223
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    on 1 hand they tighten, on the other hand they aim to import at least 100k foreign workers (assuming the number is even accurate, almost all mid to low end workers), so how will hdb and mass mkt prices really move? lol

    as long as this foreign worker tap is not turned off, the measures will only have momentary impact.. and after awhile back to square one again hehehe

  14. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by jlrx
    The sentiments expressed by the two property veterans above can be best summarised by the blue curve below.

    According to this graph, the price will hit 100,000psf real soon...

  15. #225
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    very chim...so going up or down?

  16. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by laidback
    These measures will cause the mass market private properties and MM units to go up even more I think, while having a negative impact on mid to high end private properties.

    - More price sensitive HDB owners thinking of upgrading will now go for mass market and MM units, now than middle end units are priced out of their reach by the higher cash component required and lower LTV loan given.

    - Private property owners aiming for HDB as investment properties now have to increase their budgets a bit and go for mass market/MM Units.

    - The seller's stamp duty is a form of capital gains tax and this will whack the middle and high end units hard.
    Huh? Isn't this opposite to the intent of the measures released by the government? I mean the measures are to help make HDB more affordable (of course not to collapse the price but to make its increase more gradual) and for stay and not for speculation.

    Why would government want to make high end properties more affordable since these are coveted by the rich investors anyway whom the gahmen is trying to attract to Singapore?

    Caveat: I am a non investor of property, just have a place for my own stay...

  17. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by mantrix
    +1 - whole purpose of new measures is to allow singaporeans to own a home at reasonable prices. Idiots who take away those homes for speculation have to suffer now...
    yes yes! And MBT should do something with ppl staying at pte pty and renting out the HDB to foreigners for the next step!

  18. #228
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    can anyone help me with these questions:

    Can i check if these changes only apply from 30th aug (yesterday) or can be backdated?
    Ie. if i currently own 2 properties - one HDB bought in 2007, one condo bought in 2009, the MOP that applies is 3 yrs, not 5 yrs right?

    Also with regards to the change that pte property owners cannot own HDB, they must sell their existing pte property - this also does not apply if we have bought our properties few yrs back, am i right?

    thanks in advance!

  19. #229
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    Quote Originally Posted by fclim
    Yes, if she is an occupier of the new flat according to the new HDB rules.
    It is stated that the "Proposed occupiers must not have an interest in any private property. Proposed occupiers can however be ex-owners of private property (including HUDC Phase 1 and 2 flats and pre-war flats)."

    Not if "ex-owners" mean that they have to dispose of the pte ppty or transfer the name to someone else.
    how can she be an "occupier" of the new HDB flat when you need husband and wife to be co-owners to buy a HDB?

    also, looking at the website, how many of you update your children as occupiers of the flat when they are born???

  20. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by maisonjai
    u forgot to use the word 'resale HDB', kena shoot by others .
    ya lor......wounded!!! haha

  21. #231
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    Quote Originally Posted by TOP
    My friend who owns no property just asked me a question: He plans to marry his fiancee soon and she co-owns a private property with her brother left behind by her late parent. With the new rule, Must she sells her private property within 6 months once they buy a resale HDB to start a family?

    My friend told me his fiancee can't sell as her brother family is currently living in it.

    So how to start a family?
    See the MP session may help.

  22. #232
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    I tink HDB do an auto inclusion upon registration of the BC

    Quote Originally Posted by cl0ver
    how can she be an "occupier" of the new HDB flat when you need husband and wife to be co-owners to buy a HDB?

    also, looking at the website, how many of you update your children as occupiers of the flat when they are born???

  23. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by devilplate
    nid to pay in cash leh....how to....unless her bro cash rich....cannot owe somemore if she use CPF as part of the financing

    persuade her bro to sell and both family buy HDB!!!
    don't play play, sekali that current condo value worth a lot, might be enough for both bro & sis to pay 80% for 1st ppty & 70% of 2nd for each of them. 1 condo split into 4. Lagi Huat!!

  24. #234
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    CDL counter has dropped another 40cents today for now. Lowest was $11.04.

  25. #235
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    I believe the measures will not have much impact after initial 1-2 months of look-see-look-see. Why?

    1. Too much liquidity around
    2. Many old timer investers still suffers from Lehman debacle, so will stick to property
    3. Low interest rate environment to last for a while
    4. Developers will reconfigure offering to ensure similar cash quantum to move MM units
    5. Foreigners are still arriving in droves.
    6. Developers will cherry-pick the sites released by URA and price upwards accordingly. No one wanna be stupid to reduce price first. See case of no bidders for Jurong West EC site. If government want to reduce price, land sale must be sequentially taken up, next site only available after earlier ones are sold.

  26. #236
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    Good for long-term investment for private properties, bad for those who want to buy HDB flats to invest because of higher yield (because Govt don't want people to treat HDB flats as investment and drive up the price).
    Outcomes:
    1) HDB prices stagnant.
    2) Investors cannot invest in HDB flats, so have to turn to private if they still want to invest in properties.
    3) Reduce private properties flipping through the 3yrs reducing sellers' stamp duty. The slower and longer the property prices rise, more investors (especially foreign investors) will have more confident to invest in Singapore properties (no quick boom & even quicker burst) (in other words, more investors get sucked in as they see sustainable price rises).
    Short-term transaction volumes drop, long term property prices rise more sustainable and can even climb much higher for high-end properties (sorry, not mass market because they are already quite high and most Singaporeans can't afford that type of price >$1200 psf anyway and Govt scare sub-prime like US). Already, we are hearing complaints of the cash downpayment rising from 5% to 10%. For high-end properties, how much is that to the buyers?

    Quote Originally Posted by repanse71
    I believe the measures will not have much impact after initial 1-2 months of look-see-look-see. Why?

    1. Too much liquidity around
    2. Many old timer investers still suffers from Lehman debacle, so will stick to property
    3. Low interest rate environment to last for a while
    4. Developers will reconfigure offering to ensure similar cash quantum to move MM units
    5. Foreigners are still arriving in droves.
    6. Developers will cherry-pick the sites released by URA and price upwards accordingly. No one wanna be stupid to reduce price first. See case of no bidders for Jurong West EC site. If government want to reduce price, land sale must be sequentially taken up, next site only available after earlier ones are sold.

  27. #237
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    Quote Originally Posted by maisonjai
    MBT mentioned 10% of transaction are Pte buying resale HDB, half hold & half resell, so 5% is pte speculating it. The other 90% is made up of?
    Hmm..... Maybe really the 10% of pte owners really chases the Cov up up up. Even Good that now things are going back to the norm for the 90% of resale HDB buyers hee....cheers

  28. #238
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    There are many ways to skin a cat. but you guys are carried away. those rich in high end condos say the measures will benefit them, and those that are rich in hdb and MM units are saying that the measures will benefit them instead.

    what can the government do to really scare you into not speculating? Do they really have to send in firing squads?

  29. #239
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    Hi guys,

    What happens if a person has a home loan and just signed the OTP for another private property last week before 30th August. Will the bank loan 80% or 70%? Thanks!

  30. #240
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    Quote Originally Posted by novel
    yes yes! And MBT should do something with ppl staying at pte pty and renting out the HDB to foreigners for the next step!
    xiao ar..than where those so called" foreign talent" from low end countries stay? ask them to buy resale hdb or private condo?? i dont think it is possible unless work for few years...and some just go for renting eg foreign students...garmen want to import foreign talents so housing is one issue unless you want garmen to push all resale HDB price now too...

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