Lagoon View's 1st attempt to en bloc

[tkc2263]

Lagoon View's virgin attempt to en bloc is strewn with many obstacles as reported in Today ...

In summary, each resident needs to fork out $35,000 to privatise the estate, in other words to buy back the land within their estate from the Ministry of Finance which includes car parks and the common areas.

Lagoon View sits on 535,326 sq ft housing a total of 480 units.

The road to a succesful en bloc for LV looks very daunting which includes these:

1) By 29/5/10, 80% of residents will have to place a downpayment of $5.5k

2) Then at least 84% of residents will have to pay the full amount of the levy within 4 months after signing a S&P agreement, one reported the levy can be paid by using their CPF.

Looks like Laguna Park has a much easier route to a successful en bloc than compared to LV. Apparently Neptune Court has the same "problem" as LV, the need to clear the privatisation hurdle 1st...

[jlrx]

That's why people who've got en bloc windfalls have lots of work to do.

Not only must invest money, must worry this and that, overcome hurdles, it's not so simple.

Unlike some people who don't need to put in money but can still participate in "en bloc" by hoping that other peoples' en blocs fail.

They can "short" the entire property market without putting in a single cent.

Yet the happiness they get if the property market crashes is of the same intensity as the happiness of those who had invested real money if the market rises.

Life is not fair.

[chanys]

So your advice is not to buy property with the aim of having en-bloc?

That's why people who've got en bloc windfalls have lots of work to do.

Not only must invest money, must worry this and that, overcome hurdles, it's not so simple.

Unlike some people who don't need to put in money but can still participate in "en bloc" by hoping that other peoples' en blocs fail.

They can "short" the entire property market without putting in a single cent.

Yet the happiness they get if the property market crashes is of the same intensity as the happiness of those who had invested real money if the market rises.

Life is not fair.

[urban]

Why are all the units paid the same amount? Seems like the high floor units are paid the same as low floor.. and that the facing is also not factored...
Does this mean that for enbloc, it is better to buy low floors, since the exit price is the same?


Strata Titles Board approves collective sale of Dragon Mansion
By Georgina Joseph | Posted: 10 May 2010 1906 hrs



Photos 1 of 1



SINGAPORE : The Strata Titles Board (STB) has approved the collective sale of Dragon Mansion to RL Developments, a wholly-owned unit of Roxy-Pacific Holdings.

This makes Dragon Mansion the first collective sale site to have successfully obtained STB's Sale Order under the stricter legislation governing collective sale that came into force in October 2007.

At a sale price of S$100.8 million, Dragon Mansion is also the only collective sale site which has achieved a sale price of above S$100 million since the onslaught of the global economic crisis.

Dragon Mansion, in the Spottiswoode Park area, comprises 72 units of 3-bedroom apartments.

Owners of each 1,399 square foot unit will receive S$1.4 million in sale proceeds.

The freehold site has a land area of nearly 42,000 square feet and is designated for residential use with a plot ratio of 2.8.

The new development could potentially yield a maximum gross floor area of approximately 117,000 square feet, which translates to an estimated 120 units of 1,000 square foot apartments.

- CNA/al

[jlrx]

So your advice is not to buy property with the aim of having en-bloc?

My advice is that it requires more risk and effort to participate in the en-bloc market by purchasing an en-bloc property, than by sitting back and just hoping that other peoples' en-blocs fail.

[AAA]

Why are all the units paid the same amount? Seems like the high floor units are paid the same as low floor.. and that the facing is also not factored...
Does this mean that for enbloc, it is better to buy low floors, since the exit price is the same?
_____________________________________________________________

The reason is that in a collective sale you are selling your share in the common development (land area times plot ratio). You are not just selling your unit, that is a normal sale of 1 unit.

[Douk]

Seems that marine parade will be quite happening in 2nd half.

[urban]

The reason is that in a collective sale you are selling your share in the common development (land area times plot ratio). You are not just selling your unit, that is a normal sale of 1 unit.

Those PH units with nice view may just end up the same enbloc value as the #02 units.

In that case, it makes more sense to review the strata title units when buying the enbloc property since the end result is the same, without having to pay for the 'view' and the 'higher floor' status. Maybe easier to rent out and can rent at higher costs.'

[jlrx]

Those PH units with nice view may just end up the same enbloc value as the #02 units.

In that case, it makes more sense to review the strata title units when buying the enbloc property since the end result is the same, without having to pay for the 'view' and the 'higher floor' status. Maybe easier to rent out and can rent at higher costs.'

En blocs are selling the land value rather than the buildings, because the buildings are usually already run down (especially the older ones).

The higher floor units with view would have benefited from higher rentals during their lifetime since TOP, but when reaching the en bloc stage, the developer is essentially only interested in the land.

Hence the en bloc value (for residential land) is usually shared according to an equal weightage of share value and unit floor area.

Commercial properties are more complicated.

[Property_Owner]

En blocs are selling the land value rather than the buildings, because the buildings are usually already run down (especially the older ones).

The higher floor units with view would have benefited from higher rentals during their lifetime since TOP, but when reaching the en bloc stage, the developer is essentially only interested in the land.

Hence the en bloc value (for residential land) is usually shared according to an equal weightage of share value and unit floor area.

Commercial properties are more complicated.

Pal, you seems to be interested in commercial recently...

[jlrx]

Pal, you seems to be interested in commercial recently...

Not just recently ...

Experts will call this "risk diversification" but actually I just buy this buy that sometimes also don't know what I'm buying.

[devilplate]

Hence the en bloc value (for residential land) is usually shared according to an equal weightage of share value and unit floor area.

Commercial properties are more complicated.

tats the reason why residential cum retail ppty is always harder to enbloc.

distribution of collective sales proceeds often attracts conflicts and disputes...for eg...penthse/ground flr with big patio having much bigger in strata flr area but not true in terms of number of share values...

[Komo]

En blocs are selling the land value rather than the buildings, because the buildings are usually already run down (especially the older ones).

The higher floor units with view would have benefited from higher rentals during their lifetime since TOP, but when reaching the en bloc stage, the developer is essentially only interested in the land.

Hence the en bloc value (for residential land) is usually shared according to an equal weightage of share value and unit floor area.

Commercial properties are more complicated.

I suppose land with high buildings will actually have much lower en-bloc potential since the cost of tearing down will be much higher?

[smallant]

wow.. Tis one will add on to Laguna Park pressure... Already 1st time enbloc not successful.. chaim.

[ongmk168]

wow.. Tis one will add on to Laguna Park pressure... Already 1st time enbloc not successful.. chaim.

Think Lagoon View is still long way to go for the enbloc.....not even privatise... And not easy forn the rest like Neptune or mandarin garden too.

Laguna at least now attemping 2nd enbloc... Sales committee form and Looking for Lawyer and sales agent now...

[smallant]

Yes.. tat wat I heard too.... But.. Capitaland already given them the kiss of death... Not sure what the chances are ??

[jlrx]

wow.. Tis one will add on to Laguna Park pressure... Already 1st time enbloc not successful.. chaim.

Yes.. tat wat I heard too.... But.. Capitaland already given them the kiss of death... Not sure what the chances are ??

From your posts, I know you have a unit at Laguna Park.

Dont' worry.

One thing good about en bloc properties is that they are almost guaranteed not to lose money.

Best case make lots of money, worst case break even. Where else in the world is there such a good investment?

Read this:

Business Times Dec 12, 2008

LAGUNA Park condominium along Marine Parade Road could be up for collective sale. Each owner stands to pocket between $1.8 million and $2.1 million. It works out to about $633 per square foot of gross floor area.

At $633 psf ppr, the bigger unit (1,615 sq ft last transacted on 13 Apr 2010 at $1.5 million) should get $2.1 million while the smaller unit (1,453 sq ft last transacted on 11 Feb 2010 at $1.18 million) should get $1.8 million.

What is the worst case scenario?

Laguna Park is worth the same as Boon Lay ($499 psf ppr)!

Straits Times May 6, 2010

Keppel Land wins Boon Lay bid

HIGHEST bidder Keppel Land (Mayfair) has won the tender to build homes on a plot of land next to Lakeside MRT station, the Urban Redevelopment Authority (URA) announced on Thursday.
According to the URA, Keppel Land submitted the highest bid of $303 million ($499 per sq ft per plot ratio) during the March to May tender period.

(499/603) x $2.1 million = $1.74 million for the 1,615 sq ft (still better than $1.5 million).

(499/603) x $1.8 million = $1.49 million for the 1,453 sq ft (still better than $1.18 million).

So even in the worst case scenario, Laguna Park sells at the same price as Boon Lay, they are still worth more than their last transacted price!

But in the first place is Laguna Park = Boon Lay?

[sleek]

Wah.. so what should be the developer bid then?

From your posts, I know you have a unit at Laguna Park.

Dont' worry.

One thing good about en bloc properties is that they are almost guaranteed not to lose money.

Best case make lots of money, worst case break even. Where else in the world is there such a good investment?

Read this:

Business Times Dec 12, 2008

LAGUNA Park condominium along Marine Parade Road could be up for collective sale. Each owner stands to pocket between $1.8 million and $2.1 million. It works out to about $633 per square foot of gross floor area.

At $633 psf ppr, the bigger unit (1,615 sq ft last transacted on 13 Apr 2010 at $1.5 million) should get $2.1 million while the smaller unit (1,453 sq ft last transacted on 11 Feb 2010 at $1.18 million) should get $1.8 million.

What is the worst case scenario?

Laguna Park is worth the same as Boon Lay ($499 psf ppr)!

Straits Times May 6, 2010

Keppel Land wins Boon Lay bid

HIGHEST bidder Keppel Land (Mayfair) has won the tender to build homes on a plot of land next to Lakeside MRT station, the Urban Redevelopment Authority (URA) announced on Thursday.
According to the URA, Keppel Land submitted the highest bid of $303 million ($499 per sq ft per plot ratio) during the March to May tender period.

(499/603) x $2.1 million = $1.74 million for the 1,615 sq ft (still better than $1.5 million).

(499/603) x $1.8 million = $1.49 million for the 1,453 sq ft (still better than $1.18 million).

So even in the worst case scenario, Laguna Park sells at the same price as Boon Lay, they are still worth more than their last transacted price!

But in the first place is Laguna Park = Boon Lay?

[jlrx]

Wah.. so what should be the developer bid then?

Another good thing about en bloc is that it doesn't matter what the developers bid, or whether developers want to bid at all.

Because property prices always go up in the long term, each wave of en bloc (usually spaced about a decade apart), brings property prices to an even higher level.

My very first en bloc failed because last time needed 100% consensus, but when it was finally en blocked many years later after the rule was reduced to 80% consensus, it was sold at three times the former offer price!

PROPERTISM Rule No. 1 - Property prices always go up in the long term hence properties should only be bought and not sold, unless enblocked then either:
a. Quickly buy a replacement property, or
b. If you have the cash, buy one even before the en bloc goes through.

Because just in case Laguna Park's en bloc succeeds, you must ask where are their 528 households going to stay?

Wong Kan Seng already said cannot sleep on East Coast beach.

[smallant]

Tis is bad timing.. Everytime .. Laguana going for enbloc.. the mkt melts.. Last yr was USA finanical crisis.. Tis yr is Europe.. Sigh...

[jlrx]

Tis is bad timing.. Everytime .. Laguana going for enbloc.. the mkt melts.. Last yr was USA finanical crisis.. Tis yr is Europe.. Sigh...

Don't be too sad.

There is always something happening every year (just Google "crisis" followed by the year).

2010 - Greece Euro Crisis
2008/9 - Lehman Crisis
2006/7 - USA Subprime Crisis
2004/5 - Energy Crisis
2003 - SARS Crisis
2001/2 - September 11 Crisis
2000 - Dot Com Crisis
1999 - Argentina Crisis
1998 - Russia Crisis
1996/97 - Asia Financial Crisis
1995 - Japan Crisis
1994 - Mexico Crisis
1992/93 - European Currency Crisis
1991 - India Crisis
1990 - Gulf War Crisis
1989 - Japan Crisis
1988 - Norway Banking Crisis
1987 - Black Monday Crisis
1986 - California Crisis (the Movie)



1985 - Singapore Crisis (Property prices plunged by up to 40%)

http://forums.condosingapore.com/sho...postcount=1529

PROPERTISM Rule No. 1 - Property prices always go up in the long term hence properties should only be bought and not sold.

[rooster]

lagoon view is already privatised. NC will go next.

[tkc2263]

lagoon view is already privatised. NC will go next.

Strangely the Straits Times reported yesterday, Braddell Heights is the only HUDC that is yet to privatised. The reporter must have got its facts wrong, Neptune Court hasnt even gotten onto the privatisation route yet.

From what I understand over at Neptune Court, the appointment of a law firm earlier this year is to "renegotiate" with the SLA regarding the privatisation costs which currently based on the last "agreed" price was close to S$50k per unit on the average, although it was reported yesterday the residents from the 3 estates' privatisation costs is capped at $30k. From what I understand, LV's residents need to pay close to S$25k (correct me if I am wrong) to privatise their estate.

Just a thought here.....maybe someday some super duper very deep pocket developers (China, Middle East, perhaps India) will snap up and combine Lagoon View and Laguna Park, and maybe Mandarin Gardens and Neptune Court to build 2 super duper mega out-of-the-world developments.

[smallant]

the site alone is already tough to handle.... To combine will be like mother of all enblocs.. no upside !

[jlrx]

the site alone is already tough to handle.... To combine will be like mother of all enblocs.. no upside !

Then you have not met this guy yet ...