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Thread: Any one been to Property Investment Seminars?

  1. #1
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    Default Any one been to Property Investment Seminars?

    Hi all,

    wondering if anyone here actually attended a property investment seminar, ie. paid couple of thousands to attend?

    For those who attending, do u find it useful or profitable?

    Thanks.

  2. #2
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    Whatever they "teach" you - you could find out online by googling yourself or reading property forums.

    You ever see Bill Gates giving lectures on how to become an entrepreneur or Warren Buffet give lecture about investing?

    Why not? Those who can do. Those who can't teach.

    Advice will probably be as valuable as you get from options trading and Forex classes. One thing guaranteed is that the course giver will get paid.

  3. #3
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    Still not enough here?

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    Quote Originally Posted by tuckster
    Hi all,

    wondering if anyone here actually attended a property investment seminar, ie. paid couple of thousands to attend?

    For those who attending, do u find it useful or profitable?

    Thanks.
    Definitely very useful and profitable.

    After attending these seminars, you will learn about:

    1. English idioms such as "There is a fool born every minute".

    2. Luxurious properties in Singapore such as "Sentosa Cove".

    3. Fashion accessories such as "Hermes Birkin handbags".

    The Straits Times

    March 17, 2009

    Trading 'expert' ordered to refund fees

    A GROUP of 49 people scored a legal victory over a self-styled expert on option trading who turned out to have a dodgy doctorate from an unaccredited American university.
    A dozen of the course participants said they had paid Mr Clemen Chiang between $3,600 and $4,000 last year for a three-day course on option trading - a complex and risky investing technique which often amounts to betting on share-price trends.
    Several had also forked out another $960 for training software and a handful paid $1,600 to $12,000 more for online tutorials referred to as 'webinars'.
    Mr Chiang, a 34-year-old Nanyang Technological University engineering graduate, has been running these seminars for a few years at his Freely Business School in North Bridge Road.
    He would tell students his own success story of how he made millions, and he drew hundreds of participants.
    He claimed to have a PhD in option trading, a rarity in the finance industry here.
    But when it came to light last year that his doctorate was from the unaccredited Preston University in Alabama, the group of 49 wanted their money back.
    Yesterday, the Small Claims Tribunal found that Mr Chiang had misrepresented his qualifications. It awarded all participants a refund of close to 80 per cent of their fees for the seminar and a full refund for the cost of the software and 'webinars'.
    Mr Chiang, who still calls himself 'Dr', attended the hearing but did not speak to The Straits Times.
    The Small Claims Tribunal is part of the Subordinate Courts and can hear claims involving the sale of goods or services not exceeding $10,000.
    Outside the tribunal, several participants said they felt cheated when they read a Straits Times expose on degree mills last August. The report named Mr Chiang as having a PhD from an unaccredited university.
    Sales representative Terence Tan, 41, said: 'I signed up because of his PhD. Option trading is a complicated thing. I thought this guy should know what he is talking about since he had a PhD in it.
    'So imagine my shock when I found out that his degree was not from a recognised university.'
    Like some others, he felt the course fell short of providing a good understanding of option trading.
    Engineer William Hui, who paid $8,000 for himself and his wife to attend Mr Chiang's course, said: 'He should have called it 'Millionaire mindset', because for a whole day, it was just about how much money he made, his Sentosa Cove bungalow
    and his wife's Hermes Birkin handbag costing over $10,000.
    'When he finally went into his so-called method of trading in options, I found it lacking. And then he tried to sell his software for another $960.'
    Mr Chiang still claims to have a PhD on several of his websites, but makes no mention of Preston University, which American education authorities have called a 'degree supplier' offering 'fraudulent or substandard degrees'.
    Last August, he told The Straits Times that he was also pursuing another PhD at the University of South Australia.
    When asked then why he had opted for a degree from an unaccredited institution, he said he wanted to complete a PhD in double-quick time.
    Because Preston University was listed as a partner of a private school registered with the Education Ministry here, he said he thought it was an accredited institution.
    It was only later that he realised that Preston was not accredited in the United States, he said.
    Like other business people who had bought fake degrees, Mr Chiang said then that it helped to pave the way in business.
    Checks last year found more than 200 people - including prominent businessmen and financial consultants - flaunting degrees, MBAs and doctorates from degree mills and unaccredited, substandard institutions.

  5. #5
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    The best way to be successful in property investment is in part knowing how to do your sums. I've came across bankers, auditors, taxation officers who can't count if their lives depended on it.

    Also, be diligent in your excel workings and cover all grounds and scenarios where possible.

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    Hi tuckster,

    I've attended such a program before and thus, would tend to be bias about the benefits of such program. So, please read with a pinch of salt...

    I am a newbie property investor and in fact, after attending the seminar, I decided not to invest in the initial property I had targetted, because I re-did my sums and re-evaluted the location of my initial 'target' and decided it is not worth it. Since I am not keen anymore, I can share that the condo I was looking at is The Ansley, D11, "near" Novena MRT.

    Unlike other types of investment, property investment seemed like quite a mystery art, compared to stock investment, because there are tons of books on stock investment insights, for instance, Fundamental investing (e.g. Value / Growth) and Analytical investing (e.g. 50-Day Moving Average / Momentum / CandleSLIM)...

    By insights, I mean, who / what / when / where / how is the money being made in property investment? Due to my ignorance, there seems to be no good books for the insights to property investment... if the other gurus would like to share any good books, please enlighten me!

    During the seminar I attended, I learnt from other classmates, that they had learnt some of the lessons, the hard way, paying for their mistakes. For some of them, the money paid or the opportunity costs, is way above the seminar fees and they felt that they should have attended the seminar before their first property purchase!

    Of course this site has lotsa of information and definitely covers the insights and infact, it has too much information and in bits & pieces! Maybe some gurus can piece up all the info into a co-herent strategy / game plan / insight?

    Also hor, having more info is also a problem, I need to know, which is really good info vs which are just nonsense from unqualified investor!

    There is no free lunch in this world and I believe it is safe to say, nobody would share publicly, the exact condo that they are intending to buy, in this forum... right?

    In conclusion, I still think that the seminar I attended is worth the money because I now have a game plan and know exactly the 'target' that I should be working on.

    have fun,
    fc

    disclaimer: Not all seminars is worth the money! Go to the previews with eyes wide open and check up on the trainer, before committing any money!

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    3. Fashion accessories such as "Hermes Birkin handbags".

    The Straits Times

    March 17, 2009

    Trading 'expert' ordered to refund fees


    and his wife's Hermes Birkin handbag costing over $10,000.
    quote]




    the most expensive Hermes i have seen recently in NY ..limited .. only 1 piece .. ostrict skin ... not on display somemore ... selling between
    25-32k USD ... they still havent decided on the selling price ..but already gotten alot of enquiries

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    Quote Originally Posted by proud owner
    the most expensive Hermes i have seen recently in NY ..limited .. only 1 piece .. ostrict skin ... not on display somemore ... selling between
    25-32k USD ... they still havent decided on the selling price ..but already gotten alot of enquiries
    That's more expensive than a plot of seafront land 450 sqm (4,844 sf) in Brazil!



    Land seafront in a paradise of Brazil.

    Luxury Development land seafront, best beach of Brazil, Ceará. Flexeiras Beach.

    * Price: 34,650 BRL (~ $ 16,759 USD)

    Those who think that Sentosa Cove is too expensive and its sea view is not good enough, should buy a seafront plot in a third world country.

    Alternatively, it may be more prestigious to buy a Hermes.

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    just ask yourself, if it's really that good, why should they share the information with you...

    they can make a big pile for themselves.

    i've once attended a short options talk, paid $25 for it. picked up some ideas, tried it out at home and came to the conclusion that the guy is plain bullshit. say until covered call is a real easy win, ha. just take a couple of down periods follow by a spike up, and you'll realise a big loss on the capital and earn pittance from the income on the selling of the covered calls.

  10. #10
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    It reminds me of the guy who keeps bragging that he is top 1% in NUS and dropped out of primary 3 and owns an educational company, professing to be a self-made millionaire in his twenties (when he has the backing of a rich dad). Heard from some parents and students his motivational talks are crap and does little to help a lot of students

    Quote Originally Posted by kane
    just ask yourself, if it's really that good, why should they share the information with you...

    they can make a big pile for themselves.

    i've once attended a short options talk, paid $25 for it. picked up some ideas, tried it out at home and came to the conclusion that the guy is plain bullshit. say until covered call is a real easy win, ha. just take a couple of down periods follow by a spike up, and you'll realise a big loss on the capital and earn pittance from the income on the selling of the covered calls.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by kane
    just ask yourself, if it's really that good, why should they share the information with you...

    they can make a big pile for themselves.
    They always have a ready answer for that.

    It's because "They have a heart of gold, and want to spread their gospel so that everyone can be rich, just like them".

    Hmmm ... sounds like someone in this forum here who keeps preaching his "Propertism" religion ... except that this guy doesn't charge for his gospel.

  12. #12
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    i'm of the opinion that, in property investment, learning from others' mistakes is definitely better than learning from one's own mistake...

    then, next question is, which experts would share, without holding back & for free, the mistakes they make and the properties that they are going to invest in? quite slim chance, unless if they are family / relatives...

    since i do not have any family / relatives who are successful property investors to guide me, i decided to look for my own sifu... since I wan to learn from the sifu, then i have to pay lor...

    my opinion is that not all trainers are con-man lar.... and hor, the value of teachings is not so easily quantifiable and that is probably why a lot of con-men can get away quite easily....

    so, if you are keen to attend any seminar / training, you can go to a few of those free previews before deciding... i have attended 3 previews, before choosing the one that I paid for....

    there are always 2-side to the coins... from the trainer's view, its a business afterall! if there is no money to be made, why bother to share the knowledge!?

    from the trainee's view, if i can benefit more than the money that i paid for, why not?! so, its is the perceived / real benefits of the training that is key! make sure you are able to realised the returns on investment, before parting with your hard-earned money!

    have fun!
    fc
    Last edited by limfc; 17-12-09 at 08:25.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Regulators
    It reminds me of the guy who keeps bragging that he is top 1% in NUS and dropped out of primary 3 and owns an educational company, professing to be a self-made millionaire in his twenties (when he has the backing of a rich dad). Heard from some parents and students his motivational talks are crap and does little to help a lot of students
    Yep, the same fella came to my mind too

  14. #14
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    I always take a look of the profile of the trainers. These are some cases I came across

    case 1 : the trainer has a monthly income of $1,500, and build a $18m worth of properties within five years,
    case 2 : the trainer has $10,000 saving and built multi-million worth of properties within few years
    case 3 : fipped properties and made $20m in 2007.

    the questions
    1. can these claims be verified? fact?
    2. how did they get the financing?

    case 3 : possible if u have the capital and read the timing correctly.
    And if they can make so much money within such a short time, why should they conduct preview and preview to collect trainees ? and not many sign up also

    What to learn from the seminars is mainly to master how to time the property market. Picking properties / locations are relatively easier than timing the market.

    As such, timing is not just reading the property market alone, there are many many indicators, include the currency, fund flow, other countries property markets, govt policies, interest, population, economy etc.

    In short, a lot to read and learn

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    for case 2, 10k cash not even enuf to buy a hdb these days coz covs are already 20k to 50k. Even to pay the initial down for a pte pty is also not enuf. Unless he rolls the 10k in the stock mkt b4 pumping principal plus profit in the pty mkt, i dnt see how one can turn 10k savings into a multimil pty portfolio. That guy is probably a bull talker
    Quote Originally Posted by Laguna
    I always take a look of the profile of the trainers. These are some cases I came across

    case 1 : the trainer has a monthly income of $1,500, and build a $18m worth of properties within five years,
    case 2 : the trainer has $10,000 saving and built multi-million worth of properties within few years
    case 3 : fipped properties and made $20m in 2007.

    the questions
    1. can these claims be verified? fact?
    2. how did they get the financing?

    case 3 : possible if u have the capital and read the timing correctly.
    And if they can make so much money within such a short time, why should they conduct preview and preview to collect trainees ? and not many sign up also

    What to learn from the seminars is mainly to master how to time the property market. Picking properties / locations are relatively easier than timing the market.

    As such, timing is not just reading the property market alone, there are many many indicators, include the currency, fund flow, other countries property markets, govt policies, interest, population, economy etc.

    In short, a lot to read and learn

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    What do you guys think about Andy Ong from ERC then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by focus
    What do you guys think about Andy Ong from ERC then?
    Yes, he is my case 2, had a preview yesterday, did not sign up

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    Quote Originally Posted by Laguna
    Yes, he is my case 2, had a preview yesterday, did not sign up
    Oh,I thought he's very credible.. with the likes of Douglas Foo and Ang Kong Hua partnering him..

    He recently acquired a $48 million bugis commercial building with his partners (i believed it's them).

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    Douglas Foo, the owner of Apex Pal comes from a rich family.

    To the rich, making a million from their millions is always easy. To the poor, making their first 100k then their first million is an incredibibly hard climb. I am speaking from experience.


    Quote Originally Posted by focus
    Oh,I thought he's very credible.. with the likes of Douglas Foo and Ang Kong Hua partnering him..

    He recently acquired a $48 million bugis commercial building with his partners (i believed it's them).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Regulators
    Douglas Foo, the owner of Apex Pal comes from a rich family.
    Is he by any chance related to Dennis Foo? They kinda look alike ..

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    not too sure about that, but not difficult to find out from google.

    Quote Originally Posted by cheerful
    Is he by any chance related to Dennis Foo? They kinda look alike ..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Laguna
    case 2 : the trainer has $10,000 saving and built multi-million worth of properties within few years
    Oh you were there also? Did you leave before the Q&A?
    I think one of the question then was about the 10k, how to be possible.

    If I remember correctly, the answer is something like he used the 10k to start a business, made some profits and started investing with more than the 10k lar... and it was a pooled investment, i.e. he only came up with a fraction of the 20% deposit...

    have fun!
    fc

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    that is common sense. so many of my relatives with no education have also thought about pooling money to buy properties before. from my previous threads, if you gungho enough, can even own two hdb properties, use it to roll and own a third property (a condo). my formula can retire with less than 1 mil net worth and i dont think property seminars will have the balls to teach that....


    Quote Originally Posted by limfc
    Oh you were there also? Did you leave before the Q&A?
    I think one of the question then was about the 10k, how to be possible.

    If I remember correctly, the answer is something like he used the 10k to start a business, made some profits and started investing with more than the 10k lar... and it was a pooled investment, i.e. he only came up with a fraction of the 20% deposit...

    have fun!
    fc

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    Quote Originally Posted by Regulators
    To the rich, making a million from their millions is always easy. To the poor, making their first 100k then their first million is an incredibibly hard climb. I am speaking from experience.
    stop blowing your own trumpet lah.

    blow me instead.

    bitch.

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    Haha ... some of you actually believe in these things ...





  26. #26
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    i would blow you if you are chewing gum, but again, you are just a hole filled with shit so too bad, i would give it a miss.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Anus
    stop blowing your own trumpet lah.

    blow me instead.

    bitch.

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    hee... you guys are a bunch of humorous folks... really like the photos... hee

    jlrx and regulators masters, i've followed some of your posts and also agreed with some of your opinions... like property is meant to be bot & not sold and that the non-prime areas are really over-priced (e.g. [email protected] selling for 870psf).

    so hor, would you guys be keen to compile your wu-gong-mi-ji and share it here for free? i suggest a title like, Sun Tzu Art of War for Singapore Property Investment... once you have it ready, I can help to publish it as e-Book and share to everyone...

    Once we do that, all these con-man will be out of business... hee....
    how does the proposal sound to you guys?

    have fun,
    fc

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by limfc
    i'm of the opinion that, in property investment, learning from others' mistakes is definitely better than learning from one's own mistake...

    then, next question is, which experts would share, without holding back & for free, the mistakes they make and the properties that they are going to invest in? quite slim chance, unless if they are family / relatives...

    since i do not have any family / relatives who are successful property investors to guide me, i decided to look for my own sifu... since I wan to learn from the sifu, then i have to pay lor...

    my opinion is that not all trainers are con-man lar.... and hor, the value of teachings is not so easily quantifiable and that is probably why a lot of con-men can get away quite easily....

    so, if you are keen to attend any seminar / training, you can go to a few of those free previews before deciding... i have attended 3 previews, before choosing the one that I paid for....

    there are always 2-side to the coins... from the trainer's view, its a business afterall! if there is no money to be made, why bother to share the knowledge!?

    from the trainee's view, if i can benefit more than the money that i paid for, why not?! so, its is the perceived / real benefits of the training that is key! make sure you are able to realised the returns on investment, before parting with your hard-earned money!

    have fun!
    fc
    no need to attend course, there are plenty of books available. and the knowledge they impart are just as valuable, and it's cheaper too.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by kane
    no need to attend course, there are plenty of books available. and the knowledge they impart are just as valuable, and it's cheaper too.
    dear kane,
    please share a few titles that is relevant in the local context? thanks very much for your sharing...
    fc

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    i don't find any local titles strategic enough, most sell motherhood and apple pie. in fact, you get a lot more wisdom in this forum if you read through some of the postings.

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