Buy A HDB Flat?

[andy]

everyone has a different method. for me i wouldn't go that far as to give lock stock and barrel. after JC/army, my kid will have use of any of the family's properties either shared or himself till he wants to get his own place - but it will never be transferred in his name. the extent i will go is to part-fund his first marital home. If the in-laws are of equal status, then possible each spouse will each get 50% as a matrimonial gift. nothing beyond that tho.

May I ask what do you intend to do with the rest of your wealth?

[august]

May I ask what do you intend to do with the rest of your wealth?

buy lumbo, fa-lah-li or por-shay ...

[xebay11]

Actually what is the lesson you hope to teach by staying in HDB?

[august]

Actually what is the lesson you hope to teach by staying in HDB?

empathy?
something those in ivory tower have lost completely

[andy]

buy lumbo, fa-lah-li or por-shay ...

You mean the paper-made ones used for burning

We are talking about weath after the weathly passed on.....

[Regulators]

Condo and pte estate people can also be crap in their own way, it is not the place that makes the person, it is in the person himself or upbringing. I went from rags to making my first mil years after graduation and have lived in hdb estate for most part as a kid. no doubt that you get all kinds of trash hanging around in hdb estates, but that does not make up the majority of hdb dwellers. those neighbours i had were simply heavenly and the kind of community bonding and neighbourliness is something pte estate people are lacking. People in pte estates compare bo liao things like cars and luxury items which i find extremely bo liao. People the likes of you who have lived in a pte estate most part of ur life are the ones who create that social divide. I never despise or look down on hdb living as my past experiences in hdb flats have nurtured me to have respect for people from all walks of life. Safety concern?.....not really ...my kakis and I are still alive, kicking and doing well today even though we had all lived in hdb once.

i read with interest that some of the bros here would rather - given a choice - bring up a family in a HDB than private. this is an interesting dynamic for me as i was never brought up in one, and my personal experience stems from my first marital property which was sold after 3 years. i've also stayed at senggang for a couple of weeks while transitioning renovations. here are my observations, and i am using straits times terminology so as not to be seditious.

there exists a very apparent social divide. at the upper flrs of the carpark you find beemers, mbs, porsches and maseratis; while the lower floors carry the cherries and kias of which a good many are weekend plates. a good many of these had tanned owners. every quarter there would always be an instance in the upper decks - cashcard/laptop/hp

every couple of months there will be at least one instance of theft/breakins at flats - some reported and ST, most are not

in the late wkend evenings, the compound is chock full of miscreants playing loud music, and playgrounds are littered w syringes. again, mostly the tanner variety.

in the afternoons, unites colors of ahbengs and ahlians at the void deck playing truant, some drinking and most smoking.

in the 2 weeks at senggang, a wrx had his mod parts stripped, and there were 2 fights at the nearby kopitiam



the above were strong reasons i gave up on hdb - it's no longer safe for kids today imho.

[new2mondrian]

Actually u guys are a pretty funny bunch, and we completely veered off topic (mea culpa i know)... from HDB to bringing up kids to cars (modification or otherwise). But since this thread is under "Miscellaneous" anyway, I guess no harm in me veering off topic yah?

I agree that there is a widening income gap. This is a common issue faced by all nations, and the process of wealth accumulation will only exacerbate such divide in time to come. The widening income gap will of course lead to other evils such as the haves vs have-nots and inequality of opportunities. I also agree that HDB dwelling is not without its issue of greater contact with the lower income strata.

BUT despite this, I feel that HDB dwelling has a lot to offer. Firstly, my child grows up with children of the middle income strata, and sees them as his peers. Hence it makes it easier to instil a sense of thrift in the formative years, and more importantly, that it sends a clear message to the child that his parents are not rich, and therefore there is no crutch available to him IF he doesn't strive to make a success of himself (not that private/landed housing cannot achieve this, but to ME it is easier to do so while staying in public housing). I do respect wealth that is passed from generation from generation. It is the right of every parent, particularly in the Asian context, to pass down wealth to the next generation. But from a historical perspective, passing down of wealth without the right mindset and the right set of values can sometimes do more harm than good.

There is no right or wrong when it comes to parenting, and what all parents can do is to simply try their best. To be honest, we are never fully sure if what we do is always correct, but we try like all other parents. We want to raise a grounded, well-adjusted child with a sense of social responsibility and compassion (hence we thought that HDB dwelling is a good way to start). But this is a tall order which more often than not, we aren't sure if we are doing the right thing at all. One thing for sure is that we don't want our child to suffer a crutch syndrome, to believe that if he doesn't study hard, his parents' wealth can sustain his intended lifestyle; if he cannot tolerate his work or rack up tonnes of credit card debts, mom and dad will be there to bail him out. Not that landed/private housing cannot achieve this; but during the early formative years, it is slightly easier to teach thrift by setting an example ourselves. Other equally important stuffs such as maximising the value of each dollar is not easily understood to a young child, and can come later.

One example as how I see it is this. When my 3-year-old asked for a red aeroplane (when he already has a blue one), I could tell him that mom and dad does not have a lot of money, so why don't we see if we can turn the blue plane red by making the blue plane a jacket (get some mahjong paper and red paint, and make a red jacket together)... If he wants more trains, we would collect empty toilet rolls and bottle caps, and make some trains instead of buying more. This is an exercise in creativity, and he understands that money is hard to come by in our household; and will not insist that we cater to his every want.

I totally agree that how each child turns out is more often than not the values which are instilled in his/her formative years, and the company which he/she mixes with. And there are ample examples across the entire social strata, of cases where a child eventually goes astray; and more often than not it is a lack of parental involvement rather than the class of housing which the child stays in. Hence, despite the lengthy post, it is again each to his own on how best to bring up a child, or to invest one's monies, or to do what one wishes to do in life.

[Reporter]

Actually u guys are a pretty funny bunch, and we completely veered off topic (mea culpa i know)... from HDB to bringing up kids to cars (modification or otherwise). But since this thread is under "Miscellaneous" anyway, I guess no harm in me veering off topic yah?

..........
..........

I totally agree that how each child turns out is more often than not the values which are instilled in his/her formative years, and the company which he/she mixes with. And there are ample examples across the entire social strata, of cases where a child eventually goes astray; and more often than not it is a lack of parental involvement rather than the class of housing which the child stays in. Hence, despite the lengthy post, it is again each to his own on how best to bring up a child, or to invest one's monies, or to do what one wishes to do in life.

One thing good about having a child mixing and living with those 80% who stay in public housing is that if he/she ever become a leader, he/she will be able to understand the majority he/she is leading and formulate practical policies to improve their life.

Can you imagine a civil servant who have never taken public transport formulating public transport policy? Can these policies be practical?

Can you imagine an Air Force commander who is not a pilot leading his men to fight an air war? Does he know what is a dogfight?

Can you .............

[jlrx]

One thing good about having a child mixing and living with those 80% who stay in public housing is that if he/she ever become a leader, he/she will be able to understand the majority he/she is leading and formulate practical policies to improve their life.

Can you imagine a civil servant who have never taken public transport formulating public transport policy? Can these policies be practical?

Can you imagine an Air Force commander who is not a pilot leading his men to fight an air war? Does he know what is a dogfight?

Can you .............

Can you imagine ...

[kellogs]

Mee Siam by default does not come with any hum ... LOL

No doubt living in HDB might be able to nurture the child character but in a public housing areas, the chances for mixing the bad companies is much higher ...

I guess the point is, it does not matter where a person stay ... it is the upbringing that shapes the young kid.

[xebay11]

True in a way, all have their points but sometimes wealth also makes a child more confident, that he is able to achieve much more than others, too much underdog upbringing may lead to a child who may become an underdog and feel that he is unable to succeed.

Anyway, I believe in nature 70% and nurture 30% that makes up the psychology of people, so no matter what we try to put the child through (nurture) may not be able to change his character which is governed by (nature) So let's all not be so serious LOL! I always like to think talent skips a generation, so my child should be quite OK.

[xebay11]

Condo and pte estate people can also be crap in their own way, it is not the place that makes the person, it is in the person himself or upbringing. I went from rags to making my first mil years after graduation and have lived in hdb estate for most part as a kid. no doubt that you get all kinds of trash hanging around in hdb estates, but that does not make up the majority of hdb dwellers. those neighbours i had were simply heavenly and the kind of community bonding and neighbourliness is something pte estate people are lacking. People in pte estates compare bo liao things like cars and luxury items which i find extremely bo liao. People the likes of you who have lived in a pte estate most part of ur life are the ones who create that social divide. I never despise or look down on hdb living as my past experiences in hdb flats have nurtured me to have respect for people from all walks of life. Safety concern?.....not really ...my kakis and I are still alive, kicking and doing well today even though we had all lived in hdb once.

Lighten up bro, going by statistics, it is much harder for someone with a humble background to succeed, as the environment is not so conducive, for example if you live in a neighbourhood where all your neighbours and are doctors and top professionals and your parents had the means to give you all the support to become a top professional, it is more likely you would become a top professional, not because you are hungry and strive to achieve but it comes as only the most natural thing to do. I know this for a fact because I come from an elite school with peers whose fathers include judges, lawyers, doctors, bankers etc etc and whose grandparents have donated the very buildings named after them and which we study in. BTW I am one of those who fell between the cracks and posting in condo forum....LOL but compared to most others in the general population, I think (hope) I am at least better off. Of course I must admit there are many, many in these forums whose backgrounds are more humble but even much more successful than me Hee hee.

[gfoo]

I went from rags to making my first mil years after graduation and have lived in hdb estate for most part as a kid....... those neighbours i had were simply heavenly and the kind of community bonding and neighbourliness is something pte estate people are lacking.

Yes yes, you remind us again how successful you are being an overachiever and all. it is rather impressive no less.

but the hdb estates of our generation - they were tighter, open-door policy amongst neighbours, kids play together & study together - things were much safer and close-knit then. Is that necessarily true today?

[Regulators]

how close-knit a community is depends on how open you are to accept differences. i know some people who are racist so they will steer clear of people from certain races so it sometimes matters not how good the neighbour is. there are also some people are introverts by nature or who are too overly protective of their kids, resulting in closed-door policies. every corner of singapore is made up of hdb blocks and i can't say that every hdb flat is suitable to bring up a kid, neither can i say that every block is not conducive, very much depends on individual characters, which is the same as in a pte estate. Some hdb estates i agree has a higher likelihood of witnessing crime, but some estates like Dover Close East, Cantonment, East Coast and many others provide peaceful living which is not necessarily inferior to pte estate dwellers. If singapore decides to privatise all hdb flats one day, will you be singing the same tune bout people living in pte estates?

Yes yes, you remind us again how successful you are being an overachiever and all. it is rather impressive no less.

but the hdb estates of our generation - they were tighter, open-door policy amongst neighbours, kids play together & study together - things were much safer and close-knit then. Is that necessarily true today?

[august]

did anyone see the news? HDBs nowadays increasingly dominated by foreigners/PRs who don't integrate with the locals.

we have a new set of social problems, all thanks to mr mai hum's foreign-not-talent policy

[xebay11]

did anyone see the news? HDBs nowadays increasingly dominated by foreigners/PRs who don't integrate with the locals.

we have a new set of social problems, all thanks to mr mai hum's foreign-not-talent policy

That means locals are moving up?

[focus]

I thought it's the school that you go to that will determine your character as the friends around you influence you..

For primary school, I am ok with neighbourhood one ..
but after that, it is better to go to brand name ones to mix around with future leaders and rich men's sons... when they are younger, social status not so important..and who knows.. the network you have in secondary and tertiary maybe will allow you to be help by your friends when they start working in their papa's company..

[xebay11]

I thought it's the school that you go to that will determine your character as the friends around you influence you..

For primary school, I am ok with neighbourhood one ..
but after that, it is better to go to brand name ones to mix around with future leaders and rich men's sons... when they are younger, social status not so important..and who knows.. the network you have in secondary and tertiary maybe will allow you to be help by your friends when they start working in their papa's company..

You have to start as young as possible, there is no ties stronger than helping your primary school buddy, especially if the school has a primary school, I never felt that those who joined us in Secondary school as pure.

[Reporter]

.......... I never felt that those who joined us in Secondary school as pure.

Maybe I am luckier. My secondary school didn't teach us discrimination at a young age.

[Douk]

Maybe I am luckier. My secondary school didn't teach us discrimination at a young age.

[tkc]

You have to start as young as possible, there is no ties stronger than helping your primary school buddy, especially if the school has a primary school, I never felt that those who joined us in Secondary school as pure.

I was reading with much interest on this topic until I stumbled upon this particular posting.

First and foremost, not all students who come from elite schools bear similar thoughts as you. I came from the most elite school in Sg, but I was taught NEVER to discriminate since young. Doesn't matter if you sit next to me during science lessons and swim at one another's pool after school, or we have lunch at a hawker centre after soccer. I was thought to respect CHARACTER, not the 'branded' schools, not the depth of the pockets, not the cars you drive, and most definitely, not the primary school you came from etc. Maybe my parents are a bit different, though I hope not the exception. With your 'elite' upbringing, your myopic view is a bit disturbing. Ties from primary schools? I would have severed ties with you as my school mate. Your judgment of a person's character is based upon the primary school one attends? Pure? No offence, but I feel very much ashamed, coming from an elite school, to know that elite school graduates harbour such thoughts. Maybe I am different, but I hope not the exception.

[xebay11]

I was reading with much interest on this topic until I stumbled upon this particular posting.

First and foremost, not all students who come from elite schools bear similar thoughts as you. I came from the most elite school in Sg, but I was taught NEVER to discriminate since young. Doesn't matter if you sit next to me during science lessons and swim at one another's pool after school, or we have lunch at a hawker centre after soccer. I was thought to respect CHARACTER, not the 'branded' schools, not the depth of the pockets, not the cars you drive, and most definitely, not the primary school you came from etc. Maybe my parents are a bit different, though I hope not the exception. With your 'elite' upbringing, your myopic view is a bit disturbing. Ties from primary schools? I would have severed ties with you as my school mate. Your judgment of a person's character is based upon the primary school one attends? Pure? No offence, but I feel very much ashamed, coming from an elite school, to know that elite school graduates harbour such thoughts. Maybe I am different, but I hope not the exception.

Listen to my clarification, by the time we reached upper primary most of the stutdents formed cliques, not because they wanted to, but because of their social activities, and where they lived, imagine trying to fit in a group who all lived in Queen Astrid park or met at Holland Village every day to do their shoppingt? They also met at SICC to bowl, play tennis or swim. So by the time they reached secondary level strong cliques already formed, not because they were snobs, they were all very nice, in fact the richer one was, the simpler they were, and till today I follow this mantra, I always got to Orchard Road in Berms, because when I was way young, most of my friends I knew who lived in D9, roamed in Orchard Road in the most casual attire. ie. what most of us would wear at home.

Anyway, I was just sharing my observations so please don't lable me as myopic. BTW I was one of the poorer ones, as I did not live in Queen Astrid Aprk, Whitehouse Road, or Watten Estate Heck I did not even live in D9, 10 or 11. I lived in Woodlands albeit landed property.

[xebay11]

Double post

[august]

I was reading with much interest on this topic until I stumbled upon this particular posting.

First and foremost, not all students who come from elite schools bear similar thoughts as you. I came from the most elite school in Sg, but I was taught NEVER to discriminate since young. Doesn't matter if you sit next to me during science lessons and swim at one another's pool after school, or we have lunch at a hawker centre after soccer. I was thought to respect CHARACTER, not the 'branded' schools, not the depth of the pockets, not the cars you drive, and most definitely, not the primary school you came from etc. Maybe my parents are a bit different, though I hope not the exception. With your 'elite' upbringing, your myopic view is a bit disturbing. Ties from primary schools? I would have severed ties with you as my school mate. Your judgment of a person's character is based upon the primary school one attends? Pure? No offence, but I feel very much ashamed, coming from an elite school, to know that elite school graduates harbour such thoughts. Maybe I am different, but I hope not the exception.

most elite school in sg? A** or R* ??

[gfoo]

I came from the most elite school in Sg, but I was taught NEVER to discriminate since young.

lol your this one sentence depicts a typical RI boy. you guys consider yourselves elite in what? grades?

[Regulators]

elite in name what is the use? How many inventors, nobel laurettes and scientists with cures for diseases cme frm RI Alumni?

lol your this one sentence depicts a typical RI boy. you guys consider yourselves elite in what? grades?

[orange]

he was definitely rafflesian. ac boys ARE discriminating

[gfoo]

elite in name what is the use? How many inventors, nobel laurettes and scientists with cures for diseases cme frm RI Alumni?

dun pray pray, the RI alumni came out with wonderful inventions like COE, ERP- even a michelin 4 star dish: Vongole Vermicelli du Siam ala Chino-Pomodoro (or Mee Siam ai Hum)

[proud owner]

he was definitely rafflesian. ac boys ARE discriminating

oh well ..

the rafflesia is the Biggest flower in the world (though only found in jungle) ..

what more can we say about the human rafflesians ?

they are all great ...

[proud owner]

dun pray pray, the RI alumni came out with wonderful inventions like COE, ERP- even a michelin 4 star dish: Vongole Vermicelli du Siam ala Chino-Pomodoro (or Mee Siam ai Hum)

you mean the SPG minister ? who married ang mo ?