Another of those sour grape who cannot afford but talk only. Bukit timah condo got no MRT too. How may condo can face the Park?Originally Posted by another hdb condo
Another of those sour grape who cannot afford but talk only. Bukit timah condo got no MRT too. How may condo can face the Park?
Yeah... all punching below the belts.. sigh
Hmm ... I'm no better in any way ... means you do agree your behaviour is untolerable.
Why should we give you respect when you can't even behave yourself properly in a forum?
We should not compare condos in prime areas and not prime areas. It is just
like comparing apples and oranges. Upmarket condos are found in prime areas.
As such, it is silly to argue whether Clover is an upmarket condo and the
person who brought this up is a silly person.
Actually I'm always surprised by the Singapore education system - people don't seem to be able to take criticisms well. Let's collate the good AND bad points.
Bad Points
1. Near HDB flat - lacks exclusivity and prestige
2. Too many units - facilities too crowded
3. Bad traffic - infamous CTE with the highest ERP. Will take a long time to drive home and less time with family
4. HDB upgrader neighbours which may bring HDB problems e.g. littering, urine etc.
6. Not near MRT station - not attractive to non drivers and non-driving tenants.
7. No future MRT - not much upside potential
8. Bad economy - downside risk is higher
9. Long time to TOP - no immediate rental yield to offet potential downside in capital values.
10. No viewing of actual units - actual units may turn out very different from the showflat.
11. High construction costs - there were already news out there about developers cutting corners esp on 99LH condos where margins are thin
12. 99LH condo - lease term will run out and depreciate heavily after 10 years.
Good points
1. HDB upgrader condo - not much speculation, so hopefully prices will not drop too drastically in a down market
2. For some people, they may like Bishan because their parents stay there.
3. Many units - so many neighbours and can have kampung spirit.
4. Pls feel free to add.....
What a pathetic comments from a pathetic person.
like u said, more negative than positive so on a whole, a crap development
Crap person says crap development.
Buying a condo is quite similar to marriage, you may just 'fall in-love' at first sight and don't really care about the comments from others. It is in fact very personal to me and really depends very much on personal liking.
To me, Singapore traffic is bad every where now if you are driving at peak hour. As for the travelling time, 30 to 45 mins is consider very short. If you have colleagues from says Europe, their travelling time from office to home (vice versa) can be easily 2 hours. So, why is all the complaints about?
Personally, like Clover to be near to most needed amenities yet a little away from the busy Junction 8 which give some peace after a long day work (especially near to the park too).
Last by not least, people from HDB are not as un-refine as you think. Yet, too bad if you still encounter cases like littering and urinating at public area.
Funny thinking....
1. Near HDBs means a bad thing? Why? If you live in Newton with the condos so near to each other, its even worse rite? They can see into your living room no exclusivity and privacy. Clover is tallest in Bishan, HDB cannot look into us and cannot come into our apartment which is private. I find that exclusive already, yet we have access to their public ammenities and the gorgeous park.
2. Clover only has 2 blocks, great idea because more landscaping to roam around, wont feel crowded like other establishment. Free access to the park as well.
3. CTE or ERP, heck who cares, if we can afford and drive at times to avoid ERP, we will. Alternative choices would be 2 MRT lines.
4. HDB bad habits stay in HDB, we have security to keep them out. I think this is a bias remark. Are you saying that u have never lived in HDB and you were no better than them?
5. This person doesnt know how to count, so he moved to no.6 to add a free bad point.
6. So may lazy ppl in Singapore when near MRT is only considered doorstep! I find its very near to MRT, 2 bus stops. Or its like walking from City Hall MRT to Suntec city, good exercise at the end of the day. Since SMRT will introduce season pass soon, hopping from MRT to busses will be a common thing....
7. MRT is already there, future ones are Marymount nearby. Upside potential will come from Kallang River makeover, Bishan Active Sports centre next door and proximity to Circle Line.
8. Bad economy holds for everything even 700k HDBs. Yet most buyers are owners to stay.
9. If TOP is a bad point, then every development will have this bad point! Wake up gundu!
10. Sim lian is known for quality. Can view its existing completed projects such as Viz@Holland or Pearl@Mt Faber to confirm their finishing.
11. Sim Lian owns their construction business. This is a plus point compared to other developers who may be subjected to sub contractors cutting corners.
12. Land scarce singapore, chances are, it will appreciate more than drop if we were to target a 6mil population. Examples of Rafflesia and Bishan8 nearby have sinced held their prices if not appreciated.
Everything is RELATIVE you see. Surrounded by HDB NOT a plus point for most people. Many units also NOT a "plus" point for MOST people. You may be looking out for HDB-like condos with HDB leases and HDB address, but many others, the "exclusivity" and FH matters. Anyway, beauty in the eyes of the beholder. Also, no one is in a position to defend quality is VERY good unless you see the completed real unit, but nobody can deny there is a RISK that the real thing may be v different from the showflat, esp so with escalating construction costs and thinning margins. Those that just TOP or gg to TOP soon will not have this problem because they were built during the time when developers were more generous as construction costs are cheap. As for MRT, need to be within walking distance, or else will not affect property values. With so many new lines everywhere, those without MRT may be badly hit. I think it's quite far fetched to say Kallang will benefit Bishan....
ABCD:
Kallang River makeover not kallang estate.
It is the new ABC program by PUB to makeover canals in Singapore and Bishan park is going to be done with so.
I guess information is power and in most cases, its buying with information vs condeming without knowing.
Each to his own.
This project is priced to sell. It appears to be doing much better than other launches. Of coz you can have the wait and see approach and buy TOP units but that will not gurantee you the unit of choice and price. So many dreamers of hindsight thinking.... will only say market sure drop... but if it sustained and goes up again, they will scream.. aiyaa should have bought lah.... i
We hear this all the time till now on those who just missed the last spike up.
You can go and buy Park Infinia or Seaview at current prices... or wait and wait and wait and wait........ till prices goes back to launch price.... which probably would never happen.
Everyone loves to grumble and point out negativity but cannot give examples of what should be a better purchase? That's because they are happily staying in HDB and eating sour grapes.....
Forgot 1996? The KEY word is "leasehold"
----------------------
See extract from www.salary.sg:
It’s not always so easy to make money, as the previous case studies suggested.
Slightly more than 10 years ago, a young couple bought something that almost ruined their lives financially.
It was the middle of 1996, a boom time for the stock market as well as the property market.
The couple - working professionals - were earning salaries that disqualify them for subsidised HDB housing.
Just married, they were yearning for a nice place to stay in.
They set their eyes on a 1,300 square foot condominium just north of Ang Mo Kio. The location is not very central, but the asking price was a crazy $1 million.
It was a stretch for the couple. Without huge savings, they could only afford the initial 20% downpayment and had to borrow the rest for the progress payments.
But given the rosy economy then, and the fact that they were holding well-paying jobs (making a combined $150k a year), they went ahead and bought the condo.
We all know what happened next.
The economy tanked. Asia went into financial crisis. Jobs were lost. Stock and property prices fell. Drastically.
Salaries were cut.
The couple also saw their income go down. Yet, they still had to make the mortgage repayments.
A big part of their earnings went to the bank.
They were slaves to the mortgage loan. (It’s still the case now. So they don’t save a lot.)
Worse, the condo’s value went down, almost to negative equity level, i.e. owing the bank more than the property’s worth.
Even now, when property prices are at peak levels (and maybe on the way down), the couple’s condo is still a loss-making investment. Why? Their condo is a leasehold property.
So, this unfortunate couple is “stuck” with a still-sizable bank loan, a condo that’s depreciating in value, and low savings. And they are considered high income earners…
A wrong move, and they are hit financially for a long time…
Will it happen again?
What's wrong with HDB flats which 70% of singaporean are staying in?
Nothing wrong at all, except some Singaporeans prefer to stay in private properties, if exclusive and freehold lagi better - it's an aspirational thing. You cannot stop people to aspire for a so-called "better" life right?
flip side of the coin, a couple may have bought Ferrer Court leasehold and now richer by 2mil? Or some couple bought Tiong Bharu HDB and managed to sell it for 700k?
or some friends i know went to apply ready credit to buy few units of the Sail at launch and now sold all of them for 150% profit......
this will never end. Some ppl lucky to make, some ppl just went in at wrong time. Key is to buy what you afford. In Singapore today, 1 million is nothing, easily earned by a couple in 5-10yrs.
well, the survey i did in the official clover forum was the median age of owners are between 30-40yrs of age.
so, they are not fresh graduates, mostly with kids, already have existing properties... and "upgrading" to a dream home.
that case study doesnt really apply.... and agreed with previous post, we can sight many other case studies on those who bought leaseholds that got them great returns like Farrer Court and The Sail. Even HDBs as old as 30yrs old were fetching record prices.....
to u are bad points but to me are good points.
I like to stay around HDB area b'cos i enjoy the amenities
I don't need a doorstep MRT station as I driving
I don't mind bad traffic since I leave home very early
I don't mind paying ERP as I knew it would ensure a smoother traffic. just imagine, can u reach home earlier if no ERP in early days?
I plan to sell away after stay for 9.5 years to avoid depreciation.
Lastly, I don't eat grapes as they are sour.....reserve for those gave negative comments on Clover. cheers
i can tell you real story also.
my office got ang moh come from london, though he is not officially expat but his package is very good.
They give him housing allowance but he smart and went to buy a penthouse at grange road.
He paid 1.1mil back in 2005 and went around boasting to ppl, organize party here and there.
He is just average in his job but like all singaporeans, they always sour grapes to see ang moh having higher pay....
Then just last year, his penthouse went en bloc and he got 2.5mil payout...
So, the moral of the story is, when there is one case study of a sad story on local ppl, there is always a flip side of a coin where you might think that someone who dont deserve such windfall, may still end up laughing to the bank.
ic ic...
of course there is nothing wrong with aspire for better life.
But all I can say is for those who are looking to join the exclusive club, you are obviously looking at the wrong thread...please go to join the discussion at district 9, 10 and 11. If what you have now can only allow you to buy a HDB address condo, either you work harder and smarter to earn more $$ or pray hard that the property market will crash tomorrow.
ic ic...
u also posted in the wrong thread. please go to join the discussion at HDB forum (u can set up one if there isn't)..and pray hard u will get crash by a trailer 2molo...this place is not for u!!
I am one of those Singaporeans who own a HDB flat and a condo unit. Some
prefer to live in their HDB flats and rent out their condo units. These HDB flat
owners are landlords. However, I prefer to rent out my HDB flat and live in
a condo unit. Those who live in private homes but do not own HDB flats
should not insult those HDB flat owners who could also be your relatives or friends. Those who insult HDB flat owners could be disloyal Singaporeans or
foreigners.
Aiyo, you ppl just couldn't behave.
Why must insult?
Why must not insult?
Waste time
btw, read the papers. this condo's median price have fallen in July 2008. Those who bought later had a better deal. Not sure if will drop prices further.
Price may drop, but the good ones are all sold.
I reckon those remaining are facing the West which is quite hot during the evening time.
blar blar blar wat pathetic words of self-consolation. I thk u can save all these for the developer who wud be happy to hear it frm their ardent supporter. For astute investors and people wth gd property sense nobody wud buy clover. I am paying almost the same amt 4 a mid tier condo near town n wud never be jealous over smeone who buys a mass mkt cndo nt so near town. I thk u prefer drinkinj sour grape juice to eating them
This is so Ah Q! So much compromises! Wake up early and sacrifice sleep to avoid horrendous traffic, pay most ERP compared to other parts of SG but bo bian, would be force to sell after 9.5 years or else suffer depreciation etc etc. And you manage to convince yourself these are "good" points. The most Ah Q piece I've ever seen in this forum.
Stack 05
median sure drop because all the good units + higher floors were taken already.
common sense lah!
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