Not allowing new PRs to buy HDB resale will make Singapore lose competitiveness

[jwong71]

Don't be selfish la... have to think of those many many younger generations to come after us mah,.... are you going to sacrifice so many of them to become debt slaves? They are paying so so much more than our time.Just looking back the past 8 years, how many are destined debt slaves for life already?

And newly weds won't even think of having baby/ babies to see them saddle with debts, or unable to afford.

Their kids" problem will be their problem

[chanbi]

Talking about frustration -- although i'm fine with some corrections, but I will be frustrated if price corrects more than 20%, or if it takes me more than 3 months to find a tenant. How about some care here?

Wow! Risk free investment? Economist? No need to look at the basic economics theory of Demand vs Supply?

[economist]

Wow! Risk free investment? Economist? No need to look at the basic economics theory of Demand vs Supply?

I was just making a sarcastic comment, u can't see?

[minority]

And newly weds won't even think of having baby/ babies to see them saddle with debts, or unable to afford.

Their kids" problem will be their problem

With so much subsidy wat saddle with debt? It more of the couple inability to plan properly n mostly the young putting lifestyle infront of spending prudence.

[minority]

Should PR status be so easily obtained in the first place like a few years ago?

YES if meet citeria.

[Arcachon]

There were 51,000 Housing Board flats fully owned by permanent residents as of end June, representing 6 per cent of all HDB flats, said Mr Khaw in a written parliamentary reply this month.

This year, 130 flats were sold by PRs within three years of their purchase, while 320 were sold within four years of purchase, and 490 within five years

http://www.straitstimes.com/breaking...-flats-2013082

Anyone care to share what do they read from the message above?

What I read from the message are
1. PR is cashing out.
2. They do not need resale HDB.
3. They have no intention to convert to SC.
4. Buying is better than renting.

The gov is monitoring everything, they have all the data. This might be what they are thinking.

1. We welcome you and hope you become SC but instead you chose to cash out.
2. HDB is now at all time high, it time to stop the PR from cashing out.

[thomastansb]

490/51000 = < 1%.

So more than 99% is holding to their HDB flat. My comments below:-

1. PR is cashing out - No. More than 99% is holding on.
2. They do not need resale HDB - Definitely false for those 51,000 PRs.
3. They have no intention to convert to SC - Nothing is mentioned about SC so impossible to tell
4. Buying is better than renting - Unable to tell.

I feel the 3 years cooling period is politically motivated move. Now is 2013. 3 years later will be election. If I stop most cash rich PR to buy for the next 3 years, that will remove a lot of demand and resale price might stop going up or even go down.

Is it good for people without flats - Not really. Most people buy BTO.
Is it good for people with flats like our parents - Not really but this will shut them up because no more expensive flats. You want lower HDB price, you have it

There were 51,000 Housing Board flats fully owned by permanent residents as of end June, representing 6 per cent of all HDB flats, said Mr Khaw in a written parliamentary reply this month.

This year, 130 flats were sold by PRs within three years of their purchase, while 320 were sold within four years of purchase, and 490 within five years

http://www.straitstimes.com/breaking...-flats-2013082

Anyone care to share what do they read from the message above?

What I read from the message are
1. PR is cashing out.
2. They do not need resale HDB.
3. They have no intention to convert to SC.
4. Buying is better than renting.

The gov is monitoring everything, they have all the data. This might be what they are thinking.

1. We welcome you and hope you become SC but instead you chose to cash out.
2. HDB is now at all time high, it time to stop the PR from cashing out.

[economist]

...
1. We welcome you and hope you become SC but instead you chose to cash out.
2. HDB is now at all time high, it time to stop the PR from cashing out.

It is a globally competitive world, everyone come and go, just as Singaporeans doing business elsewhere.

Talking about stopping PR from cashing out as if they are benefiting from Singapore, this is not right, I thought someone in the forum has already highlighted that PRs in Singapore have been much worse off. Take PRCs as example, had they purchased any properties in any major cities in China, the value has quadrupled in the last 8 years, their comrades must be laughing at them for their stupid act of buying HDB resale in a tiny city like Singapore and cashing out for peanuts.

You may then ask, fine, why do they need to come to Singapore? the answer is then in the first paragraph above.

[cheerful]

It is a globally competitive world, everyone come and go, just as Singaporeans doing business elsewhere.

Talking about stopping PR from cashing out as if they are benefiting from Singapore, this is not right, I thought someone in the forum has already highlighted that PRs in Singapore have been much worse off. Take PRCs as example, had they purchased any properties in any major cities in China, the value has quadrupled in the last 8 years, their comrades must be laughing at them for their stupid act of buying HDB resale in a tiny city like Singapore and cashing out for peanuts.

You may then ask, fine, why do they need to come to Singapore? the answer is then in the first paragraph above.

Indeed in this globally competitive world, people free to come & go. Likewise, different countries' govts will do things differently. But most will one way or another try to have some form of 'protectionism'. Look at neighbouring countries where a certain percent of Pte has to be owned by locals, & look at Aussie properties which have to be sold back to its citizens (if u got one of those), etc. etc.

[minority]

There were 51,000 Housing Board flats fully owned by permanent residents as of end June, representing 6 per cent of all HDB flats, said Mr Khaw in a written parliamentary reply this month.

This year, 130 flats were sold by PRs within three years of their purchase, while 320 were sold within four years of purchase, and 490 within five years

http://www.straitstimes.com/breaking...-flats-2013082

Anyone care to share what do they read from the message above?

What I read from the message are
1. PR is cashing out.
2. They do not need resale HDB.
3. They have no intention to convert to SC.
4. Buying is better than renting.

The gov is monitoring everything, they have all the data. This might be what they are thinking.

1. We welcome you and hope you become SC but instead you chose to cash out.
2. HDB is now at all time high, it time to stop the PR from cashing out.

490 out of 51K is hardly even 1% . this is nothing just normal movement. how abt some stats on singaporean selling then?

[minority]

Don't be selfish la... have to think of those many many younger generations to come after us mah,.... are you going to sacrifice so many of them to become debt slaves? They are paying so so much more than our time.Just looking back the past 8 years, how many are destined debt slaves for life already?

wat u mean selfish leh? new generation buy from goverment at subsidized rate. today 1K pm get u a 2bedder. an and 4 bed room or 5 bed room is easily affordable base on todays income scale. If people die die want to buy resale who can stop them.? thats is personal prudence issue.

The problem is people are greedy. want to pay wat $10K like in 1970s price? common. then I would want to tell the new generation. Dont be greedy leh.

[minority]

PRs can also buy BTO flats as long as one of them ie husband or wife is a Singaporean. Not sure rules changed alrdy.

either party is also singaporean so its fair.

[thomastansb]

And look at their economy and the state of their country. Sure, you can implement protectionism policies. In the end, who suffer? Neighboring countries - who? I am sure most wanted to be in Singapore than in their own country.

Indeed in this globally competitive world, people free to come & go. Likewise, different countries' govts will do things differently. But most will one way or another try to have some form of 'protectionism'. Look at neighbouring countries where a certain percent of Pte has to be owned by locals, & look at Aussie properties which have to be sold back to its citizens (if u got one of those), etc. etc.

[thomastansb]

When many flats hit the market, value go down, then Singaporeans would have nothing to say. I don't really care since my aim is to buy a 3 bedroom without 5 years MOP and rent it out. The lower the better. I mean since many people don't understand the difference between BTO prices and resale prices, so be it. They only complain 1M dollars HDB - which is actually beneficial to most Singaporeans. By 2016/17, the first batch of HDB will hit the market. Then from 2017 to 2023, we have like 180,000 - 200,000 HDB flats reaching MOP? Correct me if I am wrong.

2009, they start building (2009 + 8 years = 2017). 3 years to build and 5 years MOP.

2009 - about 25k HDB?
2010, 2011, 2012, 2013 - about 100k to 120k?
2014 to 2015 - KBW said maintained at 50k? (2015 + 8 years = 2023)

So good news for us. I would be 40 years old by 2022. Just nice to find a high yield flat at a cheap price. In case I bankrupt, no one can take my HDB also. Sounds good for me and many people here. Too bad for those upgraders but HDB is a house, not an asset anyway.

wat u mean selfish leh? new generation buy from goverment at subsidized rate. today 1K pm get u a 2bedder. an and 4 bed room or 5 bed room is easily affordable base on todays income scale. If people die die want to buy resale who can stop them.? thats is personal prudence issue.

The problem is people are greedy. want to pay wat $10K like in 1970s price? common. then I would want to tell the new generation. Dont be greedy leh.

[Arcachon]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...PE7lzakw#t=140

[Violinbite]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...PE7lzakw#t=140

There are relative truths to my understanding in this video clip. In 1960s, one can say HDB as subsidised housing. But the problem, economic structure of govt or country changes, and many not so well to do remain and stay in the old minset of the 1960s. The older parents old mindset deepens their flawed thinking.
Everyone pays taxes and CPF year after year, but how often do ones flat got upgraded? The excess funds have to go somewhere for good? Otherwise how can govt even give interest to CPF accounts? - the fact is govt has surpluses, they invested, they never remain in the old mindset. Now in terms HDB, we dont get one for FREE, still need to pay what. Resale buyer pay even more. Did govt help then? Of course they did, collect our money, coordinate the cheapest possible developer and build it up. Got extra money to go, invest away. Dont have, nevermind, the investment returns enough to give out some special 'SENG SIONG' bonuses to help some poorer group to start up a family.
The poorer group who cant think ahead of their daily need being met first, certainly it is subsidized flats. But it is not one size fit it all. Think rationally.

Just this sentence can have many different views:- 'Better study well and get a degree, or else next time cannot find a job, and you ended up sweepimg the floor!'

Welcome all of you to share your view on this sentence means to you. You will get an idea what subsidise housing means in 1960s and now:-)

[minority]

Its to force them to convert to become citizens, else how to meet the 6.9 mil target. Pay more money or become new citizen ?

Force? just for a HDB ? lol they will go rent and then go else where lor. u see the HDB too up...

[Condolauncher]

HDB flats were never meant to be treated as investments, it is public housing meant to put a roof over the heads of Singaporeans =)

[Kelonguni]

HDB flats were never meant to be treated as investments, it is public housing meant to put a roof over the heads of Singaporeans =)

Yes, now it's almost fully realised. HDBs for housing has been delinked from private housing, as well as HDBs with investment value due to location.