Owners in the West beware!!

[Ringo33]

I wasn't sure why this is a sold out project until I went for a first hand check on the place. I came away very impressed. The area is buzzing with a hive of construction activity. Westgate, big box, NTF and JCH are being built. JEM is jammed with shoppers and diners. definitely a happening place. It does seem that the area is being transformed in a big way. I guess that explain why the project is 100% sold out on its preview.

All the new buildings around Jurong Gateway are required by URA to install night lighting to emphasis on the building design. So by night, it should look very nice.

[Xan]

The view from the sail at 5 floors that is not facing marina bay will be the same anywhere because you are just looking at building from you window. for that it will cost you $2000psf.

For $1700psf at J Gateway, should be over looking the Jurong Lake, country club from >30 floor, and there are almost no comparison for such unit in right in the heart of 2nd largest commercial hub in Singapore.

No, its not buyer cant compare new launch to resale, it is forummer like you who choose to compare apple to orange.

J Gateway $1700psf

Echelon $2500psf,

Up @ Robertson $2900psf

Scotts Tower $3500psf

Marina One $4000psf ???

Not sure u blind or refuse to see what u don't want to see.
Go take a look at past six months record at the sail and some high floor mm units 31-35 floors only transact at 2kpsf.
I believe after pointing out this, no more 2kpsf for the sail mm units in the near future Liao. Damn, should hv let u continue your obsession and I should hv kept quiet about it.
I shan't be wasting my time on u.
May u find victims (opps sorry, takers) to buy your jurong mm at 2kpsf. Then I shall see how your future jurong mm buyers cope with the rental yield and cap gain after they paid 2kpsf for your jurong unit.
Good luck!

[Simi]

Maybe u can consider buying ringo33's unit for $2000psf. You can gv him more ammo to come here n brag about j gateways potential

Maybe or maybe not and thanks for your kind suggestion


You can also say that URA is bragging or even MBT is bragging when he presented the MasterPlan 2008

It takes substance to be able to brag and in this case I dare not say URA or MBT got no substances

[Ringo33]

Not sure u blind or refuse to see what u don't want to see.
Go take a look at past six months record at the sail and some high floor mm units 31-35 floors only transact at 2kpsf.
I believe after pointing out this, no more 2kpsf for the sail mm units in the near future Liao. Damn, should hv let u continue your obsession and I should hv kept quiet about it.
I shan't be wasting my time on stubborn pple like u.
May u will find victims (opps sorry, takers) to buy your jurong mm at 2kpsf. Then I shall see how your future jurong mm buyers cope with the rental yield and cap gain after they paid 2kpsf for your jurong unit.
Good luck!

I wish to repeat again, there are no MM apartment at the sail, so please stop using MM when talking about the sail. 600sqft to 500sqft is about 20% bigger. Please get this fact into your system

If your unit is facing wall, does it matter if the wall opposite is 5th or 30th floor?

You must be really blind that you didnt see a unit that was sold for $2903 psf on Apr 2013. Selective reading?

As far as rental yield, I am sure you can look up URA rental transaction record to make your own judgement. OR are you too afraid to confront the facts?

[Xan]

I wish to repeat again, there are no MM apartment at the sail, so please stop using MM when talking about the sail. 600sqft to 500sqft is about 20% bigger. Please get this fact into your system

If your unit is facing wall, does it matter if the wall opposite is 5th or 30th floor?

You must be really blind that you didnt see a unit that was sold for $2903 psf on Apr 2013. Selective reading?

As far as rental yield, I am sure you can look up URA rental transaction record to make your own judgement. OR are you too afraid to confront the facts?

Over the past 6 months, out of 5 mm units in the sail, (since u dont like the fact i call these as mm unit, lets me call them 1 bedder units. song bo?), 4 of the units sold close to 2kpsf except one. U tell me who got more serious problem in selective reading?

[Regulators]

anything that is 6xxsqft is considered MM, only difference is 6xxsqft is a normal MM and a 474sqft is a dog box MM.

BTW this is the Sail transaction for July 2012 for a 5xxsft unit at the sail. Notice that the psf is 2230psf for 51 to 55, if go down to the same level as the unit you bought at j gateway with lousy facing (coz ur MM facing the track), will be 2000psf or less.

THE SAIL @ MARINA BAY MARINA BOULEVARD Apartment 01 CCR 99 yrs lease commencing from 2002 1 1,320,000 592 Strata 51 to 55 2,230

I wish to repeat again, there are no MM apartment at the sail, so please stop using MM when talking about the sail. 600sqft to 500sqft is about 20% bigger. Please get this fact into your system

If your unit is facing wall, does it matter if the wall opposite is 5th or 30th floor?

You must be really blind that you didnt see a unit that was sold for $2903 psf on Apr 2013. Selective reading?

As far as rental yield, I am sure you can look up URA rental transaction record to make your own judgement. OR are you too afraid to confront the facts?

[Ringo33]

Over the past 6 months, out of 5 mm units in the sail, (since u dont like the fact i call these as mm unit, lets me call them 1 bedder units. song bo?), 4 of the units sold close to 2kpsf except one. U tell me who got more serious problem in selective reading?

Did you know how many units at J Gateway sold for $1700psf?

[Xan]

Did you know how many units at J Gateway sold for $1700psf?

U had not answer me yet, who suffer from more serious selective reading?

[Ringo33]

U had not answer me yet, who suffer from more serious selective reading?

There is actually nothing in your post that is worth reading not to mention about replying to your nonsensical question.

common sense will tell me that if you wish to use the sail average transacted price of 1 bedder for comparison, then shouldnt you be use average price of J Gateway? Do you know the average transacted price of J Gateway 1 bedder? Or do you still insist that you should cherry pick the record price of J Gateway to justify the fallacy that The Sail is only $200psf more expensive than J Gateway.

[Simi]

anything that is 6xxsqft is considered MM, only difference is 6xxsqft is a normal MM and a 474sqft is a dog box MM.

BTW this is the Sail transaction for July 2012 for a 5xxsft unit at the sail. Notice that the psf is 2230psf for 51 to 55, if go down to the same level as the unit you bought at j gateway with lousy facing (coz ur MM facing the track), will be 2000psf or less.

THE SAIL @ MARINA BAY MARINA BOULEVARD Apartment 01 CCR 99 yrs lease commencing from 2002 1 1,320,000 592 Strata 51 to 55 2,230

You should be the Next Minister of National Development

and amend the present Minister's definition of MM unit of below 500sq ft to 6xx sqft

[Xan]

There is actually nothing in your post that is worth reading not to mention about replying to your nonsensical question.

common sense will tell me that if you wish to use the sail average transacted price of 1 bedder for comparison, then shouldnt you be use average price of J Gateway? Do you know the average transacted price of J Gateway 1 bedder? Or do you still insist that you should cherry pick the record price of J Gateway to justify the fallacy that The Sail is only $200psf more expensive than J Gateway.

We no need to divert or twist and turn too far. Since you are the most faithful supporter of JLD and guiding angel of J, I reckoned you had bought a unit.
Till now you had not even dare to educate or share with anyone which unit type you bought and what psf u paid for. Nothing too shameful or embarrass to disclose right? I believe everyone here v interested to know. U so confident how come u act so sneaky? Good things must share lah.

[Ringo33]

You should be the Next Minister of National Development

and amend the present Minister's definition of MM unit of below 500sq ft to 6xx sqft

Cannot score goal so now he want to increase the size of goal posts..
Not surprising, especially coming from someone who will vote for himself

[Ringo33]

We no need to divert or twist and turn too far. Since you are the most faithful supporter of JLD and guiding angel of J, I reckoned you had bought a unit.
Till now you had not even dare to educate or share with anyone which unit type you bought and what psf u paid for. Nothing too shameful or embarrass to disclose right? I believe everyone here v interested to know. U so confident how come u act so sneaky? Good things must share lah.

the most common behavior of a beaten man is to switch from discussing facts to acting cute and then talks about things which are irrelevant to the topic of discussion.

[Ringo33]

again, owners in the west, beware

[Regulators]

i am owner of central and west, beware of what?

again, owners in the west, beware

[lajia]

I'm not vested in JLD but we need to talk logic and compare appropriately. Whether the MM with 1700psf can earn, that is out of the question, but I think, if you say The Sails is only 200psf more, can you list them here? Frankly, quantum is extremely impt and if there is one below 1mil and is 200psf or even 400psf more, please let me know. I'm sure there is a lot more ppl who would be interested...

We no need to divert or twist and turn too far. Since you are the most faithful supporter of JLD and guiding angel of J, I reckoned you had bought a unit.
Till now you had not even dare to educate or share with anyone which unit type you bought and what psf u paid for. Nothing too shameful or embarrass to disclose right? I believe everyone here v interested to know. U so confident how come u act so sneaky? Good things must share lah.

[Wait Long Long]

Please get your facts right! The South area as shown in the NEA website includes Orchard.

And if you check the PM2.5 for the whole month in Orchard (South area) the PM2.5 there is one of the highest. The best readings are still in Central area (which includes Thomson and AMK areas)

South includes Orchard? Probably you are referring to Marina area which is the South region.
And by the way, the PM2.5 you see at just that instance at NEA website does not capture the strange smells in Jurong, and also the frequent bursting which will release lots of PM2.5 from the "chimneys" over there in Jurong. Bet you don't know about it that is why you are sprouting nonsense! It would do you a lot of good to check through the PM2.5 for the whole month in Jurong then you will know that the PM2.5 there can fluctuates from heaven to hell..........................

[Xan]

I'm not vested in JLD but we need to talk logic and compare appropriately. Whether the MM with 1700psf can earn, that is out of the question, but I think, if you say The Sails is only 200psf more, can you list them here? Frankly, quantum is extremely impt and if there is one below 1mil and is 200psf or even 400psf more, please let me know. I'm sure there is a lot more ppl who would be interested...

I feel that u hv not follow closely to the previous post and its quite irritating to keep repeating. A forumer was kind enough to show the past 6 mths transaction of the sail. Majority of 1 bedder transact at 2kpsf. I believe u not first day here and will be able to check it yourself. And also, if u die die want to talk about below 1 mil quantum, just top up a little, u can get espada at 9xxk. Still below 1 mil quantum. It's a FH somemore.
Not a fan of espada or CCR properties but if jurong can sell at 1.7kpsf, maybe it's time to relook for such deals.
Enough said.

[teddybear]

Whatever yard stick you use, The Sail fair valuation (if new) should be 4x that of J Gateway! Ok lah, since The Sail is old, so should still be 3x of J Gateway.
That is to say, if J Gateway can sell at $1700 psf, fair valuation of The Sail should be $5100 psf! Wow! The Sail is really under-valued (the sail has been made to look so undervalued because so many people cannot afford the large quantum and must buy small quantum (<$1m) but willing to pay $1700 psf in Jurong!).
The J Gateway developer quite stupid, should build 250 sqft MM and sell at $3400 psf for $850k (instead of about 500 sqft at $1700 psf for $850k!).

There is actually nothing in your post that is worth reading not to mention about replying to your nonsensical question.

common sense will tell me that if you wish to use the sail average transacted price of 1 bedder for comparison, then shouldnt you be use average price of J Gateway? Do you know the average transacted price of J Gateway 1 bedder? Or do you still insist that you should cherry pick the record price of J Gateway to justify the fallacy that The Sail is only $200psf more expensive than J Gateway.

[Hillier]

Not sure u blind or refuse to see what u don't want to see.
Go take a look at past six months record at the sail and some high floor mm units 31-35 floors only transact at 2kpsf.
I believe after pointing out this, no more 2kpsf for the sail mm units in the near future Liao. Damn, should hv let u continue your obsession and I should hv kept quiet about it.
I shan't be wasting my time on u.
May u find victims (opps sorry, takers) to buy your jurong mm at 2kpsf. Then I shall see how your future jurong mm buyers cope with the rental yield and cap gain after they paid 2kpsf for your jurong unit.
Good luck!

Hi all, thankful to all great contributors over the years (Xan, Regulators, Ringo and many others..) though concerned about them stepping out of the line sometimes to emphasize their view..! considering the facts that people chased watertown >1500 psf, Hillier >1400 psf, SP setia & Foresque >1200 psf for bigger sized good facing high floor units, i am tempted to say why not 1600 psf for J-gateway with all amenities at the door step as well as negativities?

Though it seems >1600 psf is above average price for J-gateway, i came across mid floor lake view facing prices even at 1350 psf in J-gateway.!

[Xan]

Hi all, thankful to all great contributors over the years (Xan, Regulators, Ringo and many others..) though concerned about them stepping out of the line sometimes to emphasize their view..! considering the facts that people chased watertown >1500 psf, Hillier >1400 psf, SP setia & Foresque >1200 psf for bigger sized good facing high floor units, i am tempted to say why not 1600 psf for J-gateway with all amenities at the door step as well as negativities?

Though it seems >1600 psf is above average price for J-gateway, i came across mid floor lake view facing prices even at 1350 psf in J-gateway.!

I used to hv such mentality. If this one is priced > 1500psf, then that one is logical to be > 1700psf.
I realize instead of convincing myself to keep accepting the new high psf for new projects, maybe it's time to relook at some under valued ones.
Property investment is a learning journey, need to be flexible and mindset needs to be changed sometimes.

[eng81157]

Hi all, thankful to all great contributors over the years (Xan, Regulators, Ringo and many others..) though concerned about them stepping out of the line sometimes to emphasize their view..! considering the facts that people chased watertown >1500 psf, Hillier >1400 psf, SP setia & Foresque >1200 psf for bigger sized good facing high floor units, i am tempted to say why not 1600 psf for J-gateway with all amenities at the door step as well as negativities?

Though it seems >1600 psf is above average price for J-gateway, i came across mid floor lake view facing prices even at 1350 psf in J-gateway.!

well, i can pay $300psf more and get a fairly new FH unit @ River Valley, that will cost slightly more than $1mil.

it's a no-brainer

[mermaid]

y tis thread officially become pee-ing in the west beware!!

[lionhill]

Whatever yard stick you use, The Sail fair valuation (if new) should be 4x that of J Gateway! Ok lah, since The Sail is old, so should still be 3x of J Gateway.
That is to say, if J Gateway can sell at $1700 psf, fair valuation of The Sail should be $5100 psf! Wow! The Sail is really under-valued (the sail has been made to look so undervalued because so many people cannot afford the large quantum and must buy small quantum (<$1m) but willing to pay $1700 psf in Jurong!).
The J Gateway developer quite stupid, should build 250 sqft MM and sell at $3400 psf for $850k (instead of about 500 sqft at $1700 psf for $850k!).

the dropping of price of Sail may be contributed by its poor management, according to the feedbacks.
http://www.propertyguru.com.sg/singa...-marina-bay-59

But you raise an interesting point, how much more expensive is thought to be fair for a CCR than an OCR project.
I noticed during the bottom-up period, when the price of CCR PCs has alaready peaked while that of OCR PCs has yet to rise. the price difference may be really 3X. But is it a fair norm? any guru can enlight it?

[Hillier]

well, i can pay $300psf more and get a fairly new FH unit @ River Valley, that will cost slightly more than $1mil.

it's a no-brainer

Sorry that i am not so familiar with FH, river valley or city condos, just comparing between OCR launches with my limited exposure.

I meant to say that negative factors in J-gateway are at par with other launches such as watertown, urban vista, Bedok residences. Also the pricing is not so unreasonably high in comparison with those projects, even with resale prices of lakeside condos at 1200psf.

But the question is whether the buyers who bought at 1600 psf with ABSD of 7-10% would be able to break even in 4 years time? Guess it is a calculated risk pegged with future JLD development plans. In my opinion, it won;t be a non-performing asset either with a reasonable rental demand from expats and upper class westerners who love amenities.

[Hillier]

Sorry that i am not so familiar with FH, river valley or city condos, just comparing between OCR launches with my limited exposure.

I meant to say that negative factors in J-gateway are at par with other launches such as watertown, urban vista, Bedok residences. Also the pricing is not so unreasonably high in comparison with those projects, even with resale prices of lakeside condos at 1200psf.

But the question is whether the buyers who bought at 1600 psf with ABSD of 7-10% would be able to break even in 4 years time? Guess it is a calculated risk pegged with future JLD development plans. In my opinion, it won;t be a non-performing asset either with a reasonable rental demand from expats and upper class westerners who love amenities.

Leaving aside the appreciation potential in good times, i guess the real test will be the price depreciation during crisis times which concerns JG buyers at 1600psf. It remains to be seen whether the prices of JG will always be resilient and prove to be one of those unique condos (like City square residences) where the demand is always there.!


Just wondering whether city condos have the advantage over OCR condos and manage to fully recover once the stability returns after crisis?

[Ringo33]

I used to hv such mentality. If this one is priced > 1500psf, then that one is logical to be > 1700psf.
I realize instead of convincing myself to keep accepting the new high psf for new projects, maybe it's time to relook at some under valued ones.
Property investment is a learning journey, need to be flexible and mindset needs to be changed sometimes.

Yes need to be flexible don't adopt a dogmatic idealogy that Ccr property are all good and Ocr are crap. Talk the talk better walk the walk

[Ringo33]

I feel that u hv not follow closely to the previous post and its quite irritating to keep repeating. A forumer was kind enough to show the past 6 mths transaction of the sail. Majority of 1 bedder transact at 2kpsf. I believe u not first day here and will be able to check it yourself. And also, if u die die want to talk about below 1 mil quantum, just top up a little, u can get espada at 9xxk. Still below 1 mil quantum. It's a FH somemore.
Not a fan of espada or CCR properties but if jurong can sell at 1.7kpsf, maybe it's time to relook for such deals.
Enough said.

Anybody who do a quick search on ura site will know you are lying and do you happen to know what is the average size and psf of one bedder of j gateway?

[Secretariat]

Haha, Ringo...

After saying Landed prices are too expensive, now saying J Gateway prices are cheap?

In investment, it is never about the prices but the direction of prices. S1,600 psf is cheap when you know that it would get to $3,200 psf for the same unit/project in the near future. Conversely, $1,600 psf is expensive when you know that it would get to $800 psf in the near future.

The question is, do you really know which direction it would go?

Cheers!

[eng81157]

Sorry that i am not so familiar with FH, river valley or city condos, just comparing between OCR launches with my limited exposure.

I meant to say that negative factors in J-gateway are at par with other launches such as watertown, urban vista, Bedok residences. Also the pricing is not so unreasonably high in comparison with those projects, even with resale prices of lakeside condos at 1200psf.

But the question is whether the buyers who bought at 1600 psf with ABSD of 7-10% would be able to break even in 4 years time? Guess it is a calculated risk pegged with future JLD development plans. In my opinion, it won;t be a non-performing asset either with a reasonable rental demand from expats and upper class westerners who love amenities.

well, OCR rental yields have dropped from 4%+ to 3% (check out last week's business times) due to ever-rising OCR prices.

If you are willing to accept a 3% rental yield, you can get a FH CCR unit at almost the same price virtually. And if we talk about upside potential, an FH CCR unit can do no worse, at the same price point, than a LH OOR.