Smart investor buy resale??

[star]

I think ringgo33 is right. Regulator is rather stubborn man. Last time argue with me that if PAP loses majority seats STI won't drop. Lol what a screwed logic.

[rymccondo77]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6XyvtfYA8Y

This link was shared by bro Arcachon.

Watch Propnex CEO explain why resale unit is a better buy than newly launched unit.


Why resale unit is better than newly launched property :

1. Higher rental returns
2. Lower ABSD
3. Higher savings on the loan interest
- resale can lock in eg for a period of 3- 5years, and loan fully disbursed from the start, whereas newly launched project, loan not fully disbursed but progressively, and by the time TOP, the locked in period is likely to be over and the higher interest rate kicks in when the full loan is disbursed.

Quite ironic that he should say that resale unit is a better buy than newly launched unit when Propnex is involved in many newly launched projects.

[rymccondo77]

Why don't u guys give each other your phone number, come out and u can talk until cow come home...

Who knows, after talking and maybe having a kopi session together, they will become the best of friends

[Regulators]

Propnex selling new launches as a business, the ceo is a strong advocate of making money now than later, something that is what I have been emphasising.

Quite ironic that he should say that resale unit is a better buy than newly launched unit when Propnex is involved in many newly launched projects.

[princess_morbucks]

Quite ironic that he should say that resale unit is a better buy than newly launched unit when Propnex is involved in many newly launched projects.

If that's the case then he must be providing an objective view.

[rymccondo77]

If that's the case then he must be providing an objective view.

PropNex (and other real estate agencies) agents when selling newly launched projects, will try to convince people to buy the new project and not resale units

[rymccondo77]

Propnex selling new launches as a business, the ceo is a strong advocate of making money now than later, something that is what I have been emphasising.

Yup - making money now is better than making it later.

Hence, investing needs to start early too.

[eng81157]

I think ringgo33 is right. Regulator is rather stubborn man. Last time argue with me that if PAP loses majority seats STI won't drop. Lol what a screwed logic.

apa lu cakap?!??!???!?

did STI crash with PAP losing a GRC???!!!

[mermaid]

Yup - making money now is better than making it later.

Hence, investing needs to start early too.

wif the latest cooling measure (even though they deny it), I tink it is easier for ppl to buy new launch iso resale liao.

[mosaic]

apa lu cakap?!??!???!?

did STI crash with PAP losing a GRC???!!!

Losing GRC is no big deal, at the end of the day people still know PAP still in Power. Dude PAP losing power is no small matter. The foreign MNCs were concerned enough to pepper my friend with questions when he was doing finance deals with these MNCs.

[Ringo33]

$1 million (projected sale price) minus $850k (purchase price) minus bank interest for 4 years plus 4 years rental at $3000 minus maintenance (estimated at $250/month) gives you ROI of only 5.4% per year??? You better do your maths properly.

My projected selling price of $1 million is already very modest as parc emily which is next door on the hill is already transacting at past $1.1 million in today's market (https://www.ura.gov.sg/realEstateIIW...R!-1650326773).

If you are basing on statistics, statistics show that there is greater upside for upward movement in price for m88 compared to j gateway. You keep shouting caspian has moved from $500 to $1k plus psf, but remember you did not buy j gateway at the peak of caspian even not to mention launch, you are buying j gateway at $1600-1800psf ($400-500psf higher than caspian pricing) and you are assuming ur capital grow will be like caspian between 2009 to 2013, don't you think you look really stupid for saying that?

you have charted the graph for m88 and criticise it for its lack lustre growth for the past few years in comparison to caspian, a smart investor will see that as a buying opportunity. If m88 shoots up to $2200psf next year, marking a sharp increase of 35% in a space of one year, will you still buy given the phenominal growth? Only goons like u will buy at peak pricing in an area n pray for a new high.

To be very honest, after reading how you compute your $290k profit, I dont really expect you know understand much about what I wrote.

However for the record, I quoted below are based on actual transaction, and capital appreciation is also based on historical value appreciation of MK88, not something which you simply pluck from the sky.

Mackenzie 88 unit at $780,000 (463sqft x $1685psf) with 80% borrowing stretch over 30 years.

Loan Amount : $624,000
Monthly mortgage : $2150 per month
Monthly Maintenance : $300 per month
Monthly Property Tax : $300 per month
Agent fee : $125 per month
Total : $$2875 per month

Rent Collection : $3000 per month (let give assume you can get this kind of rent)
Net +ve cash flow :$125 per month.

After 4 years
Loan Balance after 4 years : $556,095
Total positive cash received : $125 x 4 x 12 = $6000

Assuming sold at 1895psf = $877,385 (based on 6 years average rate of capital appreciation of $52.50psf per year)
Retain profit = $877,385 - 556095 + 6000 = $327290
Initial down payment : $156,000
Gross profit = $171,290
ROI = 5.4% or $42,822 per year. (excluding stamp duty and assuming you have 4 solid year of non interrupted rent with zero expenses on repair of furnitures)

Please for sake Parc Emily owners, please dont compare your MK88 to parc emily. In terms of facilities, Parc Emily has got 50m lap pool, kids pool, playground, full size gym, sauna, tennis court, pool side BBQ Pit, and they even has got more than enough parking if you wish to own 3 cars. May I know what facilities does MK88 offers?

Plus MK88 location is also lousy because of the one way street on Mackenzie Road, so you need to get into CBD in order to reach MK88, but you cant remain in CBD.

This is what Parc Emily price chart looks like.


And this is how MK88 looks like

[Ringo33]

How do you define the $2150 installment for 4 years? I mean cash return after selling?

$2150 is the monthly mortgage which you need to pay for the bank for borrowing, which consist of interest and capital payment.

[Regulators]

I have computed based on reasonable benchmarks for future resale of m88 one bedder n rental income of 4 years. You are just jealous by the fact that m88 has a greater potential to hit $1 million based on a strong support by a project nearby n there are no projects nearby to support a 400sqft j gateway one bedder facing the noisy track in reaching $1 million. U can go into whatever nitty gritty calculations you will still end up a loser at the end of the day coz the m88 buyer buying same time as you will cash out with least $200k nett profit even before j gateway TOP. While the m88 seller is setting sites on next investment after cashing out with $200k plus, u have earned zero dollars n paying bank interest for 4 years for your dog box.

To be very honest, after reading how you compute your $290k profit, I dont really expect you know understand much about what I wrote.

However for the record, I quoted below are based on actual transaction, and capital appreciation is also based on historical value appreciation of MK88, not something which you simply pluck from the sky.




Please for sake Parc Emily owners, please dont compare your MK88 to parc emily. In terms of facilities, Parc Emily has got 50m lap pool, kids pool, playground, full size gym, sauna, tennis court, pool side BBQ Pit, and they even has got more than enough parking if you wish to own 3 cars. May I know what facilities does MK88 offers?

Plus MK88 location is also lousy because of the one way street on Mackenzie Road, so you need to get into CBD in order to reach MK88, but you cant remain in CBD.

This is what Parc Emily price chart looks like.


And this is how MK88 looks like

[Regulators]

In d9, apart from m88, there hardly anymore one bedders left that are selling below $1 million (for 500sqft n above) n the upward pressure for an 850k m88 one bedder to go $1 million is great, especially when j gateway is selling at $1600-1800psf. You can walk every inch of jurong n u won't find a 400sqft or 500sqft one bedder selling at $1 million n above, that speaks a lot of the uncertain upside potential of your unit.

To be very honest, after reading how you compute your $290k profit, I dont really expect you know understand much about what I wrote.

However for the record, I quoted below are based on actual transaction, and capital appreciation is also based on historical value appreciation of MK88, not something which you simply pluck from the sky.




Please for sake Parc Emily owners, please dont compare your MK88 to parc emily. In terms of facilities, Parc Emily has got 50m lap pool, kids pool, playground, full size gym, sauna, tennis court, pool side BBQ Pit, and they even has got more than enough parking if you wish to own 3 cars. May I know what facilities does MK88 offers?

Plus MK88 location is also lousy because of the one way street on Mackenzie Road, so you need to get into CBD in order to reach MK88, but you cant remain in CBD.

This is what Parc Emily price chart looks like.


And this is how MK88 looks like

[Ringo33]

I have computed based on reasonable benchmarks for future resale of m88 one bedder n rental income of 4 years. You are just jealous by the fact that m88 has a greater potential to hit $1 million based on a strong support by a project nearby n there are no projects nearby to support a 400sqft j gateway one bedder facing the noisy track in reaching $1 million. U can go into whatever nitty gritty calculations you will still end up a loser at the end of the day coz the m88 buyer buying same time as you will cash out with least $200k nett profit even before j gateway TOP. While the m88 seller is setting sites on next investment after cashing out with $200k plus, u have earned zero dollars n paying bank interest for 4 years for your dog box.

please do not over stretch yourself with all sort of nonsensical prediction and big talk. At the end of the day, its the facts that we are talking.

In terms of rental, MK88 is almost on par with Caspian in Ulu Jurong. In terms of price grows, it has only been appreciating by around 5% per ear over the past 6 to 7 years, and this is including the bull run from 2008 to 2010.

Like I said, a picture tell the full and complete stories. Dont need to use Parc Emily or whatever nonsense about District 9 FH to BS in this forum.

[Ringo33]

In d9, apart from m88, there hardly anymore one bedders left that are selling below $1 million (for 500sqft n above) n the upward pressure for an 850k m88 one bedder to go $1 million is great, especially when j gateway is selling at $1600-1800psf. You can walk every inch of jurong n u won't find a 400sqft or 500sqft one bedder selling at $1 million n above, that speaks a lot of the uncertain upside potential of your unit.

Really, how greats? 5% per year, for the past 6 to 7 years, while neighboring projects are enjoying 10%?

If you want to compare, please pick a good and decent project lah. MK88 and then Waterford next to buddhist temple? I am not even sure you are living in Singapore.

[Regulators]

I pick m88 only because you can afford nothing more than a dog box below $1 million. Between a dog box in district 9 n a dog box in jurong, anyone with a sane mind would go for the former prices being the same.

Really, how greats? 5% per year, for the past 6 to 7 years, while neighboring projects are enjoying 10%?

If you want to compare, please pick a good and decent project lah. MK88 and then Waterford next to buddhist temple? I am not even sure you are living in Singapore.

[Ringo33]

I pick m88 only because you can afford nothing more than a dog box below $1 million. Between a dog box in district 9 n a dog box in jurong, anyone with a sane mind would go for the former prices being the same.

You pick MK88 is because you are desperate and have no clue about what you are talking. It has got nothing to do with me.

And please, rental income is NOT PROFIT if you still have a mortgage. Get this basic FACT right before sprouting further nonsense.

Buy 1 bedder MK88 can make $290K PROFIT before J Gateway owner collect their keys? 10% ROI per year?

[Regulators]

Huh, did i hear wrongly??? You are the one sprouting nonsense. When people sell their property, they do a spreadsheet to calculate total gain in four years from rental income n capital gain. Although rental income is taxable n not capital gain, a gain is still a gain whichever way u put it. You are picking on these nitty gritty issues because you have been cornered n you can't prove that your j gateway investment would do better than m88 bought now at today's price. Hypothetically, even if m88 has zero capital growth, the m88 buyer would still be miles ahead of u through his rental earnings. While people are collecting rental, u are there paying interest on something that can't generate income for four years, ask urself who is the smarter investor. Investors profit from new developments when they buy at the low n right price like caspian, centris, lakeshore etc, but not when they are paying j gateway type of pricing. Caspian n centris were sold lower than many west projects at that time but j gateway is sold $500-700psf higher existing projects in jurong now, very different from the time centrist n Caspian buyers entered the mkt. I think u are still in dream land n you should really wake up

You pick MK88 is because you are desperate and have no clue about what you are talking. It has got nothing to do with me.

And please, rental income is NOT PROFIT if you still have a mortgage. Get this basic FACT right before sprouting further nonsense.

[Ringo33]

Huh, did i hear wrongly??? You are the one sprouting nonsense. When people sell their property, they do a spreadsheet to calculate total gain in four years from rental income n capital gain. Although rental income is taxable n not capital gain, a gain is still a gain whichever way u put it. You are picking on these nitty gritty issues because you have been cornered n you can't prove that your j gateway investment would do better than m88 bought now at today's price. Hypothetically, even if m88 has zero capital growth, the m88 buyer would still be miles ahead of u through his rental earnings. While people are collecting rental, u are there paying interest on something that can't generate income for four years, ask urself who is the smarter investor. Investors profit from new developments when they buy at the low n right price like caspian, centris, lakeshore etc, but not when they are paying j gateway type of pricing. Caspian n centris were sold lower than many west projects at that time but j gateway is sold $500-700psf higher existing projects in jurong now, very different from the time centrist n Caspian buyers entered the mkt. I think u are still in dream land n you should really wake up

please dont try to impress me with all the jargon about spreadsheet etc.

If you want to impress, then please show us how you could generate $290K of PROFIT from buying a 1 bedder MK88 for rental in 4 years.

Yes, show us your spreadsheet.

[espeyap]

please dont try to impress me with all the jargon about spreadsheet etc.

If you want to impress, then please show us how you could generate $290K of PROFIT from buying a 1 bedder MK88 for rental in 4 years.

Yes, show us your spreadsheet.

May I request, if you could do a comparison of the 2 different property investment in a spread sheet for the easy understanding. And best including the timeline. Start with 2013 until 2018 or further to 2023.

I am also quite keen to make some investment but not very sure what is the best option.

[Ringo33]

May I request, if you could do a comparison of the 2 different property investment in a spread sheet for the easy understanding. And best including the timeline. Start with 2013 until 2018 or further to 2023.

I am also quite keen to make some investment but not very sure what is the best option.

depends on individual financial circumstances and objective of purchase.

Pros for buying new

a) progressive payment (good for those who are on tight budget)
b) Buy time to escape SSD
c) No additional income or property tax for BUC property
d) Apartment is brand new, like buying new car vs used car
e) Freebies/rebate from development (if any)
f) Get to choose your preferred unit
g) no reno, agent, tenant, repairs headache when BUC. At least not untill TOP.

Pros for buying resale
a) What you see is what you get
b) Instant rental income if buying for investment, or get to stay

[Regulators]

you are asking the wrong guy. He will use Caspian trend to chart the performance of j gateway from 2013 onwards. Caspian is one of those rare cases when the developer undersold during the crisis period. If you are seriously looking for a 500+sqft one bedder to invest in district 9, those you see in the advertisement now for Mackenzie 88 would be the last you would see of a one bedder of that size selling at $8xxk. As to why there is an upward pressure for price movement, always see how the neighbouring projects are performing as an indicator and support. For j gateway, it is selling at historical high and other projects are looking at j gateway for support and upward movement in price and j gateway has got nothing to back its upward price movement apart from some lunics shouting JLD here all day and hailing that as the holy grail to a two-fold increase in price for j gateway few years down the road (like caspian or centris). I won't like to live in a place like MK88, but from a pure investment point of view, it makes more sense buying that than j gateway. Never buy at historical high and hope for a new high which is unknown territory.

Also forgot to add one more thing, MK88 has no track noise and you can definitely enjoy a quiet rest in your bedroom.

May I request, if you could do a comparison of the 2 different property investment in a spread sheet for the easy understanding. And best including the timeline. Start with 2013 until 2018 or further to 2023.

I am also quite keen to make some investment but not very sure what is the best option.

[mrtcard]

I think both R33 and regulator has a point.

M88 no doubt can collect rental first but im not sure about how quickly can they find people to rent it out. Generally I dont feel safe there really. I must admit its quiet but walking at night from parklane or mrt or from opposite the verge...the Bangladeshs will always be there because its their 'town' must visit place for groceries and picnic unless the whole little india were to shift. I don't think I want to buy or even rent there.

J gateway is definitely very pricey compared to other projects toward the west.
they say buona vista is supposed to be expensive than clementi and clementi supposed to be expensive than the ulu jurong. I must admit the potential is very high. but how high? 2000psf? there is no space nearby to launch new condo so j gateway can never be a price follower. it can only expect growth from its amenities accessibility and offices.
Again i imagine myself looking for a place to rent if I work in one of the office. I would choose hdb. cheaper or buy hdb. I still get all the goodies.

they always calculate rental yield 4% 3% but really can rent out meh?

to be fair
if m88 can grow to 1M due to nearby projects, why cant j gateway?

if my workplace is right in the middle of m88 and j gateway, and if I my company give me free accommodation between the 2, honestly I prefer j gateway. amenities and safe environment wins all. therefore I feel j gateway will attract more rental. when there is demand on rental, I don't see j gateway owners not increasing their rent and I don't see their 1650psf stagnant there.

How about a comparison between m88 and j gateway in 10 years instead.
can try factor in j gateway rental and potential capital appreciation based you guys expertise.

[Ringo33]

mackenzie 88 capital appreciation low??? What rubbish are you sprouting? M88 has gone up by $600-800psf and you call that low? As mentioned, anyone purchasing a one bedder at m88 now would be faring much better than ur tiny dog box in j gateway coz by the time u collect the keys to ur dog box, the m88 new owner would already have earned rental income of $3000 x 48 = $144000. That is just the side dish. From now till j gateway TOP, there will be another spike in price for all condos in singapore as goonies like you would have helped the general property market move up a notch. When m88 increases by another $300psf before you get the keys to your dog box, the m88 owner would have cashed out with $144k + $150k = $294k gross while goonies like u will still be dreaming about ur set of keys to the dog box. This is a classic example of what it means by a bird in hand is better than two in the bush.

please focus on the real stuffs and stop all the other small talks.
Please show us me your excel spreadsheet.

$294K profit from a $780K property in the next 4 years, that will mean a yield of 9.4% annually. What stuffs are you smoking?

As for MK88, yes the capital appreciation has been pathetic and so it its rental as compared to properties in ulu jurong. And there is nothing you could do to change the history

And btw, the Waterford Residence which you highly recommended, someone just sold a unit at a loss

[Ringo33]

While you are at it, I am just wondering why you are not trading your 17 years old Leasehold 99 property in corner of bukit batok, with no nearby mrt, for a unit at MK88?

[lionhill]

Honestly, when one looks at the high psf of the new launches, his first response would be "rather go for the resale market". When he really searches the resale market for a while, he will probably change his mind in an angry mood.

1. There are very few good resale units in the market.You must have to view a lot of units before you find a good deal. So, you must have time, and you must have patience.

2. Most resale owners are even more greedy than the developers. Their funny asking price will make you mad.

3 The agents for resale units seem to be more "arrogant" than those for new launches.

4. For new launches, at least you will see the nice show room. For some resale units, you will swear you will never look at this project again after you view a unit.

[kane]

Honestly, when one looks at the high psf of the new launches, his first response would be "rather go for the resale market". When he really searches the resale market for a while, he will probably change his mind in an angry mood.

1. There are very few good resale units in the market.You must have to view a lot of units before you find a good deal. So, you must have time, and you must have patience.

2. Most resale owners are even more greedy than the developers. Their funny asking price will make you mad.

3 The agents for resale units seem to be more "arrogant" than those for new launches.

4. For new launches, at least you will see the nice show room. For some resale units, you will swear you will never look at this project again after you view a unit.

the number of units on resale have dropped putting the sell side in an advantageous position.

[eng81157]

there are cheaper options, varying from pasir panjang to buona vista to river valley - 1/2 BRs, Freehold going at $1500-$1700psf.

according to personal preferences, all these definitely offer a better QOL

[Regulators]

With this 17yr old 3 bedder leasehold, my rental yield is 5.4% since 2010 n cap appreciation is 20% a year for the past two years. Will probably sell when i reach my profit target, you should have listened to me back in 2010 when i opened a thread to advise people to buy hor. What a pity $800k now can only get u a dog box

While you are at it, I am just wondering why you are not trading your 17 years old Leasehold 99 property in corner of bukit batok, with no nearby mrt, for a unit at MK88?