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Thread: Why 6.9m was too much information

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    Default Why 6.9m was too much information

    The Straits Times
    www.straitstimes.comPublished on Feb 16, 2013

    POLITICS 360
    Why 6.9m was too much information
    Major policy shifts eclipsed by uproar over population projection

    By Rachel Chang

    IN THE wake of the parliamentary debate on the Population White Paper, People's Action Party (PAP) politicians probably feel like they have been hit by a truck.
    Some think that they had actually anticipated the national fu-rore and therefore scheduled the White Paper for the Monday after the Punggol East by-election.
    But the chain of events was so unfortunate that it is unlikely that it unfolded by design.
    It is hard to imagine any senior politician wanting to be caught on the backfoot, clarifying that the paper contained a "worst-case scenario" and beseeching the people to trust them.
    It is hard to imagine any government wanting to contain backbench backlash by accepting an amendment to a parliamentary motion, or, before a vote on the most important document in recent years, having to apologise for a footnote.
    It was all topped off with the Prime Minister, after being praised for not leaving the controversial issue to his successor, effectively leaving it to his successor by promising that the Government will not decide on a population size beyond 2020.
    What happened over the last two weeks is a real pity, because the bulk of the document is worthy of praise. For starters, it is a policy roadmap that directly responds to, and embeds the lessons of, the difficulties of recent years.
    The two key criticisms of the Government's population policy have been that the pace of economic growth - and consequently, the influx of foreigners - has been too intense, and that the infrastructure was not readied for the surge. This resulted in a myriad of problems, from high housing prices to wage stagnation, all of which took a toll on Singaporeans' lives and convinced them that high economic growth is not in their interests.
    The White Paper marks policy shifts on both those fronts:
    First, the pace of growth and intake of foreigners will be substantially less - only a third - than that of the previous three decades. Second, the Government will now build infrastructure ahead of demand.
    The latter, especially, is a major political shift. For years, PAP ministers have been pointing to the costs of "white elephant" infrastructure, and invoking the "ghost towns" of the late 1990s, when blocks of flats stood empty after demand disappeared overnight due to an economic crisis.
    Finally, the Government is acknowledging that the holding costs of empty flats and deserted train stations are more than compensated for by the benefits of slack in the infrastructure.
    Whatever is lost when blocks of flats stand empty is more than earned back in the flexibility to respond to population surges - and in the goodwill that accrues when Singaporeans feel peace of mind.
    All of these should have been welcomed by critics and supporters alike - the former for being vindicated, the latter for the evidence that the ruling party is not hopelessly wedded to dogma. But instead, they were all but drowned out by the uproar over the 6.9 million figure.
    In the interests of better and more fruitful political discourse, let us engage in a thought experiment. What would the Population White Paper experience have been like if the population projections of 5.8 million to 6 million by 2020, and 6.5 million to 6.9 million by 2030, had not been included in the document?
    For those who have actually read the White Paper, that would mean taking out the three pages that comprise Chapter 4: Population Trajectories.
    I would argue that the document would have been essentially the same, minus the sound and fury over a number that succeeded in defining the debate without being real or particularly significant.
    Hear me out.
    One of the points National Development Minister Khaw Boon Wan made during the past two weeks was that for the average person going about her day, there is little sense of the total population of which she is a part.
    One does not interact with 6.9 million people in one day, one interacts with at most 200 or 300.
    But when one cannot get into a crowded train, for example, it begins to feel like whatever the number, it's too many.
    Importantly, this can arise in small populations or in big ones. This is a truism of urban planning and a key message that the Ministry of National Development tried to get across: Dense cities are not the same as unliveable ones.
    Government planners are confident that they can, through innovative urban solutions and more efficient use of land, cater comfortably to a population much larger than Singapore's current size.
    They may or may not succeed. The point is that in the grand scheme of things, the overall population size is actually a tangential piece of information: 5.3 million could seem like too many, and 6.9 million could actually seem like a comfortable fit.
    But to give people a number millions more than what the population now is - at a moment of unanimity that it is currently "too many" - smacks of misjudgement.
    I am not arguing for duplicity. It is imperative that the White Paper reveal the targets which the Government can control, and is working with.
    The growth of the foreign workforce, productivity and gross domestic product targets are all essential pieces of information.
    If these figures had been front-and-centre, then there could have been the same rigorous national and parliamentary debate over whether they are the right ones to aim for, minus the note of hysteria and anger.
    These components do add up to an estimated population size, but with so many assumptions and variables along the way that the final figure should not be allowed to eclipse everything else.
    For example, the White Paper's calculations were based on the current total fertility rate of 1.2. But what if it goes up? What if it goes down? What if technological breakthroughs bring about a leap forward in productivity? What if labour force participation rates spike? What if life expectancy climbs, or drops?
    As any of these unforeseen and uncontrollable factors move, so lurches the population size.
    This could have better illustrated if the White Paper had presented scenarios of a TFR of 1.2, a TFR of 1.5 (the Government's near-term goal), and a TFR of 2.1, which is the replacement rate.
    While the National Population and Talent Division did put out an occasional paper last April charting how the citizen population would change under various TFRs, the Population White Paper could have expanded on this by pairing these scenarios with a variety of productivity growth rates.
    The most optimistic of these scenarios would allow us to drastically tamp down on the growth of the foreign workforce.
    The various scenarios not only would have illustrated just how contingent the population projections are, but also how important it is to get cracking on the twin national goals of economic restructuring and baby-making.
    The key message from the Government should then have been that whatever the scenario, it is readying the infrastructure for many millions more than what we currently have - so that Singaporeans will never feel so under siege again.
    Perhaps this seems like a call to be dishonest with the people, or disingenuous with the figures.
    A long-standing criticism of the Government is that it is tight-fisted and non-transparent with information, so shouldn't we welcome the fact that it was open about that 6.9 million figure, rather than squirrelling it away, or labelling it a scenario for "year X"?
    But I think that's a simplistic interpretation of how a mature electorate deals with its elected government.
    I am a proponent of more information - but the numbers we should desire are real ones, such as the number of employment passes we give out, how many prisoners we send to the gallows, or how much we have in the national reserves. The 6.9 million is simply not in the same category.
    The Government should also refrain from telling itself that what happened with the White Paper was the necessary fallout from doing the "right" thing. The PAP likes to believe that it would rather go down in flames having governed well, than "pander" to populist pressures. Like martyrs, it will take the political hit for the long-term benefit of the country.
    Ironically, the Government actually was doing the popular thing in making those strategic planning shifts that many have been calling for for years.
    Yet, not only did it earn no extra goodwill, but also the political rancour actually grew. This was not inevitable and it's important to examine why it happened and how it could have been avoided.
    On voters' part, they should appraise the Government not on its means - working estimates and projections - but whether it succeeds in achieving its ends. In this case, that is to deliver on the high quality of life that the PAP says it can achieve. In 2030, that should be the only yardstick by which the Population White Paper is judged.
    It's a shame that that "6.9 million" seems likely to be its legacy instead.
    [email protected]

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    To me the most scary part of this paper is that there seems to be no other way of growing GDP other than immigration

    And nothing is focus on how to increase TFR so I think pap has given up and assumed TFR below 1.0 in next 20y
    Ride at your own risk !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom_opera
    To me the most scary part of this paper is that there seems to be no other way of growing GDP other than immigration

    And nothing is focus on how to increase TFR so I think pap has given up and assumed TFR below 1.0 in next 20y

    try so many time liao. cannot kick start. maybe take a worst case to plan .

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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom_opera
    To me the most scary part of this paper is that there seems to be no other way of growing GDP other than immigration

    And nothing is focus on how to increase TFR so I think pap has given up and assumed TFR below 1.0 in next 20y

    Actually there is. The new parent n child benifits. Hoping that will increase tfr

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    Hi....Do you think Hong Lim Park will be URA/SLA next development plan? This is a good piece of land for 99LH development?

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    Quote Originally Posted by yowetan
    Hi....Do you think Hong Lim Park will be URA/SLA next development plan? This is a good piece of land for 99LH development?

    U ask the wierdest question. ?....

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    Quote Originally Posted by minority
    U ask the wierdest question. ?....
    I am thinking from a leadership point of perspective.

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    Quote Originally Posted by minority
    Actually there is. The new parent n child benifits. Hoping that will increase tfr
    More money does not solve the problem - it is not a problem of liquidity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Iamderek
    More money does not solve the problem - it is not a problem of liquidity.
    More leave. So need wat ? Free emotionally support?

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    if they really do take if off imagine the uproar ...where then is the new speakers corner going to be ah

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    Sometimes I wonder these ST reporters come from which planet. Why is 6 million by 2020 and 6.9 million by 2030 too much information? I mean it is almost 100k of foreigners taken in per year from now till 2020 - that has a lot of impact and till now the paper has too little info on foreigner breakdown (low skilled vs PMET?). And then this Chua Mui hoong asking Singaporeans to just accept the white paper. I think we need better quality commentary.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wild Falcon
    Sometimes I wonder these ST reporters come from which planet. Why is 6 million by 2020 and 6.9 million by 2030 too much information? I mean it is almost 100k of foreigners taken in per year from now till 2020 - that has a lot of impact and till now the paper has too little info on foreigner breakdown (low skilled vs PMET?). And then this Chua Mui hoong asking Singaporeans to just accept the white paper. I think we need better quality commentary.

    Too much information becoz all everyone is fixated on is the no. 6.9 but never look at other things that might have been well addressed with the paper. We are throwing the baby out with the bath water.

    No mindful conversation can happen once people perception are set. Ask ard who have actually read the 77 page document? I think I have encounter only a very hand full. All are just caught up in the hate frenzy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by minority
    More leave. So need wat ? Free emotionally support?
    In all likelihood there is no solution to this problem, which from another angle is not even an issue in the first place.

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    Want to increase TFR? Free quality baby and childcare and medicals up to primary school .. free one Coe from 2nd kid

    6k bonus yawn ...
    Ride at your own risk !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom_opera
    Want to increase TFR? Free quality baby and childcare and medicals up to primary school .. free one Coe from 2nd kid

    6k bonus yawn ...
    Agreed. Pediatrician treatments are crazily expensive. Free quality baby medicals is a must. Free education also.

    Yes yes that $6k is useless. Gone before the child enters primary school. Govt tell u I help u for first 5 yrs and you're on your own for next 25 yrs. No wonder they don't dare to push birthrates too much coz they know they don't dare to do more in this area. Take in foreigners is an easier solution.

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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom_opera
    Want to increase TFR? Free quality baby and childcare and medicals up to primary school .. free one Coe from 2nd kid

    6k bonus yawn ...
    Well said! And this is just to begin with... Also must have longer paternal, maternal and child care leave, flexi working hours and arrangement for parents with children under 10 etc.

    Give me 10k bonus I also yawn.

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    Quote Originally Posted by earthling
    Well said! And this is just to begin with... Also must have longer paternal, maternal and child care leave, flexi working hours and arrangement for parents with children under 10 etc.

    Give me 10k bonus I also yawn.
    If the govt give cash it is USELESS, I repeat, TOTALLY USLESS, cos pediatrician and child care centers etc. will 'adjust' their fees accordingly...

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    this is the right step ... looks like PAP is finally waking up

    维文受访时说,政府将进一步研究,探讨如何让让更多小贩中心以非盈利的模式由社会企业经营。“我们会进一步研究,探讨如何支持这样的模式

    The first hawker center managed by social enterprise opens at Simple Bedok
    Ride at your own risk !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom_opera
    this is the right step ... looks like PAP is finally waking up

    维文受访时说,政府将进一步研究,探讨如何让让更多小贩中心以非盈利的模式由社会企业经营。“我们会进一步研究,探讨如何支持这样的模式

    The first hawker center managed by social enterprise opens at Simple Bedok
    Hi...I am really worried - it means the government does not evaluate and assess the feasibility of the plan before confirming the white paper.

    This is indeed worrying.

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    it is good if PAP can build infra structure first then talk about increasing population ...

    i still feel there are insufficient primary schools around ...

    take a look at manhattan ... a true cosmopolitan ... mainly tourists ,,, bankers ,,, etc ... and yet there are many primary schools in the city ...

    to think that there are many singles living and working in the city ... there are actually sufficient schools ...

    not so in spore ...

    making parents worry about where and how to send their kids to school ...
    making parents move house etc ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom_opera
    To me the most scary part of this paper is that there seems to be no other way of growing GDP other than immigration

    And nothing is focus on how to increase TFR so I think pap has given up and assumed TFR below 1.0 in next 20y
    can someone give me the answer.. that one generation after that 6.9m, what is the next population number?
    There is no good or bad location. There is only good or bad price.

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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom_opera
    Want to increase TFR? Free quality baby and childcare and medicals up to primary school .. free one Coe from 2nd kid

    6k bonus yawn ...
    what do singaporeans want? coe, house, pri sch Q, etc.

    solution: tag TFR to these "wants"... 1 kid 20k rebate coe, 2 kid 40k rebate coe (or whatever number it may be).... 3 kids get 3x the chances of balloting. or higher priority for matured estate balloting. pri sch admission based on # of kids (wun spiral out of control - how many kids can you have before the eldest reach p1 registration)?

    other than the coe case, the other "privileges" actually cost the garmen $0.

    i am sure our garmen not stupid to see this. but they do not wish to act on it. TFR is really not their key concern, because importing is faster and easier, and can secure more votes too.
    There is no good or bad location. There is only good or bad price.

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    So what is the magic number for population? People say 6.9 million too many so lets ask what number is good and why?
    If govt starts giving strong incentives for SC to improve higher birth rates and if it works, won't we be touching the 6.9 million in 2030 also?

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    Have a national baby lottery then? All baby birth in the yr get a chance . 1m cash , 1 condo , 1 Coe + car?


    Wat else is needed? Free medical? Free education , free child care , free holiday with mummy n daddy, free 30yrs transport pass on all sibgapore public transport, free 2 meals a day at Resturant for 30yrs.

    Enough bo?

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    Oh forgot must include emotional support. 2x meet the MP 1:1 for emotional support for life. Min 3hr per session and direct hot line to MP desk.

    Gam bo?

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    And also working with outdated assumptions and die die need to import people to hit TFR of 2.1 . Come on, people are living longer, mortality rates no longer the same, so people can work longer. Imagine retire at 60 years old and wait to die for another 30 years. In short, the old TFR of 2.1 no longer applies and few developed countries in the world use that target.

    And economic growth and $ is not everything in life. Look at the way SG has become a senseless construction site where we bulldoze everything of significance to build boring high rise blocks. Surely our heritage and culture matters?

    Even LKY said before that this country can at best accomodate 6 million comfortably. Did you realise LKY did not vote? Even within the PAP, there are dissenters.

    Quote Originally Posted by phantom_opera
    Want to increase TFR? Free quality baby and childcare and medicals up to primary school .. free one Coe from 2nd kid

    6k bonus yawn ...

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    And PAP like to use low TFR as an excuse to bring in foreigners. And they start to contradict themselves by saying they like to bring "low skilled" foreigners like construction workers and not PMET. Seriously, how does construction workers improve our TFR? How can construction workers provide support to our aged when they don't even pay taxes? Construction workers are transcient right and they don't settle down? The white paper has just too many loopholes. one has to be really daft to give it a "A1" and pass it with flying colours 77/90. Even 6 million by 2020 is a joke - it means 100k foreigners every year from today's 5.3 million. And PAP makes it sound like it's either 100k per year of immigrants or DOOMSDAY. Seriously? If I go to my Board of Directors and paint such a bad scenario analysis - either increase budget for foreigners or DIE, the BOD will fire me. Seriously? Singapore will crash and burn if we take in slightly less foreigners? And our women become maids in other countries? I just hope they realise Singaporeans are no longer fools. We have been to other developed countries and found out many have done reasonable well without selling their soul to foreigners.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wild Falcon
    And PAP like to use low TFR as an excuse to bring in foreigners. And they start to contradict themselves by saying they like to bring "low skilled" foreigners like construction workers and not PMET. Seriously, how does construction workers improve our TFR? How can construction workers provide support to our aged when they don't even pay taxes? Construction workers are transcient right and they don't settle down? The white paper has just too many loopholes. one has to be really daft to give it a "A1" and pass it with flying colours 77/90. Even 6 million by 2020 is a joke - it means 100k foreigners every year from today's 5.3 million. And PAP makes it sound like it's either 100k per year of immigrants or DOOMSDAY. Seriously? If I go to my Board of Directors and paint such a bad scenario analysis - either increase budget for foreigners or DIE, the BOD will fire me. Seriously? Singapore will crash and burn if we take in slightly less foreigners? And our women become maids in other countries? I just hope they realise Singaporeans are no longer fools. We have been to other developed countries and found out many have done reasonable well without selling their soul to foreigners.

    to me, the white paper is a big 'F'

    F - for content
    F - for consultation
    F - for PR
    F - for U-turning and twisting after leaving a distaste among citizens
    F - for the hare brained scholar who stated nursing is a low-skilled job
    F - for the perm sec who approved it without vetting thoroughly


    i do not think singaporeans are dead against FTs coming in. after all, there are certain jobs and sectors that no singaporeans will want to work in or do not have the expertise to (e.g. space, aeronautics, green energy, etc). whether such jobs can be repackaged or more incentives can be used to attract singaporeans, that is a separate issue. but we all know that the low-waged workers didn't share in the economic boom in the last decade, with inflation-adjusted wages moving southwards.

    it is the mid-level jobs, which Singaporeans are up to the job, but companies are giving it to FTs cos' of cost - does the individual singaporean benefit? try talking to the one who lost his/her job to the FT. does the company benefit? certainly. does the country benefit? definitely.

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    Default Singh Says It Best

    The best speech on the White Paper debate was given by, ironically PAP's Indergit Singh who asked for tradeoffs in economic growth for a more comfortable life for all Singaporeans. Quote: "Our past decade of rapid population growth has already created too many problems which need to be solved first before we take the next step. I call on the government to take a breather for five years, solve all the problems created by the past policies of rapid economic and population growth. We can safely say that we have failed to achieve the goal set by the then Prime Minister Goh Chok Tong, of a Swiss standard of living for most Singaporeans, except for the higher income Singaporeans including foreigners who just recently decided to make Singapore their home. So I call for a breather in this quest of growing the population and focus on improving the lives of Singaporeans and achieve that promised Swiss Standard of living for most Singaporeans first before we plan our next growth trajectory."

    So no point talking about 6.9m or whatever number that can be plucked out from the sky. Just take a breather, solve prevailing problems first.

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    Quote Originally Posted by minority
    Have a national baby lottery then? All baby birth in the yr get a chance . 1m cash , 1 condo , 1 Coe + car?


    Wat else is needed? Free medical? Free education , free child care , free holiday with mummy n daddy, free 30yrs transport pass on all sibgapore public transport, free 2 meals a day at Resturant for 30yrs.

    Enough bo?
    There are 3 groups of married couples. One don't want children and we can do nothing to encourage them to have kids. Second group is one who can afford to have many kids. Third group is one who wants kids but can't afford. So they don't have kids lor and if govt wants to enhance birth rate, this is their target group. Something enticing enough must be dished out. Medical and education cost is pretty high and they are necessities in life. Childcare don't have to be free coz its not a basic necessity in life. Holiday is a luxury so can't expect it to be free too. You sounded rich enough to afford these things so feel angry that people are asking from govt this and that.

    Tell you for a fact its not the low income group who are suffering the most in this regard. They can always apply for bursary and financial aids. Its the middle class income group who suffer the most because they don't qualify for anything. Everything also must pay by themselves.

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