Soleil

[melodies]

Tiong Bahru to Orchard Taka 8 mins so looooong? Novena to Orchard 3 mins only!
That is why Tiong Bahru is RCR and Novena is CCR.

Tiong Bahru 0 jam to orchard every morning. Take Lower delta to river valley, turn at zion road stretch and turn into paterson. 8 mins reach Taka.

10 mins max to reach Chinatown/ Suntec area if u know short cuts, not going by ECP.

[bargain hunter]

i am sure u dun drive through tiong bahru roads during the morning peak hour. how do u know the jam quite bad? i get an easy ride through to the cbd using this road or the route daytona suggested. vehicles from other estates usually go to cbd by AYE/CTE.

evening peak hours, you go from cbd (or wherever is one's workplace) to orchard, what for go to tiong bahru just to get to orchard? only places like novena gets jam from people going to malls at novena (note the queue trying to get to united square from newton road) and at the same time people who are trying to get to orchard via novena/newton circus.

I also think Tiong Bahru jam quite bad. Although HDB flats not that dense, but seem like many vehicles (from other estates) need to pass by there to go to CBD.

Evening peak hours go Orchard wah! Why nobody peak hours go Orchard?
By the way morning go CBD traffic sure very bad.

[ecimbew]

Agreed. Not all listings are genuine. The agents are trying to fish buyers and when you call them up, they will either tell you the unit is sold or owner asking gone up or try selling you some other projects.

I am an example. Luckily I found a genuine agent with real seller. One suggestion: please do not call anyone listing properties online or print. Contact only agents who did sales during launch of any project that you are eyeing.

[trump7]

There are plenty of shrewed investors (some in this forum) who can sniff out a good deal - this isn't. There's a very good reason why its price is not moving unlike its neighbours...

Which neighbours did you mean? Care to share?

[thomastansb]

Bullshit. You mean midnight? The jam is perpetually there. From novena square that road all the way to newton circle. At least 20 mins - morning or evening, both are equally disgusting.

Tiong Bahru to Orchard Taka 8 mins so looooong? Novena to Orchard 3 mins only!
That is why Tiong Bahru is RCR and Novena is CCR.

[melodies]

Didn't know you have such bad experience Newton Road! From Novena Square to Newton Circus is like only 900m only. Living in Novena don't have to use Newton Road you know. Go to Orchard have many routes, don't need to pass Newton Circus you know.

I had very bad experience with Tiong Bahru Road before. Driving from tiong bahru plaza to the other end takes me about 30 mins for that about 1km road! On that dual carriage road, I can see cars & taxis stopping on left lane while right llane have cars blocking (remember, ther are only 2 lanes in each way) waiting to turn right. So, basically the whole road is jammed & unmovable! And there are so many traffic lights on that stretch of road!

Bullshit. You mean midnight? The jam is perpetually there. From novena square that road all the way to newton circle. At least 20 mins - morning or evening, both are equally disgusting.

[melodies]

I used to pass by Tiong Bahru almost everyday and i had very bad experience with Tiong Bahru Road. Driving from tiong bahru plaza to the other end takes me about 30 mins for that about 1km road! On that dual carriage road, I can see cars & taxis stopping on left lane while right llane have cars blocking (remember, ther are only 2 lanes in each way) waiting to turn right. So, basically the whole road is jammed & unmovable! And there are so many traffic lights on that stretch of road!

Living in Novena don't have to use Newton Road you know. Go to Orchard have many routes, don't need to pass Newton Circus you know. So the jam you mention can be avoided if you live in Novena and know the roads well. However, what you say is true for those living on the other side of Newton & cannot avoid using Newton Road.

i am sure u dun drive through tiong bahru roads during the morning peak hour. how do u know the jam quite bad? i get an easy ride through to the cbd using this road or the route daytona suggested. vehicles from other estates usually go to cbd by AYE/CTE.

evening peak hours, you go from cbd (or wherever is one's workplace) to orchard, what for go to tiong bahru just to get to orchard? only places like novena gets jam from people going to malls at novena (note the queue trying to get to united square from newton road) and at the same time people who are trying to get to orchard via novena/newton circus.

[bargain hunter]

sorry, i don't need to drive past tiong bahru plaza hee.

why didn't u take the route suggested by daytona? dun have to pass by tiong bahru plaza wat?

are there so many other routes to orchard from novena? i know another route is the moulmein CTE way. which other ways are there? please discuss as this is very relevant to this Soleil thread.

I used to pass by Tiong Bahru almost everyday and i had very bad experience with Tiong Bahru Road. Driving from tiong bahru plaza to the other end takes me about 30 mins for that about 1km road! On that dual carriage road, I can see cars & taxis stopping on left lane while right llane have cars blocking (remember, ther are only 2 lanes in each way) waiting to turn right. So, basically the whole road is jammed & unmovable! And there are so many traffic lights on that stretch of road!

Living in Novena don't have to use Newton Road you know. Go to Orchard have many routes, don't need to pass Newton Circus you know. So the jam you mention can be avoided if you live in Novena and know the roads well. However, what you say is true for those living on the other side of Newton & cannot avoid using Newton Road.

[melodies]

Isn't it a fact that Tiong Bahru Road is jammed like hell?
I suppose you are not denying this fact?

Novena to Orchard many ways:
1) Newton Road -> Newton Circus (almost everybody know but the most stupid and jam road!)
2) Cavenagh Road
3) some small roads behind IRAS -> Balmoral -> Steven
4) Go Moulmein -> CTE
5) Winstedt -> Clemenceau
6) lost count already, + A few more combinations with Anthony Road etc.

All the above combinations of routes can arrive in Orchard without passing through Newton Circus!

The route suggested by Daytonas already assume he is outside of Tiong Bahru estate and is so useless! Imagine I stay in Jalan Membina near Tiong Bahru Plaza side or I exit from Tiong Bahru Plaza. Can advise me how to go from Tiong Bahru Plaza to Outram Road YMCA/YWCA quickly without taking Tiong Bahru Road and not having to make a very big detour and also pay ERP?

sorry, i don't need to drive past tiong bahru plaza hee.

why didn't u take the route suggested by daytona? dun have to pass by tiong bahru plaza wat?

are there so many other routes to orchard from novena? i know another route is the moulmein CTE way. which other ways are there? please discuss as this is very relevant to this Soleil thread.

[Wild Falcon]

No need to debate so much. During peak hours, even the Cavenaugh and Clemenceau (this is a real nightmare at Paragon side) are pretty jammed up. CTE (as everyone knows) is hopeless. And why everyday need to go Orchard Road for what? Even the food there sucks and caters to teenagers/tourists taste buds. Also depends on which part of Orchard. Novena is nearer the tail end Plaza Sing side and Tiong Bahru might be faster to Ion/Tanglin side. Such debate is pointless because 1-2 min difference to touristy place doesn't matter to most. Tiong Bahru will be faster to CBD at the south.

Isn't it a fact that Tiong Bahru Road is jammed like hell?
I suppose you are not denying this fact?

Novena to Orchard many ways:
1) Newton Road -> Newton Circus (almost everybody know but the most stupid and jam road!)
2) Cavenagh Road
3) some small roads behind IRAS -> Balmoral -> Steven
4) Go Moulmein -> CTE
5) Winstedt -> Clemenceau
6) lost count already, + A few more combinations with Anthony Road etc.

All the above combinations of routes can arrive in Orchard without passing through Newton Circus!

The route suggested by Daytonas already assume he is outside of Tiong Bahru estate and is so useless! Imagine I stay in Jalan Membina near Tiong Bahru Plaza side or I exit from Tiong Bahru Plaza. Can advise me how to go from Tiong Bahru Plaza to Outram Road YMCA/YWCA quickly without taking Tiong Bahru Road and not having to make a very big detour and also pay ERP?

[bargain hunter]

tiong bahru road the jam is only at that bottleneck which you mentioned, the junction before tiong bahru plaza. even thomas' twin regency is not affected by that junction. u were talking about getting to CBD from tiong bahru, how come suddenly become go to YWCA at outram road?

for your membina scenario: from jalan membina, simply exit to jalan bukit merah, go up the CTE and exit at havelock or merchant road and already in cbd reaching raffles place.

your No. 2 to 5 routes confirm cannot reach orchard taka in 3min during morning peak hour as u claimed. Winstedt through Clemenceau is the best route liao and even then cannot reach in 3 min in the morning peak hour if for e.g. start at thomson euro-asia. the route is slightly more than 3km but let's just use 3km as the distance for easy calculation. you need to drive at an average of 60km/h to cover 3km in 3min. that is impossible given the twists and turns, traffic lights and giving consideration to other cars on the roads during the morning peak hour.

Isn't it a fact that Tiong Bahru Road is jammed like hell?
I suppose you are not denying this fact?

Novena to Orchard many ways:
1) Newton Road -> Newton Circus (almost everybody know but the most stupid and jam road!)
2) Cavenagh Road
3) some small roads behind IRAS -> Balmoral -> Steven
4) Go Moulmein -> CTE
5) Winstedt -> Clemenceau
6) lost count already, + A few more combinations with Anthony Road etc.

All the above combinations of routes can arrive in Orchard without passing through Newton Circus!

The route suggested by Daytonas already assume he is outside of Tiong Bahru estate and is so useless! Imagine I stay in Jalan Membina near Tiong Bahru Plaza side or I exit from Tiong Bahru Plaza. Can advise me how to go from Tiong Bahru Plaza to Outram Road YMCA/YWCA quickly without taking Tiong Bahru Road and not having to make a very big detour and also pay ERP?

[bargain hunter]

that's what i was telling him/her. more pple go to work at tanjong pagar/raffles place than orchard during morning peak! and evening time say want to go orchard, already go from wherever the person is, what's there to compare for distance from home?

No need to debate so much. During peak hours, even the Cavenaugh and Clemenceau (this is a real nightmare at Paragon side) are pretty jammed up. CTE (as everyone knows) is hopeless. And why everyday need to go Orchard Road for what? Even the food there sucks and caters to teenagers/tourists taste buds. Also depends on which part of Orchard. Novena is nearer the tail end Plaza Sing side and Tiong Bahru might be faster to Ion/Tanglin side. Such debate is pointless because 1-2 min difference to touristy place doesn't matter to most. Tiong Bahru will be faster to CBD at the south.

[teddybear]

You live in Upper Bukit Timah don't even know the jam everyday there, and You don't live in Orchard and you don't need to go there, you sure you get your facts right? What if I tell you as somebody who live there that you are wrong and Cavenagh where got jam?

I go Orchard almost everyday, cannot mah? Why need to tell you why?

If you not sure please do not sprout nonsense! How on earth Novena is closer to Plaza Singapura than Ion? Regardless of which part of Orchard, the distance from Novena to ther is definitely faster than from Tiong Bahru!

No need to debate so much. During peak hours, even the Cavenaugh and Clemenceau (this is a real nightmare at Paragon side) are pretty jammed up. CTE (as everyone knows) is hopeless. And why everyday need to go Orchard Road for what? Even the food there sucks and caters to teenagers/tourists taste buds. Also depends on which part of Orchard. Novena is nearer the tail end Plaza Sing side and Tiong Bahru might be faster to Ion/Tanglin side. Such debate is pointless because 1-2 min difference to touristy place doesn't matter to most. Tiong Bahru will be faster to CBD at the south.

[melodies]

Strongly agreed! Just by what you wrote will know you are very familiar with those places, compared to those who said they don't need to go Orchard, don't live there, and yet sound like expert about all the routes around Orchard!

You live in Upper Bukit Timah don't even know the jam everyday there, and You don't live in Orchard and you don't need to go there, you sure you get your facts right? What if I tell you as somebody who live there that you are wrong and Cavenagh where got jam?

I go Orchard almost everyday, cannot mah? Why need to tell you why?

If you not sure please do not sprout nonsense! How on earth Novena is closer to Plaza Singapura than Ion? Regardless of which part of Orchard, the distance from Novena to ther is definitely faster than from Tiong Bahru!

[melodies]

I am talking about my need to travel from Tiong Bahru to Outram YMCA/YWCA and how badly jammed Tiong Bahru Road is and this is a fact that you now agreed right? So Tiong Bahru is badly jammed this statement is also true right and any alternative road from TBP to OT is just as bad.

By the way, Jalan Bukit Merah is another no-no road to take for me as it also jammed like he'll during peak hours! Wild Falcon said CTE is jammed like hell, how to take?

I only say non-peak hours is 3 mins, not peak hours. If Tiong Bahru can reach Orchard in 8 mins no jam condition as stated by Thomas, it will only take 3 mins during same time period to reach Orchard from Novena. If peak hours, may be 6 mins, but from Tiong Bahru will be >16 mins?

tiong bahru road the jam is only at that bottleneck which you mentioned, the junction before tiong bahru plaza. even thomas' twin regency is not affected by that junction. u were talking about getting to CBD from tiong bahru, how come suddenly become go to YWCA at outram road?

for your membina scenario: from jalan membina, simply exit to jalan bukit merah, go up the CTE and exit at havelock or merchant road and already in cbd reaching raffles place.

your No. 2 to 5 routes confirm cannot reach orchard taka in 3min during morning peak hour as u claimed. Winstedt through Clemenceau is the best route liao and even then cannot reach in 3 min in the morning peak hour if for e.g. start at thomson euro-asia. the route is slightly more than 3km but let's just use 3km as the distance for easy calculation. you need to drive at an average of 60km/h to cover 3km in 3min. that is impossible given the twists and turns, traffic lights and giving consideration to other cars on the roads during the morning peak hour.

[bargain hunter]

so now you talk about your need to travel from tiong bahru to outram YWCA. earlier on you were talking about distance to CBD or distance to orchard. your comparisons now become meaningless. i agree that if you want to go to YWCA from jalan membina you need to take lower delta/ganges then outram road to be faster (or more pleasant drive) but i have no idea why u suddenly bring up YWCA.

Wild Falcon is refering to your side of the CTE from north for crying out loud. the CTE from south to CBD is so smooth.

it was daytona who said morning peak no jam 8 mins. if you are talking about off peak, tiong bahru plaza to marriot hotel also can be there in 3 mins. chey.

i don't even know why i am discussing with you at all anymore. keep changing scenarios. so tiring.

I am talking about my need to travel from Tiong Bahru to Outram YMCA/YWCA and how badly jammed Tiong Bahru Road is and this is a fact that you now agreed right? So Tiong Bahru is badly jammed this statement is also true right and any alternative road from TBP to OT is just as bad.

By the way, Jalan Bukit Merah is another no-no road to take for me as it also jammed like he'll during peak hours! Wild Falcon said CTE is jammed like hell, how to take?

I only say non-peak hours is 3 mins, not peak hours. If Tiong Bahru can reach Orchard in 8 mins no jam condition as stated by Thomas, it will only take 3 mins during same time period to reach Orchard from Novena. If peak hours, may be 6 mins, but from Tiong Bahru will be >16 mins?

[thomastansb]

I think we can conclude that our roads in Singapore suck. It is jam everywhere. Be it 25 mins or 30 mins, it is still jam. It is hopeless, it is like thailand. So those condos with MRT are the best. Everywhere is jam in Singapore recently. CTE is shit but AYE is no better. PIE is a goner too. So I can conclude Singapore traffic management sucks.

[DaytonaSS]

now must need to bio small roads, avoid Expressway at all cost during peak hour. Its very frustrating to drive highway nowadays except sunday.

The newton circle is quiet a dangerous way to control traffic, i pass by there every morning to turn to my office, damn heavy n everyone is rushing to get ahead.

[land118]

The newton circle is quiet a dangerous way to control traffic, i pass by there every morning to turn to my office, damn heavy n everyone is rushing to get ahead.

wonder if it will be better if they convert the newton circus into a traffic light junction....

[land118]

Ok. Thanks for all your advises. Not buying this project.

Saw several ads in weekend classified, even have one listed at $880k #x-08 506sqft, good thing u did not succumb to deadline.

[mantrix]

Saw several ads in weekend classified, even have one listed at $880k #x-08 506sqft, good thing u did not succumb to deadline.

must have been some agent pressure selling tactics...

[andy]

sorry, i don't need to drive past tiong bahru plaza hee.

why didn't u take the route suggested by daytona? dun have to pass by tiong bahru plaza wat?

are there so many other routes to orchard from novena? i know another route is the moulmein CTE way. which other ways are there? please discuss as this is very relevant to this Soleil thread.

1. Kampung Java to Cavenagh
2. Chancery Lane to Balmoral Road

[melodies]

When I talk about travel from Tiong Bahru to Outram YWCA, I am telling a fact about how jam up Tiong Bahru Road can be, contrary to what you and the some others said about Tiong Bahru so jam free even during peak hours!
(Please refer to what you said below:
"for u to make a sweeping statement like this, u really dunno tiong bahru. tiong bahru isn't jammed at all during peak hours. the density of hdb at tiong bahru is even less than that of condos in novena/newton."
You further said:
"i am sure u dun drive through tiong bahru roads during the morning peak hour. how do u know the jam quite bad? i get an easy ride through to the cbd using this road or the route daytona suggested. vehicles from other estates usually go to cbd by AYE/CTE."

I can point above out because I have a need to travel along this road, otherwise all forumers and me will be fooled into really believing that Tiong Bahru is so jammed free as you and some others claimed!

I only talk about Tiong Bahru to Orchard and this is in response to what Thomas said:
"Novena is just another town near city. If you measure by distance, Tiong Bahru is nearer to town IMO. Orchard, River valley or Tanjong Pagar."

Then, Daytonas said:
"Tiong Bahru 0 jam to orchard every morning. Take Lower delta to river valley, turn at zion road stretch and turn into paterson. 8 mins reach Taka."

I said that when he can travel within 8 mins from Tiong Bahru to Orchard, I believe people can travel from Novena to Orchard in about 3 mins!

In response to what you said:
"i don't even know why i am discussing with you at all anymore. keep changing scenarios. so tiring."
I ask forumers to trace back and see who is changing the scenarios.

so now you talk about your need to travel from tiong bahru to outram YWCA. earlier on you were talking about distance to CBD or distance to orchard. your comparisons now become meaningless. i agree that if you want to go to YWCA from jalan membina you need to take lower delta/ganges then outram road to be faster (or more pleasant drive) but i have no idea why u suddenly bring up YWCA.

Wild Falcon is refering to your side of the CTE from north for crying out loud. the CTE from south to CBD is so smooth.

it was daytona who said morning peak no jam 8 mins. if you are talking about off peak, tiong bahru plaza to marriot hotel also can be there in 3 mins. chey.

i don't even know why i am discussing with you at all anymore. keep changing scenarios. so tiring.

[melodies]

Already have traffic lights operating during peak hours.

wonder if it will be better if they convert the newton circus into a traffic light junction....

[teddybear]

Hei, you must be flying to do this:
"tiong bahru plaza to marriot hotel also can be there in 3 mins. chey."

Please go and see for yourself at http://www.onemap.sg which advises me that:
- Tiong Bahru plaza to Marriot Hotel by driving on the road is about 4.38km.
- Novena Square to Marriot Hotel by driving on the road is about 2.54km.

For you to arrive within 3 mins to drive 4.38km distance from Tiong Bahru Plaza to Marriot Hotel means you must be driving at more than 87.6 km/h constant speed throughout without needing to stop at any traffic lights! If you add stop time at traffic lights you need to travel at >100 km/h? Is this even plausible on those roads with 60 km/h speed limit and the so many traffic lights?


On the other hand, Melodies said:
"Tiong Bahru to Orchard Taka 8 mins so looooong? Novena to Orchard 3 mins only!

That is why Tiong Bahru is RCR and Novena is CCR. "

If I do a calculation based on the distance of 2.54 km as shown by www.onemap.sg, that is equivalent to travelling at 50.8 km/h constant speed throughout without needing to stop at any traffic lights. Assuming the speed is 60+km/h (possible during off-peak hours) when we add stop time due to traffic lights, seems very much more plausible lah!


So my conclusion is:
1) What Melodies said:

"Novena to Orchard 3 mins only!

is most likely true based on actual distance and time calculation.

2) What You said:
"tiong bahru plaza to marriot hotel also can be there in 3 mins. chey."
(very sorry to say this!) just cannot be supported by the actual distance and time calculation and are just plucking any figure from the air!

so now you talk about your need to travel from tiong bahru to outram YWCA. earlier on you were talking about distance to CBD or distance to orchard. your comparisons now become meaningless. i agree that if you want to go to YWCA from jalan membina you need to take lower delta/ganges then outram road to be faster (or more pleasant drive) but i have no idea why u suddenly bring up YWCA.

Wild Falcon is refering to your side of the CTE from north for crying out loud. the CTE from south to CBD is so smooth.

it was daytona who said morning peak no jam 8 mins. if you are talking about off peak, tiong bahru plaza to marriot hotel also can be there in 3 mins. chey.

i don't even know why i am discussing with you at all anymore. keep changing scenarios. so tiring.

[land118]

Already have traffic lights operating during peak hours.

I meant, do away with the circular shape, just convert into a cross traffic light junction

[teddybear]

Seem not easy to do because on top of the circus have Dunern Flyover with supporting pillars below.

I meant, do away with the circular shape, just convert into a cross traffic light junction

[CCR]

Tell me which road not jam during peak hours nowadays?

[teddybear]

Some people here said "Tiong Bahru roads" not jam at all during peak hours!

Some roads are just more jam than others during peak hours!

Tell me which road not jam during peak hours nowadays?

[devilplate]

Tell me which road not jam during peak hours nowadays?

got many small roads at ULU area not jam one....haha

u shd say which MAIN road