How much Capital Gain Tax You are Willing to Pay?

[richwang]

I guess this is the right group to ask this question. How much capital gain tax you are willing to pay?

1) 0%;
2) 3%;
3) 5%;
4) 7%;

Thanks,
Richard

[land118]

No one will volunteer and say they are willing to pay...all policies are Top down....if have choice don't want to pay GST even....

[richwang]

Thanks. So you are willing to pay 0%. I am willing to pay 5%. So we have

1) 0% - 1;
2) 3% - 0;
3) 5% - 1;
4) 7% - 0;

Thanks, Richard

[Rosy]

We have 4yrs ssd in place already. Remove ssd and intro capital gain tax or stay status quo

[irisng]

Thanks. So you are willing to pay 0%. I am willing to pay 5%. So we have

1) 0% - 1;
2) 3% - 0;
3) 5% - 1;
4) 7% - 0;

Thanks, Richard

I'm not willing to pay either. Already paid 25% levy (aprox $100+) when I sold my previous HDB flat, now still need to pay, no money already. Want to go to far away tour, also have to consider very carefully, cannot spend so much, if not, not enough money to pay for my instalments.

[richwang]

The current SSD is on the total sales proceeds, and it is charged regardless of whether you are making money. It is useful when market gets too hot, but the side effect is very serious. When market goes down, people get confused of whether to sell or not.
If they sell, they make a loss up front

1) 16% - 1st year;
2) 12% - 2nd year;
3) 8% - 3rd year;
4) 4% - 4th year;

If they don't sell, and the market drops more than the SSD, they make a loss. When they actually take that loss - oh dear, they still need to pay SSD.

That's not fair!

Capital Gains tax is better, you only pay tax when you make money.

Thanks,
Richard

[hopeful]

I dont want to pay capital gain tax.
But I am willing to pay GST.
GST being a consumption tax is more equitable.
The more you consume, the more you pay.
So should charge GST on all purchases, including properties.

of course, GST losses should be able to carry forward into following years. afterall, we dont buy and sell properties within a year.

[Laguna]

I dun want to pay capital gain tax nor SSD
I rather give the monies to charities

[irisng]

The current SSD is on the total sales proceeds, and it is charged regardless of whether you are making money. It is useful when market gets too hot, but the side effect is very serious. When market goes down, people get confused of whether to sell or not.
If they sell, they make a loss up front

1) 16% - 1st year;
2) 12% - 2nd year;
3) 8% - 3rd year;
4) 4% - 4th year;

If they don't sell, and the market drops more than the SSD, they make a loss. When they actually take that loss - oh dear, they still need to pay SSD.

That's not fair!

Capital Gains tax is better, you only pay tax when you make money.

Thanks,
Richard

If that's the case, then SSD should do away. People might then consider capital gain tax but not so much, maybe 0.01% hehe.

[land118]

One group will be willing to pay: our million dollar salaried Ministers...

[amk]

What are you trying to achieve by imposing capital gain tax Richard ?

And, "capital gain tax" in most countries include gain on stocks and " other assesible gain via trading" , are you aware ?

As I said in the other thread, 0 capital gain tax here is one of the basic spirits of our tax systems. In my opinion there is no need to weaken this unnecessarily.

[richwang]

Well, I've spoken to some MPs, unfortunately they are the ones NOT willing to pay capital gain tax. GST on food, etc is nothing to them.

Thanks,
Richard

[hopeful]

Well, I've spoken to some MPs, unfortunately they are the ones NOT willing to pay capital gain tax. GST on food, etc is nothing to them.

Thanks,
Richard

how about GST on properties?

[richwang]

A quick google search get this one on top:

http://www.sctax.org/dor_help/Why+Do+We+Pay+Taxes.htm

I know it is not Singapore, but some justifications are valid for Singapore as well.

Everyone pays taxes in one form or another- mostly income and sales taxes. But why
do we pay these taxes?

There are many services offered to citizens that could not be managed effectively
under any other system.

The federal government uses your tax dollars to support Social Security, health care,
national defense and social services such as food stamps and housing.

Services provided by taxes in South Carolina are public schools, safe highways, health
care, prisons and social services for low-income citizens. The city or county where
you live provides water and garbage service, police and fire protection and also
contributes to public schools.

We can all admit that these services are necessary. But why must they be paid for
with taxes? Why shouldn't we just pay individually for what we use? The answer is
simple: Because no one could afford it. Each person would have to pay the full fee for
the service regardless of their ability to pay.

Our tax system is based on our "ability to pay." The more money we earn, the more
taxes we pay. And the opposite is also true. If we earn a small income, we pay less
taxes.

[richwang]

There is a timing difference between GST and Capital Gain Tax.
GST is paid when you buy. Capital Gain Tax is paid when you sell (and make money.)

Thanks,
Richard

[evergreen]

MP's won't want to impose capital gains tax because it means they themselves have to pay!
I rather have SSD than capital gains tax too. For property, it is fairer to have SSD because it "stabalizes" the prices.
If capital gains tax is imposed, property prices will be driven up as sellers increase prices to maintain their margins.

how about GST on properties?

If pay GST on properties, won't that be double taxation? The developers already paid GST on the construction.

[Worsty]

I'm willing to pay CGT if we don't have to pay interest on the the amount that we 'borrow' from CPF to pay for our mortgage.

I'm alright to pay CGT up to 5%.

I'm speaking from the point of someone that doesn't have decades/years of accumulation of wealth and still depend on CPF to assist in paying their mortgage. (generally 80-90% of the population)

Any tax be it GST or CGT will be beneficial to the rich since necessities (such as your first and only home) is always a smaller portion of their disposable income for them.

If the idea is to help devise means to generate revenue for the government, my views are to reduce or remove GST or any tax like stamp duty for a basket of necessities such as rice, milk powder, cooking oil, bread, etc etc including your first home purchase while increasing personal income tax and the levy for the casinos (both for individual Singaporeans as well as for the casino itself).

[devilplate]

Since they oredi impose draconian 4yrs ssd....no point toking abt cap gain tax liao lar.....there is no way govt can remove the ssd now unless prices of pte ppty drop alot!

So richwang, pls stop ur idea la.....u want us to pay cap gain tax on top of 4yrs ssd?

[evergreen]

I'm willing to pay CGT if we don't have to pay interest on the the amount that we 'borrow' from CPF to pay for our mortgage.

I'm alright to pay CGT up to 5%.

I'm speaking from the point of someone that doesn't have decades/years of accumulation of wealth and still depend on CPF to assist in paying their mortgage. (generally 80-90% of the population)

Any tax be it GST or CGT will be beneficial to the rich since necessities (such as your first and only home) is always a smaller portion of their disposable income for them.

If the idea is to help devise means to generate revenue for the government, my views are to reduce or remove GST or any tax like stamp duty for a basket of necessities such as rice, milk powder, cooking oil, bread, etc etc including your first home purchase while increasing personal income tax and the levy for the casinos (both for individual Singaporeans as well as for the casino itself).

I think the policy of paying back the amount we "borrow" from our own CPF is really stupid.
I agree we should remove GST for essentials. But it also means we need to impose tax or increase tax on something else. I suggest alcohol and tobacco products. Increase tax on winnings from betting and gambling. Increase tax on vice businesses such as KTV.

[amk]

That's why I ask Richard what his purpose is for a capital gain tax.
For the sole purpose of controlling pty prices, it's already totally redundant. More over there are better administrative measures to do it.
Brosd base capital gain tax is detrimental to a service economy like us. No we are far from a mature economy.
And have you talked to any tax partner in an accounting firm ? They will tell you it's unnecessarily difficult to enforce. Even just capital gain on pty only, how to define "gain" ? Inflationary cost excluded ? Is that fair ?
Btw please do not assume the gov does not want to do capital gain tax just because the officials themselves dun want to pay. This is so wrong. Our government is not like India or China. The gov's reason is valid. Dun doubt it on that.

[amk]

I think the policy of paying back the amount we "borrow" from our own CPF is really stupid.
I agree we should remove GST for essentials. But it also means we need to impose tax or increase tax on something else. I suggest alcohol and tobacco products. Increase tax on winnings from betting and gambling. Increase tax on vice businesses such as KTV.

This is far more equitable, I agree. But the enforcement will be tough. UK has this system of essential or raw goods and svcs are not taxed. However it brings a lot of enforcement irregularities. A uber expensive sushi carries no VAT because it's "raw fish" hence essential item, whereas bacon does as it's processed and thus no longer essential. A lot of administrative work to differentiate diff categories of items and services, and there are a lot of loopholes and creative go-arounds. I personally suspect this is the reason gov here does not want to do that...

[hopeful]

MP's won't want to impose capital gains tax because it means they themselves have to pay!
I rather have SSD than capital gains tax too. For property, it is fairer to have SSD because it "stabalizes" the prices.
If capital gains tax is imposed, property prices will be driven up as sellers increase prices to maintain their margins.


If pay GST on properties, won't that be double taxation? The developers already paid GST on the construction.

How is it double taxation? Developers are charged GST, but they dont "directly" charged GST to buyers. Dont think they absorbed GST, rather GST is included in the sales price.

So when we buy properties, we pay GST, when we sell, we receive GST. Those who are the end user have to bear the whole GST.

[hopeful]

This is far more equitable, I agree. But the enforcement will be tough. UK has this system of essential or raw goods and svcs are not taxed. However it brings a lot of enforcement irregularities. A uber expensive sushi carries no VAT because it's "raw fish" hence essential item, whereas bacon does as it's processed and thus no longer essential. A lot of administrative work to differentiate diff categories of items and services, and there are a lot of loopholes and creative go-arounds. I personally suspect this is the reason gov here does not want to do that...

That is the reason given by one official.
He gave the example of takeaway orders and dine-in orders.
One is charged VAT, the other isnt'. Basically changed the consumption pattern.

[richwang]

SSD is bad. It kills the market activities, not good for economy.
Let me try to work out how SSD can be converted to CGT.
Let's assume price can go up net 20% in the 1st year (dream on). 16% SSD is equivalent to 16%/20% = 80% CGT.

So if SSD is removed, and introduce CGT

1) 1st year - 80%;
2) 2nd year - 60%;
3) 3rd year - 40%;
4) 4th year - 20%;
5) 5th - 10th year - 7%
6) 11th - 20th year - 5%
7) 21th year and above -3%

Would this be better?

Thanks,
Richard

[evergreen]

How is it double taxation? Developers are charged GST, but they dont "directly" charged GST to buyers. Dont think they absorbed GST, rather GST is included in the sales price.

So when we buy properties, we pay GST, when we sell, we receive GST. Those who are the end user have to bear the whole GST.

At the moment, the government only receives the GST in their pocket once from the developer.

[irisng]

Well, I've spoken to some MPs, unfortunately they are the ones NOT willing to pay capital gain tax. GST on food, etc is nothing to them.

Thanks,
Richard

[devilplate]

SSD is bad. It kills the market activities, not good for economy.
Let me try to work out how SSD can be converted to CGT.
Let's assume price can go up net 20% in the 1st year (dream on). 16% SSD is equivalent to 16%/20% = 80% CGT.

So if SSD is removed, and introduce CGT

1) 1st year - 80%;
2) 2nd year - 60%;
3) 3rd year - 40%;
4) 4th year - 20%;
5) 5th - 10th year - 7%
6) 11th - 20th year - 5%
7) 21th year and above -3%

Would this be better?

Thanks,
Richard

u must remember cgt not fair to those investors or homeowners who buy n sell after many donkey yrs

3% cgt also alot bcoz px cud hf doubled or tripled or more!

If intro cgt, shd be zero after 5yrs to be in line wif hdb mop 5yrs

And i oredi mentioned.....how can govt remove ssd now? Whahahaha.....pls stop wasting ur time.....spend ur time on volunteering work better

[irisng]

I'm willing to pay CGT if we don't have to pay interest on the the amount that we 'borrow' from CPF to pay for our mortgage.

I'm alright to pay CGT up to 5%.

I'm speaking from the point of someone that doesn't have decades/years of accumulation of wealth and still depend on CPF to assist in paying their mortgage. (generally 80-90% of the population)

Any tax be it GST or CGT will be beneficial to the rich since necessities (such as your first and only home) is always a smaller portion of their disposable income for them.

If the idea is to help devise means to generate revenue for the government, my views are to reduce or remove GST or any tax like stamp duty for a basket of necessities such as rice, milk powder, cooking oil, bread, etc etc including your first home purchase while increasing personal income tax and the levy for the casinos (both for individual Singaporeans as well as for the casino itself).

Another way of increasing the revenue for the country is to cut the ministers/MP salary. If their salary are cut, that means that country expenses will reduce, but will anybody willing to offer a pay cut. Nobody will ever find that their money is already enough, if not there won't be so many rich people in this world.

[richwang]

Good idea. How about changing SSD to CGT as follows?

1) 1st year - 80%;
2) 2nd year - 60%;
3) 3rd year - 40%;
4) 4th year - 20%;
5) 5th year - 10%;
6) More than 5 years - 0%

Thanks,
Richard

[irisng]

How is it double taxation? Developers are charged GST, but they dont "directly" charged GST to buyers. Dont think they absorbed GST, rather GST is included in the sales price.

So when we buy properties, we pay GST, when we sell, we receive GST. Those who are the end user have to bear the whole GST.

According to what I know, if it is a GST registered company, when the company purchases something with GST, they can claim back the GST from the GST dept, likewise if they sell with GST, they have to return this GST amount to the GST dept. Do not know whether does it apply to the developer or not?