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gfoo
15-01-09, 11:02
Starting this thread for tracking purposes. This is based on newspaper prices, propguru and other online sources for the areas i'm interested in. Comments & contributions are of course welcome. Please add on any updates you might have:


15/1

Apt Status:
2006 Telok Kurau : $480psf
Beacon Edge Tembeling: $780psf
Vitra Tembeling: $620psf

Semi Condo:
Poshgrove: $615psf
Grand Duchess: $795psf
Terra Vue: $735psf
Ola Residences: $960psf (just because Lian Beng paid Bravo $42m for land)

Condos:
One Amber/Esta: $800psf
The Sea View: $1080psf

Sean.G
15-01-09, 21:06
Hi gfoo,

We share a common goal which is buying property in the Amber area. I have been viewing some 4 bdrm apts at Esta and Seaview. All owners still asking for 900+psf for Esta and 1100+psf for Seaview.

According to the agents the buyers all have holding power, which i guess could be partly true since the properties have TOP and their DPS loans would have kicked in. So I will continue to sound out the sellers with my super low offers (700-750 psf) and hopefully hit the jackpot.

Party
15-01-09, 22:35
You joker gfoo........anyway yahoo was also born like this !!!!!!!!!!!!!:)


yahooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!
gfooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!

dmonddd
15-01-09, 22:55
Hi gfoo,

We share a common goal which is buying property in the Amber area. I have been viewing some 4 bdrm apts at Esta and Seaview. All owners still asking for 900+psf for Esta and 1100+psf for Seaview.

According to the agents the buyers all have holding power, which i guess could be partly true since the properties have TOP and their DPS loans would have kicked in. So I will continue to sound out the sellers with my super low offers (700-750 psf) and hopefully hit the jackpot.

your offer of $700-750psf may not be low enuf.... a drop of only 36%. not realistic. i see a correction to $550psf as there's pressure on prices from units within the CBD area. prices for D9, 10 and D11 new launches are coming down...those have seen correction to more than 40%. Check with valuer.

gfoo
15-01-09, 22:58
yah lor - woohoooooooooooo!

wait 3 months, and let's see who has the last laugh.

the only thing that can stop this decline is mass inflation or superinflation.

heaven forbid hyperinflation, then no one wins

but all that fiat being pumped into the system will take its time to work itself into main street, until then, i think deflation still rules the day for the next couple of years

dmonddd
15-01-09, 23:32
yah lor - woohoooooooooooo!

wait 3 months, and let's see who has the last laugh.

the only thing that can stop this decline is mass inflation or superinflation.

heaven forbid hyperinflation, then no one wins

but all that fiat being pumped into the system will take its time to work itself into main street, until then, i think deflation still rules the day for the next couple of years

From URA one unit 1,561 sqft done at $737psf in Dec 2008. Hence my view that this will go further down due to D9-11 price pressure will probably happen after CNY.

gfoo
16-01-09, 14:06
Citibank's Price Estimates
16 Jan 2009

Last transacted in 4Q2008 (preliminary)
Tierra Vue $771
Grand Duchess $661
One Amber $852
Makena $1000
Costa Rhu $899
Mandarin Gardens $655
Bayshore Park $797

"Similarly for the mid-tier segment, where prices have already fallen some 20% from their peaks a year ago, we think prices are likely to reach 1998 levels rather than the 2003 levels in the absence of an overall housing oversupply. This would imply a further price decline of around 35% from current levels or approximately 45% from their peaks"

Which means according to Citibank, fair value will be:

(actuals)
Ardmore $1248
Makena $700
Costa Rhu: $507
Mandarin Gardens $384
Bayshore Park $428

(35%)
Tierra Vue $501
Grand Duchess $429
One Amber $554

Comments anyone?

For Tierra Vue and Grand Duchess i have to agree they might reach that point sooner than later, as prices just 1 or 2 lorongs away are already at that level.

How about One Amber?

My biggest worry is that if banks start valuing loans based on these citibank/ubs reports, even if you take 15% above projected, that will price One Amber at $630. That means down the road loans might have probs

firec
16-01-09, 16:02
Not totally related, but why does Citi classify Esta as mass market, but One Amber as mid-segment?

condoinvestor
16-01-09, 17:59
that is because Citi bankers and anal-lysts are bunch of idiots, would you listen to someone who cannot even keep their own act together....

Fair price for condos in the east with decent views and layouts should hold their price, as for the rest god bless those who bought them anyway, because no one wants them....

kal
16-01-09, 20:06
well, if citibank is right, they wont be in such a deepshit now. Still got ppl believe in such bank?? hahahahaha

HP65
17-01-09, 00:07
well, if citibank is right, they wont be in such a deepshit now. Still got ppl believe in such bank?? hahahahaha

Condoinvestor, Kal,

If you do not even know the difference between an analyst working in Singapore and the people who brought Citigroup to its knees, I will be blunt and ask you to stop acting stupid.

Are you vested and hoping to dump your overpriced condo? If you are, I think you better stop laughing at Citi but take a good look at your own financials. In the end, the joke could be on you.

dmonddd
17-01-09, 00:20
Condoinvestor, Kal,

If you do not even know the difference between an analyst working in Singapore and the people who brought Citigroup to its knees, I will be blunt and ask you to stop acting stupid.

Are you vested and hoping to dump your overpriced condo? If you are, I think you better stop laughing at Citi but take a good look at your own financials. In the end, the joke could be on you.

I agree with HP65 on both condoinvestor's and Kal's vested interest....i doubt they know what brought down the financial sector and what caused the property prices to tumble during the Asian crisis and SARS. Were people then bothered about the better views in east coast? basic economics of demand and supply.

This is fresh news - Sail 2-bedder unit is being negotiated for rent at $2,800. A month ago, one rented a 2 bedder above 20th floor for $3,800.

Middle east hotels' rates are discounted more than 80%. this used to be a demand driven market. and please read about the news of thousands of cars abandoned with keys at the airport.

:doh:

wishful thinking versus accepting the reality.

dmonddd
17-01-09, 00:36
and also check out the news on dublin airport...the nos of cars abandoned. condoinvestor and kal, you will fall off your chair.

gfoo
17-01-09, 08:19
chkthis: spoke to my agent again on beacon edge which i like quite a bit. Developer refused to budge on 780psf and said developer might actually raise prices down the road, as majority bought at 1300psf. In fact, huttons too has got intructions fr other developers on no further discounts.

Seems devpers havent woken up yet. Time will tell

dtrax
17-01-09, 10:11
chkthis: spoke to my agent again on beacon edge which i like quite a bit. Developer refused to budge on 780psf and said developer might actually raise prices down the road, as majority bought at 1300psf. In fact, huttons too has got intructions fr other developers on no further discounts.

Seems devpers havent woken up yet. Time will tell

Ah yah chances are they are trying to pyscho buyers to accept the asking price and dun expect a reduction..lol

muffin
17-01-09, 13:02
Hi gfoo, i'm also interested to get a unit at Beacon Edge. Was also informed by agent that the developer will not drop below $780. Have not heard that developer might increase price tho....guess i'll look out for other developments around that area. The East Coast Price Watch you collated here is most useful....many thanks

gfoo
17-01-09, 13:37
Hi gfoo, i'm also interested to get a unit at Beacon Edge. Was also informed by agent that the developer will not drop below $780. Have not heard that developer might increase price tho....guess i'll look out for other developments around that area. The East Coast Price Watch you collated here is most useful....many thanks

Cool! Honestly, if i were to buy it at 780psf, i would be a complete irrational idiot not grounded in economic reality. In today's paper, one amber at $790psf, glacier lor m w 150k reno at $480psf, even carribean at 1k.

I just hope developer gets back down to reality and make our decisions simpler an future losses slimmer

Sean.G
17-01-09, 14:52
Yeah muffin! We buyers must keep cool. See the papers today, all the developers begging for property tax deferment and dragging of repayment from the government! Then on the other end tell buyers they won't drop below their launch price. What bull! Means they cannot tahan already but still putting up a front.

Please refer to my post in ESTA thread, we must all be cautious and wait for ASH Sales.

I believe in the next few months...sellers and developers will have to be realistic when the property market becomes like lim chu kang (A GRAVEYARD)! And they still have to bear the liabilities of holding on to their units.

Even I have come to realise my offer of 700-750 for esta is stupid...i should wait for 600psf or less. (But who knows i might end up being the clown).

BTW i saw an ad in the classifieds..one owner selling Amber Residences 17++ sq ft unit for 250psf below launch price. I smell smoke..... and when there's smoke...there...FIRE

gfoo
17-01-09, 15:36
Hey muffin, for beacon edge i think before you buy you better insist on going for an onsite tour like i did first. The devt is smaller than the pix and model . E.g. The 2 grd flr pes units- u can stand and one, and spit across the 'wading pool' into the other pes. It's that small. Also try gg there abt lunch and dinner time and stand at the back. The exhaust from astons and the korean bbq blasts fumra directlu into the back of left half of e development. The right half of the development will get affected by the bbq pits which are at most 2 car lengths to the epicenter of beacon edge. Which means the entire back facing blocks will either get korean bbq smell or sgp bbq smell. No wonder only the front facing were sold. Those who bought the rear blocks at 800psf are idiots

muffin
17-01-09, 20:38
Hi gfoo,

i agree. the development is smaller than i expected. It looks so good on the model/brochure though...still i think it's bigger than The Aadara, which is on the opposite side of the road. I'm considering getting Beacon Edget coz i love the location, esp with all the foodstalls and chill out places....waiting....waiting...for the right time...;)

gfoo
17-01-09, 20:49
I hope the developer negotiates sumthing w e foodstalls. Having food exhaust blowing full force into the living room aint too healthy, not to mention window grease and gg to work smelling like a bbq. Once the developer fixes that and their ridiculous pricing, i'll get a unit for fambly stay

Just occurred to me : most beacon edge owners bought at $1280psf. Now its 780psf. Assuming avg size apt is 1000sq ft, they have lost on paper some $500,000 each.

Any beacon edge owners in this forum? Did u buy via dps and if not, has banks asked for any top up yet?

condoinvestor
17-01-09, 20:52
Dearest HP65, chillout mate, I simply made that statement as to reply to earlier post abt citi classifying esta different to one amber,

Anyway I still feel the way I do and that is my personal view, if you have an issue with it, well I am sorry but we are all entitled to our own views as long as we do not impose it on anyone,

As to vested interest, yes I do certainly have, that is why I visit this forum to learn, share and get a feel of things,

Gooday

lbb
18-01-09, 11:32
I hope the developer negotiates sumthing w e foodstalls. Having food exhaust blowing full force into the living room aint too healthy, not to mention window grease and gg to work smelling like a bbq. Once the developer fixes that and their ridiculous pricing, i'll get a unit for fambly stay

Just occurred to me : most beacon edge owners bought at $1280psf. Now its 780psf. Assuming avg size apt is 1000sq ft, they have lost on paper some $500,000 each.

Any beacon edge owners in this forum? Did u buy via dps and if not, has banks asked for any top up yet?

Yeah I did view the Beacon Edge as well. And I really liked it. Finishings were pretty good and so is the location. Didn't notice the aston's food exhaust nor the crampness you guys are referring to as the building struture wasnt up at that time. I'm still looking at Poshgrove East, The Beacon Edge and Tierra Vue (it's in order of preferance). I still think TSV, Esta and One Amber still our of my price range.

Keep the price updates going gfoo. Really appreciate it mate! (:

gfoo
18-01-09, 20:35
Just went again to see the beacon edge site this evening.
Korean BBQ smell overpowering, and on the other side where the apt bbq pits are you get faint exhaust from the bak kut teh place. mom-in-law peeked in and said way too cramped and dark due to high density. think i'll pass on this.

Makes things much easier now. My shortlist:

East
1. One Amber
2. Poshgrove East
3. Ola

Central
1. Sail

Orchard
1. Spring Grove

muffin
18-01-09, 23:04
I viewed Posh Grove last weekend. Didn't like it even though the development is bigger than Beacon Edge. The finishing is not as nice; quite plain and dull. The marketing agent quoted me $9xx psf. In today's classified, there's a unit marrketing for $6xx psf.

Petmail
19-01-09, 03:15
I viewed Posh Grove last weekend. Didn't like it even though the development is bigger than Beacon Edge. The finishing is not as nice; quite plain and dull. The marketing agent quoted me $9xx psf. In today's classified, there's a unit marrketing for $6xx psf.


$6XXpsf??? SERIOUS???

Joyland
19-01-09, 09:32
Hi, anyone have any comments on The Aristo? kinda like this development as it is very unique. Think it is selling around 900psf. Think is kinda high...



Just went again to see the beacon edge site this evening.
Korean BBQ smell overpowering, and on the other side where the apt bbq pits are you get faint exhaust from the bak kut teh place. mom-in-law peeked in and said way too cramped and dark due to high density. think i'll pass on this.

Makes things much easier now. My shortlist:

East
1. One Amber
2. Poshgrove East
3. Ola

Central
1. Sail

Orchard
1. Spring Grove

Unreg
19-01-09, 09:50
Hi all,


How much psf do you think Casa Merah will be worth then?


Thanks

latour
19-01-09, 09:57
Any comments for those at Upper East Coast, Bayshore Road :-

1) Costa Del Sol
2) The Bayshore
3) Bayshore Park

any thoughts ???

nochoice
19-01-09, 10:29
Hi, anyone have any comments on The Aristo? kinda like this development as it is very unique. Think it is selling around 900psf. Think is kinda high...

I kind of like the project as well, but quite turn off went I found out that the carpark is mechanical and there isnt any lot for guest. but if you have no carpark issue, personally think this project quite worth for money for that area, less than $1k psf.

gfoo
19-01-09, 11:10
Hi, anyone have any comments on The Aristo? kinda like this development as it is very unique. Think it is selling around 900psf. Think is kinda high...

Very small, balconies and bay windows take up 30% of gross floor area, dun like the idea of mechanical carpark, extremely extremely small land area.

it's a shame that they tore down the butterfly house to build this monstrosity

Joyland
19-01-09, 14:32
I think they are keeping the butterfly house and convert it into waiting lounge and lobby. That is one of its selling point, blending the heritage of the butterfly house and the modern architecture. beautiful... something really niche and unique.



Very small, balconies and bay windows take up 30% of gross floor area, dun like the idea of mechanical carpark, extremely extremely small land area.

it's a shame that they tore down the butterfly house to build this monstrosity

Sean.G
19-01-09, 19:40
Is there really a market for those 30-40 unit developments on a piece of land that used to be 2-3 bungalows then torn down?

I thought it would be good for own stay but super low investment potential. Furthurmore, this kinda development will have almost no maintenance (see the few along kembagan MRT, now abt one year old but look like they have been there for 10 yrs.. exterior paint look so worn out).

Personally I feel if you wanna buy htis kinda devt you shouldn't pay more than 500psf. Even in boom times....

kal
19-01-09, 20:07
I find Aristo is nice too, except the big planter area.. Those high floor seaview units are definitely command much better seaview than those in SEAVIEW condo..

muffin
19-01-09, 20:56
Hi Petmail, yup...you can check the papers.

Petmail
20-01-09, 01:53
Hi Petmail, yup...you can check the papers.


subsale units is it? but honestly if 6xxpsf really can buy for condo in telok kurau is really rare... only amery and pge.

:)
Pet

Petmail
20-01-09, 02:08
I kind of like the project as well, but quite turn off went I found out that the carpark is mechanical and there isnt any lot for guest. but if you have no carpark issue, personally think this project quite worth for money for that area, less than $1k psf.


This is cause your guess can choose to park at Chinese Swimming Club instead. the carpark allocation nowadays are mostly 1:1 regardless if it a small or big projects.

:)
Pet

Sean.G
20-01-09, 21:27
With goverment assistance targeted at SMEs and middle to lower income group, and job market targeted at helping new graduates, I think that this would help HDB and lower tier-ed condo prices.

This means that mid-level and luxury condo prices will take a big hit. Anyone shares the same sentiments?:beats-me-man:

latour
21-01-09, 08:25
With goverment assistance targeted at SMEs and middle to lower income group, and job market targeted at helping new graduates, I think that this would help HDB and lower tier-ed condo prices.

This means that mid-level and luxury condo prices will take a big hit. Anyone shares the same sentiments?:beats-me-man:

Somewhat share the same sentiment, however its still early days as the tighten economy and uncertain market is entering. Wait and see for Q1 and relook again in Q2 is on my mind. This downturn and all those govt assistance etc. etc. will take some time for pple to 'react' so the 'correction' time may be 12 to 18 months.

gfoo
21-01-09, 08:39
With analysts expecting some 200,000 foreigners to depart Singapore this year, not only will those apartments coming online in 09 like One Amber/Esta etc face even more difficulty. On property guru alone, for the Esta there are already over 100 listings for rentals.

Thus my previous price watch can be thrown out of the door. I expect at least a further 25% downwards revision in psf values.

hongdaye
21-01-09, 09:22
test...
test...

august
21-01-09, 10:04
With goverment assistance targeted at SMEs and middle to lower income group, and job market targeted at helping new graduates, I think that this would help HDB and lower tier-ed condo prices.

This means that mid-level and luxury condo prices will take a big hit. Anyone shares the same sentiments?:beats-me-man:

goverment has to help the majority middle and lower class ma, cannot always help the big boys.
Anyway the rich even though their wealth maybe diminished but they are still very well off and more than capable of taking care of themselves.:spliff:

VIPCLUB2004
21-01-09, 15:46
http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2008/fortune/0812/gallery.worst_markets.fortune/index.html?cnn=yes

From CNN money, predicts that popular USA real estate will drop another 20% more in 2009, and continue to drop a few % in 2010, and I believe the SG case is quite close to the USA case....

2009 is a year of drop futher & drop futher :D :D

Sean.G
21-01-09, 22:12
tmr is the budget! so exciting. Finally some light might be shed on how the property market will take the news.

Property tax cuts or tax holidays might help buffer and strengthen the holding power of current investors...

But i tink the real property price correction might only come in 12 mths time. I tink we must consider indonesian and china economy as well cos these are the major investors in Singapore property. So since indonesia and even china are not spared....i can forsee alot of them letting go of their Singapore investments for liquidity.

I think i better order the Saturday newspapers regularly to see what gets thrown into the market in the classifieds.

lbb
22-01-09, 20:38
$6XXpsf??? SERIOUS???


Yup, I called the developer as well, quoted me the same price. Which I think is really too steep for such a development. BUT eh, 6xx, how big was the unit? gfoo showed me some PGE units that are going for 6xx psf on propertyguru.com, but those were the penthouse units i think. 2000+ sqft. I would grab any normal 3BR apt at PGE if it goes at 600psf.

Joyland
23-01-09, 10:42
If you look at the floor plans for the Aristo, the planter may take up a lot of "wasted" space and it makes the whole unit look somewhat small. However, there are no HS and only 1 common bath, think this will somewhat compensate for the planter area.



I find Aristo is nice too, except the big planter area.. Those high floor seaview units are definitely command much better seaview than those in SEAVIEW condo..

dtrax
23-01-09, 12:04
If you look at the floor plans for the Aristo, the planter may take up a lot of "wasted" space and it makes the whole unit look somewhat small. However, there are no HS and only 1 common bath, think this will somewhat compensate for the planter area.

for those facing the seaview, the large planter area is probably a plus. I think can even setup al fresco dinner there

dtrax
23-01-09, 12:05
There are pros and cons for a single bathrm and no HS. W/o HS there will be no storage area and are single bathrm might not be ideal if renting out, i.e 2 persons or even small family.. without having to fight for toilets

gfoo
23-01-09, 13:57
Business Times - Transactions for Jan 5 to Jan 16
vs PropertyGuru Jan 23 listings (asking)

One Amber
BT: $797psf
PG: $794.63
Difference: par

Esta
BT: $808psf
PG: $834
Difference: 3%



hmmm. assuming there is a typical 1 month lag between offer and completion, means the BT units were sold during the peak dec holiday period when things were still somewhat rosy. if every other month reduce by $50psf like one amber, will it hit $550psf by July? heh heh :p

it'll be interesting to see the post CNY syndrome, ie BT transactions for 1 March onwards.

focus
23-01-09, 16:25
No need to think .. sure confirmed drop.
It's already official , a lot of countries announcing they are in recession.
Singapore (The most resilient) started dishing out "RESILENCE PACKAGE".. (1st time dipping into the RESERVE)
You know how bad it is already right?

firec
23-01-09, 21:16
After CNY? Massive retrenchments will hit all of us. If you survive, you may buy a condo and invest in blue chips to reward yourself.

Sean.G
23-01-09, 21:40
Cheers gfoo! If really one amber end up 550 psf..maybe we can become neighbours!:cheers6:

focus
24-01-09, 11:11
After CNY? Massive retrenchments will hit all of us. If you survive, you may buy a condo and invest in blue chips to reward yourself.

Sorry, I'm immune to the retrenchment part..
I am already unemployed for a long time.

gfoo
24-01-09, 15:41
Cheers gfoo! If really one amber end up 550 psf..maybe we can become neighbours!:cheers6:

yup yup! a lot of developers and investors were praying for the budget to drive up demand side. That obviously is no longer happening. Watch out for the next few months after CNY - i suspect prices are going down fast and furious once reality hits home. Even that Esta post about $800psf hard to come by - well, we shall see.

Just went to Coastal Breeze and Ris Haven. At CB, opening price is $600+ for a 99 year old. My mouth open say $400 plus i maybe consider. Well, the agent just called me again after i reached home say can negotiate. Please lor, $500psf can get similar size Freehold at telok kurau liao. Who would pay $600 for pasir ris 99 years? let's not even talk about the poor folks at quartz etc.

Also went to Natura Loft - Sheesh - $770k for a 5 rm flat? no swimming pool, completely made-in-china etc. I told them if i buy, i expect them to give me the Tiguan, dun need lucky draw. That guy didn't flinch. lol, guess a lot of similar requests too.

anyways, here's wishing all a most prosperious and resilient year of the ox. HUAT AH!

coburn
24-01-09, 16:19
Just went to Coastal Breeze and Ris Haven. At CB, opening price is $600+ for a 99 year old. My mouth open say $400 plus i maybe consider. Well, the agent just called me again after i reached home say can negotiate. Please lor, $500psf can get similar size Freehold at telok kurau liao. Who would pay $600 for pasir ris 99 years? let's not even talk about the poor folks at quartz etc.



Hi gfoo

Can you share which freehold development(s) in telok kurau are going for 500psf?

I just started looking for a 3 bedroom for own stay and telok kurau is one area that I am considering.. 500psf sounds attractive to me

Thanks!

gfoo
24-01-09, 16:34
Hi gfoo

Can you share which freehold development(s) in telok kurau are going for 500psf?

I just started looking for a 3 bedroom for own stay and telok kurau is one area that I am considering.. 500psf sounds attractive to me

Thanks!
glacier penthouse, abt 2000sqft, 100k+ or reno thrown in. check in property guru.

1500 sqft pthouse, lagenda, joo chiat, 99 years, i think slightly below 800k.

there are tons.

you can also try the newer launches.

maya at still road still got some units left, can bargain to $5xx

but the true value for these at $300-400+. you are technically subsidizing developers for their high land purchases during 2006/2007

psohgrove going for $800+, beacon at $700+ - you would be an idiot to buy at those prices now in this kind of climate.

i would wait

coburn
24-01-09, 20:48
glacier penthouse, abt 2000sqft, 100k+ or reno thrown in. check in property guru.

1500 sqft pthouse, lagenda, joo chiat, 99 years, i think slightly below 800k.

there are tons.

you can also try the newer launches.

maya at still road still got some units left, can bargain to $5xx

but the true value for these at $300-400+. you are technically subsidizing developers for their high land purchases during 2006/2007

psohgrove going for $800+, beacon at $700+ - you would be an idiot to buy at those prices now in this kind of climate.

i would wait

thanks for the info...

been to glacier... dont really like it.. rooms are pretty small... balcony is too big for me
and penthouse units should go for lower psf.. as there is plenty of "unuseable" space... if the normal units are going for say 500 psf, then i would expect penthouse units to go for 450psf

will check out maya

thanks!

myxzyden
25-01-09, 19:10
Business Times - Transactions for Jan 5 to Jan 16
vs PropertyGuru Jan 23 listings (asking)

One Amber
BT: $797psf
PG: $794.63
Difference: par

Esta
BT: $808psf
PG: $834
Difference: 3%



hmmm. assuming there is a typical 1 month lag between offer and completion, means the BT units were sold during the peak dec holiday period when things were still somewhat rosy. if every other month reduce by $50psf like one amber, will it hit $550psf by July? heh heh :p

it'll be interesting to see the post CNY syndrome, ie BT transactions for 1 March onwards.

Thanks for the helpful post gfoo. I'm also looking for a FH condo in D15/16 and these 2 project tops my wish list now. Actually I'm kinda surprised that One Amber price has dipped below the esta, I've always hav the impression tht OA is of a better value than TE. What gives?

gfoo
25-01-09, 23:38
Thanks for the helpful post gfoo. I'm also looking for a FH condo in D15/16 and these 2 project tops my wish list now. Actually I'm kinda surprised that One Amber price has dipped below the esta, I've always hav the impression tht OA is of a better value than TE. What gives?

Some valid reasons:
1. density per plot area for OA is far higher than Esta. Just compare the measly OA swimming pool vs Esta's pools

2. DPS effect will hit OA far worse than Esta. Coz Esta TOPed in 08, most if not all have already gotten their loans in check.

3. Unit in hand allows for immediate rentals. Many esta rental contracts negotiated in 08, so what can be rented out has been. when OA TOPs, it does so in a virtually negative rental environment - ie more rental defaults, much more supply, than demand. At least esta had spillover effect from sea view for those that want to stay in same area but cheaper than sea view

4. Esta you can now check out qualilty, fittings, actual facilities etc. OA it's still brochureware until TOP. pple pay a slight premium for this tangibility

OA is poised for a drop that might shock you guys. quite simply, go find out how many are under DPS and have yet to get loans, and more importantly, go do a count of how many OA units are out in the market crying for buyers. IF TOP is gonna be say Sept or so, pwah lau eh - i think even $700 considered super generous.

already, stevens road TOPed freehold going for $900psf with reno thrown in.

gfoo
28-01-09, 03:27
Transacted in past week (this is from me enquiring/bidding on things i liked but lost)

- 2006 designer interterrace off siglap - $380psf
- poshgrove penthouse - $570psf
- new development along mountbatten stretch (i promised the agent not to tell, but you guys can prob already guess) - $660psf
- one amber 3rm above #20th floor - $760psf (sold at par or slight loss)
- the rochester type A loft - $840psf

I just don't get it - why people are still looking at 99 year at kovan and pasir ris at $700psf, when if not for greedy CDL/FEO/LB, fair value is $300-400psf. i guess there's always a sucker or two out there.

also, be very very wary of agent asking prices and developer's actual asking price. my mom in Nov bought a place at sembawang, 5000sqft at $1.32m, with full designer renovation thrown in including furnishings (showunit). Agent chut price is $1.74m bare. Propertyguru avg price is $1.45m bare - all bull shitters

Petmail
28-01-09, 05:19
Yup, I called the developer as well, quoted me the same price. Which I think is really too steep for such a development. BUT eh, 6xx, how big was the unit? gfoo showed me some PGE units that are going for 6xx psf on propertyguru.com, but those were the penthouse units i think. 2000+ sqft. I would grab any normal 3BR apt at PGE if it goes at 600psf.

I suppose you should have buy the unit down if really the sales person did tell you that its direct from developer. cos savils is the marketing agent for Poshgrove East and I am very sure that the price of even the patio unit on the ground is not getting any close to 800psf not to mention that its going for 6XXpsf. somehow, i may be wrong.. but its really a good buy though @ 6XXpsf!!! if you wanna anything below $600psf, drop me a line @ 82818888. I do have a resale beautifully renovated spacious 3bedroom unit going for a firm price of $522psf ONLY!!!

:)
Pet

Petmail
28-01-09, 06:05
glacier penthouse, abt 2000sqft, 100k+ or reno thrown in. check in property guru.

1500 sqft pthouse, lagenda, joo chiat, 99 years, i think slightly below 800k.

there are tons.

you can also try the newer launches.

maya at still road still got some units left, can bargain to $5xx

but the true value for these at $300-400+. you are technically subsidizing developers for their high land purchases during 2006/2007

psohgrove going for $800+, beacon at $700+ - you would be an idiot to buy at those prices now in this kind of climate.

i would wait

bro, dun anyhow bomb leh.. maya fully sold couple of months back liao.. new owner already moved in liao.. if resale by owner then I wouldn't know but developer balance units confirm + guarantee + chop also dun have!!! :)

the glacier you spoken about think is a 3+1 Penthouse 2250sqft from developer but think minimum offer will probably consider @ close to $577psf only. it was previously a showflat with the renovation inclusive for the last four years if I am not wrong. :)

The Poshgrove East unit is a resale unit 4bedroom Penthouse market by L2G and not direct from developer. :)

However, I find that nature mansion seems to be quite a good buy @ 5XXpsf though.

:)
Pet

Geylang OKT
28-01-09, 06:21
The Glacier is next to Joo Chiat Terrace? :D

gfoo
28-01-09, 09:57
din bomb deh, this was after i sms and call agents. glacier is subsale and it's far below $577. poshgrove is subsale and has been sold, both are not direct from developer.

but the point being - developers still have not woken up. Poshgrove pple last time but $4xx, now selling $5xx on the subsale market. Developer asking $8xx to $9xx, say absorb stamp duty. Mana ada logik?


bro, dun anyhow bomb leh.. maya fully sold couple of months back liao.. new owner already moved in liao.. if resale by owner then I wouldn't know but developer balance units confirm + guarantee + chop also dun have!!! :)

the glacier you spoken about think is a 3+1 Penthouse 2250sqft from developer but think minimum offer will probably consider @ close to $577psf only. it was previously a showflat with the renovation inclusive for the last four years if I am not wrong. :)

The Poshgrove East unit is a resale unit 4bedroom Penthouse market by L2G and not direct from developer. :)

However, I find that nature mansion seems to be quite a good buy @ 5XXpsf though.

:)
Pet

focus
28-01-09, 15:27
gfoo, how do you find out what was the last transacted price of the condo or land you are interested in?

I wanna know coz I don wanna get chop or at least know the seller's buying price.

gfoo
28-01-09, 19:09
crossref ura last transacted, then crossref livesingapore 2006up transactions. The latter will give you a good base on the cost to the seller, and the 1-2 month ago market price (if you see URA listing today, means 1-2 months old pricing after allowing for option period, exercise period, conveyancing etc)

then armed with this info, go into iprop/pguru/papers and start sms-ing enquiries. once you start the bargain process, you will see that especially for D15, those w/o holding power (ie subsales), are willing to let go far below what the agent's mouth says. developers w/o holding power can also try. but most developers still haven't woken up yet, and some like poshgrove's developer trying to sell at almost 200psf more than subsales.

Basically, unless you find a decent developer, buying now does not make any sense, i would wait till June-Sep. The fair value for Katong area, after months of cross ref, and assuming economic recovery in 2H 2010, is:

Landed: $400psf
Apartment status <2yrs old: $500psf
Condo status: $600psf

You cannot compare to HDB $400psf - those units have seaview plus close to great amenities, excellent future SERS opportunity, negligible running costs, and ultimate protection from economic default. Businessmen are turning to HDB coz it provides asset protection esp if you take a HDB loan.

If you buy One Amber at $700-750psf, and it's own stay, great view etc - i would say fine, go for it. Coz even if it drops down to $500-$600 psf, you're staying in it. But if you want to get one for investment, wait longer - you should buy ONLY when rental rates stabilize and bottom out, and then you work on a basis of 3-5% yield to calculate backwards fair value.

But whether stay or invest, if you only have enough liquidity for 20% down, and borrow the best, i would not advise that. For one, banks are now lending at best 70%. If your property price falls by more than 20%, there is always the risk banks will call you to top up.

That's why i do not agree that there are many cash rich investors on the sidelines waiting to plunge in. Yes, there are many cash rich people, but in a crisis, the well heeled and informed rather be more prudent and hoard cash. Many of my friends are now thinking of doing this:

- join together to buy a bungalow with land in D15 on the cheap once values fall sufficiently. there are tons of such at frankel, fidelio, meyer, etc
- tear it down and redevelop
- live in half, sell or rent the rest
- you get a home for free just for sacrificing some free cash up front

As for those that said if prices fall back to $4xx levels, the economy is going to be shit, i say to you that the economy is already shit. All the warning signs were there in 2008 and if you haven't exited your property yet, you were either too greedy, or thought you had the holding power. If you are today equity positive, good for you . If not, life's tough, live with it.

like i said time will tell.

PS: again, the ONLY things that can reverse this decline is mass inflation or hyperinflation in a singdollar freefall. but that prob won;t happen anytime soon


gfoo, how do you find out what was the last transacted price of the condo or land you are interested in?

I wanna know coz I don wanna get chop or at least know the seller's buying price.

pegasus
28-01-09, 21:41
If people plan to buy after Jun 09 (even ST reported on this), then property prices may not fall but instead go up, thanks to the herd instinct. For units sold at < S$900 psf, don't underestimate the holding power of the 1st-hand purchasers. Those who bought for investment/speculation (read property agents!!) would have cashed out by now. How many units of the recently-TOP condos are selling below original purchase price ? Even with falling rentals, one can get 3.5% yield on the orginal price.

Sean.G
28-01-09, 22:19
I believe when people say they intend to buy in 6 mths time, prices will still not soar because:

1. We don't know how many people have survived the downturn and are in a good position to but when Q3 comes about.

2. Even if there are many buyers out there, it will likely be scavengers like us. Scavenger mentality is that if it is out of our price range, we rather let it go than go headstrong and try to outbid the idiot who offers a higher price.

3. So far all the people I know are looking to buy a place for own stay taking advantage of the fall in prices back to reality and affordability.

From my (non-expert) opinion, usually when everyone predicts Q3, we might actually see buyers come into market in Q2 if economy is really bad, or Q4 or 2010 if economy holds up and sellers can afford to wait longer. In any case, it will take someone with really big balls or really small brain to bet that property market will go up in 2009 regardless of which quarter.:spliff:

dtrax
28-01-09, 22:41
I believe when people say they intend to buy in 6 mths time, prices will still not soar because:

1. We don't know how many people have survived the downturn and are in a good position to but when Q3 comes about.

2. Even if there are many buyers out there, it will likely be scavengers like us. Scavenger mentality is that if it is out of our price range, we rather let it go than go headstrong and try to outbid the idiot who offers a higher price.

3. So far all the people I know are looking to buy a place for own stay taking advantage of the fall in prices back to reality and affordability.

From my (non-expert) opinion, usually when everyone predicts Q3, we might actually see buyers come into market in Q2 if economy is really bad, or Q4 or 2010 if economy holds up and sellers can afford to wait longer. In any case, it will take someone with really big balls or really small brain to bet that property market will go up in 2009 regardless of which quarter.:spliff:


1. We don't know how many people have survived the downturn and are in a good position to but when Q3 comes about.
- This is the factor that remains to be seen, right now for those who are willing to wait when economy deepens and for better signals in the property market. Check out bloomberg and you will know every single day, bad news are happening to many companies

2. Even if there are many buyers out there, it will likely be scavengers like us. Scavenger mentality is that if it is out of our price range, we rather let it go than go headstrong and try to outbid the idiot who offers a higher price.
- Certainly for investors who are looking for gd deals and that's what I'm doing.

3. So far all the people I know are looking to buy a place for own stay taking advantage of the fall in prices back to reality and affordability.
- I agree and my sdis is an example

focus
29-01-09, 15:01
crossref ura last transacted, then crossref livesingapore 2006up transactions. The latter will give you a good base on the cost to the seller, and the 1-2 month ago market price (if you see URA listing today, means 1-2 months old pricing after allowing for option period, exercise period, conveyancing etc)

then armed with this info, go into iprop/pguru/papers and start sms-ing enquiries. once you start the bargain process, you will see that especially for D15, those w/o holding power (ie subsales), are willing to let go far below what the agent's mouth says. developers w/o holding power can also try. but most developers still haven't woken up yet, and some like poshgrove's developer trying to sell at almost 200psf more than subsales.

Basically, unless you find a decent developer, buying now does not make any sense, i would wait till June-Sep. The fair value for Katong area, after months of cross ref, and assuming economic recovery in 2H 2010, is:

Landed: $400psf
Apartment status <2yrs old: $500psf
Condo status: $600psf

You cannot compare to HDB $400psf - those units have seaview plus close to great amenities, excellent future SERS opportunity, negligible running costs, and ultimate protection from economic default. Businessmen are turning to HDB coz it provides asset protection esp if you take a HDB loan.



Thanks , gfoo!! :) That's a great help! First time know of Livesingapore.com

And great explaination on the property hunt! :)

I think the grouping of investors to buy land and rebuilt is a sure-win proposition.. Remember it was the same in 2003 , remember newspaper reporting people buying land in katong and rebuilting for sale.. I guess they are now multi-millionaires if they were doing group investments.

How much you guys going to put in .. maybe got time, come out and kopi and see whether I can chip in ..

lbb
30-01-09, 23:44
I suppose you should have buy the unit down if really the sales person did tell you that its direct from developer. cos savils is the marketing agent for Poshgrove East and I am very sure that the price of even the patio unit on the ground is not getting any close to 800psf not to mention that its going for 6XXpsf. somehow, i may be wrong.. but its really a good buy though @ 6XXpsf!!! if you wanna anything below $600psf, drop me a line @ 82818888. I do have a resale beautifully renovated spacious 3bedroom unit going for a firm price of $522psf ONLY!!!

:)
Pet

Hey Pet, haha, thanks for the offer. I saw the ad on the 522psf place as well. But guess I'm already leaning to PGE and The Esta. I'm willing to wait, so I shall see if the prices fall to a level which I believe is worth paying and also a level which I can afford la. Guess it's a gamble. If PGE drops to 6xx, it was a good wait. If it doesn't, then I'll just take it that it's beyond my range la. Oh and for the PGE that was on propertyguru, it was a subsale if I'm not wrong. (i might be wrong!)

Cheers mate, and Happy New Year to you (and everyone else)
Here's to fruitful property hunting(and business for the agents around)
(:

Petmail
31-01-09, 10:39
Hey Pet, haha, thanks for the offer. I saw the ad on the 522psf place as well. But guess I'm already leaning to PGE and The Esta. I'm willing to wait, so I shall see if the prices fall to a level which I believe is worth paying and also a level which I can afford la. Guess it's a gamble. If PGE drops to 6xx, it was a good wait. If it doesn't, then I'll just take it that it's beyond my range la. Oh and for the PGE that was on propertyguru, it was a subsale if I'm not wrong. (i might be wrong!)

Cheers mate, and Happy New Year to you (and everyone else)
Here's to fruitful property hunting(and business for the agents around)
(:

Yes.. that unit is a sub-sale unit. And I seriously think its really a good buy since you are keen in pge.

:)
Pet

lbb
04-02-09, 18:50
Yes.. that unit is a sub-sale unit. And I seriously think its really a good buy since you are keen in pge.

:)
Pet

Yeah it's a good price psf. But when multiplied by the unit size, it puts it beyond my budget. Haha, so back to my same ol' waiting and hoping (:

firec
07-02-09, 21:19
Is PGE the same as Poshgrove East? I just went to the developer sale marketed by Savills.

The 3+1 units are tiny. And goodness- even though they offer to "reimburse" the stamp duty, the net price is still around 900psf.

At the risk of being flamed, my honest personal valuation of PGE for non-patio units is 700psf.

And if both One Amber and PGE are selling at the same psf, I would take One Amber any day.

gfoo
07-02-09, 22:11
Is PGE the same as Poshgrove East? I just went to the developer sale marketed by Savills.

The 3+1 units are tiny. And goodness- even though they offer to "reimburse" the stamp duty, the net price is still around 900psf.

At the risk of being flamed, my honest personal valuation of PGE for non-patio units is 700psf.

And if both One Amber and PGE are selling at the same psf, I would take One Amber any day.

please don't get conned by the developer. subsales last transacted for penthouse was $550psf a week or two ago. look out for subsales, they bought it cheap then.

poshgrove has too much concrete, so much so the pool looks more like a concrete longkang than a pool. landscaping is minimal due to the concrete.

lbb
09-02-09, 21:04
please don't get conned by the developer. subsales last transacted for penthouse was $550psf a week or two ago. look out for subsales, they bought it cheap then.

poshgrove has too much concrete, so much so the pool looks more like a concrete longkang than a pool. landscaping is minimal due to the concrete.

Hey guys. Well I havent taken a first hand look at PGE myself. Just drive past it a couple of times per week and stuff. But reading your comments, wow, really! The 'Artist Impression' was really impressive luh! What a let down. But I agree that i'll get One Amber instead of PGE if both are of the same price.

Then again, I think the older condos in the east have their own charm. BP, MG, the Laguna-s. I'm still considering la. Times are such that must think alot before coming out with the cash.

gfoo
09-02-09, 21:06
Hey guys. Well I havent taken a first hand look at PGE myself. Just drive past it a couple of times per week and stuff. But reading your comments, wow, really! The 'Artist Impression' was really impressive luh! What a let down. But I agree that i'll get One Amber instead of PGE if both are of the same price.

Then again, I think the older condos in the east have their own charm. BP, MG, the Laguna-s. I'm still considering la. Times are such that must think alot before coming out with the cash.

i love the older condos, esp mandarin gardens. have you seen the obscenely huge land area vs low density of the condo?

lbb
09-02-09, 21:19
i love the older condos, esp mandarin gardens. have you seen the obscenely huge land area vs low density of the condo?

Exactly bro, I was always a Bayshore Park lover though. Lush greenery all around that development. MG is awesome as well. Long land with really sweeping views. My alma mater is next to it as well. Got some emotional thingy. Heh.

I would grab Bayshore Park if it reaches 2006-ish levels.

myxzyden
09-02-09, 22:33
Exactly bro, I was always a Bayshore Park lover though. Lush greenery all around that development. MG is awesome as well. Long land with really sweeping views. My alma mater is next to it as well. Got some emotional thingy. Heh.

I would grab Bayshore Park if it reaches 2006-ish levels.

What was the 2006 level?
It's 99LH and almost 10 years already right?

lbb
10-02-09, 16:45
What was the 2006 level?
It's 99LH and almost 10 years already right?

Yup it's 99LH. And if I'm not wrong 20+ years already!
Haha, but beyond the numbers it boasts of spaciousness, good views and a nice location. Not as crowded as either The Bayshore or Costa Del Sol too.

Hmmm, 2006 you could find units at 5xx psf iirc. Pretty decent.

Sean.G
10-02-09, 22:21
I think we are in a period of limbo.

1) No new lauches worth considering, as developers are not stupid to lauch a really worthwhile project now.

2) Sellers caught in the 2007 price rush still cannot accept reality that people don't just fork out > 1mil for a crampy apartment anymore.

3) Buyers who are really out there to buy a place to stay cannot find a decent place yet due to the different expectations in price.

4) CNY over, all quiet. Not only TSV thread quiet. The once hot Esta and One Amber threads also gone quiet.

Its just like the calm before the storm.

Read a thread on property guru saying the corporate team will only invest in property in 12 mths time. I agree its crap advice too. If you're buying for own stay, generally anytime is a good time as long as the place is to your liking and fits your budget.

So if you haven't found your dream place....feel free to keep waiting. But if you have found your dream home...no harm trying to bargain down to a price you can afford.

Heard from a banker friend that now bank's take at least 2 weeks to get back to you on approval of loan. AND they will look at your job and its stability before they tell you how much they can loan you.

All these factors all force the Singapore property market to continue in this limbo state till another bad news / good news hits.

So i guess all can take some time to :sleep: rather than keep :banghead: thinking when will it hit the pits before you buy.

WolleyDragon
11-02-09, 08:41
I think we are in a period of limbo.

1) No new lauches worth considering, as developers are not stupid to lauch a really worthwhile project now.

2) Sellers caught in the 2007 price rush still cannot accept reality that people don't just fork out > 1mil for a crampy apartment anymore.

3) Buyers who are really out there to buy a place to stay cannot find a decent place yet due to the different expectations in price.

4) CNY over, all quiet. Not only TSV thread quiet. The once hot Esta and One Amber threads also gone quiet.



When I was viewing those crappy apartments in 2007/early 2008 that were asking 800 to 1000 psf.. I was thinking how crazy it was to put down good money for these type of small, facility-less apartments (Imagine $1 Million plus for a 1,200 sqft telok K apartment?!!?)

Right now, I wonder how those owners feel.. do they dare to do a current valuation on the same apartment that cost them $1 Million 1-2 yrs back??? my own guess is that the true fair value of these telok K apartments are worth at most $500K for a 1,200 sqft.

VIPCLUB2004
11-02-09, 10:06
:sleep: more and do more exercise, pay more attention the property market in 2010 :D

Two of my friends lost their job last week, both work in big big companies, one local company and one US company, and one of them just bought a NEW car when the COE was low in Dec 2008 :doh:

Save more and let others to spend more to save the economy :D

noblebaby
15-02-09, 20:49
FH really has more value than 99LH?

Douk
16-02-09, 16:17
Definitely, just compare old project at bayshore and meyer, you will see the difference..


FH really has more value than 99LH?

lbb
17-02-09, 18:47
Definitely, just compare old project at bayshore and meyer, you will see the difference..

It's true that the FH vs LH consideration does impact the value for both the examples you mentioned above. However, Meyer's superior location is another reason for the high premium it commands. It is nearer to the city than Bayshore, and also the IR. I guess this gives it the edge as well?

Petmail
19-02-09, 00:37
It's true that the FH vs LH consideration does impact the value for both the examples you mentioned above. However, Meyer's superior location is another reason for the high premium it commands. It is nearer to the city than Bayshore, and also the IR. I guess this gives it the edge as well?

you are right!

:)
Pet

lbb
24-02-09, 22:26
Hey guys, saw this ad in today's Classifieds about some preview project in Meyer Road. Any idea what's it, and where exactly?

I don't remember any upcoming project there le. Anyway, just asking for fun.. Meyer price tag too big to fit in my pocket.

Cheers!

Douk
24-02-09, 22:34
may be some small projects at margate road..



Hey guys, saw this ad in today's Classifieds about some preview project in Meyer Road. Any idea what's it, and where exactly?

I don't remember any upcoming project there le. Anyway, just asking for fun.. Meyer price tag too big to fit in my pocket.

Cheers!

VIPCLUB2004
26-02-09, 13:59
I wait for the condo index to hit 120 :sleep: :sleep: :sleep:

https://www.ura.gov.sg/pr/graphics/2009/pr09-04a7.pdf

Petmail
28-02-09, 00:12
Hey guys, saw this ad in today's Classifieds about some preview project in Meyer Road. Any idea what's it, and where exactly?

I don't remember any upcoming project there le. Anyway, just asking for fun.. Meyer price tag too big to fit in my pocket.

Cheers!

think might be next to my de centurion showflat! heard launching minimum 1400-1600psf onwards...

:)
Pet

trixie
02-03-09, 12:10
why are prices for one amber and esta still so expensive? still 800 - 900psf...
and i went to East Coast Residences showroom yesterday, the agent quoted me 800 - 850 psf.. is it worth getting it? or since it's from the agent, i can still slash the price? by how much? ECR is in D16 though....
appreciate your advise.. :)

noblebaby
02-03-09, 12:38
why are prices for one amber and esta still so expensive? still 800 - 900psf...
and i went to East Coast Residences showroom yesterday, the agent quoted me 800 - 850 psf.. is it worth getting it? or since it's from the agent, i can still slash the price? by how much? ECR is in D16 though....
appreciate your advise.. :)

no way to drop below 650sqft :tsk-tsk:

gfoo
03-03-09, 07:59
I have made a mistake by buying too early, even if my price was close to launch. oh well, can't be right all the time.

Thus, i've set aside some money shorting the S&P as a hedge. i hope it's enough

still strongly believe in the marina bay potential though.

noblebaby
03-03-09, 08:06
I have made a mistake by buying too early, even if my price was close to launch. oh well, can't be right all the time.

Thus, i've set aside some money shorting the S&P as a hedge. i hope it's enough

still strongly believe in the marina bay potential though.

why? Price for marina sails dropping again?

gfoo
03-03-09, 08:10
not yet, we shall see

gut feel - i hope i'm wrong

those who have bought into areas that do not have huge committed infrastructural and development buildouts, and not at launch price, you will have to be prepared.

i worry for those who bought into alexis for the medium term

lakeside, orchard, marina, and buona vista - at least has some mitigating factors as long as you bought at launch price pre 06

noblebaby
03-03-09, 08:12
not yet, we shall see

gut feel - i hope i'm wrong

since you were already factored in 10% drop during your purchase, then should be ok right?

yeah... buying all put to insure my big chips.... not worry... :sleep:

gfoo
03-03-09, 08:20
since you were already factored in 10% drop during your purchase, then should be ok right?

yeah... buying all put to insure my big chips.... not worry... :sleep:

i am lousy at market timing. just started my shorts yesterday.

previously held quite a bit of SKF since late 07. if i held on to that, i think today i buy sail penthouse liao lol.

oh well. i can only do the best my small, feeble mind allows

august
03-03-09, 10:44
I have made a mistake by buying too early, even if my price was close to launch. oh well, can't be right all the time.

Thus, i've set aside some money shorting the S&P as a hedge. i hope it's enough

still strongly believe in the marina bay potential though.

marina has potential, problem now is that potential may not be realised for quite some time.. i hv doubts that the two IRs will really take off as much as the govt hope for..

u buy for own stay is ok lah, buy for investment will be diff story

focus
03-03-09, 12:53
I would think MBR and Sail are the two that will stand tall..
It is sandwiched between bankers and casino-ers...
These two type of executives are all highly paid and rental shouldn't be a problem if the view is fantastic?.

And like what gfoo says.. you can see the committed infrastructure around the bay area taking place .. that place is the spotlight of the new singapore

Petmail
03-03-09, 15:21
I have made a mistake by buying too early, even if my price was close to launch. oh well, can't be right all the time.

Thus, i've set aside some money shorting the S&P as a hedge. i hope it's enough

still strongly believe in the marina bay potential though.

Dun worry bro... Trust me!!! I am confidence in time to come you will confirm plus gurantee plus chop sure make money one!!! ALthough I am not the one who sell you this unit.

:)
Pet

gfoo
04-03-09, 16:19
Dun worry bro... Trust me!!! I am confidence in time to come you will confirm plus gurantee plus chop sure make money one!!! ALthough I am not the one who sell you this unit.

:)
Pet

thanks for your vote of confidence bro, let's have coffee soon.

we shall see. in the meantime, i'm shorting the market

noblebaby
04-03-09, 17:01
thanks for your vote of confidence bro, let's have coffee soon.

we shall see. in the meantime, i'm shorting the market

we are in the same boat... short ah!!!

Petmail
04-03-09, 18:11
thanks for your vote of confidence bro, let's have coffee soon.

we shall see. in the meantime, i'm shorting the market


coffee anytime bro.. mark my word.. it will shoot really high up in no time to come!

;)
Pet

toaler
04-03-09, 20:27
coffee anytime bro.. mark my word.. it will shoot really high up in no time to come!

;)
Pet

zero credibility when that statement comes from an agent

lbb
04-03-09, 22:00
zero credibility when that statement comes from an agent

Chill man, Pet has been here for quite sometime already. And he behaves just like every normal forumer. Go easy on the agents yeah, they got to earn a living too.


Cheers Toaler, let's have constructive discussions here yup!

P.S - i'm not an agent just in case you're wondering. (:

noblebaby
04-03-09, 23:16
coffee anytime bro.. mark my word.. it will shoot really high up in no time to come!

;)
Pet

Waiting STI 1200... S&P 650 :spliff:

Property_Owner
05-03-09, 08:50
Waiting STI 1200... S&P 650 :spliff:

1200? So high? I'm waiting for below 1000 to enter again:spliff:

myxzyden
05-03-09, 12:27
just got a quote from "the world's local bank", OA is valued at 750psf now...

Seems like standing strong eh....

East Lover
05-03-09, 12:37
just got a quote from "the world's local bank", OA is valued at 750psf now...

Seems like standing strong eh....
"the actual local bank" can even valued OA at 820psf.:cool:

VIPCLUB2004
05-03-09, 12:48
"the actual local bank" can even valued OA at 820psf.:cool:

Don't know whether those bankers feel shame or not, they lose billions of $$ and still comment here & there, predict here & there, only thing they cannot predict is how much they will lose :D

gfoo
05-03-09, 17:39
so i went to my lawyer's today (she does purely conveyg)

i asked 'how's business'

she said

'very bad a couple of months ago. then all of a sudden, boom!'

'nuff said

myxzyden
05-03-09, 18:10
so i went to my lawyer's today (she does purely conveyg)

i asked 'how's business'

she said

'very bad a couple of months ago. then all of a sudden, boom!'

'nuff said
hmm... dun quite get u. Boom as in literally or blasted?

U meant the market suddenly got revived or collapsed?

gfoo
05-03-09, 18:12
revived ...
even in the waiting room, it was back to back with pple waiting for their turn to sign conveyg docs

myxzyden
05-03-09, 18:17
revived ...
even in the waiting room, it was back to back with pple waiting for their turn to sign conveyg docs

could that be the folks who bought alexis and caspian?
anyway the feb figures will be publish mid of march rite? :)

blackswan
05-03-09, 21:54
revived ...
even in the waiting room, it was back to back with pple waiting for their turn to sign conveyg docs

that's a very good sign......

august
05-03-09, 22:36
revived ...
even in the waiting room, it was back to back with pple waiting for their turn to sign conveyg docs

good good.. means less liquidity in the mkt :o

code01
10-03-09, 01:02
Don't know whether those bankers feel shame or not, they lose billions of $$ and still comment here & there, predict here & there, only thing they cannot predict is how much they will lose :D

lol thats a good one :D

proud owner
10-03-09, 07:36
lol thats a good one :D

not every bank lose money lah ...

VIPCLUB2004
26-03-09, 14:15
Nobody drop sth here for 2 weeks, seems we will get better price soon :D

sevol
20-04-09, 16:54
So how are the prices look like for the start of Q2? Just want your thoughts

For the Telok Kurau Jalans, how much lower psf can it go?=
Latest I checked is low - mid 6xx psf for FH

Autonomy
20-04-09, 17:05
So how are the prices look like for the start of Q2? Just want your thoughts

For the Telok Kurau Jalans, how much lower psf can it go?=
Latest I checked is low - mid 6xx psf for FH

I think for Telok Kurau area, it can vary a bit in terms of psf cos its spread across a big area. It depends on which lorong, whether near park connector or mrt, situated at the end or in the middle of the lorong etc...

sevol
20-04-09, 17:38
autonomy

what you say makes sense

i think as the lorongs can go deep in, i am only looking prices of apts or condos next or one condo away from park connector

middle telok kurau lorongs eg L, M, N do you think i can get a FH unit for 6xx-7xx psf?

i am looking for my in-law, she prefers small devt because she doesn't like one big village 100s of units type of devt

wondering should i go in now or wait for year end

on the website i saw a 2000sqf unit lodged at 629psf :scared-4: she cannot afford 2000sqft but a 1500+ one will do since she is a widow but i realise smaller units have higher PSFs

Autonomy
20-04-09, 19:43
autonomy

what you say makes sense

i think as the lorongs can go deep in, i am only looking prices of apts or condos next or one condo away from park connector

middle telok kurau lorongs eg L, M, N do you think i can get a FH unit for 6xx-7xx psf?

i am looking for my in-law, she prefers small devt because she doesn't like one big village 100s of units type of devt

wondering should i go in now or wait for year end

on the website i saw a 2000sqf unit lodged at 629psf :scared-4: she cannot afford 2000sqft but a 1500+ one will do since she is a widow but i realise smaller units have higher PSFs

For those lorongs that u mentioned, should be able to get those prices that u stated. But usually those that are near to park connector might fetch a slightly higher premium then those in the middle.

Does she has any concerns with regards to public transportation? I think lorong G and H are better cos they are within walking distance to the mrt(around 400m along the park connector)

And yes, smaller units definitely commands higher psf.

sevol
20-04-09, 19:58
For those lorongs that u mentioned, should be able to get those prices that u stated. But usually those that are near to park connector might fetch a slightly higher premium then those in the middle.

Does she has any concerns with regards to public transportation? I think lorong G and H are better cos they are within walking distance to the mrt(around 400m along the park connector)

And yes, smaller units definitely commands higher psf.

thanks for the info

she is not a driver so will take the mrt and taxi. i will look into G and H, thanks.
i am not familiar with the park connector, does it lead direct to MRT or does it stop at some big road crossing/junction?

So I guess if I want low 6xx in this current market, must go for bigger units ie >2000sqf?

Wonder which is a better deal, bigger with lower psf or smaller with higher psf. Very hard to help an elderly relative to buy :beats-me-man:

Autonomy
20-04-09, 20:14
thanks for the info

she is not a driver so will take the mrt and taxi. i will look into G and H, thanks.
i am not familiar with the park connector, does it lead direct to MRT or does it stop at some big road crossing/junction?

So I guess if I want low 6xx in this current market, must go for bigger units ie >2000sqf?

Wonder which is a better deal, bigger with lower psf or smaller with higher psf. Very hard to help an elderly relative to buy :beats-me-man:

The park connector leads directly to the mrt. Just need to cross two roads... Changi road and sims ave east. No major junctions and roads have traffic lights so should be no problem for elderly.

Also its a straight, direct and flat terrain via park connector to the mrt. The other end of the park connector is the east coast park. So it depends on which lorong u wanna be at. Its either nearer to mrt or nearer to east coast park.

As for buying a bigger or smaller unit, it depends on her needs and budget. If there are not too many staying then no point going for bigger units. Even though psf is lower, the quantum is higher... unless of cos got money to burn then its a different story :)

sevol
20-04-09, 21:25
The park connector leads directly to the mrt. Just need to cross two roads... Changi road and sims ave east. No major junctions and roads have traffic lights so should be no problem for elderly.

Also its a straight, direct and flat terrain via park connector to the mrt. The other end of the park connector is the east coast park. So it depends on which lorong u wanna be at. Its either nearer to mrt or nearer to east coast park.

As for buying a bigger or smaller unit, it depends on her needs and budget. If there are not too many staying then no point going for bigger units. Even though psf is lower, the quantum is higher... unless of cos got money to burn then its a different story :)

Autonomy thank you very much! Your posts have been extremely helpful

No money to burn, she is just a simple widow on sufficiently comfortable budget, nothing too extravagant :) Will let her about what your said re the park connector, she should be very happy with it.

Autonomy
20-04-09, 21:53
Autonomy thank you very much! Your posts have been extremely helpful

No money to burn, she is just a simple widow on sufficiently comfortable budget, nothing too extravagant :) Will let her about what your said re the park connector, she should be very happy with it.

No worries... one added advantage is the telok kurau park located at the park connector near lorong h if she prefers the greeneries. But I think the psf will be slightly higher for these areas.

blackswan
20-04-09, 22:50
I think there are still some left over units from Verte which is just directly in front of Telok kurau Park and just sitting beside the park connector. Was interested in the project for quite a while a few months ago so did walk from the MRT to and fro quite a couple of time and did time those walk. All in all, Autonomy said, its very easy to walk as its a straight road.

the timimg is around 10 mins (leisure walk, and jay walk a bit when the coast is clear at the traffic lights).

Must say I quite enjoy the walk as there is gentle breeze from the sea and birds chirping along the river (lokang).

the developer is Roxy Homes, and would say the furnishing is not fantastic but do believe they have smaller units of around 1500psf that you mention.

Happy searching

franzmark
20-04-09, 23:38
to get big unit with lower psf or a small unit with higher psf, I think mre importantly u shud look at the needs of the person living there. If it is an old widow (probably with some common ailments like rheumatism or arthritis) i do not see any good for her to live in a huge unit or units with stairs unless there are many people living undr 1 roof. If buying for investment, a 2bdrm unit or studio type aptment is advisable coz they are easier to offload or rent when looking at absolute quantum.

sevol
21-04-09, 09:36
autonomy, blackswan, franzmark thanks for your helpful comments

sevol
21-04-09, 10:21
Sorry so many questions.

Will prices drop even further for these lorongs? I am not sure, hear some people say it will drop more but to expect the prices to go to low 5xx seem quite impossible for new devts.

Autonomy
21-04-09, 11:21
Sorry so many questions.

Will prices drop even further for these lorongs? I am not sure, hear some people say it will drop more but to expect the prices to go to low 5xx seem quite impossible for new devts.

That's something no one can predict, not even the experts. But by studying the trend, it has indeed drop in the past few months. Whether is it the lowest point no one knows.

But for new developments to drop to low 5xx and at the better situated blocks and lorongs, I think will meet quite a big resistance cos 99 years leasehold developments in suburb already selling at 6xx.

But my own opinion is if you are buying for own stay, then finding a place that you really like and as long as you are not buying at the peak or at the high side, then its ok. Cos even when it drops further, you might not be able to get the place that u wanted cos its sold or the owner refused to sell cos the prices are too low, unless fire sales or some other cases...

I think what is important is to do financial planning to see if you can afford comfortably and not to over stretch and over commit.

blackswan
21-04-09, 11:55
dun know about the rest but for Verte, luckily aku never buy last year Oct or so as the price the still around 800+, recently relaunch and price at 600+ and still nego!!!

Autonomy
21-04-09, 12:07
dun know about the rest but for Verte, luckily aku never buy last year Oct or so as the price the still around 800+, recently relaunch and price at 600+ and still nego!!!

600+? For the bigger penthouse units? That's quite a good price. Cos based on caveat lodged, the lowest reflected was 767.

By the way when did they relaunch? Cos I thought they tore down the show flat?

Autonomy
21-04-09, 12:27
Actually i did a search, and I think the 6xx is for the biggest unit which is 2754 sq ft. The rest of it are still in the 7xx region.

sevol
21-04-09, 14:46
Cos even when it drops further, you might not be able to get the place that u wanted cos its sold or the owner refused to sell cos the prices are too low

Agree. It is either grab the unit now if she likes it a lot or wait for possibly lower psf but then she may have to settle with a unit she does not like as much

blackswan Will you bite if Verte goes to low 600s for bigger units? Sounds good to me when you compare it with the past transactions. Then again maybe can wait a bit longer unless it is your dream unit

blackswan
21-04-09, 15:52
no cos its just beside the park conector and the lonkang which i stronglt believe will bred mosqitoes in humid temp.

But beed bros and sis staying somewhere around there to confirm. like those staying in The Treeline.

sevol
21-04-09, 16:11
no cos its just beside the park conector and the lonkang which i stronglt believe will bred mosqitoes in humid temp.

But beed bros and sis staying somewhere around there to confirm. like those staying in The Treeline.

anyone staying around that area confirm if got mosquito problem?

i stayed near a big longkang once, but no mosquito problem. maybe because i was on a high floor. 5 floor and lower i have no idea.

Autonomy
21-04-09, 16:18
good point. anyone staying around that area confirm if got mosquito problem?

My advice is for you to go down personally and if you can bring her along. See if she likes the area, the surroundings, whether she thinks the distance to the mrt is ok and at the same time you can check the mosquito breeding problem. Looking for the right property invloves a lot of leg work.

I have been there a couple of times walking along the canal and also stayed in telok kurau park, but I had never encounter mosquito bites. But as I am not staying there, I think others are more in a position to advise you on that.

sevol
21-04-09, 16:59
I went to the area 3 times, visited 4 Lorongs. Didn't have time to walk to the MRT but went a little way up. I don't see the walk to the MRT as a problem. Good for the elderly who are still fit and see walking as exercise.

During the times I visited that area, can't tell if there is a mosquito problem since all 3 times were in the day. Maybe I should just stand still there for 30 mins at night and see if anything bites :doh:

Autonomy
21-04-09, 17:03
I went to the area 3 times, visited 4 Lorongs. Didn't have time to walk to the MRT but went a little way up. I don't see the walk to the MRT as a problem. Good for the elderly who are still fit and see walking as exercise.

During the times I visited that area, can't tell if there is a mosquito problem since all 3 times were in the day. Maybe I should just stand still there for 30 mins at night and see if anything bites :doh:

Haha use yourelf as a bait to see if the mosquitoes will bite... that's an idea.

sevol
27-04-09, 17:17
went there late at night over the weekend..no mosquito bites :D

Autonomy
27-04-09, 17:27
went there late at night over the weekend..no mosquito bites :D

Was there over the weekends also cause I frequently cycle past there doing the Tour Of Eastern Park Connector haha...

sevol
28-04-09, 11:12
well if you see some idiot standing still, that was me :D

it is a very nice area...

Autonomy
28-04-09, 11:25
well if you see some idiot standing still, that was me :D

it is a very nice area...

If you like that area, then u should start doing more research and see if there are any developments that u like and fit your budget. Sometimes buying is an emotional thing...

sevol
06-05-09, 22:05
Heard from a friend that there's a unit in TK. Next to the connector.

Asking for 720psf, pte lift, pte lap pool. Size I can't remember, maybe 2000sqf? TOP in two years time.

Good deal? Let's say when economy recovers, how much do you think such a unit will cost?

Autonomy
06-05-09, 22:14
Heard from a friend that there's a unit in TK. Next to the connector.

Asking for 720psf, pte lift, pte lap pool. Size I can't remember, maybe 2000sqf? TOP in two years time.

Good deal? Let's say when economy recovers, how much do you think such a unit will cost?

Are you looking at it for own stay or for pure investment purposes? Cos whether good deal or not depends on what u looking for.

If its for own stay, then as long as u found the place that u really like and can give you the kind of lifestyle that u also wanted and dream of, then of cos its good deal.

But if its for investment then who knows? Most people will ask you to look at D1, D9-11, and you will need to do lots of research.

sevol
06-05-09, 23:26
just wondering if it is a good deal at this time. i'm just checking prices all around. anyway this particular unit is beyond my budget :doh:

VIPCLUB2004
08-05-09, 11:49
just wondering if it is a good deal at this time. i'm just checking prices all around. anyway this particular unit is beyond my budget :doh:

800K for a 3 bed room condo at East Coast :D

VIPCLUB2004
08-05-09, 12:00
By the way, how is Cote d'Azur ?? Seems the location and price are better than many others leh.... :sleep:

lbb
09-05-09, 12:53
By the way, how is Cote d'Azur ?? Seems the location and price are better than many others leh.... :sleep:

Well, it has a very good location and it's one of the newer condos along the marine parade stretch. I remember a time when people were complaining about the residents hanging their laundry in the balconies for all the ECP users to see etc. But guess the location trumps everything, PP's convenience and the Katong eateries. Guess my only qualm is that the development looks slightly crowded with its blocks, wont really know if it's true as I havent been inside though, so I might be wrong. But the asking price now is close to 800psf right, and it's LH as well... hmmm...

Just my 2 cents worth.

Anyway, just wanna ask you guys, what do you think is a fair psf for a 3BR at Bayshore Park, I would say the 550-600 range considering it's age and all, your inputs?

firec
09-05-09, 22:06
Anyway, just wanna ask you guys, what do you think is a fair psf for a 3BR at Bayshore Park, I would say the 550-600 range considering it's age and all, your inputs?
550-600psf is reasonable considering it's LH. I like its location too. But I'm sure sellers and their agents will tell you even Mandarin Gardens can command a higher psf. You just have to firm.

Douk
10-05-09, 00:00
Well, it has a very good location and it's one of the newer condos along the marine parade stretch. I remember a time when people were complaining about the residents hanging their laundry in the balconies for all the ECP users to see etc. But guess the location trumps everything, PP's convenience and the Katong eateries. Guess my only qualm is that the development looks slightly crowded with its blocks, wont really know if it's true as I havent been inside though, so I might be wrong. But the asking price now is close to 800psf right, and it's LH as well... hmmm...

Just my 2 cents worth.

Anyway, just wanna ask you guys, what do you think is a fair psf for a 3BR at Bayshore Park, I would say the 550-600 range considering it's age and all, your inputs?

even at 650psf, it is still reasonable if you really like that unit and when market sentiment is good. If it is for investment, then there is quite a few units on sales. so you may find better bargain at <600psf.

Bayshore park is a good bet due to its very affordable price now, good location and enbloc potential, even though it is LH... this enbloc element will boost up your property price during the upswing (maybe 10 yrs later).

lbb
12-05-09, 13:12
even at 650psf, it is still reasonable if you really like that unit and when market sentiment is good. If it is for investment, then there is quite a few units on sales. so you may find better bargain at <600psf.

Bayshore park is a good bet due to its very affordable price now, good location and enbloc potential, even though it is LH... this enbloc element will boost up your property price during the upswing (maybe 10 yrs later).

Hmmm, I've been looking around but haven't found any unit <600psf man. I would seriously consider the sale if I find a 3br that is sold at that price. Hmmmm, not actually looking so far as to en bloc potential, but rather it's the kind of lifestyle, the big grounds and location that BP offers. It's tucked into that big ground at the end of Bayshore Road, prefer that compared to MG which is sandwhiched between the ECP and a road. MG has sweeping views due to it's rectangular land shape though, guess that's a good point about it. I'll get back on my BP hunt, if I find a 3Br <600psf, I'm gonna chiong. Haha, thanks guys.. any lobangs! =P

Sean.G
14-06-09, 17:53
I think the supporters of a bull run in the property market have won this round.

Everything is now so over priced, and agents are as yaya as ever. I say to agents...enjoy your time.....

Looks like a bear supporter like me will now retreat into the shadows.....

It a crazy world...bank cannot match valuation but sellers just up their prices 20-30 psf every week. Anyway economists have adjusted their U shaped recovery to a W shaped one. I wonder if this goes on what other letter can they use?

Anyway for those who listen to advice that says dun miss the boat, lemme just say this, for every up...there is a down. I will wait for the downward sloping part of the W recovery.

And for new readers on this site, please try to listen to good advice from seasoned investors (i.e. gfoo or property_investor or proud owner) and less from newbies in the private property market who just bought DBR thinking they strike gold buying cemetary leasehold land at 675 psf or higher.

jc
14-06-09, 23:37
I think the supporters of a bull run in the property market have won this round.

Everything is now so over priced, and agents are as yaya as ever. I say to agents...enjoy your time.....

Looks like a bear supporter like me will now retreat into the shadows.....

It a crazy world...bank cannot match valuation but sellers just up their prices 20-30 psf every week. Anyway economists have adjusted their U shaped recovery to a W shaped one. I wonder if this goes on what other letter can they use?

Anyway for those who listen to advice that says dun miss the boat, lemme just say this, for every up...there is a down. I will wait for the downward sloping part of the W recovery.

And for new readers on this site, please try to listen to good advice from seasoned investors (i.e. gfoo or property_investor or proud owner) and less from newbies in the private property market who just bought DBR thinking they strike gold buying cemetary leasehold land at 675 psf or higher.

Hey Pal, in any circumstances there would be analysts on both sides of the coin. Goldman, BOAML, DMG, DBS, etc are bulls, Nomura & Citi are bears. Either way, the analysts still keep their jobs, becos they can always revise their forecast. As someone has mentioned in this forum, ultimately listen to yourself to decide, do your research n not rely only on advice from whoever. It is your $$ n you have to face the consequences.

firec
15-06-09, 02:15
Agents yaya? Thought many have quit. The recent sales boom are mostly developer sales, and agents doing these collect only a small fraction of commission only. And sellers asking higher prices may not be music to agents, cos the higher they ask, the more buyers they scare away.

I think the supporters of a bull run in the property market have won this round.

Everything is now so over priced, and agents are as yaya as ever. I say to agents...enjoy your time.....

Looks like a bear supporter like me will now retreat into the shadows.....

It a crazy world...bank cannot match valuation but sellers just up their prices 20-30 psf every week. Anyway economists have adjusted their U shaped recovery to a W shaped one. I wonder if this goes on what other letter can they use?

Anyway for those who listen to advice that says dun miss the boat, lemme just say this, for every up...there is a down. I will wait for the downward sloping part of the W recovery.

And for new readers on this site, please try to listen to good advice from seasoned investors (i.e. gfoo or property_investor or proud owner) and less from newbies in the private property market who just bought DBR thinking they strike gold buying cemetary leasehold land at 675 psf or higher.

cheerful
15-06-09, 09:08
Hi pal, actually will it be W-shaped anot oso nobody knows mah ...

Not sure if DBR used to be cemetery or watever ... but if some pp like to buy that's really their biz .... likewise if they really think abt striking gold or din think at all ..



Anyway for those who listen to advice that says dun miss the boat, lemme just say this, for every up...there is a down. I will wait for the downward sloping part of the W recovery.

And for new readers on this site, please try to listen to good advice from seasoned investors (i.e. gfoo or property_investor or proud owner) and less from newbies in the private property market who just bought DBR thinking they strike gold buying cemetary leasehold land at 675 psf or higher.

silver023
15-06-09, 10:09
Agents yaya? Thought many have quit. The recent sales boom are mostly developer sales, and agents doing these collect only a small fraction of commission only. And sellers asking higher prices may not be music to agents, cos the higher they ask, the more buyers they scare away.

Called an agent 2 weeks ago to enquire about a re-sale apartment and her first question was "Do you have enough budget?".

Sellers are asking for 120K-200K above bank valuation. I'm only hoping that it's beacuse they're dreaming. :sleep:

East Coast Boy
15-06-09, 16:11
IMPROVED market sentiment sent sales of new private homes surging to 1,668 units in May.
This is way above already-strong developer sales levels of 1,214 units in April and 1,220 units in March.

Last month, developers launched 1,161 new homes, up from 1,085 in April, according to data released by the Urban Redevelopment Authority on Monday.

The best-selling project in May was Martin Place Residences in Kim Yam Road. Frasers Centrepoint sold 186 units of the 302-unit project at a median price of $1,423 per sq ft

Other popular projects in May include The Wharf Residence in Tong Watt Road and The Arte in Jalan Datoh.

Buyers picked up 140 units of The Wharf Residence at a median price of $1,186 psf and units of The Arte at a median price of $933 psf.

Attractive price cuts - from peak levels - had boosted demand for new homes recently.

Sean.G
15-06-09, 21:10
1) I used to stay at sunbird road, the housing estate behind the DBR site is. The DBR plot used to b a cemetary, so is simei green plot as well.

2) Been negotiating with agents for the past few months, highlighted that 6 out of 6 banks cannot match valuation of what the sellers are asking for. Agnet tell me "No money then dun buy, are you a serious buyer?" Which makes sense but if you dun call that being yaya, i dunno what is yaya.

3) Been looking up and down whole of D15 and D16, prices just keep going up and up. Asked about a few resale units, all sold within one month. or at least that's what the agents tell me.

Hence i conclude that agents ARE being yaya now, and there ARE increased transactions in the resale pty mkt.

Property_Owner
15-06-09, 21:12
I think the supporters of a bull run in the property market have won this round.

Everything is now so over priced, and agents are as yaya as ever. I say to agents...enjoy your time.....

Looks like a bear supporter like me will now retreat into the shadows.....

It a crazy world...bank cannot match valuation but sellers just up their prices 20-30 psf every week. Anyway economists have adjusted their U shaped recovery to a W shaped one. I wonder if this goes on what other letter can they use?

Anyway for those who listen to advice that says dun miss the boat, lemme just say this, for every up...there is a down. I will wait for the downward sloping part of the W recovery.

And for new readers on this site, please try to listen to good advice from seasoned investors (i.e. gfoo or property_investor or proud owner) and less from newbies in the private property market who just bought DBR thinking they strike gold buying cemetary leasehold land at 675 psf or higher.

You are a damn good example of the 3rd generation sour grapes. Salute salute :doh: :doh: 2007 did you buy? 2008 did you buy? 2009 will you buy? Can't get anything then blame the whole world but yourself!

Property_Owner
15-06-09, 21:14
Well, it has a very good location and it's one of the newer condos along the marine parade stretch. I remember a time when people were complaining about the residents hanging their laundry in the balconies for all the ECP users to see etc. But guess the location trumps everything, PP's convenience and the Katong eateries. Guess my only qualm is that the development looks slightly crowded with its blocks, wont really know if it's true as I havent been inside though, so I might be wrong. But the asking price now is close to 800psf right, and it's LH as well... hmmm...

Just my 2 cents worth.

Anyway, just wanna ask you guys, what do you think is a fair psf for a 3BR at Bayshore Park, I would say the 550-600 range considering it's age and all, your inputs?

Bayshore Pk? This price can buy. en-bloc? Matter of when. Just need some money on renovation. Cheers

Property_Owner
15-06-09, 21:16
By the way, how is Cote d'Azur ?? Seems the location and price are better than many others leh.... :sleep:


the only set back for this is next to ECP (road noise), LH.

Sean.G
15-06-09, 21:19
You are a damn good example of the 3rd generation sour grapes. Salute salute :doh: :doh: 2007 did you buy? 2008 did you buy? 2009 will you buy? Can't get anything then blame the whole world but yourself!

2005 (The Sail), 2007(The Belvedere), 2008(Tribeca). In any case, what makes you so sure i am 3rd generation? You mean from my post you can know so much abt me?

Anyway there is no sour or sweet grapes. I am just putting across that i no longer think its a good time to buy as the pty mkt now is bullish. Are you chinese educated and don't understand english? Maybe i can give you some tuition on how to read posts...

smartinvest
16-06-09, 12:46
I think the supporters of a bull run in the property market have won this round.

Everything is now so over priced, and agents are as yaya as ever. I say to agents...enjoy your time.....

Looks like a bear supporter like me will now retreat into the shadows.....

It a crazy world...bank cannot match valuation but sellers just up their prices 20-30 psf every week. Anyway economists have adjusted their U shaped recovery to a W shaped one. I wonder if this goes on what other letter can they use?

Anyway for those who listen to advice that says dun miss the boat, lemme just say this, for every up...there is a down. I will wait for the downward sloping part of the W recovery.

And for new readers on this site, please try to listen to good advice from seasoned investors (i.e. gfoo or property_investor or proud owner) and less from newbies in the private property market who just bought DBR thinking they strike gold buying cemetary leasehold land at 675 psf or higher.


You can wait but time is money, In the mean time we are enjoying our new home :) You can wait at the bus stop and the the sloping part may come few years later ... Ha ha I enjoy the nice sea view and pool for the next few years while you can wait ...

WolleyDragon
16-06-09, 13:38
1) I used to stay at sunbird road, the housing estate behind the DBR site is. The DBR plot used to b a cemetary, so is simei green plot as well.

2) Been negotiating with agents for the past few months, highlighted that 6 out of 6 banks cannot match valuation of what the sellers are asking for. Agnet tell me "No money then dun buy, are you a serious buyer?" Which makes sense but if you dun call that being yaya, i dunno what is yaya.

3) Been looking up and down whole of D15 and D16, prices just keep going up and up. Asked about a few resale units, all sold within one month. or at least that's what the agents tell me.

Hence i conclude that agents ARE being yaya now, and there ARE increased transactions in the resale pty mkt.

Actually, it's the comfort level you can afford, buy if the price quoted is within your affordability range. Why bother how much each property is costing now or next time.. like that, you can never get that dream house of yours..you'll be like a dog chasing it's own tail.. always going round in a circle.

jitkiat
16-06-09, 13:56
I met one uncle at Simei, he owns 3 Simei properties, one landed at Sunbird, one Simei Green EC rented out, now another penthouse in DBR all within 200m radius. He told me last time he stayed at 4room HDB at Simei, then he upgraded to Simei Green EC, then he bought landed property. He just bought within his means. If it is affordable and you like the project, not buying at a peak of property bubble, then just go ahead and buy.

Property_Owner
16-06-09, 14:16
If you feel agents are yaya towards you, then dont deal with them. There are so many adv by owner themself. Why dun call them up and nego with them.


Btw just to share. I had call a owner before to ask about her unit. I asked her the price to sell, then asked if can nego or not. Guess what! That lady told me price is net, no money dun buy. Next time if i call her either a willing buyer will buy before me or she will sell higher. :doh:

Agents? Agree there are bad agents around. But i'm sure there are good ones too. Just need to do some homework. :)

wqmai
16-06-09, 21:10
Actually, it's the comfort level you can afford, buy if the price quoted is within your affordability range. Why bother how much each property is costing now or next time.. like that, you can never get that dream house of yours..you'll be like a dog chasing it's own tail.. always going round in a circle.

Agreed. Its really difficult to time the bottom. 2 mths back, people would say wait cos prices will come down further. Now people would say prices rises already, wait for the next price down as the prices is 'W' shape. When the next downturn comes, people would say wait longer as the prices would come down further. Once the prices goes up, they would say, wait for the next downturn. This would just goes on forever.

jc
17-06-09, 00:41
Agreed. Its really difficult to time the bottom. 2 mths back, people would say wait cos prices will come down further. Now people would say prices rises already, wait for the next price down as the prices is 'W' shape. When the next downturn comes, people would say wait longer as the prices would come down further. Once the prices goes up, they would say, wait for the next downturn. This would just goes on forever.

Haha...These pple would never buy one lah... Talk a lot but wanting to buy Condo at HDB px :doh:

East Lover
17-06-09, 09:53
Agreed. Its really difficult to time the bottom. 2 mths back, people would say wait cos prices will come down further. Now people would say prices rises already, wait for the next price down as the prices is 'W' shape. When the next downturn comes, people would say wait longer as the prices would come down further. Once the prices goes up, they would say, wait for the next downturn. This would just goes on forever.
Really no point keep on waiting. the price will never come back to the last cycle's lowest price. as long as you can afford, and most important, you like, then buy lah.

I missed 2006 boat, only bought one for investment, but haven't found an idea one for own stay yet, the price suddenly all shot up on 2007. no choice lah, gonna to wait. stay in current place loh.

So this time, I don't mind to pay early 07 price to buy an idea house for own stay. life so short, don't want to wait long long liao, enjoy first.

WolleyDragon
17-06-09, 11:17
using kopitiam food as an analogy;

15 yrs ago.. prices of chicken rice, wanton mee all cost abt $1.50..
10 yrs ago.. same products cost average $2.00
nowadays.. they cost between $2.50 to $3.50..

Of course we all hope to pay $1.50 for char kwey tiao.. But if everyone wants to sell at $2.50, what to do? Do you scold the hawker.. say he yaya kelapar??

You can wait quietly by the coconut tree and snigger at all that you'll buy only when it's $1.50.. Thing is.. life goes on.. people will still buy at $2.50.. and they will enjoy the hot plate of char kwey tiao.. and maybe finish up with a nice cool glass of chin chow..

And all this time, you're still by the coconut tree..

jitkiat
17-06-09, 11:19
using kopitiam food as an analogy;

15 yrs ago.. prices of chicken rice, wanton mee all cost abt $1.50..
10 yrs ago.. same products cost average $2.00
nowadays.. they cost between $2.50 to $3.50..

Of course we all hope to pay $1.50 for char kwey tiao.. But if everyone wants to sell at $2.50, what to do? Do you scold the hawker.. say he yaya kelapar??

You can wait quietly by the coconut tree and snigger at all that you'll buy only when it's $1.50.. Thing is.. life goes on.. people will still buy at $2.50.. and they will enjoy the hot plate of char kwey tiao.. and maybe finish up with a nice cool glass of chin chow..

And all this time, you're still by the coconut tree..

Some shrink in size/quantity over the years yet price goes up.:doh:

East Lover
17-06-09, 11:41
using kopitiam food as an analogy;

15 yrs ago.. prices of chicken rice, wanton mee all cost abt $1.50..
10 yrs ago.. same products cost average $2.00
nowadays.. they cost between $2.50 to $3.50..

Of course we all hope to pay $1.50 for char kwey tiao.. But if everyone wants to sell at $2.50, what to do? Do you scold the hawker.. say he yaya kelapar??

You can wait quietly by the coconut tree and snigger at all that you'll buy only when it's $1.50.. Thing is.. life goes on.. people will still buy at $2.50.. and they will enjoy the hot plate of char kwey tiao.. and maybe finish up with a nice cool glass of chin chow..

And all this time, you're still by the coconut tree..
I like that analysis man!

So you bought some unit already?;)

Property_Owner
17-06-09, 12:03
using kopitiam food as an analogy;

15 yrs ago.. prices of chicken rice, wanton mee all cost abt $1.50..
10 yrs ago.. same products cost average $2.00
nowadays.. they cost between $2.50 to $3.50..

Of course we all hope to pay $1.50 for char kwey tiao.. But if everyone wants to sell at $2.50, what to do? Do you scold the hawker.. say he yaya kelapar??

You can wait quietly by the coconut tree and snigger at all that you'll buy only when it's $1.50.. Thing is.. life goes on.. people will still buy at $2.50.. and they will enjoy the hot plate of char kwey tiao.. and maybe finish up with a nice cool glass of chin chow..

And all this time, you're still by the coconut tree..

Haha, can I buy you a beer? :cheers1:

lbb
17-06-09, 22:47
Bayshore Pk? This price can buy. en-bloc? Matter of when. Just need some money on renovation. Cheers

Haha, hey yeah... still scouting around, but with the recent surge in sentiments, the price range I quoted still seems pretty impossible to find. But yeah, I'm ready to renovate the place, afterall, if ever it en-bloc-s, I believe it'll be during the next cycle which is about 7-10 years away.

So the search goes on... though I've also considered Casa Merah, but that one also prices increasing on a weekly basis. Made a mistake not to look at it earlier, but hey... we'll hope and see what comes!

Thanks for the reply mate.

East Coast Boy
17-06-09, 22:54
Parc SeaBreeze Price list

I have got the info from HSR agent. The price are as follows:

2nd to 13th floor
Stack 1 $1210 to 1410 psf 1593/1615sq ft
Stack 2 $1250 to 1450psf 1356/1378sq ft
Stack 3 $1180 to 1370psf 1356/1378 sq ft
Stack 4 $1170 to 1350psf 1593/1615 sq ft

5th to 13th floor
Stack 5 $1020 to 1100 psf 1292 sq ft
Stack 6 $1050 to 1160psf 1292 sq ft

15th to 18th floor
Stack 1 $1450 to 1510psf 1593/1615 sq ft
Stack 2 $1490 to 1550psf 1356/1378 sq ft
Stack 3 $1390 to 1450psf 1356/1378 sq ft
Stack 4 $1370 to 1430psf 1593/1615 sq ft

Penthouse 19th floor
Stack 1 $1530psf 3035 q ft
Stack 3 $1470psf 3035 sq ft
Stack 5 $1215psf 2562 sq ft
Stack 6 $1245psf $2562 sq ft

Please add 3% if client going for interest absorption option.
Due to overwhelming response, to have the above pricing please have it confirmed by latest today.
After which the price will be revised.

pod
17-06-09, 23:26
Wunder hows the parc seabreeze sales doing? briskly good?:D

Alexis
17-06-09, 23:36
My friend and I are buying 2 units each. Seems prices have already gone up.


Parc SeaBreeze Price list

I have got the info from HSR agent. The price are as follows:

2nd to 13th floor
Stack 1 $1210 to 1410 psf 1593/1615sq ft
Stack 2 $1250 to 1450psf 1356/1378sq ft
Stack 3 $1180 to 1370psf 1356/1378 sq ft
Stack 4 $1170 to 1350psf 1593/1615 sq ft

5th to 13th floor
Stack 5 $1020 to 1100 psf 1292 sq ft
Stack 6 $1050 to 1160psf 1292 sq ft

15th to 18th floor
Stack 1 $1450 to 1510psf 1593/1615 sq ft
Stack 2 $1490 to 1550psf 1356/1378 sq ft
Stack 3 $1390 to 1450psf 1356/1378 sq ft
Stack 4 $1370 to 1430psf 1593/1615 sq ft

Penthouse 19th floor
Stack 1 $1530psf 3035 q ft
Stack 3 $1470psf 3035 sq ft
Stack 5 $1215psf 2562 sq ft
Stack 6 $1245psf $2562 sq ft

Please add 3% if client going for interest absorption option.
Due to overwhelming response, to have the above pricing please have it confirmed by latest today.
After which the price will be revised.

Property_Owner
18-06-09, 10:10
My friend and I are buying 2 units each. Seems prices have already gone up.

Worth to buy? Pai seh. No sour grapes. I find this project kind of bore. Facing HDB flats

jitkiat
18-06-09, 10:23
Increase your position when market continues to prove you correct is indeed the secret of success in any investment. Congratulations to Alexis/Property_owner.:cheers1:

Begbie
19-06-09, 19:49
Parc SeaBreeze Price list

I have got the info from HSR agent. The price are as follows:

2nd to 13th floor
Stack 1 $1210 to 1410 psf 1593/1615sq ft
Stack 2 $1250 to 1450psf 1356/1378sq ft
Stack 3 $1180 to 1370psf 1356/1378 sq ft
Stack 4 $1170 to 1350psf 1593/1615 sq ft

5th to 13th floor
Stack 5 $1020 to 1100 psf 1292 sq ft
Stack 6 $1050 to 1160psf 1292 sq ft

15th to 18th floor
Stack 1 $1450 to 1510psf 1593/1615 sq ft
Stack 2 $1490 to 1550psf 1356/1378 sq ft
Stack 3 $1390 to 1450psf 1356/1378 sq ft
Stack 4 $1370 to 1430psf 1593/1615 sq ft

Penthouse 19th floor
Stack 1 $1530psf 3035 q ft
Stack 3 $1470psf 3035 sq ft
Stack 5 $1215psf 2562 sq ft
Stack 6 $1245psf $2562 sq ft

Please add 3% if client going for interest absorption option.
Due to overwhelming response, to have the above pricing please have it confirmed by latest today.
After which the price will be revised.

Are u the HSR agent or are u advertising on behalf of the HSR agent?

East Coast Boy
19-06-09, 21:00
Are u the HSR agent or are u advertising on behalf of the HSR agent?

Just to inform your no need to waste time going to view the project. But if you have spare money then take your time lor.

WolleyDragon
22-07-09, 11:45
how's Parc SeaBreeze sales doing after their initial 2nd launch?? transactions still gung ho??

eng81157
24-07-09, 13:35
how's Parc SeaBreeze sales doing after their initial 2nd launch?? transactions still gung ho??

i bought a unit myself couple of weeks back, @ 1195psf. what spurred the purchase was the proximity to amenities and PP, the uncluttered surroundings and located within the 1km radius to tao nan.

heard stack 5 and 6 almost sold except the top floors. as for the stacks facing the sea, almost all but the larger penthouses are sold.

sabian
24-07-09, 16:47
u create new nick just to tell us this???

i think if they have good sales, it will show up on the caveats and FEO will shout loud loud in the ST.

99yr want to sell at FH pricing? If FEO screw up and bid too high or market the project too late, now want buyers to carry the baby?:scared-3:

They got one more FH plot behind seaview. Wonder what the psf will be???

richwang
29-07-09, 17:32
Will the goverment's hint of property market has some speculation slow down the recent price climb?
Thanks,

focus
29-07-09, 18:25
Will the goverment's hint of property market has some speculation slow down the recent price climb?
Thanks,

Nope.. The only thing that will slow property market is when government introduce regulation to restrict it. Like when they take out DPS, it will reduce the opportunists who wants to flip but have no capital.. or if they want to stimulate demand..they introduce DPS again..

Other measures like taxation also helps but not as much as those that affects the purchase directly at the point of sale.