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amber
17-02-07, 11:53
from MCL Land's website

http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/9709/imgtheesta49dc53rg7.jpg

http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/2811/theestasitemap4a6b83tv4.jpg


December 2006:
http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/7840/theestajan0714af034le2.jpg

Unregistered
11-06-07, 13:44
Beautiful development. Any owners of esta willing to let go ? Price per sqft ? has it reallly gone over 1000psqft ?

Unregistered
13-06-07, 12:43
Beautiful development. Any owners of esta willing to let go ? Price per sqft ? has it reallly gone over 1000psqft ?

YES current asking 900-1K psf depending on floor n facing.
However the land area seems small as the blocks are coming up
too close in comparison to the neighbouring new condo by
Wheelock which has large land and equal no of units as Esta .....

just my 2 cents....

Unregistered
13-06-07, 17:27
Esta seems to be the cheapest among the 3 big new Amber condos.

Unregistered
13-06-07, 18:20
Esta seems to be the cheapest among the 3 big new Amber condos.

Esta was the first to be launched at 600 - 700psf,
followed by SeaView at 750 - 850 psf and then One Amber at
about the same as Wheelock's project.

So that is why presently the prices for all 3 projects in the sub sale
market are different.

Unregistered
01-07-07, 10:33
Just drove past the esta and realised the 5 blocks are really very close to each other unlike the seaview,no wonder the prices are lagging,

East Lover
13-06-08, 15:11
Witness the emergence of The Esta, where form and design are simple, modern and understated. Mirroring the kaleidoscope of life and nature, the fusion of sky and earth is seamlessly reflected in captivating architecture and lush landscapes. Staggered balconies allude to gardens floating in the sky and make alluring promises of airiness and tranquility that are an absolute pleasure to look forward to everyday.
http://www.mclland.com.sg/images/property/esta/esta-overview.jpg

East Lover
13-06-08, 15:15
Will it be a good buy given the price from $850-$900 PSF?

Unregistered.
13-06-08, 16:13
Just drove past the esta and realised the 5 blocks are really very close to each other unlike the seaview,no wonder the prices are lagging,
But look the floor plan. isn't it better then the seaview?
http://www.mclland.com.sg/images/property/esta/4bed_type_c2.jpg

registered
13-06-08, 23:25
But look the floor plan. isn't it better then the seaview?
http://www.mclland.com.sg/images/property/esta/4bed_type_c2.jpg

The floorplans are not to scale.

My interpretation of Esta floorplan is that the living dining area is cramped and the kitchen is very small, wasted foyer space at entrance in comparison to SeaView Type E which has a very spacious living dining and the kitchen is huge in comparison to new developments which have a "one way street" type of kitchen.

Also note Bath 2 in Esta is without the WC but instead there is a powder room so one need to go in and out.....

Type E in SeaView has 3 good size bathrooms(with Rain-shower) and one tiny wc cum shower in the yard area.

Unregistered123
17-06-08, 14:47
Will it be a good buy given the price from $850-$900 PSF?
That price range sounds even better than those Telok Kurau area small properties...
Personally, still can wait for a while, say end of 2008, near TOP period, by then the "deferred payment" no longer can be deferred, many of the owners have no choice but to reduce their sky-high price to original price. good luck!

buy
17-06-08, 22:13
esta a good project...

East Viewer
19-06-08, 14:38
One new project will be launched at Pasir Ris this weekend, walking distance to MRT. One site put on sales just next to The Tropica, with good bedok reservior view.

Shall we shift our searching from the East Coast side to further east?

JR
23-06-08, 02:36
"The floorplans are not to scale."

Though the floorplan may not be to scale, the same goes for every other project including Seaview.

"My interpretation of Esta floorplan is that the living dining area is cramped and the kitchen is very small, wasted foyer space at entrance in comparison to SeaView Type E which has a very spacious living dining and the kitchen is huge in comparison to new developments which have a "one way street" type of kitchen."

On the contrary, i feel that the living & dining area of Esta would be more spacious than Seaview Type E, as less space is wasted on the huge balcony in Seaview. Kitchen is small for Esta? U kidding me? Esta kitchen has a full U shape whereas Seaview is a L shape. Not sure whether u cook but i personally prefer more space to put my ingredients during preparation.

Abt the foyer, one plus pt is we can leave the door open n let air circulate so it is more windy and at the same time neightbours won't be able to see our family activities unless they step into the house.

"Also note Bath 2 in Esta is without the WC but instead there is a powder room so one need to go in and out"

In fact, i find it a plus point for Esta design. Unless one has a attached toilet, else Esta design is useful, so that 2 or more pple in the hse can do different activities at the same time, eg. Morning i shower while my brother passing motion at same time, np :) both in time to leave the hse for work.

"Type E in SeaView has 3 good size bathrooms(with Rain-shower) and one tiny wc cum shower in the yard area."

I am not sure whether u have been to the actual unit at the Seaview, but u mean showering at the tiny wc cum shower in the yard area? C'mon... :)

Yes agree that Seaview has 3 bathrooms. I am not sure abt others but i personally spend less than 1 hr each day in the bathrm shower + poo poo, maybe even less. Asking me to pay above $1k psf for bathroom space using less than 1hr everyday?

No offence to anyone this is just my personal opinion :)

JR
23-06-08, 02:45
The floorplans are not to scale.

My interpretation of Esta floorplan is that the living dining area is cramped and the kitchen is very small, wasted foyer space at entrance in comparison to SeaView Type E which has a very spacious living dining and the kitchen is huge in comparison to new developments which have a "one way street" type of kitchen.

Also note Bath 2 in Esta is without the WC but instead there is a powder room so one need to go in and out.....

Type E in SeaView has 3 good size bathrooms(with Rain-shower) and one tiny wc cum shower in the yard area.

"The floorplans are not to scale."

Though the floorplan may not be to scale, the same goes for every other project including Seaview.

"My interpretation of Esta floorplan is that the living dining area is cramped and the kitchen is very small, wasted foyer space at entrance in comparison to SeaView Type E which has a very spacious living dining and the kitchen is huge in comparison to new developments which have a "one way street" type of kitchen."

On the contrary, i feel that the living & dining area of Esta would be more spacious than Seaview Type E, as less space is wasted on the huge balcony in Seaview. Kitchen is small for Esta? U kidding me? Esta kitchen has a full U shape whereas Seaview is a L shape. Not sure whether u cook but i personally prefer more space to put my ingredients during preparation.

Abt the foyer, one plus pt is we can leave the door open n let air circulate so it is more windy and at the same time neightbours won't be able to see our family activities unless they step into the house.

"Also note Bath 2 in Esta is without the WC but instead there is a powder room so one need to go in and out"

In fact, i find it a plus point for Esta design. Unless one has a attached toilet, else Esta design is useful, so that 2 or more pple in the hse can do different activities at the same time, eg. Morning i shower while my brother passing motion at same time, np :) both in time to leave the hse for work.

"Type E in SeaView has 3 good size bathrooms(with Rain-shower) and one tiny wc cum shower in the yard area."

I am not sure whether u have been to the actual unit at the Seaview, but u mean showering at the tiny wc cum shower in the yard area? C'mon... :)

Yes agree that Seaview has 3 bathrooms. I am not sure abt others but i personally spend less than 1 hr each day in the bathrm shower + poo poo, maybe even less. Asking me to pay above $1k psf for bathroom space using less than 1hr everyday?

No offence to anyone this is just my personal opinion :)

Unregistered123
23-06-08, 10:55
"The floorplans are not to scale."

Though the floorplan may not be to scale, the same goes for every other project including Seaview.
Asking me to pay above $1k psf for bathroom space using less than 1hr everyday?

Well say, JR! I totally agree! the Esta layout is more logical and practical then the Seaview!

Esta Better Fei Shui
23-06-08, 11:38
Esta has better fei shui as the entry foyer is a clever design. SW's case hard to retain $$$.

See the below explainations:

玄关在佛教中被称为入道之门。佛经云:“玄关大启,正眼流通。”而在住宅结构中,玄关则特指居所的外门,是进出房屋的必经之地,是亚洲传统建筑的重要组成部分。
玄关是住宅内核最重要组成部分之一,可说是住宅的咽喉地带,它给予进入者的感觉相当与人与人之间的第一印象。据心理学分析,第一印象通常产生于前七秒,而这与进入住宅内部审视、玄关调整气息的时间基本相同。在西方,玄关就代表家庭的金钱运,对宅运吉凶具有决定性的影响。
玄关是从大门进入客厅的缓冲区域,让运动的进入者静气敛神,同时是引气入屋必经之道,因此它的布置好坏可直接影响住宅的风水。

从风水的角度来看,从大门入宅的旺气与财气应尽可能在屋内回旋,为住宅充分利用后,才慢慢流出屋外。

***倘若大门与阳台或窗户形成一直线,则从大门流入之旺气与财气便会迅速从阳台或窗口流走,旺气直入直出,是“泄水”之局,令家中的人及钱财均难一积聚。如果没有实墙,则在进门之处即可将阳台客厅一眼望穿,即形成俗称“前通后通,人才两空”的格局,对家居不利。***

客厅是一家大小日常安坐聚首的所在,是家庭的活动中心,所以不能太暴露。如果客厅无遮掩,缺乏私密性,家中各人的一举一动均为外人在大门外一览无余,那便缺乏安全感,从风水角度来说亦非吉兆。
而玄关即是大门与客厅的缓冲地带,基本上起到了遮掩的作用,令外人不能随便在大门外观察到屋内的活动,就可解决以上的问题。有玄关在旁护持,在客厅里会感受到安全性大增,同时也不怕私隐外露。

Esta has foyer as a good 玄关, but SV does not have!

buy
25-06-08, 20:40
out of ten

only one one believe in fengshui

Uregistered
25-06-08, 21:29
Many desperate sellers of Esta using "good fengshui, good layout" story as a
bait to attract buyers but com'mon - look at how the project is coming up - even HDB blocks not so close together !!

Wait till the buyers get the keys - dont keep high expectations - how much
did MCL launch - 600 plus psf - so what you expect - super Luxury ??

buy
25-06-08, 21:51
want to buy then buy

dun want to buy then dun buy

JR
25-06-08, 22:32
Many desperate sellers of Esta using "good fengshui, good layout" story as a
bait to attract buyers but com'mon - look at how the project is coming up - even HDB blocks not so close together !!

Wait till the buyers get the keys - dont keep high expectations - how much
did MCL launch - 600 plus psf - so what you expect - super Luxury ??

I am not sure whether u have been to the New kind of HDB flats within 5 yrs old or to non-GCB landed pty. Perhaps then one might learn to appreciate closeness on a relative basis. Anyway, the fact is new projects nowadays are all built closer to one another, esp 5 sty apts where the swiming pool width is relatively narrower.

If all units are built with a north south orientation with regular layout, it may be difficult to maintain the distance bet. blks. If spacious environment and absolute privacy is paramount, perhaps one might consider Ardmore Park.

Btw I am a little puzzled by a school of thought mentioning closeness bet, stack 5 & 11. The fact is both stacks do not have rooms facing each other as all rooms face north or south n so privacy is still maintained. Judging by pure aesthetic is dangerous, as then i would interpret One Amber as the stacks "stick" to each other.

No one is talking about Luxury apt here. Correct me if i am wrong, Esta launch px is $700+, roughly same as Seaview. Personally i find it dangerous to adopt the argument of judging the quality of project by launch px at different periods. By this argument, probably Dakota residences is more "luxury" than The Sail as the Sail is initially launched in 2004 at ave $900.

JR
25-06-08, 23:55
Esta has better fei shui as the entry foyer is a clever design. SW's case hard to retain $$$.

See the below explainations:

玄关在佛教中被称为入道之门。佛经云:“玄关大启,正眼流通。”而在住宅结构中,玄关则特指居所的外门,是进出房屋的必经之地,是亚洲传统建筑的重要组成部分。
玄关是住宅内核最重要组成部分之一,可说是住宅的咽喉地带,它给予进入者的感觉相当与人与人之间的第一印象。据心理学分析,第一印象通常产生于前七秒,而这与进入住宅内部审视、玄关调整气息的时间基本相同。在西方,玄关就代表家庭的金钱运,对宅运吉凶具有决定性的影响。
玄关是从大门进入客厅的缓冲区域,让运动的进入者静气敛神,同时是引气入屋必经之道,因此它的布置好坏可直接影响住宅的风水。

从风水的角度来看,从大门入宅的旺气与财气应尽可能在屋内回旋,为住宅充分利用后,才慢慢流出屋外。

***倘若大门与阳台或窗户形成一直线,则从大门流入之旺气与财气便会迅速从阳台或窗口流走,旺气直入直出,是“泄水”之局,令家中的人及钱财均难一积聚。如果没有实墙,则在进门之处即可将阳台客厅一眼望穿,即形成俗称“前通后通,人才两空”的格局,对家居不利。***

客厅是一家大小日常安坐聚首的所在,是家庭的活动中心,所以不能太暴露。如果客厅无遮掩,缺乏私密性,家中各人的一举一动均为外人在大门外一览无余,那便缺乏安全感,从风水角度来说亦非吉兆。
而玄关即是大门与客厅的缓冲地带,基本上起到了遮掩的作用,令外人不能随便在大门外观察到屋内的活动,就可解决以上的问题。有玄关在旁护持,在客厅里会感受到安全性大增,同时也不怕私隐外露。

Esta has foyer as a good 玄关, but SV does not have!

Thank you for sharing your Fengshui knowledge. I have always wanted to learn :) Can u recommend some good books for Fengshui for novice. Tks.

Esta Better Fei Shui
26-06-08, 14:48
Thank you for sharing your Fengshui knowledge. I have always wanted to learn :) Can u recommend some good books for Fengshui for novice. Tks.
什么是风水学?
古人云:“一坟二宅三命”,风水历来被视为左右命运的枢钮,风水绝学秘密相传,真正风水秘术从不公开,风水学也是易象企划的一个重要内容,而近年来社会上一些江湖术士只是一知半解,便充当行家,遗害国人。 有人大力宣扬“东四命、西四命”、“五鬼六煞”等机械的,简单的风水学说,不仅误人子弟,而且亦遗害后人。

风水学是什么呢?实际上就是地球物理学、水文地质学、宇宙星体学、气象学、环境景观学、建筑学、生态学以及人体生命信息学等多种学科综合一体的一门自然科学。其宗旨是审慎周密地考察、了解自然环境,利用和改造自然,创造良好的居住环境,赢得最佳的天时地利与人和,达到天人合一的至善境界。

风水的本质是“气”,而“气”是生命之源,亦是生命之根本,风水中的“气”是周围环境中的各个物体在时间和空间上所占的“序”所决定的,而“序”的改变恰恰是辩证唯物主义中事物由量变到质变的一种方式之一(另一种方式是量的积累),环境的改变,物体(包括家俱、办公桌等)位置的变化就会引起“气”的改变,从而就会改变风水环境,所以风水学是环境学,更是生命学,是地道的科学,而绝非迷信。

古书有众多论述对“风水”的解释,如:
《葬经》中:“气乘风则散,界水则止,故人聚之使不散,行之使有止,故谓之风水”。又云“深浅得乘,风水自成”。
《青乌先生葬经》:“内气萌生,外气成形,内外相乘,风水自成”。
《风水辨》:所谓风者,取山势之藏纳,土色之坚厚不冲冒四面之风,与无所谓地风者,也所谓水者取其地势之高燥,无使水近夫亲肤而已若水势曲屈而环向之,又其第二义也。”
《地理人子须知》:“地理家以风水二字喝其名者,即郭(璞)氏所谓葬者乘生气也。而生气何以察之?曰,气之来,有水以导之;气之止,有水以界之;气之聚,无风以散之。故曰要得水、要藏风。又曰气乃水之母,有气斯有水……

“风水”只是名称,而非风和水。风水又称堪舆,或称卜宅、相宅、图宅、青乌、青囊、形法、地理、阴阳、山水之术。
所以单从“风水”二字去前行对风水的解释,或者从古籍中搜集一语录去解释是远远不够的。
要了解风水,则要进入其学术体系。深析它的渊源沿革。
最早的“卜宅之文”在商周之际或更早即已出现,见载中国最早文献如《尚书》、《诗经》等若干篇章。分析其宗旨,则可理解为审慎周密地考察自然环境,顺应自然,有节制地利用和改造自然,创造良好的居住环境而臻于天时、地利、人和诸吉咸备,达于天人合一的至善境界。
如何周密地考察自然环境(即择地)?顺应自然并不等于听天由命,那如何顺应自然,何为自然之理(分析天地之理)?如何利用和改造自然(风水中讲立向立局?如何得天时、地利、人和,使其达到天人合一?等等问题正是研究风水的重要课题。

参考:中国周易网

Esta Better FengShui
26-06-08, 14:54
Thank you for sharing your Fengshui knowledge. I have always wanted to learn :) Can u recommend some good books for Fengshui for novice. Tks.

Don't really know much, just like to share :). Found a book list of Feng Shui, want to have a look?

001.《九星论命法》
002.《四柱阴阳经》与《四柱阴阳经1-6期辅导》
003.《通天宝座》
004.《另类八字学合集》
005.《日干用神表解》
006.《奇门遁甲教程讲义》
007.《董公择日秘要》(原本)
008.《地理辩正补义》
009.《地理辩正补证》
010.《地理丛谈》
011.《地理骊珠》
012.《地理元空法鉴》
013.《发微论》
014.《平阳地理玉函经》
015.《三字青囊经》
016.《阳宅指要》
017.『阳宅正宗』
018.『玄空二十四山飞星图』
019.《地理啖蔗录》
020.《葬经笺注版》
021.《因是子静坐法》
022.《山洋指迷》
023.《遁甲集成》
024.《协纪辨方书》
025.《地理人子须知》
026.《神相铁关刀》
027.《地理辨惑》
028.《河洛玄机》
029.《平阳地理玉函经》
030.《遁甲符应经》
031.《发微论》
032.《大六壬玉藻金英》
033.《廿四山厝屋除白蚁秘诀》
034.《元运发微》
035.《三字青囊经》
036.《宅 经》
037.《古今图书集成博物汇编艺术典笫651至680卷》
038.《金锁玉关断语修正》
039.《金锁玉关》经文
040.《六爻断卦技法》
041.《小六壬预测法》


044.《梅花易术汇集》
045.《中华奇书V1.0》
046.《五行生克的数学表达法》
047.《黄金策》
048.《六壬实战详解》
049.《贵人禄马择日表》
050.《易经明道录》
051.《八字真踪》
052.《蔡昔琼四柱函授资料》
053.《生命时空信息学》
054.《姓名学常识》
055.《弘易堂--姓名学》
056.《八字强弱鉴定法》
057.《公元与干支相互换算的新方法》
058.《十干生旺死绝表》究竟怎么用?
059.《曾国藩相术口诀》
060.《达摩祖师相诀秘传》
061.《宋英成命理宝鉴摘要》
062.《卦技二十法点窍》
063.《新编鬼谷子全书》
064.《化煞原理及化煞方法》
065.《命魂内部教材》
066.《火珠林》
067.《改运绝窍》
068.《二元八运元运太岁表》
069.《杨公滴滴金》
070.《六爻及卦象预测风水浅谈》
071.《蒋公字字金》
072.《秘传六十四卦分金爻线吉凶断》
073.《卜文论结婚应期》
074.《阴符奇门断法天机》
075.《阴符奇门断法步骤分析》
076.《玄空运用基础》
077.《盲人断命秘诀》
078.《金锁玉关风水实例》
079.《风 水 用 品》
080.《正宗六爻高层断解实例》
081.《彩票宝石》
082.《紫白诀》
083.《阳宅指南》
084.《阳宅天元赋》
085.《天元歌第四论阳宅》
086.《都天宝照经》
087.《青囊奥语》
088.《平洋千金诀》
089.《青囊序》
090.《平砂玉尺经》
091.《飞星赋》
092.《揭开金口诀之奥秘》
093.《金口诀疑难问答》
094.《金锁玉关评“阳宅外形图说”》
095.《奇门大师张德顺》
096.《了凡四训白话篇》
097.《江湖金口诀》
098.《四柱六神用法问答》
099.《子平病源生死诀》
100.《六壬学起源及基本认识》

Esta Better FengShui
26-06-08, 14:59
什么是风水

其实风水,是个系统的体系。先讲究自然的环境(峦头外局),与室内设计布局(内局)和 主人的命宫结合,最后是在考虑元运(大的时间断)和年月日时(吉时)。把以上完整的结合,才能算是真正的风水。

关于家居与风水有这样的说法:

1、风水理论认为洗手间五行属水,阴气较重。所以,洗手间的门正对床,容易引起腰肾不适。

2、“屋大人少,是凶屋”,认为“大房子会吸人气”。

3、风水师指出睡在窗口大、朝东或朝西的房间中容易因“光煞”导致“血光之灾”。

4、居室里的植物不是随便能摆的。

5、风水上将“床正上方的屋顶装有吊灯”称为“吊灯压床”,认为“煞气重”。对健康不利。

针对以上说法,您持什么样的态度,是否信以为真,是否有疑虑?究竟是不是这样呢?我们来看看专家们怎么说。

调查一:“屋大人少,是凶屋”,认为“大房子会吸人气”。像这种情况该怎么解决呢?

专家建议:这是古代的风水理论。多用些花花草草,而且屋大与否,人少与否都是相对的。

调查二:关于家居风水,居室应该摆放植物是不是也要有讲究?

专家建议:信不信都有影响,明白了枯叶蝶和竹节虫为何长成那个样子就会明白环境对生物的影响,无非人长的大一些,他们小一些,小一些影响大一些,对人影响相对小一些,但依然存在。我们没必要夸大风水作用也没必要无视或是小视,环境对人影响本就是天经地义。

调查三:招财猫和风水有关吗

专家建议:风水吉祥物与风水职能物品有别,吉祥物即是图一吉利的意思,招财猫之类的属于此类。

调查四:家里的镜子太多,镜子在风水来说它很阴寒容易会招邪?

专家建议:现如今不止女子爱照镜子,男子亦爱对镜理装容。在生活中镜子对你我的“吸引”可不一般,少了它可绝对不行。君不闻女子常曰“宁可一月无肉,不可一日无镜”!

镜子有帘拉上就成了,用时拉开不用时拉上,至于后面一个问题,也有不少是自然损坏的,与风水无关。

调查五:厨房跟洗手间相隔一面墙,风水有没有问题?

专家建议:卫生间或是厨房弄个球形的灯,就可以解决问题。

调查六:床的座向问题

专家建议:床是人的修身养性最直接的地儿,需要的首先是聚气。也许天下最讲究的就是当年的皇帝,去看看他们睡的地儿是一种启发:

首先是卧室不大于12平米,这样的空间最合适,不大不小正合适。由此我们得出这样的结论:人的卧室这么大最好,原因就是皇帝这么讲究的人都这样。我们没理由不这样做,他们睡的地儿一般是三面床靠墙,这当然也是一种经验,聚气不散自然是最好的。其对立面就是睡在有过堂风的地儿,不得病就是好的。根本不可能舒服。

卧室大小与床的摆法我们有了,还解要解决一个问题,那就是床的坐向,有说南北向摆的,有说东西向摆的。专业一些的话,自然是寻其旺位摆床,这是相当明确的。而对于一般业主与风水爱好者是较困难的,那么我们来这样想一下,放大一下思路,在冰天雪地的外面,就算是找到了最旺的位置这睡在那儿也不舒服。而在风和日丽的春夏就算是随便躺在一块草地上也十分舒服,这里面坐向就失去了意义。由此我们再收回思路于家里片面强调床的座向是没意义的。以实用为准,如果东南西北这么重要,那么斜向四十五度的如乾巽坤艮四隅宅不就根本无法摆床了?显然这相当可笑?更可笑的是现在根本就没有正南的房子。

全中国大约只有故宫是,如果强调了这样的正向那床肯定是没法儿摆的。因此,与时俱进,才是真正的宜居之道。

Unregistered..
07-07-08, 06:58
Jus txn a deal for 3 bedder 1313sqft at $855psf. When nearing TOP some sellers are willing to let it go at that price. This is because they dun 1 to take up a loan..... be patient... it will come down even more and near launch price.... yes... BUT ONLY IN THIS MARKET SENTIMENT ya..

I will wait
07-07-08, 10:57
Jus txn a deal for 3 bedder 1313sqft at $855psf. When nearing TOP some sellers are willing to let it go at that price. This is because they dun 1 to take up a loan..... be patient... it will come down even more and near launch price.... yes... BUT ONLY IN THIS MARKET SENTIMENT ya..
Good! Will put on hold for another half year, let's see how on end of year, when TOP is comming, market is quiet.... not ask too much lah, $700psf good enough :)

Unregistered.
07-07-08, 14:17
Jus txn a deal for 3 bedder 1313sqft at $855psf. When nearing TOP some sellers are willing to let it go at that price. This is because they dun 1 to take up a loan..... be patient... it will come down even more and near launch price.... yes... BUT ONLY IN THIS MARKET SENTIMENT ya..
How come the URA has only one transaction for May and zero for June?

THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,181,700 1,313 900 May-08

Is it due to the unmatched expectation? Owners still want above 1K psf and buyers are only willing to pay below $850 psf? No transaction at all in June and only one deal in May? wow.... tug of war :P

Esta Agent
08-07-08, 10:10
You are right. Owner's expectation and buyer's expectation got 1 big gap now.

BTW recent transacted is at 920psf sold by me

Unregistered123
10-07-08, 10:46
You are right. Owner's expectation and buyer's expectation got 1 big gap now.

BTW recent transacted is at 920psf sold by me

URA just woke up to the bay window/GFA games! http://www.ura.gov.sg/circulars/text/dc08-17.pdf

Does it mean the floor area should exclude the bay windows/planter box? Or at least sell it in 20% of the normal PSF? In some country, the balcony price is only half price of the internal space price! Now a days, every developers in Singapore give a big big balcony, every room with bay window (actually reduce the room size), then dear to include all into the floor area, then sell in a sky high price! TG, URA woke up!

SG expat
10-07-08, 11:55
Just spoke to a very high up anaylst from ABM. It was a very spooky conversation about the situation of SG. After researching for the whole year and planning for next year, SG will Very likely go into recession at 2009. In fact, it is a 50/50 chance. Many jobs will be leaving SG very soon as well.
No wonder so many developers suddenly launch at double quick time. Looks like they know more than us....

ang mohs DIE!
10-07-08, 12:15
Ang Mohs still suffering from BIG ego problem. Temasek, China, MiddleEast rescuing their investment banks is already a kind of "decoupling".

decoupled!
10-07-08, 14:27
Ang Mohs still suffering from BIG ego problem. Temasek, China, MiddleEast rescuing their investment banks is already a kind of "decoupling".

So very true.

The whole non-Western world is looking at the West like vultures, waiting to buy up their entire economies and suck up their resources for ourselves. Middle East, China, India, you name it. It is a mistaken perception that these countries depend on Western trade to survive.

Unregistered123
10-07-08, 15:49
Just spoke to a very high up anaylst from ABM. It was a very spooky conversation about the situation of SG. After researching for the whole year and planning for next year, SG will Very likely go into recession at 2009. In fact, it is a 50/50 chance. Many jobs will be leaving SG very soon as well.
No wonder so many developers suddenly launch at double quick time. Looks like they know more than us....


Please la....with F1 and two IR coming by 2009 total $10B investment singapore till go into recession at 2009 ???

That Anaylst form ABM must be form USA la...

Market Watcher
10-07-08, 16:30
www.todayonline.com/articles/264192.asp

A-Beng
10-07-08, 16:31
www.todayonline.com/articles/264192.asp

Thanks for the article.

This article reminds me what Kwek LB did exactly the same sometime in 2005. Back then we were stormed by SARS and faced a very bleak economy prospect. Nevertheless, he urged ppl to invest in Singapore ppty. But, none took his words seriously. Only a few who shared his insight and now become new millionaires in Singapore.

Will the history repeat itself? Only time will tell.

Unregistered123
10-07-08, 18:17
Thanks for the article.

This article reminds me what Kwek LB did exactly the same sometime in 2005. Back then we were stormed by SARS and faced a very bleak economy prospect. Nevertheless, he urged ppl to invest in Singapore ppty. But, none took his words seriously. Only a few who shared his insight and now become new millionaires in Singapore.

Will the history repeat itself? Only time will tell.
He is the head of high-end property developer SC Global, of course will say so lah

Tony Blair
10-07-08, 18:39
When HDB prices crash,then we can talk about pte ppty bust.

Be Real
11-07-08, 10:01
He is the head of high-end property developer SC Global, of course will say so lah

Yes, he has vested interest. On the same day, another view:

http://www.todayonline.com/articles/264193.asp

Unregistered1
11-07-08, 11:46
You are right. Owner's expectation and buyer's expectation got 1 big gap now.

BTW recent transacted is at 920psf sold by me
Straits Times Index goes below 2900 today again. Will the Esta owner lower down their expectation?
By the way, is it true that more owner will give way near toward to TOP? so that they no need to pay for Stamp Duty and no housing loan?

TKT
11-07-08, 14:39
URA just woke up to the bay window/GFA games! http://www.ura.gov.sg/circulars/text/dc08-17.pdf

Does it mean the floor area should exclude the bay windows/planter box? Or at least sell it in 20% of the normal PSF? In some country, the balcony price is only half price of the internal space price! Now a days, every developers in Singapore give a big big balcony, every room with bay window (actually reduce the room size), then dear to include all into the floor area, then sell in a sky high price! TG, URA woke up!


Definitely about time!!! I had commented before about this in another thread because these days for new developments, you just see all these planters and bay windows... in the showflats, all look great because of smart ID... but when owners get their units, they get a shock how small the bedrooms are, liveable spaces, etc... and huge planters and bay windows!

Glad finally someone in URA woke up to this... except that why was it allowed to continue for so long!

DRSG
11-07-08, 14:41
Definitely about time!!! I had commented before about this in another thread because these days for new developments, you just see all these planters and bay windows... in the showflats, all look great because of smart ID... but when owners get their units, they get a shock how small the bedrooms are, liveable spaces, etc... and huge planters and bay windows!

Glad finally someone in URA woke up to this... except that why was it allowed to continue for so long!


Probably some guy at URA bought a unit and realised he / she was short changed by the bay windows and planters.

TKT
11-07-08, 14:48
Probably some guy at URA bought a unit and realised he / she was short changed by the bay windows and planters.



Yeah... stupid loophole, world-class!

Esta Agent
12-07-08, 12:13
Straits Times Index goes below 2900 today again. Will the Esta owner lower down their expectation?
By the way, is it true that more owner will give way near toward to TOP? so that they no need to pay for Stamp Duty and no housing loan?

Stamp Duty is already paid sir.

Whether they will lower down their expectation or not, i cannot tell you. If i can predict i will be richer than any of them.

But at 900psf in east coast i think at most it will dip to 800+. unlikely that it goes below 800 we have areas like telok kurau and lower end areas like bayshore (99) still holding strong at 800. If prime east areas like amber road drop to 700+ it means our economy is taking a strong beating. At that time i don't think we will be chatting in this forum.

Agent Foo
12-07-08, 14:04
Stamp Duty is already paid sir.

Whether they will lower down their expectation or not, i cannot tell you. If i can predict i will be richer than any of them.

But at 900psf in east coast i think at most it will dip to 800+. unlikely that it goes below 800 we have areas like telok kurau and lower end areas like bayshore (99) still holding strong at 800. If prime east areas like amber road drop to 700+ it means our economy is taking a strong beating. At that time i don't think we will be chatting in this forum.
Has to come to 600psf. No other way. This time its going to be bad and real scary.

Newsreader
12-07-08, 15:29
Has to come to 600psf. No other way. This time its going to be bad and real scary.

Lee KY say Next 10 years.... S'pore GDP will 7 to 8% pa.

Be confident of our economy.

vino
12-07-08, 17:15
Definitely about time!!! I had commented before about this in another thread because these days for new developments, you just see all these planters and bay windows... in the showflats, all look great because of smart ID... but when owners get their units, they get a shock how small the bedrooms are, liveable spaces, etc... and huge planters and bay windows!

Glad finally someone in URA woke up to this... except that why was it allowed to continue for so long!

Does it mean developers are no longer able to get this 'area' for free?

Some agents were telling me developers need not pay for this portion of the property hence we are seeing all these bay windows and planters all over the new projects.

If so, does it also mean we will no longer see this built into new projects?

Unregistered123
14-07-08, 09:31
But at 900psf in east coast i think at most it will dip to 800+. unlikely that it goes below 800 we have areas like telok kurau and lower end areas like bayshore (99) still holding strong at 800. If prime east areas like amber road drop to 700+ it means our economy is taking a strong beating. At that time i don't think we will be chatting in this forum..

Has to come to 600psf. No other way. This time its going to be bad and real scary.
Heard that One Amber unit already asking for $799psf. possible to go down to $700+ level. Who is still buying Bayshore at 800 now?

Unregistered123
14-07-08, 09:59
Saw an adv on Saturday's classified. A semi-D in simei asking for only S$800K, have 55 years lease left.
Is it worthy to buy? since it's even cheaper than those 10 years old 99 lease cond?
1.2 mil The Esta v.s. 800K semi-D (even though only 55 yrs lease), which one better? life long loan v.s. debt free or lease loan, life is so short, right?

kal
14-07-08, 10:25
Heard that One Amber unit already asking for $799psf. possible to go down to $700+ level. Who is still buying Bayshore at 800 now?

One amber at $799psf, heard from where? in yr dream is it?? :sleep:

SM
14-07-08, 10:41
Lee KY say Next 10 years.... S'pore GDP will 7 to 8% pa.

Be confident of our economy.
Cheong liao lah!

Unregistered123
14-07-08, 10:58
One amber at $799psf, heard from where? in yr dream is it?? :sleep:
It's found in One Amber's forum...
http://forums.condosingapore.com/showthread.php?t=758&page=2

Are you one amber owner? cool down, don't over react leh.

Unregistered123
14-07-08, 11:00
It's found in One Amber's forum...
http://forums.condosingapore.com/showthread.php?t=758&page=2

Are you one amber owner? cool down, don't over react leh.

Fire sale is on the way... One Amber grd flr asking $799psf.. The Esta 3 bedder high floor transacted at $855psf... OK i am getting my money ready to buy a fire sale unit....
http://forums.condosingapore.com/showthread.php?t=758&page=2

Unregistered.
14-07-08, 11:22
Saw an adv on Saturday's classified. A semi-D in simei asking for only S$800K, have 55 years lease left.
Is it worthy to buy? since it's even cheaper than those 10 years old 99 lease cond?
1.2 mil The Esta v.s. 800K semi-D (even though only 55 yrs lease), which one better? life long loan v.s. debt free or lease loan, life is so short, right?
It's dangerous! the 55 years lease is highly not extentable. current CPF has strict rule, not allow ppl use CPF to pay installment fully for the private property less than 60 year lease!

Can you image who will buy it if you want to sell it in 10 years time? even no bank wanna loan you! All those rules make this semi-D a luxury lease - a rental of $800K for 55 years! Well, it's long enough for this generation, but you can't leave anything for your next generation...:) think twice!

TKT
14-07-08, 12:36
Does it mean developers are no longer able to get this 'area' for free?

Some agents were telling me developers need not pay for this portion of the property hence we are seeing all these bay windows and planters all over the new projects.

If so, does it also mean we will no longer see this built into new projects?


Think right now, for example you bought a 1200sft condo, this 1200sft includes all these bay window, planter. So you paid to developer based on this 1200sft. However, for developer, they dont have to pay GFA to URA for all these bay window and planter.

In other words, the developer make more money if they can sell you more sft of bay windows and planters - hence, you see all these big bay windows and huge planters all plastered in these new projects!

Correct me if wrong, that's how i read it, cheers!

Unregistered123
21-07-08, 09:30
Think right now, for example you bought a 1200sft condo, this 1200sft includes all these bay window, planter. So you paid to developer based on this 1200sft. However, for developer, they dont have to pay GFA to URA for all these bay window and planter.

In other words, the developer make more money if they can sell you more sft of bay windows and planters - hence, you see all these big bay windows and huge planters all plastered in these new projects!

Correct me if wrong, that's how i read it, cheers!
Does it mean that we can negotiate the actual floor area in re-sale market, since the "real" size is only that little? Can we either pay less PFS, or pay less floor area? want's the impact for the resale market?

nregistered
21-07-08, 20:59
Does it mean that we can negotiate the actual floor area in re-sale market, since the "real" size is only that little? Can we either pay less PFS, or pay less floor area? want's the impact for the resale market?

Of course u cant pay less floor area as the title deed is for 1200sq ft(example). There will be no impact on resale market.

The previous rules were an incentive which was misused as developers found a way to make extra by 'engulfing" the entire unit with bay windows and planters (even in kitchen,bathrooms, planters in bedrooms).

Unregistered1
22-07-08, 13:25
Of course u cant pay less floor area as the title deed is for 1200sq ft(example). There will be no impact on resale market.

The previous rules were an incentive which was misused as developers found a way to make extra by 'engulfing" the entire unit with bay windows and planters (even in kitchen,bathrooms, planters in bedrooms).
Wow, what to do for the huge bathroom baywindow? can't even sit, only can put shampoo! :sleep:
wait for T.O.P for bargain power :jump-for-joy:

Unregistered1
22-07-08, 13:30
Testing:
Characters Icon Meaning another way
:-) happy :) (-: (:
:-)) very happy :))
:-D big smile :D
:-O surprised / o, no :O
:-P tongue sticking out :P :-p :p
;-) wink ;)

Unregistered1
22-07-08, 13:32
:-( sad :(
:-(( very sad :((
:-/ confused :-\
:"> embarrassed
:-> vicious :>
:-| undecided :|

Unregistered1
22-07-08, 13:33
B-) wearing sunglasses
:-B wearing regular glasses / is a nerd :B
X-( angry x-( X( x(
:-X in love :-x :X :x
I-) asleep |-) I-|
=; Talk to my hand
@};- rose
<):) cowboy
8-X skull
=:-) alien =:)
0:-) angel
>:) devil

Unregistered1
22-07-08, 13:34
:O) clown :o) :0) <@:)
3:-O cow 3:-o 3:O
:(|) monkey
:O) pig :@)
**== US-flag
(~~) Pumpkin
[-( crossed arms / in a huff
*-:) Light bulb
:-$ Shhh
~:> Chicken
~o) cup of coffee
%%- lucky / clover
b-( beat up
:)>- peace
:-& sick
=* kiss :-* :*

Unregistered1
22-07-08, 13:34
;;) flirt / blink ;;-)
/:-) what / raise eyebrow /:)
(%) ying/yang
o-+ Yahoo Fighter - April
o=> Yahoo Fighter- Billy
o-> Yahoo Fighter- Hiro
:-L mad
[-o< praying
[-X No no no
>:D< this much / hugging
\:D/ swinging / dancing
=D> applause
:-? thinking
:^o liar :^O
@-) hypnotized
8-| looking around / rolling eyes
8-} crazy
(:| tired
=p~ drooling
$-) money eyes
:-" whistling
#-o doh!

Unregistered1
22-07-08, 14:48
:thumb: <:thumb:>
:jumpy: <:jumpy:>
:whip: <:whip:>
:happy:
:sad:
:dry:
:angry:
:unsure:
:mellow:
:sleep:
:glare:
:blink:
:cry:

Unregistered1
22-07-08, 14:51
:bsflag:
:hammer:
:wav:
:brickwall:
:hb:

Good try
22-07-08, 16:18
:joy-to-jump:

Unregistered1
22-07-08, 16:21
:joy-to-jump:
:jump-for-joy: wrong sequence :p

Unregistered1
29-07-08, 11:54
Record 13,400 homes to be completed next year
Rents expected to fall, especially in prime districts and East Coast. Fiona Chan reports.

Next year is likely to be a bad one for landlords.
A bumper crop of newly completed homes is scheduled to flood the market, making more apartments available for rent and pushing down rents, which saw record rises last year.

And with lower rents, private home prices - which industry observers say have reached their peak - may drop further, especially those in the prime districts.

A massive 13,399 new private homes will be ready for occupation next year. This is double the average in recent years and the most in a single year, according to property consultancy CB Richard Ellis (CBRE).

Official supply numbers show 10,500 completions next year and 11,800 the year after, but CBRE's analysis, based on construction progress and delays, reveals more completions next year.

It expects this new supply to depress rents by 5 to 10 per cent on average next year, coming on top of a global economic slowdown that might lead firms to hire fewer expatriates, the main source of tenants.

In the prime areas, rents could slide up to 15 per cent next year, on top of a decline that has already begun this year, predicted CBRE.

Popular rental areas such as the East Coast and Orchard will be among the worst hit as keen demand for homes there in recent years led developers to build aggressively.

An 'alarming' 3,341 new homes will be completed in the East Coast next year, double the number this year, CBRE said. Major projects in the area, which covers Katong and Marine Parade to Bedok and Changi, include the 562-unit One Amber and the 556-unit Casa Merah.

In the prime districts 9, 10 and 11, some 4,240 homes will be ready in areas such as Orchard, Holland, River Valley, Tanglin and Newton. RiverGate, with 545 units, is the biggest condominium scheduled to open its doors.

Suburban areas will also see a large jump in finished homes next year. In the north and north-west, for example, there will be 10 times more than this year.

But this is unlikely to result in a glut or lower rents as most suburban home buyers intend to occupy their units.

Property experts warn that many major prime projects to be ready this year and next are those that had attracted investors rather than owner-occupiers, which means their units will add to the rental supply.

'Some big condos in the downtown areas have a higher proportion of investors,' said Mr Colin Tan of property firm Chesterton International. These include the 1,111-unit Sail @ Marina Bay, which will be fully completed by the end of this year, and the 312-unit Clift in McCallum Road, expected next year.

'We don't even have to wait for the 14,000 homes next year; rents are already moderating and should come down in the third quarter,' he said, adding that landlords are lowering their asking rentals.

He cited the case of The Sea View in Amber Road, whose 546 units were completed this year. 'I asked someone there, how are the rents? He said: 'I'm not sure really, there's no demand'.'

This will be welcome news for renters, who have had to face ever-increasing rents over the last two years.

Rents have shot up 60 per cent on average since 2006 and even doubled in some places, thanks to an influx of expats and a shortage of rental homes.

For example, in Cuscaden Residences in the Tanglin area, a typical 1,485 sq ft unit could fetch $9,200 in monthly rents last year, from about $6,500 in 2005. This year, it has fallen to $8,100, according to recent reports. Next year, it could fall by another 10 per cent to $7,300, if CBRE's predictions come true.

Entrepreneur Sebastien Dechamps, 29, who came here from France three years ago and started a website for expatriates, said high rents have seen more expatriates moving away from the city to places in the north and the east.

'The fall in rental prices is definitely good news. It might encourage expats to move to the city, which is great because they can put more vibrancy back into the city and into its nightlife,' he said.

A fall in rentals generally leads to a fall in home prices for two reasons: landlords, less able to service their mortgages, are willing to let go of their units more cheaply, while would-be investors will only pay as much as a home can fetch in rents.

The supply situation is not likely to improve beyond 2010: The latest official data shows that apart from the 21,000 or so homes to be completed over the next two years, there are another 20,000 homes scheduled to be built in 2011.

But Savills Singapore's director of business development and marketing, Mr Ku Swee Yong, is still optimistic.

He expects higher than average housing demand during 'the next few years of growth', and believes that after accounting for demolitions of collective sale estates, the 'net supply should be balanced by demand'.

Source: Straits Times 27th July 2008

Unregistered1
29-07-08, 11:56
***
In the prime areas, rents could slide up to 15 per cent next year, on top of a decline that has already begun this year, predicted CBRE.

Popular rental areas such as the East Coast and Orchard will be among the worst hit as keen demand for homes there in recent years led developers to build aggressively.

An 'alarming' 3,341 new homes will be completed in the East Coast next year, double the number this year, CBRE said. Major projects in the area, which covers Katong and Marine Parade to Bedok and Changi, include the 562-unit One Amber and the 556-unit Casa Merah
***

And the Esta will be T.O.P soon!

I will wait
31-07-08, 14:37
The latest URA transaction:

--------
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,122,615 1,313 855 Jul-08
--------

Wait for $800, then consider... why not? Cheap and good! And i believe the bed rooms are surely bigger than the sea view's pigeon hole... :)

I will wait
31-07-08, 14:37
The latest URA transaction:

--------
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,122,615 1,313 855 Jul-08
--------

Wait for $800, then consider... why not? Cheap and good! And i believe the bedrooms are surely bigger than the sea view's pigeon hole... :)

rregistered
31-07-08, 16:21
The latest URA transaction:

--------
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,122,615 1,313 855 Jul-08
--------

Wait for $800, then consider... why not? Cheap and good! And i believe the bedrooms are surely bigger than the sea view's pigeon hole... :)

How can u be so sure the rooms in Esta wont be small or it could be
the kitchen or living that may be cramped......there is no free lunch.

Unregistered888
31-07-08, 17:41
How can u be so sure the rooms in Esta wont be small or it could be
the kitchen or living that may be cramped......there is no free lunch.

Esta : bedrooms are bigger, but the dinning/living/kitchen/balcony are very much smaller..There is no use for the balcony

I will wait
31-07-08, 18:13
Esta : bedrooms are bigger, but the dinning/living/kitchen/balcony are very much smaller..There is no use for the balcony
Can wait till TOP, then have a physical look and feel first before commit anything. no argument, no regret.

registered
01-08-08, 11:03
Note the balcony in Esta - they are on alternate floors so one can easily look into neighbours unit from one level higher.

Also there is no basement parking - go and check it out.

Rather wait till TOP before buying.

wait also
01-08-08, 11:50
Note the balcony in Esta - they are on alternate floors so one can easily look into neighbours unit from one level higher.

Also there is no basement parking - go and check it out.

Rather wait till TOP before buying.
No basement parking? Sure or not? 400 unit leh, where got place to park so many cars?

Really want to see which type of unit is better, normal balcony one or the terrace type. wait till TOP!

East Lover
01-08-08, 17:18
Note the balcony in Esta - they are on alternate floors so one can easily look into neighbours unit from one level higher.

Also there is no basement parking - go and check it out.

Rather wait till TOP before buying.
See the word - comprising of basement carparks...
http://membres.lycos.fr/pengssc/img/060513_esta03.jpg

TOP in 1 month
01-08-08, 17:26
Thanks East Lover for the photo.

Just noticed that the TOP date is comming soon: 31th August 2008! Wow! One more month, then all can see liao!

Real Estate Pundit
06-08-08, 10:02
All right folks, this is for information only. For sharing.

Caveats lodged for The Esta from this year, very few transactions.

Unit___Size, sqft__$psf___Total_______Contract date
15-04__1313______855___$1,122,615__14 Jul 08
19-07__1346_____1000___$1,346,000__14 Jul 08
10-12__1346______877___$1,180,000__8 Jul 08
13-11__1593______929___$1,480,000__7 Jul 08
19-20__1561______974___$1,520,000__27 Jun 08
11-10__1561______930___$1,451,730__26 Jun 08
10-11__1561______955___$1,490,755__24 Jun 08
10-03__1313______900___$1,181,700__14 May 08
09-08__1001______950___$950,950____30 Apr 08
16-17__1561______965___$1.506.365__14 Apr 08
04-02__1475______990___$1,460,000__08 Apr 08
04-18__1346______930___$1,251,780__03 Apr 08
14-08__1001______1119__$1,120,000__02 Apr 08
09-06__1399______1038__$1,452,000__28 Mar 08
17-02__1464______1107__$1,620,000__06 Mar 08
07-20__1561______1100__$1,717,100__22 Jan 08
17-08__1001______1100__$1,101,100__15 Jan 08
18-17__1561______1086__$1,695,000__27 Dec 07

Thanks!
06-08-08, 10:10
All right folks, this is for information only. For sharing.

Caveats lodged for The Esta from this year, very few transactions.

Unit___Size, sqft__$psf___Total_______Contract date
15-04__1313______855___$1,122,615__14 Jul 08
19-07__1346_____1000___$1,346,000__14 Jul 08
10-12__1346______877___$1,180,000__8 Jul 08
13-11__1593______929___$1,480,000__7 Jul 08
19-20__1561______974___$1,520,000__27 Jun 08
11-10__1561______930___$1,451,730__26 Jun 08
10-11__1561______955___$1,490,755__24 Jun 08
10-03__1313______900___$1,181,700__14 May 08
09-08__1001______950___$950,950____30 Apr 08
16-17__1561______965___$1.506.365__14 Apr 08
04-02__1475______990___$1,460,000__08 Apr 08
04-18__1346______930___$1,251,780__03 Apr 08
14-08__1001______1119__$1,120,000__02 Apr 08
09-06__1399______1038__$1,452,000__28 Mar 08
17-02__1464______1107__$1,620,000__06 Mar 08
07-20__1561______1100__$1,717,100__22 Jan 08
17-08__1001______1100__$1,101,100__15 Jan 08
18-17__1561______1086__$1,695,000__27 Dec 07
Thanks, expert! All say the ESTA will T.O.P around Oct 08. what's the reasonable price to go in for the better unit?
possible to go to $800psf? by Chinese New Year? :p

Esta Summary
06-08-08, 10:15
2 Bedroom
Type A1 - 1001 sq ft (18 Units)
Type A1a - 1141 sq ft (1 Unit)
Type A2 - 1001 sq ft (19 Units)

2 Bedroom + study
Type A3 - 1130 sq ft (10 Units)
Type A3b - 1173 sq ft (10 Units)
Type A4 - 1130 sq ft (9 Units)
Type A4a - 1270 sq ft (2 Units)
Type A4b - 1173 sq ft (9 Units)

3 Bedroom
Type B1 - 1313 sq ft (56 Units)
Type B1a - 1690 sq ft (2 Units)
Type B1b - 1378 sq ft (9 Units)
Type B2 - 1346 sq ft (56 Units)
Type B2a - 1464 sq ft (1 Unit)
Type B2b - 1399 sq ft (9 Units)
Type B2c - 1432 sq ft (1 Unit)

3 Bedroom + Study
Type B3 - 1399 sq ft (28 Units)
Type B3a - 1507 sq ft (3 Units)
Type B3b - 1464 sq ft (18 Units)
Type B4 - 1410 sq ft (28 Units)
Type B4a - 1485 sq ft (1 Unit)
Type B4b - 1475 sq ft (20 Units)

4 Bedroom
Type C1 - 1561 sq ft (38 Units)
Type C1a - 1647 sq ft (2 Units)
Type C2 - 1593 sq ft (38 Units)
Type C2a - 1711 sq ft (2 Units)

Penthouse
Type D1 - 2960 sq ft (2 Units)
Type D2 - 3477 sq ft (2 Units)
Type D3 - 3068 sq ft (3 Units)
Type D4 - 2368 sq ft (2 Units)
Type D5 - 3186 sq ft (1 Unit)

Real Estate Pundit
06-08-08, 10:37
Thanks, expert! All say the ESTA will T.O.P around Oct 08. what's the reasonable price to go in for the better unit?
possible to go to $800psf? by Chinese New Year? :p

Hi, I am not an expert but i merely have an additional instrument to properly track the market. Being able to share this info will help others to make informed decisions.

I do not have a crystal ball to see if $800 is possible....but it is a distinct possibility for the lower floors. When? 2-3 months? Very possible......

Caveats lodged for The Esta from this year, very few transactions.

Unit___Size, sqft__$psf___Total_______Contract date
15-04__1313______855___$1,122,615__14 Jul 08
19-07__1346_____1000___$1,346,000__14 Jul 08
10-12__1346______877___$1,180,000__8 Jul 08
13-11__1593______929___$1,480,000__7 Jul 08
19-20__1561______974___$1,520,000__27 Jun 08
11-10__1561______930___$1,451,730__26 Jun 08
10-11__1561______955___$1,490,755__24 Jun 08
10-03__1313______900___$1,181,700__14 May 08
09-08__1001______950___$950,950____30 Apr 08
16-17__1561______965___$1.506.365__14 Apr 08
04-02__1475______990___$1,460,000__08 Apr 08
04-18__1346______930___$1,251,780__03 Apr 08
14-08__1001______1119__$1,120,000__02 Apr 08
09-06__1399______1038__$1,452,000__28 Mar 08
17-02__1464______1107__$1,620,000__06 Mar 08
07-20__1561______1100__$1,717,100__22 Jan 08
17-08__1001______1100__$1,101,100__15 Jan 08
18-17__1561______1086__$1,695,000__27 Dec 07

Thanks!
06-08-08, 11:40
Hi, I am not an expert but i merely have an additional instrument to properly track the market. Being able to share this info will help others to make informed decisions.

I do not have a crystal ball to see if $800 is possible....but it is a distinct possibility for the lower floors. When? 2-3 months? Very possible......

Well, still thank you for your kind sharing...

You see this transaction:
15-04__1313______855___$1,122,615__14 Jul 08

it's 15th floor, and south facing unit! Maybe not so many ppl buy the idea of sky terrace? Personally I feel the sky terrace is very unique!

caveats
06-08-08, 22:17
Hi, I am not an expert but i merely have an additional instrument to properly track the market. Being able to share this info will help others to make informed decisions.

I do not have a crystal ball to see if $800 is possible....but it is a distinct possibility for the lower floors. When? 2-3 months? Very possible......

Caveats lodged for The Esta from this year, very few transactions.

Unit___Size, sqft__$psf___Total_______Contract date
15-04__1313______855___$1,122,615__14 Jul 08
19-07__1346_____1000___$1,346,000__14 Jul 08
10-12__1346______877___$1,180,000__8 Jul 08
13-11__1593______929___$1,480,000__7 Jul 08
19-20__1561______974___$1,520,000__27 Jun 08
11-10__1561______930___$1,451,730__26 Jun 08
10-11__1561______955___$1,490,755__24 Jun 08
10-03__1313______900___$1,181,700__14 May 08
09-08__1001______950___$950,950____30 Apr 08
16-17__1561______965___$1.506.365__14 Apr 08
04-02__1475______990___$1,460,000__08 Apr 08
04-18__1346______930___$1,251,780__03 Apr 08
14-08__1001______1119__$1,120,000__02 Apr 08
09-06__1399______1038__$1,452,000__28 Mar 08
17-02__1464______1107__$1,620,000__06 Mar 08
07-20__1561______1100__$1,717,100__22 Jan 08
17-08__1001______1100__$1,101,100__15 Jan 08
18-17__1561______1086__$1,695,000__27 Dec 07

how do you see the unit number in the caveats lodge in URA website??

Real Estate Pundit
07-08-08, 07:41
how do you see the unit number in the caveats lodge in URA website??

It is not from URA website. It is a commercial site that needs subscription fee in order to access data.

where
07-08-08, 13:34
It is not from URA website. It is a commercial site that needs subscription fee in order to access data.

which site? ipropertyNET ?

Real Estate Pundit
07-08-08, 16:26
which site? ipropertyNET ?

SISV. Can see unit number as well as buyer type.....meaning local or foreigner. Private address or HDB.

840
09-08-08, 16:31
Today the papers quoted $840 as cheapest ready for transaction...

Unregistered.
11-08-08, 14:07
Today the papers quoted $840 as cheapest ready for transaction...
Good news! Paper say $840, actually can bargain to $800? I believe price will drop further when oct TOP time. Don't forget the first hand owener only bought below $700!

Real Estate Pundit
11-08-08, 17:24
No caveats lodged for The Esta between 15th July 2008 to 1st Aug 2008.

Over priced also?
12-08-08, 11:52
See extract from www.salary.sg:

It’s not always so easy to make money, as the previous case studies suggested.

Slightly more than 10 years ago, a young couple bought something that almost ruined their lives financially.

It was the middle of 1996, a boom time for the stock market as well as the property market.

The couple - working professionals - were earning salaries that disqualify them for subsidised HDB housing.

Just married, they were yearning for a nice place to stay in.

They set their eyes on a 1,300 square foot condominium just north of Ang Mo Kio. The location is not very central, but the asking price was a crazy $1 million.

It was a stretch for the couple. Without huge savings, they could only afford the initial 20% downpayment and had to borrow the rest for the progress payments.

But given the rosy economy then, and the fact that they were holding well-paying jobs (making a combined $150k a year), they went ahead and bought the condo.

We all know what happened next.

The economy tanked. Asia went into financial crisis. Jobs were lost. Stock and property prices fell. Drastically.

Salaries were cut.

The couple also saw their income go down. Yet, they still had to make the mortgage repayments.

A big part of their earnings went to the bank.

They were slaves to the mortgage loan. (It’s still the case now. So they don’t save a lot.)

Worse, the condo’s value went down, almost to negative equity level, i.e. owing the bank more than the property’s worth.

Even now, when property prices are at peak levels (and maybe on the way down), the couple’s condo is still a loss-making investment. Why? Their condo is a leasehold property.

So, this unfortunate couple is “stuck” with a still-sizable bank loan, a condo that’s depreciating in value, and low savings. And they are considered high income earners…

A wrong move, and they are hit financially for a long time…

Will it happen again?

From other thread. Scary! Will it happen in the Esta? is it over priced? since this project is the cheapest one in marin parad area, will it turn to negative equity level?

Freehold hooray
12-08-08, 12:45
From other thread. Scary! Will it happen in the Esta? is it over priced? since this project is the cheapest one in marin parad area, will it turn to negative equity level?

The key word is "leasehold"....

Real Estate Pundit
12-08-08, 19:41
From other thread. Scary! Will it happen in the Esta? is it over priced? since this project is the cheapest one in marin parad area, will it turn to negative equity level?

FYI, it has become negative equity for everyone who bought in 2006 and 2007. Don't forget the 3% stamp duty and legal fees spent up front. What about the interest payable on housing loan? All this adds up.

Eastie
13-08-08, 12:33
Prices for Esta seem to be falling by the day. As low as $825 psf today. I think $700+ psf isn't too far away.

Unregistered123
13-08-08, 13:26
Prices for Esta seem to be falling by the day. As low as $825 psf today. I think $700+ psf isn't too far away.
Good news! Keep us updated, ok? Thanks!

East Lover
13-08-08, 17:02
http://www.keonghong.com/Projects/ProjectPhotos/ProgressPhotos/Esta16Jul08.JPG

East Lover
13-08-08, 17:09
Contract Period 01 Mar 06 - 31 Aug 08
Duration 30 Months
Contract Sum S$ 74,280,000.00

Design & Build Contract for New Erection of 5 Blocks of 21 Storey Condominium Housing Development (Total 400 units) comprising of Basement Carparks, Communal Facilties and Swimming Pool on Lot 3391T MK 25 at 27 Amber Gardens / Mounbatten Road, Singapore (Design and Build)

Developer Richdeal Pte Ltd ( c/o MCL Land Limited)
Architects Design Link Architects
Civil & Structural Engineers P&T Consultants Pte Ltd / KTP Consultants Pte Ltd ( AC Checker)
M&E Consultant Engineers United Project Consultants Pte Ltd
Quantity Surveyors KPK Quantity Surveyors Singapore Pte Ltd
Design & Build Main Contractor Keong Hong Construction Pte Ltd

East Lover
13-08-08, 17:26
So never believe the show flat, see the actual unit then decide!
Good luck, all the east/esta lovers!
http://membres.lycos.fr/pengssc/img/060513_esta01.jpg

rr
17-08-08, 19:24
anybody interested super high floor 3 bedrooms facing north?

PH
17-08-08, 22:18
any penthouse available ?

keen buyer
17-08-08, 22:42
anybody interested super high floor 3 bedrooms facing north?
I'm keen provided price is right. Pls email me your price and details at [email protected]. Thanks.

Eastie
18-08-08, 12:35
anybody interested super high floor 3 bedrooms facing north?


How much are you asking for?

nicenice
21-08-08, 22:45
yep how much

Kace
22-08-08, 11:48
Esta Looks just like Seaview...Nothing fascinating about seaview apart from their clubhouse

Unregistered?
22-08-08, 14:40
Esta Looks just like Seaview...Nothing fascinating about seaview apart from their clubhouse
Well, the price is different! The newspaper got unit asking $825 psf now! check the URA, there is a transaction at $855psf, while the Seaview lowest is $1000psf, so which one better? money for value is of course The Esta lah.

Ever been the Sea View, wow, the rooms are super tiny!

Unrgistered
22-08-08, 14:48
Well, the price is different! The newspaper got unit asking $825 psf now! check the URA, there is a transaction at $855psf, while the Seaview lowest is $1000psf, so which one better? money for value is of course The Esta lah.

Ever been the Sea View, wow, the rooms are super tiny!

so u think Esta rooms will be super big or what - all 3 projects One Amber, Esta and SV designed at same time and u can expect similar size rooms.

Cta
22-08-08, 14:49
Well, the price is different! The newspaper got unit asking $825 psf now! check the URA, there is a transaction at $855psf, while the Seaview lowest is $1000psf, so which one better? money for value is of course The Esta lah.

Ever been the Sea View, wow, the rooms are super tiny!


if u have seen Cote d Azur bedrooms - then Sea View's are much better size !!

nicenice
22-08-08, 19:31
sea view is miuch bigger then cote de azur

Unregistered11
23-08-08, 10:08
Today Esta got $815 psft

esta_815psf
25-08-08, 15:53
Bruddy... Esta at 815 psf ? Sure or not ??

esta_800psf]
25-08-08, 16:23
Bruddy... Esta at 815 psf ? Sure or not ??
I saw some agent even quote 800psf on the sat adv, duno how true...

kal
25-08-08, 16:26
lousy stack, low floor, next to M road... sometimes good stack/floor commands premium price. Lousy stack/floor/facing wanna sell low low, also nobody wants..

esta_800psf
25-08-08, 16:41
lousy stack, low floor, next to M road... sometimes good stack/floor commands premium price. Lousy stack/floor/facing wanna sell low low, also nobody wants..
Well, ppl say to buy the lousiest unit in the best location is wiser than to buy the best unit in a lousy location. You know there are a lot of adv on Casa Merah, also dear to ask $750psf...!

750psf for D16 99, why not buy a lousy unit at $800psf @ D15 FS?

Location, location, location!

prices still going south
26-08-08, 08:08
Esta will go below $800psf very soon, if singapore goes into a technical recession which is very likely, expect to see Esta and the rest of the D15 to go below $700psf.

Good luck to all D15 punters.

Price will go North
26-08-08, 09:42
Sentiment in the Singapore property market is now far from bullish, but data shows that nearly 97 per cent of those who have sold private apartments and condos in the subsale market in the first seven months of this year have made profits.

Only 3 per cent incurred losses, an analysis of caveats by Savills Singapore shows.

For those who turned a profit, the average gain per unit came to $417,563 or 36.5 per cent. Generally, the longer the holding period, the bigger the gain.

Subsale deals are seen as a proxy for the level of speculative activity in the market. On average, those who had bought their units in 2004 and sold them in the subsale market this year made the biggest gain, averaging nearly $692,000, or an 84 per cent profit. They are followed by those who had picked up units in
2005, who recorded an average gain of about $645,200 or 62 per cent from selling their homes in the subsale market this year.

In absolute dollar terms, the smallest average gain of around $175,600 was by those who bought their units this year, reflecting a holding period of just a few months.

The profit or loss in the calculation is the difference between sale and purchase prices and does not take into account stamp duty and other expenses.

‘The fact is that longer holding periods allow for larger gains, shorter holding periods for smaller gains. This is consistent with the fact that real estate is a long-term investment. Investors with short exit time frames should look for alternative instruments,’ said Savills Singapore’s director of marketing and business development Ku Swee Yong.

Savills’ analysis was based on 1,040 caveats for subsale transactions from Jan 1 to July 31 this year captured by Urban Redevelopment Authority’s Realis system as at Aug 19. Of these, 821 had previous caveat records dating back to 2003 and Savills compared the latest subsale price of each unit with the earlier price paid by the seller to work out the profit or loss.

Citylights, Varsity Park Condo and The Sail @ Marina Bay had the most subsales in the first seven months of this year - 63, 47 and 45 respectively. The Sea View and City Square Residences had 30-plus subsales each. Park Infinia at Wee Nam, The Calrose, Icon and The Raintree each had 20-odd subsales.

Subsales, often seen as a gauge of speculative activity, refer to secondary market deals in projects that have yet to receive their Certificates of Statutory Completion. This may be anywhere from three to 12 months after the project receives its Temporary Occupation Permit (TOP).

Market watchers note that many of the projects topping the subsale chart this year had either received TOP or are close to receiving TOP. Some of the units that changed hands in the subsale market could have been purchased on deferred payment schemes from developers in the past. Typically, such schemes run out when the projects get their TOP and that is when buyers have to pay the chunk of the purchase price to developers.

The deferred payment scheme was scrapped in October last year to discourage speculative buying.

Of the 25 loss cases for subsale deals done this year, sellers of about half the units had themselves bought theirs in the subsale market, while the other half had made direct purchases from developers. For instance, the four units sold in the subsale market at a loss this year at City Square Residences had all been picked up in the subsale market last year.

Looking ahead, Savills’ Mr Ku expects subsales to maintain at current levels, that is, about 150 units a month. Those who want to sell now will have to expect lower profits, he said.

‘Whether in good or bad times, there will still be subsale losses from people being forced to make untimely sales due to corporate liquidation, bankruptcy, divorce,’ Mr Ku added.

In cases where investors are sitting on potential losses, Jones Lang LaSalle Singapore’s head of residential, Jacqueline Wong, said: ‘My advice to my clients, who are usually foreigners, have bought in prime districts and are well off, would be, ‘If you can, hang on. It will be just a temporary paper loss. Singapore has a lot of things going for it in the mid term’.’

Another seasoned property consultant said: ‘A lot will depend on your entry price vis-a-vis other owners, especially in a big development. If a lot of them bought at say $1,000 psf from the developer and you got your unit later for $1,800 psf in the subsale market from an earlier buyer, you’re in a disadvantageous position. If the market dives, the earlier buyers could offload their units at much lower prices than your cost price.

‘On the other hand, everybody may be in the same boat. Say, if you’ve bought into a small project of 30 units and everyone’s bought at about the same price, and if there’s not much competition from surrounding projects, chances of prices going down substantially may be lower because everyone’s locked in at the same threshold.’

esta_700psf
26-08-08, 11:23
Esta will go below $800psf very soon, if singapore goes into a technical recession which is very likely, expect to see Esta and the rest of the D15 to go below $700psf.

Good luck to all D15 punters.
Oh Yeh! $700psf is coming soon! STI went down 2700 just now, if the first hand Esta owner bought it at $650psf, selling it at $700psf still can cover the cost of stamp duty and bank loan interest... otherwise it's hard to hold it. you know the rental in the Sea View is pretty weak, that will be even weaker in Esta!

Real Estate Pundit
27-08-08, 15:08
Hi Esta$700psf,

Still going to be a while before your prediction will happen if at all. See the conflicting Fiona Chan's ST article yesterday and Temasek's stagflation warning in BT page 1 today.

I rather heed to Temasek's warning than listen to Fiona.

Anyway, only 1 transaction between 15 Jul 08 to 15 Aug 08.

Unit___Size, sqft__$psf___Total_______Contract date
1X-07__1346______929___$1,250,000__15 Aug 08 --- NEW, but below #14
15-04__1313______855___$1,122,615__14 Jul 08
19-07__1346_____1000___$1,346,000__14 Jul 08
10-12__1346______877___$1,180,000__8 Jul 08
13-11__1593______929___$1,480,000__7 Jul 08
19-20__1561______974___$1,520,000__27 Jun 08
11-10__1561______930___$1,451,730__26 Jun 08
10-11__1561______955___$1,490,755__24 Jun 08
10-03__1313______900___$1,181,700__14 May 08
09-08__1001______950___$950,950____30 Apr 08
16-17__1561______965___$1.506.365__14 Apr 08
04-02__1475______990___$1,460,000__08 Apr 08
04-18__1346______930___$1,251,780__03 Apr 08
14-08__1001______1119__$1,120,000__02 Apr 08
09-06__1399______1038__$1,452,000__28 Mar 08
17-02__1464______1107__$1,620,000__06 Mar 08
07-20__1561______1100__$1,717,100__22 Jan 08
17-08__1001______1100__$1,101,100__15 Jan 08
18-17__1561______1086__$1,695,000__27 Dec 07

esta_700psf
27-08-08, 16:17
Hi Esta$700psf,

Still going to be a while before your prediction will happen if at all. See the conflicting Fiona Chan's ST article yesterday and Temasek's stagflation warning in BT page 1 today.

I rather heed to Temasek's warning than listen to Fiona.

Anyway, only 1 transaction between 15 Jul 08 to 15 Aug 08.

Unit___Size, sqft__$psf___Total_______Contract date
1X-07__1346______929___$1,250,000__15 Aug 08 --- NEW, but below #14
15-04__1313______855___$1,122,615__14 Jul 08
19-07__1346_____1000___$1,346,000__14 Jul 08
10-12__1346______877___$1,180,000__8 Jul 08
13-11__1593______929___$1,480,000__7 Jul 08
19-20__1561______974___$1,520,000__27 Jun 08
11-10__1561______930___$1,451,730__26 Jun 08
10-11__1561______955___$1,490,755__24 Jun 08
10-03__1313______900___$1,181,700__14 May 08
09-08__1001______950___$950,950____30 Apr 08
16-17__1561______965___$1.506.365__14 Apr 08
04-02__1475______990___$1,460,000__08 Apr 08
04-18__1346______930___$1,251,780__03 Apr 08
14-08__1001______1119__$1,120,000__02 Apr 08
09-06__1399______1038__$1,452,000__28 Mar 08
17-02__1464______1107__$1,620,000__06 Mar 08
07-20__1561______1100__$1,717,100__22 Jan 08
17-08__1001______1100__$1,101,100__15 Jan 08
18-17__1561______1086__$1,695,000__27 Dec 07
Hi Real Estate Pundit,

Thanks for the prompt update.

Surprise to see 1X-07 go back to $929psf.... Have to admit that Type B2 has a better layout, no waste space on the master bedroom balcony, no sky terrace, and full pool facing. Just for facing north, duno fengshui good or not...

So my $700psf dream will not come true so soon liao...:(

Btw, look this 15-04 (at $855psf), is it worthy to buy the lousy unit in the best location, rather than to buy the best unit in a lousy location?

Real Estate Pundit
27-08-08, 17:00
Hi Real Estate Pundit,

Thanks for the prompt update.

Surprise to see 1X-07 go back to $929psf.... Have to admit that Type B2 has a better layout, no waste space on the master bedroom balcony, no sky terrace, and full pool facing. Just for facing north, duno fengshui good or not...

So my $700psf dream will not come true so soon liao...:(

Btw, look this 15-04 (at $855psf), is it worthy to buy the lousy unit in the best location, rather than to buy the best unit in a lousy location?

2 ways to look at the new transaction, 1. the buyer really really likes the unit (although I do not know why coz it is not TOP yet and thus can't see the actual unit) and 2. A sucker is made everyday :doh:

What I have analysed in the past year is that when it is 'Sellers' market', even rubbish properties can be sold! But when it is 'Buyers' market', most transactions are for good properties. Eg. high floor, good view, good layout...

It is now 'Buyers' market', so why worry about buying "... lousy unit in the best location, rather than to buy the best unit in a lousy location?" Wait a couple more months and you will have a lot more choices. :)

Do pick up today's Business Times. Temasek is warning about possible stagflation for Singapore. SO $700psf? WHO can tell?

BT guru
27-08-08, 17:07
read the biz times whch says not many people would sell their units at a loss unless extraneous circumstances cause them to. Statistically only a small handful of units sold at loss in subsale mkt mainly frm citylights n citysquare. I think the dreams of cheapos out there for nosedive prices will nt cme to past

latour
27-08-08, 18:27
2 ways to look at the new transaction, 1. the buyer really really likes the unit (although I do not know why coz it is not TOP yet and thus can't see the actual unit) and 2. A sucker is made everyday :doh:

What I have analysed in the past year is that when it is 'Sellers' market', even rubbish properties can be sold! But when it is 'Buyers' market', most transactions are for good properties. Eg. high floor, good view, good layout...

It is now 'Buyers' market', so why worry about buying "... lousy unit in the best location, rather than to buy the best unit in a lousy location?" Wait a couple more months and you will have a lot more choices. :)

Do pick up today's Business Times. Temasek is warning about possible stagflation for Singapore. SO $700psf? WHO can tell?

$700 psf or lower, pls post here and let us know, many will be interested. I'm still holding back on buying, still making comparison amongs SV, One Amber and ESTA.

CX
27-08-08, 21:49
$700 psf or lower, pls post here and let us know, many will be interested. I'm still holding back on buying, still making comparison amongs SV, One Amber and ESTA.

Hi latour,

From what i see,Esta prices is the weakest among amber road.almost everyweek,you can see the prices kept dropping n dropping..
I think $700psf is steal but gotta depends on stack facing as well..:)

lbb
27-08-08, 22:02
Hmmmmm, 700 is a real steal... even if the facing isnt that good, or the floor is pretty low..

I guess my view stems from the location of the condo. True, seaview is rather pathetic from all the blockage, but the food nearby, PP with all it's supermarket and stores, the beach to unwind and the friendly ECP (compared to CTE) is good enough reasons to get a unit at this place...

I would definately go for it at that price, but opp looks like Rose Garden's gonna be developed... construction.. garh, for these past few years amber's looking like one massive construction site. doesnt look as though it's gonna stop anytime soon.

recession
28-08-08, 09:26
read the biz times whch says not many people would sell their units at a loss unless extraneous circumstances cause them to. Statistically only a small handful of units sold at loss in subsale mkt mainly frm citylights n citysquare. I think the dreams of cheapos out there for nosedive prices will nt cme to past
When u loss your job, then we shall see. Prediction is that it is coming sooon.

007
28-08-08, 10:50
When u loss your job, then we shall see. Prediction is that it is coming sooon.
let's not hope for this to happen. if recession comes, you and I could lose our job. by then, even if people sell, you will not be able to buy.

esta_700psf
28-08-08, 15:02
2 ways to look at the new transaction, 1. the buyer really really likes the unit (although I do not know why coz it is not TOP yet and thus can't see the actual unit) and 2. A sucker is made everyday :doh:

What I have analysed in the past year is that when it is 'Sellers' market', even rubbish properties can be sold! But when it is 'Buyers' market', most transactions are for good properties. Eg. high floor, good view, good layout...

It is now 'Buyers' market', so why worry about buying "... lousy unit in the best location, rather than to buy the best unit in a lousy location?" Wait a couple more months and you will have a lot more choices. :)

Do pick up today's Business Times. Temasek is warning about possible stagflation for Singapore. SO $700psf? WHO can tell?

April 21 (Bloomberg) -- Government of Singapore Investment Corp., the sovereign fund that has invested about $18 billion in UBS AG and Citigroup Inc. since December, said the world economy may be headed for its worst recession in three decades.

``We could be facing a recession which is longer, deeper and wider than any recession that we have encountered in the last 30 years,'' Tony Tan, deputy chairman of GIC, as the company is known, said in a speech to more than 500 employees in Singapore today.

Tan said GIC, which oversees more than $100 billion, faces its ``most challenging years'' since being founded 27 years ago, as the global supply of credit contracts. His remarks come as the fund considers investing more in UBS, which is reeling from $38 billion of writedowns.

The banking industry will probably be the worst affected by a global recession, said Guy de Blonay, a director at New Star Asset Management Ltd. in London, which manages $1.2 billion in financial stocks.

``You cannot rule out the possibility of an operating environment for banks taking a sharp turn for the worse,'' he said. ``Indeed, history suggests that a deep banking crisis is not over until the sector has been subject to broad re- capitalization and management shake-ups.''

The International Monetary Fund this month changed its forecast for global economic growth to 3.7 percent for 2008 from an earlier projection of 4.1 percent. It also said there's a 25 percent chance of a world recession, citing the worst financial crisis in the U.S. since the Great Depression.

`Extreme Uncertainty'

The reduction was the third by the Washington-based lender since July, when it predicted the world economy would cope with the U.S. credit squeeze and grow 5.2 percent this year.

GIC, set up in 1981 as the government's fund manager for Singapore's foreign reserves, has earned an annual average 9.5 percent since its inception, it said two years ago at its 25th anniversary.

Tan, 68, told his employees that they're entering a period of ``extreme uncertainty'' in the world economy and global financial markets.

``The next years may well be among the most challenging years for GIC since our establishment,'' Tan said. ``As banks continue to deleverage, cutting down on their lending activities and causing contraction in credit supply, the prospects for the U.S. economy and possibly even the world economy are fraught with considerable downside risks.''

More Scrutiny

Adding to the challenges, sovereign wealth funds face more scrutiny by the U.S. and European nations after buying assets including banks and real estate. The U.S. is pushing the government-run funds to agree to guidelines being drafted by the International Monetary Fund and the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development.

U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson and sovereign wealth funds of Abu Dhabi and Singapore agreed last month to adopt rules for greater disclosure. The efforts are aimed in part to head off protectionist sentiment in Congress against foreign investors.

Citigroup, the biggest U.S. bank, and UBS are two of the hardest-hit companies by the collapse of the subprime mortgage market. Citigroup on April 18 posted a $5.11 billion first- quarter loss on almost $16 billion of trading writedowns and increased bad loan reserves, and cut 9,000 jobs.

UBS on April 1 said it will seek 15 billion francs ($15 billion) on top of the $13 billion it already raised from GIC and an unidentified Middle Eastern investor. GIC owns rights to acquire stock with 9.5 percent of its voting rights.

Return Targets

GIC said this month it will examine the terms of UBS's rights offer before deciding on whether to participate. The dilution to shareholders and those holding UBS's mandatory convertible notes from the rights offer is a ``necessary step,'' GIC said at the time.

Tan today defended funding Citigroup and UBS, saying the investment is ``long term'' that will yield returns when markets stabilize.

GIC, which doesn't publish financial statements, aims to achieve a rate of return exceeding the average inflation rate in the U.S., Japan and Germany, according to its Web site. Its average rate of return over global inflation was 5.3 percent per annum since 1981, the fund said two years ago.

==>Global Recession May Be Worst in 30 Years!

rich stay rich
28-08-08, 15:08
millionaires going up in numbers worldwide and singaporeans becoming mre affluent compared to previous years. We can all wait out the storm as we have holdng power so i can sleep well every nite.
April 21 (Bloomberg) -- Government of Singapore Investment Corp., the sovereign fund that has invested about $18 billion in UBS AG and Citigroup Inc. since December, said the world economy may be headed for its worst recession in three decades.

``We could be facing a recession which is longer, deeper and wider than any recession that we have encountered in the last 30 years,'' Tony Tan, deputy chairman of GIC, as the company is known, said in a speech to more than 500 employees in Singapore today.

Tan said GIC, which oversees more than $100 billion, faces its ``most challenging years'' since being founded 27 years ago, as the global supply of credit contracts. His remarks come as the fund considers investing more in UBS, which is reeling from $38 billion of writedowns.

The banking industry will probably be the worst affected by a global recession, said Guy de Blonay, a director at New Star Asset Management Ltd. in London, which manages $1.2 billion in financial stocks.

``You cannot rule out the possibility of an operating environment for banks taking a sharp turn for the worse,'' he said. ``Indeed, history suggests that a deep banking crisis is not over until the sector has been subject to broad re- capitalization and management shake-ups.''

The International Monetary Fund this month changed its forecast for global economic growth to 3.7 percent for 2008 from an earlier projection of 4.1 percent. It also said there's a 25 percent chance of a world recession, citing the worst financial crisis in the U.S. since the Great Depression.

`Extreme Uncertainty'

The reduction was the third by the Washington-based lender since July, when it predicted the world economy would cope with the U.S. credit squeeze and grow 5.2 percent this year.

GIC, set up in 1981 as the government's fund manager for Singapore's foreign reserves, has earned an annual average 9.5 percent since its inception, it said two years ago at its 25th anniversary.

Tan, 68, told his employees that they're entering a period of ``extreme uncertainty'' in the world economy and global financial markets.

``The next years may well be among the most challenging years for GIC since our establishment,'' Tan said. ``As banks continue to deleverage, cutting down on their lending activities and causing contraction in credit supply, the prospects for the U.S. economy and possibly even the world economy are fraught with considerable downside risks.''

More Scrutiny

Adding to the challenges, sovereign wealth funds face more scrutiny by the U.S. and European nations after buying assets including banks and real estate. The U.S. is pushing the government-run funds to agree to guidelines being drafted by the International Monetary Fund and the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development.

U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson and sovereign wealth funds of Abu Dhabi and Singapore agreed last month to adopt rules for greater disclosure. The efforts are aimed in part to head off protectionist sentiment in Congress against foreign investors.

Citigroup, the biggest U.S. bank, and UBS are two of the hardest-hit companies by the collapse of the subprime mortgage market. Citigroup on April 18 posted a $5.11 billion first- quarter loss on almost $16 billion of trading writedowns and increased bad loan reserves, and cut 9,000 jobs.

UBS on April 1 said it will seek 15 billion francs ($15 billion) on top of the $13 billion it already raised from GIC and an unidentified Middle Eastern investor. GIC owns rights to acquire stock with 9.5 percent of its voting rights.

Return Targets

GIC said this month it will examine the terms of UBS's rights offer before deciding on whether to participate. The dilution to shareholders and those holding UBS's mandatory convertible notes from the rights offer is a ``necessary step,'' GIC said at the time.

Tan today defended funding Citigroup and UBS, saying the investment is ``long term'' that will yield returns when markets stabilize.

GIC, which doesn't publish financial statements, aims to achieve a rate of return exceeding the average inflation rate in the U.S., Japan and Germany, according to its Web site. Its average rate of return over global inflation was 5.3 percent per annum since 1981, the fund said two years ago.

==>Global Recession May Be Worst in 30 Years!

esta_700psf
28-08-08, 15:10
http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/worldbiz/archives/2008/08/27/2003421486

CRISIS FALLOUT: For the financial year, the Singaporean fund reported a total return of 7 percent by market value compared with the 27 percent reported the year before

AFP, SINGAPORE
Wednesday, Aug 27, 2008, Page 10
Singaporean sovereign wealth fund Temasek Holdings, which invested billions in investment bank Merrill Lynch, yesterday reported a record profit of S$18.2 billion (US$12.8 billion).

But the state-linked investment firm in control of some of Asia’s best-known companies warned that slowing global economic growth following the US financial crisis could limit future opportunities.

“The fallout of the credit crisis will continue to dampen the global economy over the next 24 months, with sharply escalated oil and food prices beginning to test inflation expectations,” company chairman S. Dhanabalan said.

The record annual profit for the year to March covered a period during which Temasek invested US$4.9 billion in Merrill Lynch.

That deal followed the financial crisis and global credit crunch sparked by the meltdown in the US subprime mortgage sector. Sovereign wealth funds like Temasek have stirred controversy after rescuing big banks hit by the crisis.

The funds, government-created investment vehicles, have emerged as a potent force in global markets, sparking concerns that their investment policies are too opaque and could threaten national security.

Temasek, which has claimed a record of transparency, said strong operating performance by its portfolio companies “and healthy realized gains from its direct investment activities” contributed to its record profit.

It said in a statement that its portfolio rose in value to S$185 billion, up 13 percent from S$164 billion the previous year.

But Dhanabalan said Temasek was worried about risks from an environment of high inflation and slowing growth, sometimes referred to as “stagflation.”

Dhanabalan said: “This presents huge socio-political as well as economic risks in the next three to five years. Opportunities may be limited in such a scenario.”

Temasek is the largest shareholder in Merrill, which announced last month that it was dumping billions of dollars of mortgage debt at a steep loss and raising US$8.5 billion in new capital, including US$3.4 billion from Temasek.

The Singaporean fund first invested in the US bank Merrill Lynch in December, with a requirement that if Merrill raised more capital within 12 months at a lower share price, Temasek would be compensated for the difference.

The proviso kicked in for the most recent Temasek investment into Merrill, with the fund putting that US$2.5 billion compensation back into the US bank along with another US$900 million.

Temasek said for the first time net investments outside Asia were S$10 billion, exceeding net investments within Asia of S$5 billion.

Its exposure to economies outside Asia increased from 22 percent of its portfolio to 26 percent, due to the Merrill Lynch stake and investments in Latin America and Russia, the company said.

For the financial year, Temasek reported total shareholder return of seven percent by market value. That compares with the 27 percent in the previous year.

Temasek controls Singapore Airlines, Neptune Orient Lines and Singapore Telecommunications as well as other major regional firms.

It is one of two Singapore government investment vehicles along with the Government of Singapore Investment Corp.

Andrew
28-08-08, 19:46
Hmmmmm, 700 is a real steal... even if the facing isnt that good, or the floor is pretty low..

I guess my view stems from the location of the condo. True, seaview is rather pathetic from all the blockage, but the food nearby, PP with all it's supermarket and stores, the beach to unwind and the friendly ECP (compared to CTE) is good enough reasons to get a unit at this place...

I would definately go for it at that price, but opp looks like Rose Garden's gonna be developed... construction.. garh, for these past few years amber's looking like one massive construction site. doesnt look as though it's gonna stop anytime soon.

I also agree that $700 psf is a good buy. The agent are still quoting $800 plus for 3-BR and $900 plus for 2-BR. I guess wait and see is a good strategy but don't forget TOP soon, so if those with holding power do not sell, prices unlikely to go further down unless there is a Depression rather than recession in Singapore.

vino
28-08-08, 22:16
All things move in cycle. It's the law of nature so it's not a matter of how but a matter of when.

Joe6816
29-08-08, 11:02
$700 psf or lower, pls post here and let us know, many will be interested. I'm still holding back on buying, still making comparison amongs SV, One Amber and ESTA.


700psf ??? Give me your number. I get one unit for you. Just standby your cheque

CX
29-08-08, 13:35
700psf ??? Give me your number. I get one unit for you. Just standby your cheque


Hi,

I suppose you're an agent & sounds confident of getting a 700psf unit..pardon me for asking,low floor?which stack?:)

Unregistered.
29-08-08, 14:19
Hi,

I suppose you're an agent & sounds confident of getting a 700psf unit..pardon me for asking,low floor?which stack?:)
I think he just a joker lah...

Joe6816
29-08-08, 14:27
Hi,

I suppose you're an agent & sounds confident of getting a 700psf unit..pardon me for asking,low floor?which stack?:)


Yup, Agent 007 here.Fire had just started and burning slowly. Everyday u read papers and only see prices heading south. STI now below 2700, sing dollar at 1.42, property share weakening, temasek mentioned we might be heading towards slagflation, expots are lower, US in deep shit, more property launching now(small developer, can't hold),some property holding back launch(big developer, can hold) OLA was asking 1200 psf...my buyer went and was offered 9xx...bank cautious giving loans.......I can go on and on....scary right?

Tell me wat project you want, high floor, low floor, wat stack and I will get it for you at your price at the right time. At the mean time, let the fire burn...

Joe6816
29-08-08, 14:34
I think he just a joker lah...


you think i'm a joker? You know how many owner are jammed by bank when they asked for bank loan. I have a owner that can't even get a refinance. Most investors are holding more then 10 units at a time. When times gets bad, sure to throw few units at a loss. ESTA bought at 6xx, they throw at 7xx(if they can get buyer then ok) don't be surprise low floor will hit 6xx. This recession is going to be a slow slow long one.

esta_650psf
29-08-08, 16:41
you think i'm a joker? You know how many owner are jammed by bank when they asked for bank loan. I have a owner that can't even get a refinance. Most investors are holding more then 10 units at a time. When times gets bad, sure to throw few units at a loss. ESTA bought at 6xx, they throw at 7xx(if they can get buyer then ok) don't be surprise low floor will hit 6xx. This recession is going to be a slow slow long one.
So I should rename as esta_650psf?
When is TOP date for the Esta? End August or End Oct or End Dec?

Joe6816
29-08-08, 16:49
So I should rename as esta_650psf?
When is TOP date for the Esta? End August or End Oct or End Dec?



Early Nov, owner already got letters. So soon they will have to take up loans and pay maintenance fees. 650psf??? huh, possible, for those unit main door is at balcony. As these unit are not in demands. also not easy to rent out as there's too high supply and low demand. Look at Seaview, asking so high 7k to rent. how to move......why 7k is to cover the month;y bank payment. so Esta 650 might happen....keep ur finger cross and standby your cheque.... I grad the unit for u

esta_650psf
29-08-08, 16:59
Early Nov, owner already got letters. So soon they will have to take up loans and pay maintenance fees. 650psf??? huh, possible, for those unit main door is at balcony. As these unit are not in demands. also not easy to rent out as there's too high supply and low demand. Look at Seaview, asking so high 7k to rent. how to move......why 7k is to cover the month;y bank payment. so Esta 650 might happen....keep ur finger cross and standby your cheque.... I grad the unit for u

Noticed that the most of the transactions so far are the Sky Terrace type, is it because the normal balcony type owners have more holding power? or mainly bought for own stay? have to say the layout of sky terrace type is a bit funny...
so will the normal balcony type go down to 650 also? :p

latour
29-08-08, 17:44
Early Nov, owner already got letters. So soon they will have to take up loans and pay maintenance fees. 650psf??? huh, possible, for those unit main door is at balcony. As these unit are not in demands. also not easy to rent out as there's too high supply and low demand. Look at Seaview, asking so high 7k to rent. how to move......why 7k is to cover the month;y bank payment. so Esta 650 might happen....keep ur finger cross and standby your cheque.... I grad the unit for u

It all sounds good for hunters, house hunters now...

buy
29-08-08, 21:05
wait long long for prices to drop so low

kal
29-08-08, 21:20
wait long long for prices to drop so low

i disagree with u.. wait long long also don have la.. if esta drop till 600-700psf, then those condo in north side will be 200-300 psf?? then HDB will be 50-100psf??? joe6816 stands for Joker6816?

buy
29-08-08, 21:38
if not fated to own one private property

then jsut be it

no point keep on trying to bring down the price

It dun works

just be happy where u stay put

recession coming
29-08-08, 23:38
i disagree with u.. wait long long also don have la.. if esta drop till 600-700psf, then those condo in north side will be 200-300 psf?? then HDB will be 50-100psf??? joe6816 stands for Joker6816?
The esta now around $800+psf. With recession coming, $600psf will be expensive.

lollollollol
30-08-08, 00:08
what a joke. you know nothing about the property market. if esta sells for 600psf and all condo prices drop by 200psf, then all condos will be a sellout. don't you know that singaporeans are becoming more affluent then ever? look at the number of millionaires out there. i consider myself average and in the next few years, i would have made my first million. a million is no big deal to many singaporeans today so fat hope if you are waiting for property prices to fall below the floor. most owners would rather hold than make losses....


The esta now around $800+psf. With recession coming, $600psf will be expensive.

Unregistered69
30-08-08, 08:34
i disagree with u.. wait long long also don have la.. if esta drop till 600-700psf, then those condo in north side will be 200-300 psf?? then HDB will be 50-100psf??? joe6816 stands for Joker6816?



Are you Kal stupid? I AM JOE AND WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO DO? WHAT JOKER?
YOUR FATHER or MOTHER NEVER TEACH YOU MANNER IS IT? OR THEY CAN'T?

bishan
30-08-08, 08:40
what a joke. you know nothing about the property market. if esta sells for 600psf and all condo prices drop by 200psf, then all condos will be a sellout. don't you know that singaporeans are becoming more affluent then ever? look at the number of millionaires out there. i consider myself average and in the next few years, i would have made my first million. a million is no big deal to many singaporeans today so fat hope if you are waiting for property prices to fall below the floor. most owners would rather hold than make losses....


I bought Bishan in 1996. 97 market crash...... till now I can't sell.....still CPF loss

lbb
30-08-08, 15:18
i disagree with u.. wait long long also don have la.. if esta drop till 600-700psf, then those condo in north side will be 200-300 psf?? then HDB will be 50-100psf??? joe6816 stands for Joker6816?


Hmmmmm, actually it's possible for Esta to fall to around the 650-7oo range I think. But for north side condos to fall to 200-300, it's really too steep a fall. Guess they'll most probably sell at a high 4xx psf la.. HDB on the other hand, the volatile one.. Expats might try to get it and affect the price, or the govt might release more units or change some laws...

Action reaction thing going on there, so time would tell...

(though it'll be awesome for Esta to go to the 650-700 range. Damn good buy)

Just my humble opinion! (:
Peace!

Eastie
30-08-08, 15:58
I believe it is possible for Esta to drop further. Lowest psf being quoted this week is $800. They are still the same units/stack that have been up for sale for a good couple of months now. If there are no takers soon, it is likely the price will be lowered further (unless the owner decides to hold) as TOP is only a couple of months away. While I think $650 psf is improbable (not impossible!), I think we should be seeing $7XX psf by middle of September.

Wait Long Long
31-08-08, 14:23
The panic selling of homes that some property experts had forecast months ago has not materialised after all - not this year, anyway.

Market watchers had previously warned that the negative sentiment in the property market - which stemmed from the United States sub-prime crisis late last year and persists still - might prompt property investors to offload their uncompleted units at fire-sale prices and drive home prices down.

But a recent analysis by Savills Singapore found that almost everyone who sold a private apartment or condominium unit in the sub-sale market in the first seven months of this year pocketed robust gains.

This implies that, for this year at least, property investors are still sitting on comfortable profits and are likely to be in no hurry to exit their investments, said Savills’ director of business development and marketing, Mr Ku Swee Yong.

‘The cost of holding on to properties is quite low right now because of low interest rates, so for those who haven’t already exited the market, there’s no urgency to sell,’ he added.

When an individual buys an uncompleted property and resells it before it has been built, the transaction is called a sub-sale. Such sales are often used to measure property speculation, since sub-sale sellers are often short-term investors who never intended to occupy their units.

Savills’ data, first published in the Business Times last Tuesday, showed that 97 per cent of sub-sale sellers this year have cashed out at a profit. On average, they reaped $417,563 per unit, or a 36.5 per cent gain.

Property consultants say this comes as little surprise, as many of the units that were sub-sold this year were in developments that were launched in 2006 or even earlier, at relatively low prices that allowed plenty of room for price gains.

Citylights in Jellicoe Road, for instance, which saw the most number of sub-sales this year, was first launched in December 2004 at an average price of $590 per sq ft (psf). Up till the development was completed earlier this year, units changed hands at steadily rising prices, topping out at $1,200 to $1,300 psf.

But while the private housing market may be spared the carnage of selling hysteria this year and even next year, some industry players caution that 2010 may be a different scenario.

The projects that will be completed then were mostly launched during the peak of the market last year and this year. Buyers bought high and are likely to register losses if they want out of their investments, experts say.

Generally, there is a rush to offload units right before a project’s completion, as that is when more payment instalments are due.

So come 2010, if prices stay soft and the economy has not made a spectacular recovery from the current slowdown, buyers might start to feel a greater urgency to sell their properties and the market might be flooded with these ‘expensive apartments’, said Wing Tai chairman Cheng Wai Keung last week.

Mr Colin Tan, associate director of Chesterton International, added that investors who have cashed out by now are the experienced ones, while ‘it is the novice investors who are usually left holding on to their units’ and may be more prone to panic selling later.

Already, the profits that were reaped by sub-sellers this year have dwindled according to how recently they bought their units, consultants noted.

Those who made the original purchase in 2004 and 2005 gained more than $600,000 each on average, while those who bought their units last year made only $230,000 on average, according to Savills’ data. Investors who bought and sold within this year reaped only about $175,000 on average.

Part of this is due to the general principle that the longer you hold a property investment, the greater the gains will be, said Dr Chua Yang Liang, head of South-east Asia research at Jones Lang LaSalle.

However, a large part of the difference in gains also arose from the huge run-up in prices over the last two years. This spectacular growth is unlikely to be repeated, removing a cushion from investors still hoping to resell their units before completion in 2010 and beyond.

But a glimmer of hope for the property market lies in the healthy profits that investors have made so far this year.

Savills estimates that punters took home a total of $350 million in profits alone from sub-sales in the first seven months of this year. While consultants think it is unlikely that all the money has already been ploughed back into property, they expect it to return to the market eventually, which may help to prop up prices.

However, Chesterton’s Mr Tan believes this will happen only when current prices soften enough to attract investors again.

‘Properties are not like shares - you cannot come in and out even as prices decline,’ he said. ‘To lessen your risk, you come in only when you think prices have bottomed out or are at sustainable levels.’

Joe6816
31-08-08, 16:34
The panic selling of homes that some property experts had forecast months ago has not materialised after all - not this year, anyway.

Market watchers had previously warned that the negative sentiment in the property market - which stemmed from the United States sub-prime crisis late last year and persists still - might prompt property investors to offload their uncompleted units at fire-sale prices and drive home prices down.

But a recent analysis by Savills Singapore found that almost everyone who sold a private apartment or condominium unit in the sub-sale market in the first seven months of this year pocketed robust gains.

This implies that, for this year at least, property investors are still sitting on comfortable profits and are likely to be in no hurry to exit their investments, said Savills’ director of business development and marketing, Mr Ku Swee Yong.

‘The cost of holding on to properties is quite low right now because of low interest rates, so for those who haven’t already exited the market, there’s no urgency to sell,’ he added.

When an individual buys an uncompleted property and resells it before it has been built, the transaction is called a sub-sale. Such sales are often used to measure property speculation, since sub-sale sellers are often short-term investors who never intended to occupy their units.

Savills’ data, first published in the Business Times last Tuesday, showed that 97 per cent of sub-sale sellers this year have cashed out at a profit. On average, they reaped $417,563 per unit, or a 36.5 per cent gain.

Property consultants say this comes as little surprise, as many of the units that were sub-sold this year were in developments that were launched in 2006 or even earlier, at relatively low prices that allowed plenty of room for price gains.

Citylights in Jellicoe Road, for instance, which saw the most number of sub-sales this year, was first launched in December 2004 at an average price of $590 per sq ft (psf). Up till the development was completed earlier this year, units changed hands at steadily rising prices, topping out at $1,200 to $1,300 psf.

But while the private housing market may be spared the carnage of selling hysteria this year and even next year, some industry players caution that 2010 may be a different scenario.

The projects that will be completed then were mostly launched during the peak of the market last year and this year. Buyers bought high and are likely to register losses if they want out of their investments, experts say.

Generally, there is a rush to offload units right before a project’s completion, as that is when more payment instalments are due.

So come 2010, if prices stay soft and the economy has not made a spectacular recovery from the current slowdown, buyers might start to feel a greater urgency to sell their properties and the market might be flooded with these ‘expensive apartments’, said Wing Tai chairman Cheng Wai Keung last week.

Mr Colin Tan, associate director of Chesterton International, added that investors who have cashed out by now are the experienced ones, while ‘it is the novice investors who are usually left holding on to their units’ and may be more prone to panic selling later.

Already, the profits that were reaped by sub-sellers this year have dwindled according to how recently they bought their units, consultants noted.

Those who made the original purchase in 2004 and 2005 gained more than $600,000 each on average, while those who bought their units last year made only $230,000 on average, according to Savills’ data. Investors who bought and sold within this year reaped only about $175,000 on average.

Part of this is due to the general principle that the longer you hold a property investment, the greater the gains will be, said Dr Chua Yang Liang, head of South-east Asia research at Jones Lang LaSalle.

However, a large part of the difference in gains also arose from the huge run-up in prices over the last two years. This spectacular growth is unlikely to be repeated, removing a cushion from investors still hoping to resell their units before completion in 2010 and beyond.

But a glimmer of hope for the property market lies in the healthy profits that investors have made so far this year.

Savills estimates that punters took home a total of $350 million in profits alone from sub-sales in the first seven months of this year. While consultants think it is unlikely that all the money has already been ploughed back into property, they expect it to return to the market eventually, which may help to prop up prices.

However, Chesterton’s Mr Tan believes this will happen only when current prices soften enough to attract investors again.

‘Properties are not like shares - you cannot come in and out even as prices decline,’ he said. ‘To lessen your risk, you come in only when you think prices have bottomed out or are at sustainable levels.’


Heard a unit in Esta just sold at 8xx........

Unregister
31-08-08, 17:43
First east has nothing going on other than the (dirty with faeces and radio active substances) beach. Imagine a unit in the east that has no sea view, bad traffic, poor public transport, no good school, relatively far from city. Worst still, recent news says that the waters has radioactive leak. It is not much more attractive than say the north. So in short, if Esta drop to 600-700psf, the north is unlikely to drop to 200-300psf. They will just converge. Maybe the north will be 500-600psf.


i disagree with u.. wait long long also don have la.. if esta drop till 600-700psf, then those condo in north side will be 200-300 psf?? then HDB will be 50-100psf??? joe6816 stands for Joker6816?

toaler
31-08-08, 20:52
First east has nothing going on other than the (dirty with faeces and radio active substances) beach. Imagine a unit in the east that has no sea view, bad traffic, poor public transport, no good school, relatively far from city. Worst still, recent news says that the waters has radioactive leak. It is not much more attractive than say the north. So in short, if Esta drop to 600-700psf, the north is unlikely to drop to 200-300psf. They will just converge. Maybe the north will be 500-600psf.

hmm relatively far from the city? i think tanjong katong -> rochor (city exit) is less than 10 mins leh if that's considered far from the city, the north is abt a light year away... lol

at least the people living in the east still have a radioactive and feces laden beach near their home.. the people in the north have to take a bus/drive for 30mins to get to the radioactive and feces laden beach on weekends haha the fact is singapore only has that many nice beaches and 2 of them are in the east and the other one is at sentosa.. dont think you can consider west coast park a beach

Far
31-08-08, 22:26
I'm afraid the beach is NOT nice, polluted (which you have admitted) and overcrowded. The north is nearer to nature reserves. Other than Tanjong Rhu - look at the map D15 and D16 are relatively far from town. Certain north parts of SG are much nearer to town than say Katong or Siglap which is FAR. I'm afraid most paople are not hard up in going to the Singapore beach. The east people will also have to drive 30 min to reach any of the nature reserves in Singapore. Not everyone is as impressed with the Singapore beach as you do. So you should respect other's opinion.


hmm relatively far from the city? i think tanjong katong -> rochor (city exit) is less than 10 mins leh if that's considered far from the city, the north is abt a light year away... lol

at least the people living in the east still have a radioactive and feces laden beach near their home.. the people in the north have to take a bus/drive for 30mins to get to the radioactive and feces laden beach on weekends haha the fact is singapore only has that many nice beaches and 2 of them are in the east and the other one is at sentosa.. dont think you can consider west coast park a beach

keen buyer
31-08-08, 23:28
you think i'm a joker? You know how many owner are jammed by bank when they asked for bank loan. I have a owner that can't even get a refinance. Most investors are holding more then 10 units at a time. When times gets bad, sure to throw few units at a loss. ESTA bought at 6xx, they throw at 7xx(if they can get buyer then ok) don't be surprise low floor will hit 6xx. This recession is going to be a slow slow long one.

if u have a unit selling 700 psf at esta please email me at [email protected]. thanks

Eastie
01-09-08, 00:35
I'm afraid the beach is NOT nice, polluted (which you have admitted) and overcrowded. The north is nearer to nature reserves. Other than Tanjong Rhu - look at the map D15 and D16 are relatively far from town. Certain north parts of SG are much nearer to town than say Katong or Siglap which is FAR. I'm afraid most paople are not hard up in going to the Singapore beach. The east people will also have to drive 30 min to reach any of the nature reserves in Singapore. Not everyone is as impressed with the Singapore beach as you do. So you should respect other's opinion.


You must be joking right? Katong is FAR from town?! I suppose you need to define which part of town then. I live in Katong, and it takes me 5 to 7 mins to get to Suntec City. I don't think you can use a map to judge distance or time taken to travel, its the accessibility that makes all the difference.

No comments re beaches or nature reserves, that's subjective and I agree, to each its own.

Radioactive_East
01-09-08, 01:06
Just wondering.. Radioactive leakage in Changi beaches.. Will tis means that East pricing should be dropping ??

buy
01-09-08, 01:16
Just wondering.. Radioactive leakage in Changi beaches.. Will tis means that East pricing should be dropping ??

you staying inside the sea?

Joe6816
01-09-08, 10:20
Just wondering.. Radioactive leakage in Changi beaches.. Will tis means that East pricing should be dropping ??


People, no matter where you stay in singapore it's still a tiny red dot. It's up to you how to view it or wat you like. Why there's people buying Lexus when they can buy toyota. What eat chicken rice at hotel when you can have it at coffeeshop. We are all staying in thin tiny red dot, if there is radiation, don't you think this red dot will all be affected? Cheers

KK1
01-09-08, 12:45
Is Esta already 100% fully sold? So if want to get a unit must get from sub-sales? TOP already?

Joe6816
01-09-08, 12:47
Is Esta already 100% fully sold? So if want to get a unit must get from sub-sales? TOP already?


100% sold 2 years back. Yes must buy sub sale. TOP early Nov, owner get letters for it.

DL
01-09-08, 12:56
100% sold 2 years back. Yes must buy sub sale. TOP early Nov, owner get letters for it.

A good friend of mine own a penthouse @ Esta aready received the letters from the developers..:)

Real Estate Pundit
01-09-08, 16:18
3 transaction between 16 Aug 08 to 22 Aug 08.

Unit___Size, sqft__$psf___Total_______Contract date
2X-05__2368_____1132___$2,680,000__22 Aug 08 - New
1X-05__1130______925___$1,045,250__19 Aug 08 - New
1X-07__1346______936___$1,260,000__18 Aug 08 - New
1X-07__1346______929___$1,250,000__15 Aug 08
15-04__1313______855___$1,122,615__14 Jul 08

Joe6816
01-09-08, 16:31
3 transaction between 16 Aug 08 to 22 Aug 08.

Unit___Size, sqft__$psf___Total_______Contract date
2X-05__2368_____1132___$2,680,000__22 Aug 08 - New
1X-05__1130______925___$1,045,250__19 Aug 08 - New
1X-07__1346______936___$1,260,000__18 Aug 08 - New
1X-07__1346______929___$1,250,000__15 Aug 08
15-04__1313______855___$1,122,615__14 Jul 08


#0x-18 1313 8xx 22nd Aug(cheque collected)
#11-1x 1173 9xx 26nd Aug(cheque collected)
#1x-03 1346 938 30nd Aug(cheque collected)
#0x-13 1399 815 31st Aug(cheque collected)

Caveat not lodge yet for all

esta_650psf
01-09-08, 17:16
#0x-18 1313 8xx 22nd Aug(cheque collected)
#11-1x 1173 9xx 26nd Aug(cheque collected)
#1x-03 1346 938 30nd Aug(cheque collected)
#0x-13 1399 815 31st Aug(cheque collected)

Caveat not lodge yet for all

Map the unit with the estat site plan:
http://www.mclland.com.sg/esta/03esta_siteplan.html

How come most of the transactions are sky terrace type? does it mean the "normal balcony type" owners have more holding power?

Potential Esta Investor
01-09-08, 17:30
I believe it is possible for Esta to drop further. Lowest psf being quoted this week is $800. They are still the same units/stack that have been up for sale for a good couple of months now. If there are no takers soon, it is likely the price will be lowered further (unless the owner decides to hold) as TOP is only a couple of months away. While I think $650 psf is improbable (not impossible!), I think we should be seeing $7XX psf by middle of September.

I share your sentiments and believe a probable psf would be in the range of $700+. When the economy start to show signs of moving to recession, this is the most likely situation. It is the worst USA economy and last week, the British Government said it is their worst in 60 years! Since the property was launched around this range, it is a most probable situation.....

Joe6816
01-09-08, 17:36
Map the unit with the estat site plan:
http://www.mclland.com.sg/esta/03esta_siteplan.html

How come most of the transactions are sky terrace type? does it mean the "normal balcony type" owners have more holding power?


I can't say whether the owner will have holding power or not. If 1st owner maybe they will reduced price to 7xx but they still earn(bought 6xx). But don't think 2nd owner will sell at 7xx unless they are in trouble and need to sell off asap.

Unr egistered
01-09-08, 18:28
Its because sky terrace turn out not what it was expected to be .....

take a drive and see these units are faced in such a way that neigbour directly above can see what is happening in your unit and secondly if it rains, you need to take an umbrella to reach your front door - can u imagine that ?

Assume its the "master piece" work of a bunch of "green horn" designers eh!



Map the unit with the estat site plan:
http://www.mclland.com.sg/esta/03esta_siteplan.html

How come most of the transactions are sky terrace type? does it mean the "normal balcony type" owners have more holding power?

KK1
01-09-08, 18:35
I can't say whether the owner will have holding power or not. If 1st owner maybe they will reduced price to 7xx but they still earn(bought 6xx). But don't think 2nd owner will sell at 7xx unless they are in trouble and need to sell off asap.

The interior veri spacious and the facilities good. Dun tink any owners will let go below 850psf for such a neat and cosy home.

Unregistered.
01-09-08, 18:44
Its because sky terrace turn out not what it was expected to be .....

take a drive and see these units are faced in such a way that neigbour directly above can see what is happening in your unit and secondly if it rains, you need to take an umbrella to reach your front door - can u imagine that ?

Assume its the "master piece" work of a bunch of "green horn" designers eh!
Not only the sky terrace type... The normal balcony type also have the same problem - the upper stair neighbour can see everything very clearly when you site relax in the balcony! the worse thing is that they can throw anything down if happen got Joo Chiat neighour straight above! Oh my! must be super Green horn designers!

registered
01-09-08, 19:10
The interior veri spacious and the facilities good. Dun tink any owners will let go below 850psf for such a neat and cosy home.

how u so sure interiory veri spacious - heard kitchen very tiny

DL
01-09-08, 20:50
how u so sure interiory veri spacious - heard kitchen very tiny

The living rooms & master bedroom is quite tiny as well..

KK1
01-09-08, 21:07
The living rooms & master bedroom is quite tiny as well..

How does one define tiny? Compare to luxury condo where a 2 bedroom can be 1,500sqft against an Esta 3 room? Or compare the old type of HDB with Esta? Based on projects went to so far, most projects these days are "compact" indeed and not just restricted to Esta. Colleague who have a unit there said spacious as compared to another one who have 1184sqft 3 room in another project. For the price original owners got it.....it is a steal for Freehold property.

But on the other hand, the talk on design of balcony is interesting. It reminded me of a North project in Ang Mo Kio call Grandeur 8.

http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/4706/grandeur81gg5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Joe6816
01-09-08, 22:05
The interior veri spacious and the facilities good. Dun tink any owners will let go below 850psf for such a neat and cosy home.


Already sold. #04-1x 2 days back at 815 psf

Joe6816
01-09-08, 22:10
How does one define tiny? Compare to luxury condo where a 2 bedroom can be 1,500sqft against an Esta 3 room? Or compare the old type of HDB with Esta? Based on projects went to so far, most projects these days are "compact" indeed and not just restricted to Esta. Colleague who have a unit there said spacious as compared to another one who have 1184sqft 3 room in another project. For the price original owners got it.....it is a steal for Freehold property.

But on the other hand, the talk on design of balcony is interesting. It reminded me of a North project in Ang Mo Kio call Grandeur 8.

http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/4706/grandeur81gg5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

We all live in a tiny country but all have dreams to live in big houses.
Cheers

C X
01-09-08, 23:00
Already sold. #04-1x 2 days back at 815 psf

Hi Mr.Joe,

Pardon me for asking,how come the prices of Esta is so weak?can say one of the weakest in amber road..

PS:Esta Owner or Owner to be,don't flame me hor..im just curious of the weak prices..:)

Cheers

Joe6816
01-09-08, 23:10
Hi Mr.Joe,

Pardon me for asking,how come the prices of Esta is so weak?can say one of the weakest in amber road..

PS:Esta Owner or Owner to be,don't flame me hor..im just curious of the weak prices..:)

Cheers

I'm not saying the price is weak. On average units there are still asking 9xx to 1xxx. Some 2nd owner are priced 1200 and above. Also depends on the stacks.

To me this unit is panic selling, I feel that this is a kind of trap for owners. If all units are to hold price together, I believe Esta will be strong. For this unit, once owner decide to lower the selling price, buyer will know(sure appear everyday in papers).....no offer will comes in...owner panic cause price lowered but no offer.....wait n wait....then lower a bit more....same thing will happen....wait n wait...offer will come in but very low....owner no choice but to sell to highest offer to him but also not good price....my 2 cents thoughts...what u think?

Joe6816
01-09-08, 23:14
Hi Mr.Joe,

Pardon me for asking,how come the prices of Esta is so weak?can say one of the weakest in amber road..

PS:Esta Owner or Owner to be,don't flame me hor..im just curious of the weak prices..:)

Cheers

Btw the launch price is about 6xx in Jan 06, cheapest launch price for that area during these few years. Peak last year sold some unit up to 1200 psf

Joe6816
01-09-08, 23:21
I'm not saying the price is weak. On average units there are still asking 9xx to 1xxx. Some 2nd owner are priced 1200 and above. Also depends on the stacks.

To me this unit is panic selling, I feel that this is a kind of trap for owners. If all units are to hold price together, I believe Esta will be strong. For this unit, once owner decide to lower the selling price, buyer will know(sure appear everyday in papers).....no offer will comes in...owner panic cause price lowered but no offer.....wait n wait....then lower a bit more....same thing will happen....wait n wait...offer will come in but very low....owner no choice but to sell to highest offer to him but also not good price....my 2 cents thoughts...what u think?

In another way, if 1 owner lower price too much and too quickly, he's sending message that he MUST sell, so buyer will wait till price drop even more

C X
01-09-08, 23:21
I'm not saying the price is weak. On average units there are still asking 9xx to 1xxx. Some 2nd owner are priced 1200 and above. Also depends on the stacks.

To me this unit is panic selling, I feel that this is a kind of trap for owners. If all units are to hold price together, I believe Esta will be strong. For this unit, once owner decide to lower the selling price, buyer will know(sure appear everyday in papers).....no offer will comes in...owner panic cause price lowered but no offer.....wait n wait....then lower a bit more....same thing will happen....wait n wait...offer will come in but very low....owner no choice but to sell to highest offer to him but also not good price....my 2 cents thoughts...what u think?

Joe,

What u said is true..Although im not the first owner for the belvedere,the agents marketing for my current unit before i bought over also says that..alot of offers came in but owners don't see cheque n they started to panic..especially those owners wanted to sell urgently & in need of cash,they got panic & will sell @ any reasonable offer from the buyer..Lucky buyers will grab a unit @ a good price..overall it also depends on timing & whether you're fated to that unit or not..:p

Also my 2 cents worth of comments..:)

Cheers

C X
01-09-08, 23:30
In another way, if 1 owner lower price too much and too quickly, he's sending message that he MUST sell, so buyer will wait till price drop even more

Agree..Buyer call the shots now,not the seller!

As an agents now is not easy to please both buyers & sellers..:)

Joe6816
01-09-08, 23:36
Joe,

What u said is true..Although im not the first owner for the belvedere,the agents marketing for my current unit before i bought over also says that..alot of offers came in but owners don't see cheque n they started to panic..especially those owners wanted to sell urgently & in need of cash,they got panic & will sell @ any reasonable offer from the buyer..Lucky buyers will grab a unit @ a good price..overall it also depends on timing & whether you're fated to that unit or not..:p

Also my 2 cents worth of comments..:)

Cheers

My other thought would be how Esta would fare when it TOP, Of course those good unit will hold price(don't use marketing weakening or sub prime as an excuse or whatever for this example), My feel is tat for those walk in balcony units.........will the owner hold and wait OR.......to sell it at 7xx, cash out and goes for other project that is better. Sorry, no offences to owners of those units, I would feel that lower dun the price, cash out, move on to invest in something better

My feel is in property investment,

Apply the following rules and you will gain

1)Timing-Beginning of a new uptrend
2)Location
3)Information-who can get you the best price unit in the targeted area.

C X
01-09-08, 23:52
My feel is in property investment,

Apply the following rules and you will gain

1)Timing-Beginning of a new uptrend
2)Location
3)Information-who can get you the best price unit in the targeted area.

No heart feeling for owners & owners to be of amber road area..:)

from what i see,it will be over conjested along amber roads with so many up & coming new projects along that area..

dakota
02-09-08, 00:06
No heart feeling for owners & owners to be of amber road area..:)

from what i see,it will be over conjested along amber roads with so many up & coming new projects along that area..
Why buy Dist15? Go buy Dist14 Dakota! Still many units on sale!

Unregistered......
02-09-08, 09:28
No heart feeling for owners & owners to be of amber road area..:)

from what i see,it will be over conjested along amber roads with so many up & coming new projects along that area..
that's why possible to have a good buy...otherwise all like the seaview, price high high, room small small, AND nobody buy!

Joe6816
02-09-08, 11:07
Why buy Dist15? Go buy Dist14 Dakota! Still many units on sale!

It's all up to the buyer, most of my buyer that buy there had grown up in Katong and been staying there for decades. It's hard not to stay there for them. Don't you agree? 1 of them even can tell me who's the original Katong Laksa that he has been eating since childhood.....

Cheers

700psf???
02-09-08, 14:15
700psf ??? Give me your number. I get one unit for you. Just standby your cheque

just curious, 700psf deal close? or just say say only?

Joe6816
02-09-08, 14:22
just curious, 700psf deal close? or just say say only?

700 psf is possible. last transaction was only 815psf. But the question is how long will buyer hold up to buy? Cause when you talk about market heading south, how low is low? Will buyer start to rush in when it drop to 8xx or still wait till price drop to 7xx? We never know, who can know the future? We can only predict. Will we see a repeat of 97? Who knows?

C X
02-09-08, 20:39
Why buy Dist15? Go buy Dist14 Dakota! Still many units on sale!

I aready have a unit @ meyer road & another unit @ D9,enough for me..D14 Dakota not my cup of investment..still have many units on sale means it's not selling well since the launch man..:p

C X
02-09-08, 20:43
It's all up to the buyer, most of my buyer that buy there had grown up in Katong and been staying there for decades. It's hard not to stay there for them. Don't you agree? 1 of them even can tell me who's the original Katong Laksa that he has been eating since childhood.....

Cheers

Agree with what u said Joe..I miss my childhood days @ Katong Park that's why i got a unit there to stay & invest..:)

C X
02-09-08, 20:48
Why buy Dist15? Go buy Dist14 Dakota! Still many units on sale!

Just to add,i would rather go for The Esta which is @ D15 & sounds nicer rather than D14..Given that price,Esta is more value for money rather than Dakota..No heart Feeling ya!:)

Cheers

esta_700psf
03-09-08, 09:39
I'm not saying the price is weak. On average units there are still asking 9xx to 1xxx. Some 2nd owner are priced 1200 and above. Also depends on the stacks.

To me this unit is panic selling, I feel that this is a kind of trap for owners. If all units are to hold price together, I believe Esta will be strong. For this unit, once owner decide to lower the selling price, buyer will know(sure appear everyday in papers).....no offer will comes in...owner panic cause price lowered but no offer.....wait n wait....then lower a bit more....same thing will happen....wait n wait...offer will come in but very low....owner no choice but to sell to highest offer to him but also not good price....my 2 cents thoughts...what u think?
Hi Joe, What's the best stack(s) for The Esta?

Joe6816
03-09-08, 12:18
Hi Joe, What's the best stack(s) for The Esta?


Pool view

Stack 17, 20, 6, 7

Family pool/ Jacuzzi view

Stack 16, 10, 11

Unblock view(at least #6)

stack 14, 15, 18, 19, 02, 03

facing opp neighbour
03-09-08, 12:50
for esta, better get unblocked view, those pool view means facing opposite block neighbour .. quite near le...

Unregistered.
03-09-08, 14:13
for esta, better get unblocked view, those pool view means facing opposite block neighbour .. quite near le...
True. The Seaview units also got this problem - good pool view, but lost privacy...

Joe6816
03-09-08, 14:36
for esta, better get unblocked view, those pool view means facing opposite block neighbour .. quite near le...


I always tell my buyers, which is the best stack they decided.
Esta those facing mountbatten road yes it's unblock but there's road noise
Facing Pool view close to other block but pool view mah
Facing Amber Garden Road face nothing but quite. Not much road noise

Joe6816
03-09-08, 14:37
True. The Seaview units also got this problem - good pool view, but lost privacy...


But BIG balcony

buy
03-09-08, 14:43
But BIG balcony

someppl like big balcony

it is down to each own liking

Joe6816
03-09-08, 14:49
someppl like big balcony

it is down to each own liking


Agree...One man poison, another man meat

esta_650psf
03-09-08, 18:11
100% sold 2 years back. Yes must buy sub sale. TOP early Nov, owner get letters for it.
Joe, please let us know once the Esta TOP, keen to see and feel the actual units, then decide to offer 650 or 700! :)
see the picture in previous page sky terrace maybe not bad leh...

U fool
03-09-08, 20:47
Joe, please let us know once the Esta TOP, keen to see and feel the actual units, then decide to offer 650 or 700! :)
see the picture in previous page sky terrace maybe not bad leh...

Are u Dreaming???650-700 for sky terrace??? wait until ur neck like d giraffe so long will have lah..

Geylang OKT
03-09-08, 20:57
Are u Dreaming???650-700 for sky terrace??? wait until ur neck like d giraffe so long will have lah..

possible for 650 or 700 unless the developer is his PAPA..call me Ah pa,i sell you my geylang condo for 650 lahhhhhhh...

Unregistered.
03-09-08, 22:08
Drop to S$500 psf can?

Geylang OKT
03-09-08, 23:58
Drop to S$500 psf can?

Halo U think go market buy fish n veg ah?thi is condo forum not parsat forum hor..u think i suka suka Orper $650 ah?U siao..U think too much liao my son..i ask my lovely new arrival to make u not to think so much ok?then u pay only $499 rather than $500..$1 give u tips n seek 4 garment advise go for B.M.W..

Ya incase u dunno what is B.M.W hor,i tell..

Bus
Mrt
Walk

buy
04-09-08, 00:13
Drop to S$500 psf can?


hahaha

joke of the month

Unregistered.
04-09-08, 09:21
Once those crazy guys came to this thread, that's it! All the nonsense, dirty words will be full of this forum...
Go back to your D14 forum lah!

老Hero
04-09-08, 09:29
Once those crazy guys came to this thread, that's it! All the nonsense, dirty words will be full of this forum...
Go back to your D14 forum lah!
Eat shit and die

Hornet
04-09-08, 10:37
Drop to S$500 psf can?

What a joke. Where got so high one? $400psf can lar.

Esta
04-09-08, 14:55
Today Business Time, 3 units of ESTA sold for $ 930+ PSF to $ 1,050 PSF..........$ 650 to $ 750 PSF NO WAY MAN.....

esta_650psf
04-09-08, 16:15
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,260,000 1,346 936 Aug-08
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,250,000 1,346 929 Aug-08
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,098,000 1,173 936 Aug-08
-------------
1,346 is type B2, with normal balcony, no extra balcony at master bedroom. no unit #, thus can't tell is pool facing or unblock view

1173 is type A3B, 2 bedder + study, with normal balcony and unblock view.

Seems the walk-in balcony really unpopular, can't demand good price, therefore 650 is possible!!

esta_650psf
05-09-08, 12:22
尽管本地发展商的股价今年以来已下滑33%,跌势较海峡时报指数的22%来得大,分析师却认为它们目前还未见底。

  高盛(Goldman Sachs)预期本地住宅市场接下来会出现更多疲软的迹象,建议投资者远离该市场六到九个月的时间。

  随着本地优质房地产价格今年以来下滑了10%,高盛预计它从现在到明年底期间会继续挫跌20%。目前保持稳定的大众房地产价格则料将下滑10%。

  高盛指出,虽然目前的股价已反映了房地产市场的疲弱,但由于下跌风险犹存,投资者对本地发展商依然保持谨慎态度。

  高盛对本地房地产股持有的消极态度可从它给予的评级略见一斑。七只股票中,有五只获得“中性”评级,其余两只被建议抛售。虽然不看好本地发展商,高盛却对房地产投资信托(REITs)市场表示看好。

  联昌国际(CIMB-GK)则指出,大市值房地产股目前估计正以低于重估后净资产值(RNAV)30%到40%的价格交易。这较1997至1998年的55%到80%折让与2003年的45%到55%折让甚远。根据以上历史低位,它认为房地产市场的估价还未见底。

  假设商用房地产价值下滑30%到40%至2003年沙斯(SARS)风暴的水平,中国和越南等区域市场的房地产价格也自现水平继续挫跌30%,联昌国际估计目前的估价象征着平均销售价格(ASP)25%到60%的跌幅。

  联昌国际指出,尽管股票估价已降低不少,房屋价格却在低成交量的同时显现韧性。由于股市一般都是向前看的,因此要是房屋价格大跌,其走下坡的风险也会随之增加。

  它也指出,更多环球经济衰退的坏消息,以及房地产投机活动的下降,都会继续影响市场的表现。随着更多项目完工,明年对市场来说会是更大的考验。

  尽管房地产股目前的估价相当低,但由于市场缺乏重估的催化剂,并有可能出现更多坏消息,联昌国际因而维持对该行业的“中性”评级。由于市场目前仍在探底,它建议投资者等到估价临近历史低位时才出手。

  星展唯高达(DBS Vickers)则对本地房地产市场维持乐观态度,预期我国经济中期基本面将保持强劲。此外,房地产市场在2001至2003年低潮的初期也比现在来得差。当时,空房率以及未来供应(pipeline supply)占现有供应(available stock)的比例都创下高水平。

  但它指出,自1996年开始有统计数据以来,今年可能是私宅销售最惨淡的一年。随着需求大幅缩减,第一手市场的销售量在首季跌至762个单位。虽然它第二季增至1525个单位,上半年售出的总单位却不超过2300个。这是2003全年创下的最低水平(5156个单位)的约44%。

  在个人而非发展商占据的转售市场,需求则维持在12年来的平均水平。今年上半年转售的单位已占12年平均销售量的约58%。

《联合早报》

Madness
09-09-08, 14:10
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,260,000 1,346 936 Aug-08
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,250,000 1,346 929 Aug-08
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,098,000 1,173 936 Aug-08
-------------
1,346 is type B2, with normal balcony, no extra balcony at master bedroom. no unit #, thus can't tell is pool facing or unblock view

1173 is type A3B, 2 bedder + study, with normal balcony and unblock view.

Seems the walk-in balcony really unpopular, can't demand good price, therefore 650 is possible!!

This is Madness!! NO THIS IS SINGAPORE.

Joe6816
10-09-08, 00:01
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,260,000 1,346 936 Aug-08
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,250,000 1,346 929 Aug-08
THE ESTA AMBER GARDENS Condominium 1,098,000 1,173 936 Aug-08
-------------
1,346 is type B2, with normal balcony, no extra balcony at master bedroom. no unit #, thus can't tell is pool facing or unblock view

1173 is type A3B, 2 bedder + study, with normal balcony and unblock view.

Seems the walk-in balcony really unpopular, can't demand good price, therefore 650 is possible!!

Seens hard to find 8xx anymore. Owner not affected by STI, maybe they don't buy STI...any unit that 9xx glad or regret....

latour
10-09-08, 09:20
Seens hard to find 8xx anymore. Owner not affected by STI, maybe they don't buy STI...any unit that 9xx glad or regret....

Is 9xx the right level of price psf ?

Joe6816
10-09-08, 09:51
Is 9xx the right level of price psf ?


Any unit 900 to close is good price now. When TOP owner need to service loan and bank penalty so price will be up

C X
10-09-08, 12:35
Latest Caveats Lodged for The Esta:

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z265/jdmautocare/123.jpg

Joe6816
10-09-08, 14:46
Latest Caveats Lodged for The Esta:

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z265/jdmautocare/123.jpg

MOONCAKE FESTIVAL OFFER!!! 1313 SQFT VERY HIGH FLOOR, GOOD STACK, NORTH FACING, NO NOON SUN......

ASKING ONLY 900PSF TO CLOSE. CALL ME NOW....

JOE
81712412

Joe6816
10-09-08, 20:53
MOONCAKE FESTIVAL OFFER!!! 1313 SQFT VERY HIGH FLOOR, GOOD STACK, NORTH FACING, NO NOON SUN......

ASKING ONLY 900PSF TO CLOSE. CALL ME NOW....

JOE
81712412

SORRY, AT 815PSF

ANOTHER FIRE SALE, 1399 SQFT ASKING ONLY AT 815PSF. CALL ME NOW

C X
10-09-08, 20:57
WooW..$825psf will set the low price for the year..which stack is this unit?low or mid floor?

C X
10-09-08, 21:21
Thanks for your sms update..appreciate:)

look at equity mkt
10-09-08, 22:30
Stock market has always been the leading indicator whereas property is lagging. With equity markets around the world under pressure I really doubt property price can stay firm for too long.

Unregistered.
11-09-08, 09:15
SORRY, AT 815PSF

ANOTHER FIRE SALE, 1399 SQFT ASKING ONLY AT 815PSF .CALL ME NOW
Sky terrace, 3 + study? which stack? 03? 06? 09 or 13? low or mid floor?

esta_650psf
11-09-08, 09:18
WooW..$825psf will set the low price for the year..which stack is this unit?low or mid floor?
it's asking $815psf lah

Joe6816
11-09-08, 09:46
Sky terrace, 3 + study? which stack? 03? 06? 09 or 13? low or mid floor?


3 plus study, stack 13, low floor.

700psf
11-09-08, 09:54
700psf will be the right price to buy since the prices are still going down.

Joe6816
11-09-08, 10:18
700psf will be the right price to buy since the prices are still going down.

AMK Design,Built and Sell 'HDB' flat already selling at 5xx psf, if Esta is to drop to to 700 or below, then can buy 5 room in Marine Parade at 250K? Yes, I agree market is not strong now but we all forgotten something that had happened now: INFLATION....In 97 market clash but inflation does not set in.....Now inflation is at a time high of 7%. If I keep my cash in FD at 1% interest, I'm not earning but lost 6%. Where to find chicken rice selling at $2.50 in food count now. Even if STI goes down to below 2000 will you be able to get chicken rice from that same store at $2? Or market clash people will start selling chicken at $1.50. Will SMRT gives a discount or free ride?

Now land cost is high, can I say 300psf to 350psf? Construction costs is about 350 to 400 psf. Developer profit 15 to 20 %. Work out to be at least 750 to launch(LIVIA{99 yrs} for example 650psf/Dakota{99 yrs} for 9xxpsf). Esta is Freehold only at 8xx to 9xx psf. Where to find. Silversea 99 yrs 2nd floor unit with expressway and tree view asking for 1320psf....which is better?

Jus my 2cents thoughts
Cheers

buy
11-09-08, 13:09
if everything cheap

then everyone stay in condo

HDB become empty

Joe6816
11-09-08, 13:18
if everything cheap

then everyone stay in condo

HDB become empty

Agree. Buyer will always have objections to whatever they wan to buy. But if you see a buyer with no objection then something is wrong. No objection no sale, that why buying and selling is about negotiating, not like a car with fix price.

willing
11-09-08, 13:20
in this world

we cant please everyone

So some one will be able to afford to live in a bigger

private house then someone one else

inflation no more
11-09-08, 21:35
AMK Design,Built and Sell 'HDB' flat already selling at 5xx psf, if Esta is to drop to to 700 or below, then can buy 5 room in Marine Parade at 250K? Yes, I agree market is not strong now but we all forgotten something that had happened now: INFLATION....In 97 market clash but inflation does not set in.....Now inflation is at a time high of 7%. If I keep my cash in FD at 1% interest, I'm not earning but lost 6%. Where to find chicken rice selling at $2.50 in food count now. Even if STI goes down to below 2000 will you be able to get chicken rice from that same store at $2? Or market clash people will start selling chicken at $1.50. Will SMRT gives a discount or free ride?

Now land cost is high, can I say 300psf to 350psf? Construction costs is about 350 to 400 psf. Developer profit 15 to 20 %. Work out to be at least 750 to launch(LIVIA{99 yrs} for example 650psf/Dakota{99 yrs} for 9xxpsf). Esta is Freehold only at 8xx to 9xx psf. Where to find. Silversea 99 yrs 2nd floor unit with expressway and tree view asking for 1320psf....which is better?

Jus my 2cents thoughts
Cheers

Both AUD and NZ have cut their interest rates recently. Inflation is no longer the threat! It's growth that central banks around the world are concerned now.
Stock market is the leading indicator, has always been the case and will always be the case.

Miming
12-09-08, 08:37
there is inflation, there is also deflation. Prices can go up prices can drop. What goes up must come down, everybody knows that. Times bad, deflation is best for cash-rich people - things get cheaper and money value goes up, like striking 4-D. So buy esta at 600 psf - possible in this market?

esta_650psf
12-09-08, 11:30
there is inflation, there is also deflation. Prices can go up prices can drop. What goes up must come down, everybody knows that. Times bad, deflation is best for cash-rich people - things get cheaper and money value goes up, like striking 4-D. So buy esta at 600 psf - possible in this market?
600 too much lah. all the owner and agents will jump! right, Joe? :)

650 psf is reasonable and possible!

Douglas
12-09-08, 11:42
Early Nov, owner already got letters. So soon they will have to take up loans and pay maintenance fees. 650psf??? huh, possible, for those unit main door is at balcony. As these unit are not in demands. also not easy to rent out as there's too high supply and low demand. Look at Seaview, asking so high 7k to rent. how to move......why 7k is to cover the month;y bank payment. so Esta 650 might happen....keep ur finger cross and standby your cheque.... I grad the unit for u

I am interested in 2+1. will buy at 750psf.

Esta_600psf
12-09-08, 11:42
Get real mate.. If construction cost is high... Dun award the project to tat fellow lor... Seek to delay the project.. Prices will plunge.. Now... even oil also plunge nearly 50 from the peak in jul of $147/bbls to now below $98 !!!
Matter of time before all the raw materials prices collapse..
Sooner than you think, esta might be consider expensive even at 600ish psf !

Joe6816
12-09-08, 12:06
Get real mate.. If construction cost is high... Dun award the project to tat fellow lor... Seek to delay the project.. Prices will plunge.. Now... even oil also plunge nearly 50 from the peak in jul of $147/bbls to now below $98 !!!
Matter of time before all the raw materials prices collapse..
Sooner than you think, esta might be consider expensive even at 600ish psf !

Why USA is in Iraq? You think to look for WOMD?

Btw if you pass a construction site, what nation does these CHEAP workers came from? You still wan cheap? So if wan to lower construction price, get more cheaper workers from Afican countries....then you can get your FREEHOLD CONDO at 600psf.

Joe6816
12-09-08, 12:11
Both AUD and NZ have cut their interest rates recently. Inflation is no longer the threat! It's growth that central banks around the world are concerned now.
Stock market is the leading indicator, has always been the case and will always be the case.

It's all linked

inflation?
12-09-08, 23:39
It's all linked
That's why property price will stay soft for some period of time.

TO_Joe
12-09-08, 23:53
Hey Joe... Cool it man !
Tis how the cycle works bruddy !
What goes up must comes down..
Workers ? No problem.. township of 20,000 will be created as suggested by our Minister lah.. Important thing is to bring the cost down.
So... Matter of time mate..
Be patient... Iraq .. no need... Here in spore will get all cheaper workers ..
We are a natural magnet to attract all talents !
Spore boleh ! I have confidence ....

Zeng Han Jun
13-09-08, 00:36
It does go in cycle, but Joe has brought in a very interesting point about inflation with regards to property prices.

Inflation plays a very important factor in maintaining the property prices at the current level. Inflation rate itself may come down but... for it to hit below 0% and create a downward pressure may not be very probable. Political and business fundamentals in Singapore is strong enough to withstand and prevent negative inflation.

Unregistered88
13-09-08, 00:51
It does go in cycle, but Joe has brought in a very interesting point about inflation with regards to property prices.

Inflation plays a very important factor in maintaining the property prices at the current level. Inflation rate itself may come down but... for it to hit below 0% and create a downward pressure may not be very probable. Political and business fundamentals in Singapore is strong enough to withstand and prevent negative inflation.

Property prices have appreciated almost 50% in 2007 alone ... that's much faster than even the official CPI increase (7.5% is the highest year-on-year increase so far). So it may more than compensate for any fall in prices ...

Unregistered888
13-09-08, 11:52
REAL Estate Developers Association of Singapore (Redas) president Simon Cheong says private home prices are unlikely to drop much from current levels as selling prices are close to replacement costs, inclusive of construction costs.

Also, developers had a good year last year and ‘a lot of buffer’, he added, suggesting that they will be under less pressure to lower prices to chalk up further sales. ‘So I don’t anticipate that the drop will be too severe if there is one,’ Mr Cheong told reporters on the sidelines of Redas’ Mid-Autumn Festival Celebration yesterday.

However, some market watchers point out that developers are not uniform in financial strength.

DTZ senior director (research) Chua Chor Hoon agreed that the established developers who have made supernormal profits in the last few years have more holding power. ‘However, some new players who bought sites at high prices last year may not have enjoyed big profits. And there are smaller developers who may need to roll projects one after another to generate cashflow,’ she said.

Analysts say weaker players may be more inclined to trim prices if necessary to dispose of their projects. Another factor affecting price levels is the secondary market, including subsale transactions.

The median subsale prices of Citylights and The Sail @ Marina Bay eased about 2 and 14 per cent respectively in the second quarter of 2008 from the preceding quarter, according to a recent caveats analysis by DTZ.

Mr Cheong also said that high-end home prices have peaked but will probably achieve a new high ‘eventually when the sentiment improves, the economy improves, come 2010 when the integrated resorts come into play and with Singapore being a successful wealth management centre’.

Mr Cheong also said he continued to be upbeat about the Singapore property market in the long term, citing the Republic’s political stability and strong fundamentals, as well as upcoming projects/events that will further position Singapore as a global city. ‘I think when the whole storm blows over, the market should be able to accept the situation better and hopefully by next year, say 12 months’ time, we will be in a better state than now,’ he said.

Despite the generally upbeat tone of Mr Cheong’s comments, there is no denying the uncertainty in the short term.

Frasers Centrepoint CEO Lim Ee Seng, when quizzed on where the property market is headed in the next six months, said: ‘I don’t know. I hope that the market will be better. It’s all sentiment-driven. But I believe if there is good news in the market, the good sentiment will come back very quickly.’

Gwee Lian Kheng, group chief executive of UOL Group, said that there may be a tendency for some developers to slow down on the construction of their projects given that holding cost (interest cost) is 3 to 5 per cent, much lower than the 30 per cent rise in construction costs in the past nine months. ‘So there’s an advantage by slowing down.’ On a more positive note, Mr Gwee noted that prices of some construction materials like steel have started to stabilise.

Others like City Developments can ride on the advantage of having a diverse residential landbank comprising low-, mid- and high-end sites, said the company’s group general manager Chia Ngiang Hong. ‘We can pull out projects for which there is demand in the market. For the time being, the low- and mid-ends are still quite resilient,’ he added.

East Coast Lover
13-09-08, 16:40
Stack 13 selling @ $815? Thot it was sold 2 weeks ago? U mean the buyer back out from this transaction and let go it's 1% deposits? Time is REALLY BAD!!!

Unregistered123
13-09-08, 23:38
Hi,

this will be my first purchase from 2nd hand market, can any expert here advise what's the minimum deposit amount and loan arrangement?

thanks in advance.

Unregistered123
13-09-08, 23:56
5% cash, 5% cpf, borrow 90% max... depending on your profile.

For investment property, the max loan amt is 70%.... again depending on your profile

Joe6816
14-09-08, 00:13
Stack 13 selling @ $815? Thot it was sold 2 weeks ago? U mean the buyer back out from this transaction and let go it's 1% deposits? Time is REALLY BAD!!!


JUST SOLD. Who ask time is bad. If time is bad no deal close then we agents advertise for what?

orangepops
14-09-08, 03:26
we have a fixed budget and due to personal reasons, need to purchase a unit within next few weeks. after a long search, we have chosen the esta and are simply trying to decide on the layout we will choose. i was hoping to field for some opinions before we make a choice. :-)

can any share their inputs on the B1 layout? it has a balcony entrance and the refrigerator unit seems to be located in the living area outside the kitchen. we are fine with the roorless, balcony entrance as we have a good deal of plants we'd like to showcase. however, i am uncertain about why a refrigerator would be in the living area. is this normal in singapore? it seems pretty ugly in my opinion, but the price differential is so big that i dont just want to disregard this layout. (B1 layouts are at least 50-100psf discounted versus other layouts.)

Looking forward for your opinions on this! Or any other more practical recommendations on 3BR layout will be appreciated.

By the way, the low floor, stack 13 unit was also offerred to us, but its a difficult unit to appreciate because of its unit number as well as its frontage. Otherwise, i'm quite sure someone will take it up because its the cheapest right now at around 815psf.

Joe6816
14-09-08, 09:28
we have a fixed budget and due to personal reasons, need to purchase a unit within next few weeks. after a long search, we have chosen the esta and are simply trying to decide on the layout we will choose. i was hoping to field for some opinions before we make a choice. :-)

can any share their inputs on the B1 layout? it has a balcony entrance and the refrigerator unit seems to be located in the living area outside the kitchen. we are fine with the roorless, balcony entrance as we have a good deal of plants we'd like to showcase. however, i am uncertain about why a refrigerator would be in the living area. is this normal in singapore? it seems pretty ugly in my opinion, but the price differential is so big that i dont just want to disregard this layout. (B1 layouts are at least 50-100psf discounted versus other layouts.)

Looking forward for your opinions on this! Or any other more practical recommendations on 3BR layout will be appreciated.

By the way, the low floor, stack 13 unit was also offerred to us, but its a difficult unit to appreciate because of its unit number as well as its frontage. Otherwise, i'm quite sure someone will take it up because its the cheapest right now at around 815psf.

Hi, had a long day yesterday helping someone becoming a proud owner of Esta. Will be busy today but might help you first before i speed off. There's 2 ways you can look at about the refrigerator. Either you find it ugly or in my opinion, I find it quite good cause I can reach the refrigerator faster and easier for my beer while chilling in the hall enjoying EPL. Keep in touch...gtg


Cheers

buy
14-09-08, 14:25
when esta top?

Joe6816
14-09-08, 14:57
we have a fixed budget and due to personal reasons, need to purchase a unit within next few weeks. after a long search, we have chosen the esta and are simply trying to decide on the layout we will choose. i was hoping to field for some opinions before we make a choice. :-)

can any share their inputs on the B1 layout? it has a balcony entrance and the refrigerator unit seems to be located in the living area outside the kitchen. we are fine with the roorless, balcony entrance as we have a good deal of plants we'd like to showcase. however, i am uncertain about why a refrigerator would be in the living area. is this normal in singapore? it seems pretty ugly in my opinion, but the price differential is so big that i dont just want to disregard this layout. (B1 layouts are at least 50-100psf discounted versus other layouts.)

Looking forward for your opinions on this! Or any other more practical recommendations on 3BR layout will be appreciated.

By the way, the low floor, stack 13 unit was also offerred to us, but its a difficult unit to appreciate because of its unit number as well as its frontage. Otherwise, i'm quite sure someone will take it up because its the cheapest right now at around 815psf.

Do call me or PM me for a non obligation discussion on getting your unit at the best price at the right time.

Joe
81712412

Joe6816
14-09-08, 15:00
Developers appeal to Govt over bay window ruling

Posted: 12 Sep 2008 08:39 PM CDT

THEY might look innocuous, but bay windows and planter boxes have become a hot topic of discussion between property developers and the Government.

The talks centre on a controversial decision by the Urban Redevelopment Authority (URA) to include the area of such design features in gross floor area (GFA) calculations.

Bay window and planter boxes, which often make up about 5 per cent of a condo's saleable area, used to be exempt from GFA calculations. But buyers paid developers for this area as it was provided with the unit.

The URA caught the industry by surprise on July 7 when it stated that the revised guidelines would take effect from Oct 7. It was reported at the time that the move would close a 'loophole' that developers had been exploiting.

Planter boxes were originally introduced to provide greenery and visual relief to high-rise condos.

However, the URA said feedback and its own investigations found extensive unauthorised conversions of planter boxes into balcony space or extensions of the living room - which defeated the original purpose.

This also led to the buildings being less energy efficient, said the URA.

But developers said yesterday it was a 'misconception' that they were profiting from it.

UOL Group chief operating officer Liam Wee Sin told The Straits Times that contrary to general perception, developers did not 'have it free'.

'There's a reason why it's there in the first place,' he said. 'It costs money to construct these features, and it is not given to us free.'

It is part of the 'residual land value' and developers factor this when bidding for a site, he said.

A Lianhe Zaobao report quoted market sources who suggested the change might lead developers to pay less for land.

It cited the sale of a site next to Tanah Merah MRT station that was awarded recently at $282 per sq ft per plot ratio (psf ppr). This was 11 per cent less than the $318.50 psf ppr attained by a neighbouring site before the GFA change was announced.

The president of the Real Estate Developers' Association of Singapore (Redas), Mr Simon Cheong, said he could not comment further because talks were 'in process'.

Mr Cheong, who was speaking at Redas' annual Mid-Autumn Festival celebration, said that developers were cautious in their short-term outlook due to high construction costs.

'Hopefully in 12 months' time, we'll be in a better state than now,' he said.

He cited Singapore's low interest rates and upcoming events such as the Formula One race and Youth Olympics for his bullish outlook.

On the price of real estate, he said that 'if it drops, it will not be much more'.

The replacement cost of apartments, including cost of construction, is very close to selling prices already, he added.

Mass market home prices are dependent on local demand and 'this is subjective to how the economy is'.

Joe6816
14-09-08, 15:09
when esta top?


Early Nov. Might be Late Oct