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vip
22-03-16, 15:46
http://propertysoul.com/2016/03/22/take-it-or-regret-later/

Take it or regret later

March 22, 2016

Best offer to board the last flight

Last week I was at the Hong Kong International Airport trying to catch the 8 pm flight back to Singapore when the staff at the check-in counter gave me an unexpected offer.

“Ms xx, are you in a hurry to fly back? We have checked in 300 passengers and the flight is already full. Can we put you on the next available flight departing 1.50 am?”

“But it’s only 6 pm now. Is there any earlier flight?”

“Most passengers have done their check-in online. And I am afraid that all other flights are full.”

Online check-in? My meetings were so packed that I didn’t even have time to turn on the TV in my hotel room.

“If you can take the 1.50 am flight, we will offer you free upgrade to the next higher class. You can choose to upgrade on this flight or any flight in the future. On top of that, we will give you one thousand dollars in cash right now.”

She said this as she put her hand inside the drawer. She was probably thinking of the famous line in The Godfather ‘make him an offer he can’t refuse’.

“Wait. One thousand Singapore or Hong Kong currency?”

“Hong Kong dollars.” Oops, did I just ask a silly question?

“Look, we can put you on standby but there is no guarantee that we can find you a seat. The best is that you take this offer.”

Honestly, I would rather be on my own bed than on the bed of an upgraded cabin in the wee hours of the morning.

“But my husband is waiting for me at the Changi Airport.” It was just my polite way of saying ‘no’.

“You can call him now. We provide free IDD here. What is his number?” She held up the receiver of the phone at her desk.

“I think I just try my luck for the 8 pm flight.”

“Okay, it’s up to you,” with an expression that said ‘what a stubborn customer!’.

“Here’s a $40 F&B voucher. Go get a drink and come back to check again an hour later.”

I grabbed a $39 mango sago drink nearby as quickly as possible and spent the next 40 minutes standing near her counter. I waited till no one in the check-in queue and approached her right away.

I was relieved that she finally printed my boarding pass to board the 8 pm flight. It was code-shared with three flights. No wonder it was so full!


Special offer at the showflat

One morning in 2011, I followed the crowd to visit the sales gallery of a new project launch.

“How many bedrooms are you looking for?” The property agent asked me.

“Two bedders.”

“Our two bedrooms are all sold out … Wait, we still have one 2+1 unit left here.”

“It’s facing outside. I prefer a pool view unit.”

“Facing the pool is very noisy. Why pay more to get the noise?” She added, “We already have two customers eyeing this last 2+1 unit. They are checking with their bank now. You’d better hurry before it’s gone.”

“But there is Phase 2, right?”

“Phase 2 blocks are 3 and 4 bedrooms. Only Phase 1 units enjoy 5 percent discount off the list price. The project is selling very well. The developer will definitely increase the price, at least 20 percent. Besides, the facing and furnishing of Phase 2 units are not as good as Phase 1, and no branded appliances too. That’s why everyone is buying now!”

I looked around and saw many eager buyers holding their cheque book. It’s true that everybody else was buying – except that Phase 2 units have 2 bedrooms, better facing and nice pool views, plus selling with the same furnishing and price level.


Look what savvy investors are doing

At the end of a flat viewing in 2001, a property agent said this to me,

“Quickly make an offer now if you are keen. I am only telling you this: Recently, I notice that many true investors have started going back to the property market. You don’t want to miss all the good deals before prices go up again.”

I wanted to be one of the savvy ones too. If only I had enough cash to buy!

Soon the property market was plagued by September 11, SARS and economic downturn. It was not until 2006 that the market finally showed signs of recovery.


Say yes or regret later

FOMO (Fear of Missing Out) is the fear of regret for missing a good opportunity or an attractive reward. It’s the same mentality why shoppers have to buy right now because they can’t afford to miss it when things are on sale.

In investment, FOMO is the fear of missing the best time to buy, a high return or a big profit. No one want to think in retrospect how one could have laughed all the way to the bank but instead end up with nothing.

Last month we just celebrated another wedding anniversary. I can still recall somebody said this to me many years ago,

“I am going to ask you one last time. If I don’t get a ‘yes’ this time, I might have to start looking elsewhere … You are a smart girl and I know you always do the right thing.”

I should have known that this is manipulation of my FOMO.

Kelonguni
22-03-16, 18:04
Luckily you managed to take the 8pm flight and did not ask for an additional 1000 off!

Glad you made the right decision when it was finally available.

Pool facing actually better for rental yield although its not my preference.

Citizen
22-03-16, 20:07
A Property sale agent job is convincing ppl being it is a good buy or bad buy, good time or bad time. 2009 many property agents trying very hard to sell me their projects. I was so smart and savvy that I didn't buy from them. Sighs ! If not I could have make alot from properties. Can anyone please highlight me why the writer keep writing bad about property ? Can anyone tell how many percent of ppl lost on property investment . Is it 100% or 99% so bad that people keep talking bad about buying property. What is the losing rate as compare to other investments? Or they MTB so they wanted or hope prices will plunge?

Citizen
22-03-16, 20:31
In feb or march 2009 I was offer a unit at quartz at buangkok. We were given half day to think and I rejected. My Friend bought it. The rest is history. I should blame the agent for not convincing enough or blame myself for being too savvy. Sighs

Citizen
22-03-16, 20:38
If not because of our govt CMs the property prices will skyrocketed. But why there are ppl in the forum said that the prices will collapse instead? Sighs ! What are their motives?

henryhk
23-03-16, 06:33
If not because of our govt CMs the property prices will skyrocketed. But why there are ppl in the forum said that the prices will collapse instead? Sighs ! What are their motives?

So they want to buy cheap....currently it is dropping slowly, they hope like oil price crash from. $100 to $40.... If u can wait then wait until 2018...to see the situation.. I just sold one unit, now accumulate more cash for one in 2018, hopefully the measures are removed partially

Citizen
23-03-16, 08:06
Thanks Henryhk for your sincere advice.

HP65
23-03-16, 09:06
If not because of our govt CMs the property prices will skyrocketed. But why there are ppl in the forum said that the prices will collapse instead? Sighs ! What are their motives?

The way I looked at it...there are only 2 categories of people who wished for prices to fall / collapse.

1) First time buyers either for own stay or for investment. Need as low an entry point as possible.

2) Those looking to upgrade, whether for own stay or a bigger investment ppty

3) People who truly believe prices are too highly speculated and fear the effects of a bust in prices and the wider implications on the rest of the economy.

Now, how many fall into (1) or (2)? I would say mostly are (1) or (2). For those who are vested already, i.e. those holding to at least 1 investment ppty, whether prices go up or down doesn't really matter.

So now you understand why some are asking for prices to collapse?

dreamer888
23-03-16, 11:28
The way I looked at it...there are only 2 categories of people who wished for prices to fall / collapse.

1) First time buyers either for own stay or for investment. Need as low an entry point as possible.

2) Those looking to upgrade, whether for own stay or a bigger investment ppty

3) People who truly believe prices are too highly speculated and fear the effects of a bust in prices and the wider implications on the rest of the economy.

Now, how many fall into (1) or (2)? I would say mostly are (1) or (2). For those who are vested already, i.e. those holding to at least 1 investment ppty, whether prices go up or down doesn't really matter.

So now you understand why some are asking for prices to collapse?

I think there is a 4th category which I will classify myself into - i.e. people who are currently holding to a ppty and looking to buy a 2nd one for investment purposes. Definitely, i would want a low entry point for the ppty purchase.

But price movements are due to market forces which are affected by several factors like interest rates, supply & demand of ppties, the general economy outlook etc. If prices are meant to fall due to any of these factors, then the downward trend will persist.

Amber Woods
23-03-16, 12:14
If not because of our govt CMs the property prices will skyrocketed. But why there are ppl in the forum said that the prices will collapse instead? Sighs ! What are their motives?

On the contrary, I am also wondering why there are people hoping prices will skyrocket?

Most likely these are people holding multiple properties (maybe also highly leveraged) and have no intention to buy more. This group is actually very small or the minority. The majority who want to buy or buy more are hoping for prices to dive.

HP65
23-03-16, 14:00
I think there is a 4th category which I will classify myself into - i.e. people who are currently holding to a ppty and looking to buy a 2nd one for investment purposes. Definitely, i would want a low entry point for the ppty purchase.

But price movements are due to market forces which are affected by several factors like interest rates, supply & demand of ppties, the general economy outlook etc. If prices are meant to fall due to any of these factors, then the downward trend will persist.

Dreamer888,

I classify you under Cat (1) as one who wants to enter the market for investment, the lower the price, the better.

The problem lies with accurately predicting demand & supply. Even with perfect info on supply, we still cannot predict the hands that can alter demand and supply here in Sg - Govt policies.

HP65
23-03-16, 14:05
On the contrary, I am also wondering why there are people hoping prices will skyrocket?

Most likely these are people holding multiple properties (maybe also highly leveraged) and have no intention to buy more. This group is actually very small or the minority. The majority who want to buy or buy more are hoping for prices to dive.

Short term speculators...anybody who intend to make super normal profits with a less than 5 yrs horizon is my definition for this group. While I have benefited twice over in terms of boom/bust cycle, I really do not favor it.

Kelonguni
23-03-16, 14:08
On the contrary, I am also wondering why there are people hoping prices will skyrocket?

Most likely these are people holding multiple properties (maybe also highly leveraged) and have no intention to buy more. This group is actually very small or the minority. The majority who want to buy or buy more are hoping for prices to dive.

It has dived already. 4Q 2015 it dived by 0.49%.

No rush. Those who want to wait can continue to wait bah.

Imagine VIP after being informed there were seats for 8pm flight still want to bargain and hold out for a better deal... I can only imagine the outcome at the end. That is what we are looking at right now where property is concerned. How many % more diving are you looking out for?

Kelonguni
23-03-16, 15:15
Assuming 0.5% dive a quarter, it should be about 2% drop in one more year.

Assuming 1% dive a quarter, it should be about 4% drop in one year. I don't believe it will happen but some do.

The rental gain in 1 year is already typically close to or more than 4%.

We can only assess in a year's time.

dreamer888
23-03-16, 16:11
Dreamer888,

I classify you under Cat (1) as one who wants to enter the market for investment, the lower the price, the better.

The problem lies with accurately predicting demand & supply. Even with perfect info on supply, we still cannot predict the hands that can alter demand and supply here in Sg - Govt policies.

Yeah, in that sense you are correct. Anyone would favour a low entry point for investment.

Agreed on that. It is just too tough to predict the best timing to enter the market. Most of the time, luck is an important element. But when it comes to the ppty market, I always believe in one thing. When the market is hot and everyone's buying, sell your ppty. When the market is dead and everyone wants to sell their ppty, it's the best time to get in.

proud owner
23-03-16, 17:21
Yeah, in that sense you are correct. Anyone would favour a low entry point for investment.

Agreed on that. It is just too tough to predict the best timing to enter the market. Most of the time, luck is an important element. But when it comes to the ppty market, I always believe in one thing. When the market is hot and everyone's buying, sell your ppty. When the market is dead and everyone wants to sell their ppty, it's the best time to get in.


You are quite right ....


I have always been asked, "When is the right time to buy?"

My answer has always been :

if you know for certainty that your job is secured, and that you have no problem servicing loans for the next 5 years , That will be the time to buy.

Citizen
23-03-16, 17:57
You are quite right ....


I have always been asked, "When is the right time to buy?"

My answer has always been :

if you know for certainty that your job is secured, and that you have no problem servicing loans for the next 5 years , That will be the time to buy.

Even Soharto didn't know he would resigned in 1998. How can we know our job security and no problem servicing loans for the next 5 years. Unless we really work within our mean. Can afford a bungalow we buy a semi-d , can buy condo we buy HDB. No improvement

dreamer888
23-03-16, 18:08
Even Soharto didn't know he would resigned in 1998. How can we know our job security and no problem servicing loans for the next 5 years. Unless we really work within our mean. Can afford a bungalow we buy a semi-d , can buy condo we buy HDB. No improvement

Nobody knows for sure what would happen in the future. I would say always have a Plan B if things don't work out well. As long as there is an exit plan, just go for it. If one needs to worry every single bit of everything, 5 years down the road, you will still be at the same spot as you were 5 years ago.

Citizen
23-03-16, 18:12
I believe majority of spore ppl work within their mean. So when foreigner push up the property prices, they kpkb and hope for it to crash so they can invest.

Citizen
23-03-16, 18:16
Nobody knows for sure what would happen in the future. I would say always have a Plan B if things don't work out well. As long as there is an exit plan, just go for it. If one needs to worry every single bit of everything, 5 years down the road, you will still be at the same spot as you were 5 years ago.
Thanks dreamer888, but what is plan B.

proud owner
23-03-16, 18:38
Even Soharto didn't know he would resigned in 1998. How can we know our job security and no problem servicing loans for the next 5 years. Unless we really work within our mean. Can afford a bungalow we buy a semi-d , can buy condo we buy HDB. No improvement

i did, when i purchased all my properties.
My loans were never more than 15 yrs.


I knew then that for next 5 yrs i would still have my job..

Even if i lose it the next day, i knew i had sufficient savings to LIVE and service lone for up to 5 yrs..

thats quite worrisome. If you do not know where you stand in your company, or how your contribution to your company helps secure your job... then you have a problem...

As to your plan B .... thats your way of ensuring that you are able to service another 5 yrs of loans..

each of us have our own ways ... BUT as long as you know you can do it for up to 5 yrs ... then thats the time to make that commitment to buy ...

Citizen
23-03-16, 18:44
Thanks Proud Owner for your advice. Once I know my stand the prices already shoot up thus I'm still waiting now. Sighs

Citizen
23-03-16, 18:47
Somehow I believe that there must be some risk we have to take in order to advance.

Kelonguni
23-03-16, 23:28
But when it comes to the ppty market, I always believe in one thing. When the market is hot and everyone's buying, sell your ppty. When the market is dead and everyone wants to sell their ppty, it's the best time to get in.

I also thought I believed in that. But it never happened the way people envisioned it. Below is one of my best friend's and my experience.

http://www.srx.com.sg/cooling-measures

Everyone started to buy in 2009 but we had no money yet. The only option is very high LTV loan. Such high risks, so let everyone else go first.

Many people continued to buy in 2010-2011 and property continued to spike. Max LTV decreased and SSD came in. Wanted to buy but not enough for downpayment. Need to save some more...

2011 - ABSD started to be implemented but no charges for SC second property. You could already see what was coming. We have saved enough. I tell my friend to buy he said wait to see because it is still very hot.

2012 - crazy LTV. Most people already cannot go for multiple loans. And still prices grew and transactions were still very high, which meant people were still buying.

2013 - the turnaround. ABSD 2 (7% for SC's second property) plus TDSR. Market suddenly cooled. Very few people could enter the market anymore, and the market was dead.

2014-2015 - Market was dead. Would you get in? I wouldn't if there was no obvious game plan.

2016 March - Market was dead for close to 3 years. Still dead? If transactions start to rise and everyone starts to buy today, do you sell your property or withhold the purchase you have been preparing for because everyone's buying? Or do you cheong with them to secure quickly?

So what happened to my best friend? He decoupled his HDB and bought an OCR resale in late 2015, literally when market was dead, at a very low fixed long term interest rate, just like what you have advocated. Good or bad move? We can only wait and see.

august
24-03-16, 00:54
Good or bad move is better than never move. :p

AdoLee
24-03-16, 05:36
Very Nice Post, I will use this in my career to attract customers in my real estate company.
Yeah the fear of loosing makes us do such things that we cant even imagine.
So rather than "regretting later", I will prefer to "take it"

Citizen
24-03-16, 08:00
Thanks Kelonguni for your overviews. My experience was none of the factors you mentioned. I didn't commit is because during 2009 I heard more bad news and advices. The prices were going even lower if I can wait a few months. Many so call gurus and bank managers claimed that the economy going collapse. I remember govt need to guarantee money in the bank. The fears were so strong that prevented me from committing property investment.

Leeds
24-03-16, 10:26
Thanks Kelonguni for your overviews. My experience was none of the factors you mentioned. I didn't commit is because during 2009 I heard more bad news and advices. The prices were going even lower if I can wait a few months. Many so call gurus and bank managers claimed that the economy going collapse. I remember govt need to guarantee money in the bank. The fears were so strong that prevented me from committing property investment.

It is not complete to look at the property market between 2009 to now because this period is only part of the property cycle. One should look at the period from 1990 to now to have a good understanding of how the market actually works even though every cycle is different due to different circumstances.

Your experiences and decision in 2009 was "right" because the world was just starting to react to the Lebman's crisis in 2008 with the expectation that the US would be experiencing a similar financial crisis like the one in Asia in 1997. Singapore then was still in the midst of recession. What the FED did to save the US from a severe recession was to flood the market with cheap money and with near zero interest rate were unprecedential. These cheap money and low interest rates caused asset inflation across many cities in the world including Singapore.

What the FED did did not provide real economic growth. The slow down in China is going to hit US much more than it ability to generate domestic growth. At home, the government's firmness in preventing asset bubbles is working and the soft landing is slowing making its present felt.

There were many people who sold their flats in late 2009 and hoping to buy back later were severely punished. If you are not one of them, count yourself lucky.

If you think you have missed the boat to buy in 2009 by looking at today's price, sure you feel sour; but fed not because between 2009 and now the cycle is still "not complete". Currently, many resale transactions in RCR (less in OCR) have already reached 2010/2011 level. Prices in CCR had already "crashed".

If you had bought between 2009 and 2013 and are collecting rents over the past years, it should not bother you whether prices go up or down further. If you bought between 2013 and now, you should be financially solid to be able to ride out the cycle. Having said that, of course we are going to see more bank sales going forward because of the declining rental market, softer job market and the expected rising interest rate. This is normal as the market wipes out the weak buyers.

Property investment is really for the long term (10 years at least). In between cycles, there will be minor adjustments due to both latent and effective demands.

We are still in the midst of adjustment in this current cycle.

dreamer888
24-03-16, 11:47
Thanks dreamer888, but what is plan B.

Everyone has a different Plan B. It just gotta be one that you are comfortable executing it. My Plan B is I have a fully paid up HDB flat. If I bought a private ppty today and things don't work out well in the next couple of years, I might foresee myself selling the private ppty (perhaps at a small loss) and return to stay at my HDB flat. Life still goes on....

Arcachon
25-03-16, 22:12
A Property sale agent job is convincing ppl being it is a good buy or bad buy, good time or bad time. 2009 many property agents trying very hard to sell me their projects. I was so smart and savvy that I didn't buy from them. Sighs ! If not I could have make alot from properties. Can anyone please highlight me why the writer keep writing bad about property ? Can anyone tell how many percent of ppl lost on property investment . Is it 100% or 99% so bad that people keep talking bad about buying property. What is the losing rate as compare to other investments? Or they MTB so they wanted or hope prices will plunge?

She sold all her property.

Property Soul is a property enthusiast who bought her first condominium unit for rent since 2002. In the next 4˝ years, she built up a portfolio of five private properties. By 2008, its total value had more than doubled. In 2010 and 2011, she sold four of the properties, realizing a net profit of 80 to 120 percent.

TOKARA
26-03-16, 00:17
It is not complete to look at the property market between 2009 to now because this period is only part of the property cycle. One should look at the period from 1990 to now to have a good understanding of how the market actually works even though every cycle is different due to different circumstances.

Your experiences and decision in 2009 was "right" because the world was just starting to react to the Lebman's crisis in 2008 with the expectation that the US would be experiencing a similar financial crisis like the one in Asia in 1997. Singapore then was still in the midst of recession. What the FED did to save the US from a severe recession was to flood the market with cheap money and with near zero interest rate were unprecedential. These cheap money and low interest rates caused asset inflation across many cities in the world including Singapore.

What the FED did did not provide real economic growth. The slow down in China is going to hit US much more than it ability to generate domestic growth. At home, the government's firmness in preventing asset bubbles is working and the soft landing is slowing making its present felt.

There were many people who sold their flats in late 2009 and hoping to buy back later were severely punished. If you are not one of them, count yourself lucky.

If you think you have missed the boat to buy in 2009 by looking at today's price, sure you feel sour; but fed not because between 2009 and now the cycle is still "not complete". Currently, many resale transactions in RCR (less in OCR) have already reached 2010/2011 level. Prices in CCR had already "crashed".

If you had bought between 2009 and 2013 and are collecting rents over the past years, it should not bother you whether prices go up or down further. If you bought between 2013 and now, you should be financially solid to be able to ride out the cycle. Having said that, of course we are going to see more bank sales going forward because of the declining rental market, softer job market and the expected rising interest rate. This is normal as the market wipes out the weak buyers.

Property investment is really for the long term (10 years at least). In between cycles, there will be minor adjustments due to both latent and effective demands.

We are still in the midst of adjustment in this current cycle.

Appreciate your insights

Myself a noob and just bought one off from the bank...really need to tahan this adjustment wave now

Citizen
26-03-16, 07:37
She sold all her property.

Property Soul is a property enthusiast who bought her first condominium unit for rent since 2002. In the next 4˝ years, she built up a portfolio of five private properties. By 2008, its total value had more than doubled. In 2010 and 2011, she sold four of the properties, realizing a net profit of 80 to 120 percent.

Thanks Arcachon for your CSI , indeed she had a hidden agenta. No wonder she kept writing bad about property investment.

Citizen
26-03-16, 07:41
Appreciate your insights

Myself a noob and just bought one off from the bank...really need to tahan this adjustment wave now

Don't tell me other investments are much easier to tahan ?

Arcachon
26-03-16, 07:52
Thanks Arcachon for your CSI , indeed she had a hidden agenda. No wonder she kept writing bad about property investment.

No one person can move the market just by talking about it.

The government has done a good job to hold the boat so that more can get on it.

As to how long can they can hold depends on the current under the boat.

Every cycle there will be those who chose to sit by the bank and wait for a bigger boat and those who will get on the boat when they see one.

At the end of the day, the boat will still have to move because of the current.

Arcachon
26-03-16, 07:58
For those on the market, the raw material for building property have gone up due to China going green.

They have enough of the dirty air.

Moral of the story, I need to pay more on the building material the property should be cheaper right.

Came back from France after 8 years and 8 months already see three colleagues got cancer.

One just passes away, how many life can you live.

Sitting on the bank waiting for the bigger boat may not be so wise as the second, minute, hours, days, weeks, months of your life burn away.

Ok, going for breakfast then steam room and then swimming to burn my days remaining on earth.

https://scontent-sin1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xat1/v/t1.0-9/12647059_10206698015701956_4326306820456137730_n.jpg?oh=d6afc2be12f014be581fb57856fee099&oe=57817CB6

DC33_2008
26-03-16, 08:19
Watch out for bank sale of OCRs in the next 2 years.
It is not complete to look at the property market between 2009 to now because this period is only part of the property cycle. One should look at the period from 1990 to now to have a good understanding of how the market actually works even though every cycle is different due to different circumstances.

Your experiences and decision in 2009 was "right" because the world was just starting to react to the Lebman's crisis in 2008 with the expectation that the US would be experiencing a similar financial crisis like the one in Asia in 1997. Singapore then was still in the midst of recession. What the FED did to save the US from a severe recession was to flood the market with cheap money and with near zero interest rate were unprecedential. These cheap money and low interest rates caused asset inflation across many cities in the world including Singapore.

What the FED did did not provide real economic growth. The slow down in China is going to hit US much more than it ability to generate domestic growth. At home, the government's firmness in preventing asset bubbles is working and the soft landing is slowing making its present felt.

There were many people who sold their flats in late 2009 and hoping to buy back later were severely punished. If you are not one of them, count yourself lucky.

If you think you have missed the boat to buy in 2009 by looking at today's price, sure you feel sour; but fed not because between 2009 and now the cycle is still "not complete". Currently, many resale transactions in RCR (less in OCR) have already reached 2010/2011 level. Prices in CCR had already "crashed".

If you had bought between 2009 and 2013 and are collecting rents over the past years, it should not bother you whether prices go up or down further. If you bought between 2013 and now, you should be financially solid to be able to ride out the cycle. Having said that, of course we are going to see more bank sales going forward because of the declining rental market, softer job market and the expected rising interest rate. This is normal as the market wipes out the weak buyers.

Property investment is really for the long term (10 years at least). In between cycles, there will be minor adjustments due to both latent and effective demands.

We are still in the midst of adjustment in this current cycle.

Arcachon
26-03-16, 09:39
Watch out for bank sale of OCRs in the next 2 years.

Maybe a bit of study who is buying OCR would help.

I know a number with fully paid HDB with tons of cash still waiting for the Big boat.

DC33_2008
26-03-16, 09:45
I did not qualify, 'in some locations'.
Maybe a bit of study who is buying OCR would help.

I know a number with fully paid HDB with tons of cash still waiting for the Big boat.

Citizen
26-03-16, 11:29
Watch out for bank sale of OCRs in the next 2 years.

Don't need to wait for next 2 years , everyday also have bank sale la.

teddybear
26-03-16, 12:57
Wait for BIG DISCOUNT ones, and many many more to come as loan interest rate goes up, retrenchment and jobless rate start to increase, economy goes down and foreigners leaving and few will rent or will ask for cut-throat rent (like $1500 pm for a 3 Bedder private condo, and this even happened for Upper Bukit Timah RCR area, not to mention any other Tom Dick & Harry OCR locations)........

As to the HDB upgraders, they will be hit left-right-centre that they will stopped thinking about upgrading to private condos (let alone think about buying a private condo even for investment) and ONLY WORRYING whether they will be able to keep their JOBs and endure till recession over and better time comes........


Don't need to wait for next 2 years , everyday also have bank sale la.

Arcachon
26-03-16, 15:08
Wait for BIG DISCOUNT ones, and many many more to come as loan interest rate goes up,

Fixed at 1.68% for the next 2 years.

retrenchment and jobless rate start to increase

Singapore have over a million foreign worker. ???????

economy goes down.

Everywhere go down but we still build MRT station one after another, Airport extension, etc. ??????

foreigners leaving

Go back to US or Europe and become jobless ???????

$1500 pm for a 3 Bedder private condo.

My HDB is renting out at $2600 can tell me where I want to rent.

As to the HDB upgraders, they will be hit left-right-centre that they will stopped thinking about upgrading to private condos (let alone think about buying a private condo even for investment) and ONLY WORRYING whether they will be able to keep their JOBs and endure till recession over and better time comes........

Should go Marine Parade HDB carpark and take a look at what car they are driving to understand what is HDB upgraders.

Arcachon
26-03-16, 15:37
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLQ5LMn6Y5U


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLQ5LMn6Y5U

Ilikeu
26-03-16, 19:07
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLQ5LMn6Y5U


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLQ5LMn6Y5U

Looks good. Buy one more ppty in Jurong!?

focus
26-03-16, 20:38
[Last month we just celebrated another wedding anniversary. I can still recall somebody said this to me many years ago,

“I am going to ask you one last time. If I don’t get a ‘yes’ this time, I might have to start looking elsewhere … You are a smart girl and I know you always do the right thing.”

I should have known that this is manipulation of my FOMO.

Cool.. this line would be what Frank Underwood(House of Cards) would say to get what he wants.. :)

Ilikeu
26-03-16, 21:33
Fixed at 1.68% for the next 2 years.

retrenchment and jobless rate start to increase

Singapore have over a million foreign worker. ???????

economy goes down.

Everywhere go down but we still build MRT station one after another, Airport extension, etc. ??????

foreigners leaving

Go back to US or Europe and become jobless ???????

$1500 pm for a 3 Bedder private condo.

My HDB is renting out at $2600 can tell me where I want to rent.

As to the HDB upgraders, they will be hit left-right-centre that they will stopped thinking about upgrading to private condos (let alone think about buying a private condo even for investment) and ONLY WORRYING whether they will be able to keep their JOBs and endure till recession over and better time comes........

Should go Marine Parade HDB carpark and take a look at what car they are driving to understand what is HDB upgraders.


As and when rental for 3 bedder private condo is at $1500... STI would probably be at 1500, Dow at less than 10000...
If anyone takes this view that it will happen, they should sell all..... and wait.
But is there anyone who will do that...?

teddybear
27-03-16, 00:08
That is the rental for RCR condos........
And you can imagine how bad OCR condos will be?

Anyway, it is also a fact that majority's timing in investment is always wrong...... :hopelessness:


As and when rental for 3 bedder private condo is at $1500... STI would probably be at 1500, Dow at less than 10000...
If anyone takes this view that it will happen, they should sell all..... and wait.
But is there anyone who will do that...?

Arcachon
27-03-16, 08:11
Last time SGD 1.50 can buy one big bowl of fish ball noodle.

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/singapore/money-supply-m3

SGD 6,600 can buy Circuit Road 3 room HDB.

Don't worry, we live in a Nanny state, pay million for the administrator they should know what they are doing.

Last time we have this for SGD 1.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/65/909_at_TA-4SU_Skyhawk_of_the_Singapore_Air_Force_(3218404424).jpg

Now we have this for a few million

http://www.merawan.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/Av-Gasp-Events-rsafopenhouse1.jpg

Last time school are so Simple and Basic.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?p=131660036#post131660036

Citizen
27-03-16, 08:39
If you had bought between 2009 and 2013 and are collecting rents over the past years, it should not bother you whether prices go up or down further. If you bought between 2013 and now, you should be financially solid to be able to ride out the cycle. Having said that, of course we are going to see more bank sales going forward because of the declining rental market, softer job market and the expected rising interest rate. This is normal as the market wipes out the weak buyers.

Property investment is really for the long term (10 years at least). In between cycles, there will be minor adjustments due to both latent and effective demands.

We are still in the midst of adjustment in this current cycle.

Like you said, property investment is really for long term (at least 10 years). Then you said going to see more bank sales base on declining rental market. Which period of the buyers will be in bank sales? Before or after 2009?
What make you think property buyers after 2009 are weak and those before 2009 will be force to let bank foreclosure? (since they already hold their properties for almost or more than 10 years). Sighs!!

Arcachon
27-03-16, 08:58
A lot of owners before 2009 and after 2009 are seating on a lot of cash waiting to buy more but ABSD and TDSR stop them from buying. Those who brought after Dec 2011 are those who have a lot of cash and cannot wait anymore. Those who brought after TDSR are those earning too much money don't know where to keep.

No one can talk down the market, same with no one can stop the market from going higher.

Time will proof market will adjust to reality.

Arcachon
27-03-16, 09:19
29 June 2013. ------http://www.mas.gov.sg/~/media/MAS/Regulations%20and%20Financial%20Stability/Regulations%20Guidance%20and%20Licensing/Commercial%20Banks/Regulations%20Guidance%20and%20Licensing/Guidelines/TDSR_Guidelines_Refin_10Feb14.pdf

12 January 2013 ------https://www.iras.gov.sg/IRASHome/uploadedFiles/IRASHome/News_and_Events/Additional%20Measures%20to%20Ensure%20a%20Stable%20and%20Sustainable%20Property%20Market%20-%20Annex%20I.pdf

On and after 14 Jan 2011 --- https://www.iras.gov.sg/irashome/Other-Taxes/Stamp-Duty-for-Property/Working-out-your-Stamp-Duty/Selling-or-Disposing-Property/Seller-s-Stamp-Duty--SSD--for-Residential-Property/

Citizen
27-03-16, 10:44
Thanks Arcachon for your views, as i alway said you are positive. Am I wrong to say those who invested in local properties believe in singapore growth and they are prepared for long term. Those who don't believe in singapore growth even the prices are low they are not prepare to invest in local properties.

Arcachon
27-03-16, 10:57
I was in France from Mar 2007 to Nov 2015, still cannot get myself to buy a French property.

But in Singapore if Bank can loan me I will still buy another one.

The rate of money printing is just unbelievable, still don't understand how they manage to keep the hyperinflation check.

Kelonguni
27-03-16, 11:18
After understanding how to play this game, my only regret is not starting earlier.

But still in time to siam ABSD. Heng arh!

Actually ABSD slows down the rate of accumulation because it is paid upfront and cannot be loaned. Not an issue for the rich but more of a concern for the middle income.

Arcachon
27-03-16, 11:29
Who paid for all this.

https://www.nparks.gov.sg/~/media/nparks-real-content/gardens-parks-and-nature/diy-walk/diy-walk-pdf-files/eastern-coastal-loop.pdf

China has the ghost town, Japanese have this long time ago.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/06/world/asia/06japan.html?_r=0

Lucky Singapore land too small to built road.

Japan spent too much on increasingly wasteful roads and bridges, and not enough in areas like education and social services, which studies show deliver more bang for the buck than infrastructure spending.

Everything our million dollar servant do, they do it for money (ROI)

Arcachon
27-03-16, 11:40
Between 1991 and 1995, Japan spent some $2.1 trillion on public works, in an economy roughly half as large as that of the United States, according to the Cabinet Office.

Singapore spending is peanut compare to Japan and China.

Ilikeu
27-03-16, 11:52
I was in France from Mar 2007 to Nov 2015, still cannot get myself to buy a French property.

But in Singapore if Bank can loan me I will still buy another one.

The rate of money printing is just unbelievable, still don't understand how they manage to keep the hyperinflation check.



Not easy to survive 8 years in a country like france....

Arcachon
27-03-16, 12:38
The only thing I learn is never to use English to a French if you are not English.

Ilikeu
27-03-16, 13:13
The only thing I learn is never to use English to a French if you are not English.

Indeed. They conduct internal meetings in french and refuse to do so in english.
Really tough for an asian there.

Ilikeu
27-03-16, 13:40
That is the rental for RCR condos........
And you can imagine how bad OCR condos will be?

Anyway, it is also a fact that majority's timing in investment is always wrong...... :hopelessness:

When ppty is down and time to go in, most would have lost a lot too in stocks etc.
It is easy to say market will one day boom and will one day crush. But it is not easy to say when.

Arcachon
27-03-16, 13:51
http://news.asiaone.com/news/malaysia/long-wait-specialise-makes-malaysia-lose-doctors-singapore

Don't know where the Doctor sleep at night.

Kelonguni
27-03-16, 14:44
When they graduate, they will constitute rental demand.

But during their studies, they also have the residential options of student hostels.


http://news.asiaone.com/news/malaysia/long-wait-specialise-makes-malaysia-lose-doctors-singapore

Don't know where the Doctor sleep at night.

DC33_2008
27-03-16, 15:12
Japan has more catastrophe like earthquake, tsunami, etc.
Between 1991 and 1995, Japan spent some $2.1 trillion on public works, in an economy roughly half as large as that of the United States, according to the Cabinet Office.

Singapore spending is peanut compare to Japan and China.