View Full Version : 5 Reasons Why It’s Still a Terrible Time to Buy Singapore Property
By Gerald Tay (guest contributor)
Tempted to buy a property due to the falling prices? Think again. In this article I will go through five reasons why I think it’s still a terrible time to buy Singapore property.
1. Property prices are still high for mass market homes
Since Q1 2009, prices in the Core Central Region (CCR) have risen 30 percent, 42 percent in the Rest of Central Region (RCR), and 60 percent in the Outside Central Region (OCR).
Since the peak in Q3 2013, prices of mass market homes have fallen a measly 5.5 percent. Properties in the OCR are still overpriced. Mass-market home prices haven’t dropped as much as those for luxury housing. Rental incomes are falling and vacancy rates are rising. A huge oversupply is looming on the horizon.
The bottom is still far from sight even though vested players claim it will happen in the next three to six months. While new home sales have dropped significantly, prices have stayed relatively high due to developers’ holding power.
There is still room for a further decline of property prices in the OCR.Investment opportunities will arise over the next couple of years when prices decline further.
My last purchase of a Singapore residential property was in mid-2012 before the policies came in. I won’t be re-entering the Singapore residential market until I see a further decline in prices. Prices need to drop by about 20 to 30 percent to make residential investments attractive again, not a measly 5.5 percent!
2. Interest rates are low but rising
Property prices rose as interest rates fell, and property prices will fall if interest rates rise with a weakened economy.
The way to win the game is to have cash on hand to buy at a low price when others cannot borrow very much because of high interest rates and the constraint of the debt servicing ratio. Then you get a low price, and you get capital appreciation caused by future interest rate declines. To buy an expensive property or believe in the fallacy of “affordable” property at a time of low (and rising) interest rates and high prices is a mistake.
It is far better to pay a low price with high interest rates than a high price with low interest rates, even if the mortgage payment is the same either way.
3. Government property curbs are here to stay
Many are betting on a removal of the cooling measures. I don’t see the government removing property curbs for the next two years. With interest rates on the way up, there will be pressure. The policy is working, there is no reason whatsoever for the government to relax it.
When stringent property curbs are here to stay, this only means property prices are still high.
4. Buyers are still biting the marketers’ bait
The problem with buyers who act like lemmings is that they become obvious targets for clever marketers. In today’s property market, how does a seller of real estate use human weaknesses to sell and profit?
Here’s a case study from the latest property launch near Seletar:
The Solution – Sell, market and lure “desperate” buyers with under $1,000 per-square-foot on average condominium units to beat the TDSR (Total Debt Servicing Ratio).
The Outcome – 1,110 lemmings rushed to snap up smaller units with empty cheques and balloting. 78% of project was sold within a weekend.
The Profits – 1,400 small unit apartments are cramped into every space possible.
This new successful sales model will soon be copied by other developers. As long as foolish buyers keep biting, sellers will continue to sell to them. Watching others get rich during boom times while you don’t is terrible enough. Lemmings want it now and that’s why they are prime targets today.
5. We may have an even greater financial crisis coming
Look for falling oil prices and another scare in China to spook the speculators, followed by a series of growing defaults like in 2008, but worse. They’re also kidding themselves if they think they can stop everybody from selling their stocks (look at China).
And expect the global crash that follows to be even more brutal thanks to all the financial manipulation in the system.But even beyond a global stock bubble, housing bubble, fracking bubble, and pension problems, there are signs of economic destruction across the world.
The air has been let out of China’s stock market. Commodity prices are down across the board to the detriment of the world’s emerging markets.Long-term interest rates are rising despite global efforts to suppress them with continued stimulus.Europe is enlarging the black hole of Greece by funnelling even more money into it.The euro zone as a whole has an unemployment rate over 10%.Japan is caught in a downward demographic spiral.
Chaos is erupting. And despite efforts to stop the global economic system from melting down, free market forces are finally starting to show governments and central banks who’s in charge. That’s the simple, bitter truth of it.
Inaction for now is the best action for savvy buyers and investors.Many are tuned in to the devastating market forces ahead. Those who are listening will be the best prepared. Those who have been patiently waiting on the side-lines and preparing themselves to take advantage of the coming crisis will be best rewarded.
For the buyers of today, I wish them luck.
By guest contributor Gerald Tay, who is the founder and coach at CREI Academy Group Pte Ltd, an organization dedicated to empowering retail property investors with smarter investing philosophy and strategies. He is a full-time investor with over 13 years of solid experience in building his wealth through Property Investment and is financially wealthy today.Posted courtesy of www.Propwise.sg, a Singapore property blog dedicated to helping you understand the real estate market and make better decisions. Click here to get your free Property Beginner’s and Buyer’s Guide.
Related Articles
https://sg.news.yahoo.com/5-reasons-why-still-terrible-time-buy-singapore-155117291.html?linkId=15886594
By Gerald Tay (guest contributor)
Tempted to buy a property due to the falling prices? Think again. In this article I will go through five reasons why I think it’s still a terrible time to buy Singapore property.
1. Property prices are still high for mass market homes
Since Q1 2009, prices in the Core Central Region (CCR) have risen 30 percent, 42 percent in the Rest of Central Region (RCR), and 60 percent in the Outside Central Region (OCR).
Since the peak in Q3 2013, prices of mass market homes have fallen a measly 5.5 percent. Properties in the OCR are still overpriced. Mass-market home prices haven’t dropped as much as those for luxury housing. Rental incomes are falling and vacancy rates are rising. A huge oversupply is looming on the horizon.
The bottom is still far from sight even though vested players claim it will happen in the next three to six months. While new home sales have dropped significantly, prices have stayed relatively high due to developers’ holding power.
There is still room for a further decline of property prices in the OCR.Investment opportunities will arise over the next couple of years when prices decline further.
My last purchase of a Singapore residential property was in mid-2012 before the policies came in. I won’t be re-entering the Singapore residential market until I see a further decline in prices. Prices need to drop by about 20 to 30 percent to make residential investments attractive again, not a measly 5.5 percent!
2. Interest rates are low but rising
Property prices rose as interest rates fell, and property prices will fall if interest rates rise with a weakened economy.
The way to win the game is to have cash on hand to buy at a low price when others cannot borrow very much because of high interest rates and the constraint of the debt servicing ratio. Then you get a low price, and you get capital appreciation caused by future interest rate declines. To buy an expensive property or believe in the fallacy of “affordable” property at a time of low (and rising) interest rates and high prices is a mistake.
It is far better to pay a low price with high interest rates than a high price with low interest rates, even if the mortgage payment is the same either way.
3. Government property curbs are here to stay
Many are betting on a removal of the cooling measures. I don’t see the government removing property curbs for the next two years. With interest rates on the way up, there will be pressure. The policy is working, there is no reason whatsoever for the government to relax it.
When stringent property curbs are here to stay, this only means property prices are still high.
4. Buyers are still biting the marketers’ bait
The problem with buyers who act like lemmings is that they become obvious targets for clever marketers. In today’s property market, how does a seller of real estate use human weaknesses to sell and profit?
Here’s a case study from the latest property launch near Seletar:
The Solution – Sell, market and lure “desperate” buyers with under $1,000 per-square-foot on average condominium units to beat the TDSR (Total Debt Servicing Ratio).
The Outcome – 1,110 lemmings rushed to snap up smaller units with empty cheques and balloting. 78% of project was sold within a weekend.
The Profits – 1,400 small unit apartments are cramped into every space possible.
This new successful sales model will soon be copied by other developers. As long as foolish buyers keep biting, sellers will continue to sell to them. Watching others get rich during boom times while you don’t is terrible enough. Lemmings want it now and that’s why they are prime targets today.
5. We may have an even greater financial crisis coming
Look for falling oil prices and another scare in China to spook the speculators, followed by a series of growing defaults like in 2008, but worse. They’re also kidding themselves if they think they can stop everybody from selling their stocks (look at China).
And expect the global crash that follows to be even more brutal thanks to all the financial manipulation in the system.But even beyond a global stock bubble, housing bubble, fracking bubble, and pension problems, there are signs of economic destruction across the world.
The air has been let out of China’s stock market. Commodity prices are down across the board to the detriment of the world’s emerging markets.Long-term interest rates are rising despite global efforts to suppress them with continued stimulus.Europe is enlarging the black hole of Greece by funnelling even more money into it.The euro zone as a whole has an unemployment rate over 10%.Japan is caught in a downward demographic spiral.
Chaos is erupting. And despite efforts to stop the global economic system from melting down, free market forces are finally starting to show governments and central banks who’s in charge. That’s the simple, bitter truth of it.
Inaction for now is the best action for savvy buyers and investors.Many are tuned in to the devastating market forces ahead. Those who are listening will be the best prepared. Those who have been patiently waiting on the side-lines and preparing themselves to take advantage of the coming crisis will be best rewarded.
For the buyers of today, I wish them luck.
By guest contributor Gerald Tay, who is the founder and coach at CREI Academy Group Pte Ltd, an organization dedicated to empowering retail property investors with smarter investing philosophy and strategies. He is a full-time investor with over 13 years of solid experience in building his wealth through Property Investment and is financially wealthy today.Posted courtesy of www.Propwise.sg, a Singapore property blog dedicated to helping you understand the real estate market and make better decisions. Click here to get your free Property Beginner’s and Buyer’s Guide.
Related Articles
https://sg.news.yahoo.com/5-reasons-why-still-terrible-time-buy-singapore-155117291.html?linkId=15886594
Yes Sir, I will wait. Let me know when it is safe to buy.
Yes Sir, I will wait. Let me know when it is safe to buy.
You got to wait long long
Great Singapore Sales should be coming in 2020 or thereafter, particularly in OCR.............
Yes Sir, I will wait. Let me know when it is safe to buy.
You got to wait long long
Did the author advise to buy during 2009-2011 crises?
What will you do if you have money in the Bank and the Bank is printing more money, what happen to your money.
In Singapore, the Bank printing of money is well control by MAS by TDSR.
You need the growth so they start to print money call Bond.
Now the Bond (money printing) is going to depreciate your money in the Bank, what will you do.
Got money in the Bank and not using it will only make the money buy less.
2006 - 2 Bedroom @ Southbank SGD 535,000.
Do you think with all the money printing, it will cost SGD 535,000 again.
I advise forumers here to buy during early 2009.............. I bought a few myself......... :devilish:
Now is NOT the time to buy....... For those over-leveraged, better SELL...............
Did the author advise to buy during 2009-2011 crises?
Best time to buy for own stay, and below valuation.
If lucky enuff can get 100-125k cheaper from 2013 peak.
Great Singapore Sales should be coming in 2020 or thereafter, particularly in OCR.............
So that is to say rent until 2020 then buy. If it is accurate we still need to deduct rental expenses. If not double blow.
I see only one chance when what he said will be true:
"We may have an even greater financial crisis coming". Please note the word "may",
we can say that anytime.
So that is to say rent until 2020 then buy. If it is accurate we still need to deduct rental expenses. If not double blow.
We can always wait till 2020 then do accounting with Teddybear. He will bear all your losses (if any) but if you gain, he won't charge a single cent. So cool right?
Great Singapore Sales should be coming in 2020 or thereafter, particularly in OCR.............
Beside using time why not we use PSF, how much then we can buy? any kind souls or experts can advise?
NorthernStar
28-07-15, 15:13
IMO, If buy for own stay, it is time to see see look look to get the one u would fall in love.. For investment, i am waiting till mid next year..
IMO, If buy for own stay, it is time to see see look look to get the one u would fall in love.. For investment, i am waiting till mid next year..
The one I like is above $1300PSF, the one can compromise is $900plus PSF. Should buy or wait?
Great Singapore Sales should be coming in 2020 or thereafter, particularly in OCR.............
yeah right. oh forgot according to you any thing LH99 are shit so no need even to wait till 2020 lah.. Bull shit. lah.. Talk is so cheap for Prata flipper.
Beside using time why not we use PSF, how much then we can buy? any kind souls or experts can advise?
Very much is location - dependent and what you aim to buy for. PSF wise also dependent on size and other offerings. Not quite possible to just park any psf figure.
Very much is location - dependent and what you aim to buy for. PSF wise also dependent on size and other offerings. Not quite possible to just park any psf figure.
Its always location location location. and holding power in time of over supply.
Caspian successful launch in 2009 of 580psf average was the start of a massive price uptrend. Will we get 580psf again for OCR condos in 2019?
Caspian successful launch in 2009 of 580psf average was the start of a massive price uptrend. Will we get 580psf again for OCR condos in 2019?
There is at least 1 person in this forum who can explain until that can happen.
That said, supposing the current price for Caspian is 1.1kpsf, it is not unfathomable to drop to 1kpsf. But i believe that is about it.
People saying drop to precise 2009 levels are either out of touch, delusional, or trying to mislead the public in a perfectly legal and legitimate way.
Didn't the minister said property prices should drop to close to 2009 low level to be affordable???? :devilish:
There is at least 1 person in this forum who can explain until that can happen.
That said, supposing the current price for Caspian is 1.1kpsf, it is not unfathomable to drop to 1kpsf. But i believe that is about it.
People saying drop to precise 2009 levels are either out of touch, delusional, or trying to mislead the public in a perfectly legal and legitimate way.
Didn't the minister said property prices should drop to close to 2009 low level to be affordable???? :devilish:
Which minister I make sure I call all I know to vote for him, or you are misleading , KBW concern public housing only
Ok, I found the information to back up what I said............ You can see the news below...
Oh, by the way, minority said $160k per year income is HIGH-INCOME, how come the Minister regards those earning $5k a month (or $60k per year) income as LOW-INCOME and faces financial difficulty in getting housing and hence he is helping them??? So, minority must be LYING since the Minister can't be lying right!
Taking the 4x annual income as a yard-stick, a $160k per year earners cannot even afford a 3-rm EC of decent size which costs much more $640k !!!
So, how can $160k per year income be HIGH-INCOME?!
So, the minister helped us to prove that minority lied again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Given that the "VERY HIGH"-income heartlanders' household income averages about $150k per year, they can only afford $150k x4 = $600k properties or $500 psf for a 1200 sqft 3-rm condo! :scared-3:
So, expect OCR 99-years leasehold private condos to drop to about $500 psf before property cooling measures will be removed???? :heart-borken:
New HDB flats to become cheaper (http://news.asiaone.com/print/News/Latest%2BNews/Singapore/Story/A1Story20130310-407509.html)
Minister Khaw vows to make them nearly 30 per cent cheaper to keep homes affordable. -ST
Rachel Chang
Mon, Mar 11, 2013
The Straits Times
SINGAPORE- The prices of new flats will become almost 30 per cent cheaper to keep the Singapore dream of home ownership alive, National Development Minister Khaw Boon Wan pledged Friday.
The ambitious goal makes clear the Government's commitment to "restoring and maintaining" the affordability of flats for first-time home buyers, he told Parliament.
Hinting at a fundamental redesign of public housing, Mr Khaw said that he wants new flat prices in non-mature estates at around "four years of salary" - what they were before the property bull run of the last six years began.
That is, new homes in non-mature estates will be priced at four times the annual median income of flat applicants.
This would mean a sharp drop from current prices, which are about 5.5 years of salary.
Referring to young first-timers, the minister declared that "their Singapore dream of owning their own homes, like their parents', is safe".
He already broke with HDB convention in 2011 by delinking Build-to-Order (BTO) prices from the rising resale market when he took over the housing portfolio.
This meant that while the resale market has risen 12.5 per cent since, prices of new flats launched have stayed stable. Since 2007, when the current property upswing began, the resale price index has spiked 95.8 per cent.
On Friday, Mr Khaw made clear that he would be going much further than price stabilisation.
Bringing down BTO prices in non-mature estates will be partly through market cooling measures, and "partly by seeing if an alternative housing option can be designed", he said.
He did not elaborate, but analysts said the remark portended major policy changes - perhaps shorter flat leases or different classes of new flats.
In a budget debate speech chock-full of policy announcements, Mr Khaw answered calls from MPs to meet the housing needs of groups that have been on the sidelines in the first half of his term. He had something for everyone, from singles and divorcees to second-timers and young couples waiting for their new flats to be built.
Fulfilling a promise Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong made in last year's National Day Rally, he announced that singles aged 35 years old and above will be able to buy new two-room flats from July.
The first batch will likely be in Sengkang, but only those earning $5,000 and less a month will be eligible, he said, as they face the most financial difficulty in getting housing.
Didn't the minister said property prices should drop to close to 2009 low level to be affordable???? :devilish:
There is at least 1 person in this forum who can explain until that can happen.
That said, supposing the current price for Caspian is 1.1kpsf, it is not unfathomable to drop to 1kpsf. But i believe that is about it.
People saying drop to precise 2009 levels are either out of touch, delusional, or trying to mislead the public in a perfectly legal and legitimate way.
What, you mean HDB flats affordability has different yard-stick from private property prices??? If so, why?????
Which minister I make sure I call all I know to vote for him, or you are misleading , KBW concern public housing only
proud owner
28-07-15, 21:15
There is at least 1 person in this forum who can explain until that can happen.
That said, supposing the current price for Caspian is 1.1kpsf, it is not unfathomable to drop to 1kpsf. But i believe that is about it.
People saying drop to precise 2009 levels are either out of touch, delusional, or trying to mislead the public in a perfectly legal and legitimate way.
Even if it would drop to 580 psf (2009 price)...knowing Singaporeans, when it reaches 800 psf, 1st wave of buyers will jump in, then 700 2nd wave, etc..
Chances are it will never reach 580 psf ...
Just like COE, once we see 1 or 2 mths of fall, all jump in to buy car ....
will it ever reach $50 ?
Ok, I found the information to back up what I said............ You can see the news below...
Oh, by the way, minority said $160k per year income is HIGH-INCOME, how come the Minister regards those earning $5k a month (or $60k per year) income as LOW-INCOME and faces financial difficulty in getting housing and hence he is helping them??? So, minority must be LYING since the Minister can't be lying right!
Taking the 4x annual income as a yard-stick, a $160k per year earners cannot even afford a 3-rm EC of decent size which costs much more $640k !!!
So, how can $160k per year income be HIGH-INCOME?!
So, the minister helped us to prove that minority lied again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Given that the "VERY HIGH"-income heartlanders' household income averages about $150k per year, they can only afford $150k x4 = $600k properties or $500 psf for a 1200 sqft 3-rm condo! :scared-3:
So, expect OCR 99-years leasehold private condos to drop to about $500 psf before property cooling measures will be removed???? :heart-borken:
New HDB flats to become cheaper (http://news.asiaone.com/print/News/Latest%2BNews/Singapore/Story/A1Story20130310-407509.html)
Minister Khaw vows to make them nearly 30 per cent cheaper to keep homes affordable. -ST
Rachel Chang
Mon, Mar 11, 2013
The Straits Times
SINGAPORE- The prices of new flats will become almost 30 per cent cheaper to keep the Singapore dream of home ownership alive, National Development Minister Khaw Boon Wan pledged Friday.
The ambitious goal makes clear the Government's commitment to "restoring and maintaining" the affordability of flats for first-time home buyers, he told Parliament.
Hinting at a fundamental redesign of public housing, Mr Khaw said that he wants new flat prices in non-mature estates at around "four years of salary" - what they were before the property bull run of the last six years began.
That is, new homes in non-mature estates will be priced at four times the annual median income of flat applicants.
This would mean a sharp drop from current prices, which are about 5.5 years of salary.
Referring to young first-timers, the minister declared that "their Singapore dream of owning their own homes, like their parents', is safe".
He already broke with HDB convention in 2011 by delinking Build-to-Order (BTO) prices from the rising resale market when he took over the housing portfolio.
This meant that while the resale market has risen 12.5 per cent since, prices of new flats launched have stayed stable. Since 2007, when the current property upswing began, the resale price index has spiked 95.8 per cent.
On Friday, Mr Khaw made clear that he would be going much further than price stabilisation.
Bringing down BTO prices in non-mature estates will be partly through market cooling measures, and "partly by seeing if an alternative housing option can be designed", he said.
He did not elaborate, but analysts said the remark portended major policy changes - perhaps shorter flat leases or different classes of new flats.
In a budget debate speech chock-full of policy announcements, Mr Khaw answered calls from MPs to meet the housing needs of groups that have been on the sidelines in the first half of his term. He had something for everyone, from singles and divorcees to second-timers and young couples waiting for their new flats to be built.
Fulfilling a promise Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong made in last year's National Day Rally, he announced that singles aged 35 years old and above will be able to buy new two-room flats from July.
The first batch will likely be in Sengkang, but only those earning $5,000 and less a month will be eligible, he said, as they face the most financial difficulty in getting housing.
LET ME CALL YOUR BULLSHIT! AS USUAL SELECTIVE QUOTING AND MIS QUOTING!!! PASSAGE IS TALKING ABOUT BTO!! ANYWAY SINCE YOU SAY EVERY MIDDLE CLASS PERSON EARN 160K RIGHT!! OK LETS GO WITH YOUR BULL SHIT THEN!!! SO A COUPLE IS 320K!!! SO BASE ON YOUR BULL SHIT MISS QUOTE TRYING TO APPLY 4.4yrs reference meant for HDB to EC... a COUPLE OF MIDDLE CLASS JUST NEED 3 YRS TO PAY FOR EC!!! SO BASE ON THAT CRAP LIES OF YOURS!!! OUR HOUSING IS REALLY CHEAP FOR THE 160K EARNERS!!! AND THESE MIDDLE CLASS JUST NEED 3YRS TO PAY FOR A EC!!!!! WAH!!! SO SONG!!!!
DONT LIE PLS SHOW U THE QUOTE 5K IS CLASSIFIED AS LOW INCOME BY MP.. SHOW US!! I CHALLENGE U! AS USUAL IS LIES AND BULL!!!
YOU REALLY HAVE A LOT OF SHIT!!!! UR DADDY NEVER GIVE U ANY BROKE BACK RIDES TODAY????
minority,
You cannot read? Ok ok, I enlarged the fonts size for you.....
If $5k per month income is NOT low-income, why the Minister need to help them in buying their property????
And you still refuse to answer the question about Amos Yee???? You got things to hide about Amos Yee's case???? :confused:
LET ME CALL YOUR BULLSHIT! AS USUAL SELECTIVE QUOTING AND MIS QUOTING!!! PASSAGE IS TALKING ABOUT BTO!! ANYWAY SINCE YOU SAY EVERY MIDDLE CLASS PERSON EARN 160K RIGHT!! OK LETS GO WITH YOUR BULL SHIT THEN!!! SO A COUPLE IS 320K!!! SO BASE ON YOUR BULL SHIT MISS QUOTE TRYING TO APPLY 4.4yrs reference meant for HDB to EC... a COUPLE OF MIDDLE CLASS JUST NEED 3 YRS TO PAY FOR EC!!! SO BASE ON THAT CRAP LIES OF YOURS!!! OUR HOUSING IS REALLY CHEAP FOR THE 160K EARNERS!!! AND THESE MIDDLE CLASS JUST NEED 3YRS TO PAY FOR A EC!!!!! WAH!!! SO SONG!!!!
DONT LIE PLS SHOW U THE QUOTE 5K IS CLASSIFIED AS LOW INCOME BY MP.. SHOW US!! I CHALLENGE U! AS USUAL IS LIES AND BULL!!!
YOU REALLY HAVE A LOT OF SHIT!!!! UR DADDY NEVER GIVE U ANY BROKE BACK RIDES TODAY????
Ok, I found the information to back up what I said............ You can see the news below...
Oh, by the way, minority said $160k per year income is HIGH-INCOME, how come the Minister regards those earning $5k a month (or $60k per year) income as LOW-INCOME and faces financial difficulty in getting housing and hence he is helping them??? So, minority must be LYING since the Minister can't be lying right!
Taking the 4x annual income as a yard-stick, a $160k per year earners cannot even afford a 3-rm EC of decent size which costs much more $640k !!!
So, how can $160k per year income be HIGH-INCOME?!
So, the minister helped us to prove that minority lied again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Given that the "VERY HIGH"-income heartlanders' household income averages about $150k per year, they can only afford $150k x4 = $600k properties or $500 psf for a 1200 sqft 3-rm condo! :scared-3:
So, expect OCR 99-years leasehold private condos to drop to about $500 psf before property cooling measures will be removed???? :heart-borken:
New HDB flats to become cheaper (http://news.asiaone.com/print/News/Latest%2BNews/Singapore/Story/A1Story20130310-407509.html)
Minister Khaw vows to make them nearly 30 per cent cheaper to keep homes affordable. -ST
Rachel Chang
Mon, Mar 11, 2013
The Straits Times
SINGAPORE- The prices of new flats will become almost 30 per cent cheaper to keep the Singapore dream of home ownership alive, National Development Minister Khaw Boon Wan pledged Friday.
The ambitious goal makes clear the Government's commitment to "restoring and maintaining" the affordability of flats for first-time home buyers, he told Parliament.
Hinting at a fundamental redesign of public housing, Mr Khaw said that he wants new flat prices in non-mature estates at around "four years of salary" - what they were before the property bull run of the last six years began.
That is, new homes in non-mature estates will be priced at four times the annual median income of flat applicants.
This would mean a sharp drop from current prices, which are about 5.5 years of salary.
Referring to young first-timers, the minister declared that "their Singapore dream of owning their own homes, like their parents', is safe".
He already broke with HDB convention in 2011 by delinking Build-to-Order (BTO) prices from the rising resale market when he took over the housing portfolio.
This meant that while the resale market has risen 12.5 per cent since, prices of new flats launched have stayed stable. Since 2007, when the current property upswing began, the resale price index has spiked 95.8 per cent.
On Friday, Mr Khaw made clear that he would be going much further than price stabilisation.
Bringing down BTO prices in non-mature estates will be partly through market cooling measures, and "partly by seeing if an alternative housing option can be designed", he said.
He did not elaborate, but analysts said the remark portended major policy changes - perhaps shorter flat leases or different classes of new flats.
In a budget debate speech chock-full of policy announcements, Mr Khaw answered calls from MPs to meet the housing needs of groups that have been on the sidelines in the first half of his term. He had something for everyone, from singles and divorcees to second-timers and young couples waiting for their new flats to be built.
Fulfilling a promise Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong made in last year's National Day Rally, he announced that singles aged 35 years old and above will be able to buy new two-room flats from July.
The first batch will likely be in Sengkang, but only those earning $5,000 and less a month will be eligible, he said, as they face the most financial difficulty in getting housing.
Didn't the minister said property prices should drop to close to 2009 low level to be affordable???? :devilish:
That's why you must read my message closely. Dropping to 2009 levels (generally) is way different from dropping to 2009 levels (precisely).
As pointed by Minority, the 60% spike was pointed as a "problem" because the corresponding income backing this rise was not a 60% rise in income.
If you study the household income changes from 2009 to 2014, you will realise that household income growth is roughly 38%. Assuming background inflation of about 2%, income has about risen 50% in total relative to home prices, which has dropped maybe 6-7%.
http://www.singstat.gov.sg/docs/default-source/default-document-library/publications/publications_and_papers/household_income_and_expenditure/pp-s21.pdf
My estimation is a drop of about 5% to reach equilibrium, and a max of 15% to undershoot the 2009 value for safety buffer, but this can be confounded with global economy or local situation so depending on the political climate, the response can be adjusted accordingly. An ideal situation would be to slowly calibrate the responses upon reaching equilibrium.
minority,
You cannot read? Ok ok, I enlarged the fonts size for you.....
If $5k per month income is NOT low-income, why the Minister need to help them in buying their property????
And you still refuse to answer the question about Amos Yee???? You got things to hide about Amos Yee's case???? :confused:
wow!! MIS QUOTE AGAIN??? taking a policy to help singles who cannot form a family nueclues to buy HDB 2 bed room is being misquoted and twisted buy liars like u??? let me help u bold it all in case u cannot read or comphren?
a single earning $5K X 12 = 60K can easily afford a 4 bed room with the 4 yrs multipler of 240K but becoz he is a single he cannot buy directly HDB! basicaly its to address those people needs who are single!! SO WHAT LOW INCOME? and the policy the catch phrase Single 35 <5000 income. ok . So dont talk cock.
BTW current CDL EC have 640K ok so dont talk cock 640K income in 4yrs cannot afford EC!!!! WAT bullshit! get ur farting facts right!
"
Fulfilling a promise Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong made in last year's National Day Rally, he announced that singles aged 35 years old and above will be able to buy new two-room flats from July.
The first batch will likely be in Sengkang, but only those earning $5,000 and less a month will be eligible, he said, as they face the most financial difficulty in getting housing"
That's why you must read my message closely. Dropping to 2009 levels (generally) is way different from dropping to 2009 levels (precisely).
As pointed by Minority, the 60% spike was pointed as a "problem" because the corresponding income backing this rise was not a 60% rise in income.
If you study the household income changes from 2009 to 2014, you will realise that household income growth is roughly 38%. Assuming background inflation of about 2%, income has about risen 50% in total relative to home prices, which has dropped maybe 6-7%.
http://www.singstat.gov.sg/docs/default-source/default-document-library/publications/publications_and_papers/household_income_and_expenditure/pp-s21.pdf
My estimation is a drop of about 5% to reach equilibrium, and a max of 15% to undershoot the 2009 value for safety buffer, but this can be confounded with global economy or local situation so depending on the political climate, the response can be adjusted accordingly. An ideal situation would be to slowly calibrate the responses upon reaching equilibrium.
AMOS WHO IS THAT? AMOS WHO AGIAN?? I ATE SOME FAMOUS AMOS COOKIES JUST NOW AND SHITTED IT OUT.. u WANT THAT SHIT?
That's why you must read my message closely. Dropping to 2009 levels (generally) is way different from dropping to 2009 levels (precisely).
As pointed by Minority, the 60% spike was pointed as a "problem" because the corresponding income backing this rise was not a 60% rise in income.
If you study the household income changes from 2009 to 2014, you will realise that household income growth is roughly 38%. Assuming background inflation of about 2%, income has about risen 50% in total relative to home prices, which has dropped maybe 6-7%.
http://www.singstat.gov.sg/docs/default-source/default-document-library/publications/publications_and_papers/household_income_and_expenditure/pp-s21.pdf
My estimation is a drop of about 5% to reach equilibrium, and a max of 15% to undershoot the 2009 value for safety buffer, but this can be confounded with global economy or local situation so depending on the political climate, the response can be adjusted accordingly. An ideal situation would be to slowly calibrate the responses upon reaching equilibrium.
I think you miss something very important, cheap money.
https://scontent-cdg2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/11002647_10204592752311687_9195757010213831057_n.jpg?oh=c8ebc3b16f6968fb1650aeb893b24e7f&oe=564B4CA4
http://sbr.com.sg/sites/default/files/news/May18Chart.PNG
Household debt vs M3.
I think you miss something very important, cheap money.
https://scontent-cdg2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/11002647_10204592752311687_9195757010213831057_n.jpg?oh=c8ebc3b16f6968fb1650aeb893b24e7f&oe=564B4CA4
I think you miss something very important, cheap money.
https://scontent-cdg2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/11002647_10204592752311687_9195757010213831057_n.jpg?oh=c8ebc3b16f6968fb1650aeb893b24e7f&oe=564B4CA4
I see policy intent curbing the rise of cheap money since TDSR implementation, although the effects are starting to be lost.
Anyway regardless of cheap money, the discussion is on the level to which price should drop to before the intent is met. And statistically, we are still experiencing the drop.
So with all the charts, theories and debates, what then are the correct PSF to buy?
e.g.
OCR near mrt $1000 PSF
RCR near mrt $1300 PSF
CCR near mrt $1500PSF
Please advise
Buy when you can afford, not when the price is low or high.
If you pass TDSR than go ahead and buy.
Buy what depend on buy for investment or shelf stay.
Money in the Bank can only let you buy less, the longer you put in the Bank.
Don't believe put a million in the Bank and see what you can buy 10 years later.
Buy when you can afford, not when the price is low or high.
If you pass TDSR than go ahead and buy.
Buy what depend on buy for investment or shelf stay.
Money in the Bank can only let you buy less, the longer you put in the Bank.
Don't believe put a million in the Bank and see what you can buy 10 years later.
Arcachon thank you for your advice, what I meant is the right price to buy rather than affordability. e.g if a person can buy @1300
should he wait for the price to drop or just buy it now?
I don't have time to check the documents and statistics, but since you have read it, I pose my questions to you:
- You say from 2009 to 2014, household income grows roughly 38%, but I seriously doubt it, unless you are talking about the top-tier income earners. So, this is for which percentile of income?
- You make another mistake about inflation here too. Inflation erodes your real affordability, so if inflation is 2% p.a. or 10% for past 5 years (which is not true because the "real" inflation (not "measured" inflation) is probably >25% because of super high inflation from 2009-2014), then your real income drop by corresponding amount. Anyway, you can't just add inflation % into income growth %.....
So in summary, your conclusion is wrong..... :wink-new:
That's why you must read my message closely. Dropping to 2009 levels (generally) is way different from dropping to 2009 levels (precisely).
As pointed by Minority, the 60% spike was pointed as a "problem" because the corresponding income backing this rise was not a 60% rise in income.
If you study the household income changes from 2009 to 2014, you will realise that household income growth is roughly 38%. Assuming background inflation of about 2%, income has about risen 50% in total relative to home prices, which has dropped maybe 6-7%.
http://www.singstat.gov.sg/docs/default-source/default-document-library/publications/publications_and_papers/household_income_and_expenditure/pp-s21.pdf
My estimation is a drop of about 5% to reach equilibrium, and a max of 15% to undershoot the 2009 value for safety buffer, but this can be confounded with global economy or local situation so depending on the political climate, the response can be adjusted accordingly. An ideal situation would be to slowly calibrate the responses upon reaching equilibrium.
It's ok. People who take time to read will understand exactly my point. You would probably still dismiss it even if you fully understood.
I don't have time to check the documents and statistics, but since you have read it, I pose my questions to you:
- You say from 2009 to 2014, household income grows roughly 38%, but I seriously doubt it, unless you are talking about the top-tier income earners. So, this is for which percentile of income?
- You make another mistake about inflation here too. Inflation erodes your real affordability, so if inflation is 2% p.a. or 10% for past 5 years (which is not true because the "real" inflation (not "measured" inflation) is probably >25% because of super high inflation from 2009-2014), then your real income drop by corresponding amount. Anyway, you can't just add inflation % into income growth %.....
So in summary, your conclusion is wrong..... :wink-new:
So with all the charts, theories and debates, what then are the correct PSF to buy?
e.g.
OCR near mrt $1000 PSF
RCR near mrt $1300 PSF
CCR near mrt $1500PSF
Please advise
Price is what u pay pay. Value is what u get.
Why focus on mrt only? Why not other attributes ?
For self stay or investment?
One man's meat is the others poison.
OOT a bit a few of my of colleagues took the plunge and brought properties already. Anyone noticed the same around you?
It's ok. People who take time to read will understand exactly my point. You would probably still dismiss it even if you fully understood.
Actually I tend to focus on posts by Kelonguni, minority and Arcachon in this thread since their reasoning makes more sense to me. No offence but the ones by Teddybear always revolve around a few themes only...
Price is what u pay pay. Value is what u get.
Why focus on mrt only? Why not other attributes ?
For self stay or investment?
One man's meat is the others poison.
OOT a bit a few of my of colleagues took the plunge and brought properties already. Anyone noticed the same around you?
Getting a bit confused, let get some example, what is consider good price for HPR or botanique if one can afford, should he buy now or
wait for right price? if for own stay buy now and for investment wait further till they drop to RIGHT PSF? if it never drop forget about it.
Getting a bit confused, let get some example, what is consider good price for HPR or botanique if one can afford, should he buy now or
wait for right price? if for own stay buy now and for investment wait further till they drop to RIGHT PSF? if it never drop forget about it.
If target is new property, then its very very challenging to get good price. Wanna get good price? Suggest put in effort and hunt for a right one in the resale market.
If you have a home and not renting wait, if renting and age is catching up act soon before too late.
Know a neighbor with 4 kids still schooling, brought condo and retire.
Price is what u pay pay. Value is what u get.
Why focus on mrt only? Why not other attributes ?
For self stay or investment?
One man's meat is the others poison.
OOT a bit a few of my of colleagues took the plunge and brought properties already. Anyone noticed the same around you?
Yes, noticed the same trend around me as well. And if you examine the profiles of who these colleagues are (relative to others in your organisation or the general public), it is possible to derive another insight.
If you have a home and not renting wait, if renting and age is catching up act soon before too late.
Know a neighbor with 4 kids still schooling, brought condo and retire.
Thank you for your advice, very simple and straight forward advice. no beating around brushes.
We are at a market transition pt currently. Where the Cheap $$ and low interest rates re un winding. Look at China over the last yr till now. Its unwind . All the Assets inflation cause by cheap money is unwinding as the QE ends. So the question is when to enter the market. Likely until the interest rates are officially increase post Sept all eyes are on where the int will go. We are all seeing the commodity being wacked, economy heavy on commodity at taking a beating & assets that were inflated by cheap money will be taking a hit too. So in sort it unless there is a good deal it might be good to take a pause till after end of the year to see where the market is going.
Singapore land is limited and supply of housing have been ramp up in the public housing as well as the private sectors. So buying a place for investment one must ask one self how long is the holding period. Can I get better yield on cash and how liquid is my investment. ? Coz buying a physical assets is not so liquid and in face of rising interest rates the yield might be eroded. Unless there are some price correction.
From the building cost perspective new launches will have underline cost to content with. Material cost , labour cost and land cost. which will provide a support to the new launch prices.
As property are mid to long term investment. Some social risk that affect the country in the next 20 yrs which indirectly have impact to pricing. Aging population , limits in the economy if there is a shift is the social habits and there are not enough young blood in the population to spur the economy. The vibrancy of the economy and country will determine how Singapore will develop and that indirectly determine the value of the assets the people hold.
So those who think that the assets should be worth less so they can buy more must why the assets have suddenly become less worth? is it due to external turmoil ? or basically the economy and vibrance of the country have be come less? I think it would be healthy if singapore continue to lead the ASEAN PACK. if we are more expensive than the other folks because we have a more vibrant economy then its a good thing. Coz it means people want to come to Singapore and Singapore benefits from it.
In Short the Right time is when ones feel comfortable with the investment and truly understand the risk and are comfortable with the risk. It is important have the holding power to hold through the ups and downs. and in all property its location location location and access to tenant pool near by. Yield verses interest rates.
Getting a bit confused, let get some example, what is consider good price for HPR or botanique if one can afford, should he buy now or
wait for right price? if for own stay buy now and for investment wait further till they drop to RIGHT PSF? if it never drop forget about it.
What is a right price for others may not be a right price for you. We all have our own budget. Buy when you feel the price is right for you. And us. Agree that if you what a really good price look only at resale and bargain very hard.
Then you need to consider your loan period and your estimated income in the coming years. like what Arachon said, buy what you can afford.
Buying a property especially for own stay isn't any different from other personal purchases. Except that the $ in question is a lot higher.
Yes, noticed the same trend around me as well. And if you examine the profiles of who these colleagues are (relative to others in your organisation or the general public), it is possible to derive another insight.
So what are the profiles of your colleagues like?
If target is new property, then its very very challenging to get good price. Wanna get good price? Suggest put in effort and hunt for a right one in the resale market.
Resale Prop if can get a good price has it value. lock in of int right now. and straight can lease out. but with current oversupply the rental yield can get compressed to the 3% or less region. and with interest rates for fix 2yr hovering at 2%. the delta of yield and risk factor have to be considered. one advantage is Property the leverage. the interest for leverage is still consider low i.e. 2% currently. verses other form of investment. i.e. margin trading , personal loans etc. but once int move up then all these will be negated.
Yes, noticed the same trend around me as well. And if you examine the profiles of who these colleagues are (relative to others in your organisation or the general public), it is possible to derive another insight.
I have know of a lot of people who want to buy! all say waiting for a big crash. I have a friend who sold his place in 2008 pre crash. and refused to get back in hoping the price will go back to 2005 prices. Coz he considered everything is over prices. He have been renting since then. I think close to 6-7 yrs.! frankly its not worth to rend so long. LKY is right we should not be a nation of renters. Actually I told her to get a resale HDB since they made profit with the condo. Pride and fear that they miss the drop and cannot buy a condo later due to MOP of HDB. but paying rental for 6-7 yrs in a condo can actually pay off a 3-4 bed room HDB by now had they not rented.
Anyway in short I see a lot of people hoping to buy , one or two took the plunge as they are tired of the wait and age is catching up. i.e. older you or the short the loan period to.
So when there are so many people sitting on the side line hoping to buy and the physiological support is $900-1000psf. I wonder how can the prices go back to 2009 crisis pricing that people so much hoped it goes unless there is a global crisis. But when that happen the same people will be frozen with fear which is why they missed the 2009 lows anyway.
Resale Prop if can get a good price has it value. lock in of int right now. and straight can lease out. but with current oversupply the rental yield can get compressed to the 3% or less region. and with interest rates for fix 2yr hovering at 2%. the delta of yield and risk factor have to be considered. one advantage is Property the leverage. the interest for leverage is still consider low i.e. 2% currently. verses other form of investment. i.e. margin trading , personal loans etc. but once int move up then all these will be negated.
I think yield will be depressed for quite a few years. Thus property investment only forms a small part of my portfolio...Looking at some other areas to invest such as stocks aside from property but cheap money made quite a few companies over priced.
I have know of a lot of people who want to buy! all say waiting for a big crash. I have a friend who sold his place in 2008 pre crash. and refused to get back in hoping the price will go back to 2005 prices. Coz he considered everything is over prices. He have been renting since then. I think close to 6-7 yrs.! frankly its not worth to rend so long. LKY is right we should not be a nation of renters. Actually I told her to get a resale HDB since they made profit with the condo. Pride and fear that they miss the drop and cannot buy a condo later due to MOP of HDB. but paying rental for 6-7 yrs in a condo can actually pay off a 3-4 bed room HDB by now had they not rented.
Anyway in short I see a lot of people hoping to buy , one or two took the plunge as they are tired of the wait and age is catching up. i.e. older you or the short the loan period to.
So when there are so many people sitting on the side line hoping to buy and the physiological support is $900-1000psf. I wonder how can the prices go back to 2009 crisis pricing that people so much hoped it goes unless there is a global crisis. But when that happen the same people will be frozen with fear which is why they missed the 2009 lows anyway.
Yes. This are my sediments too. Due to age n shorter runway..many of my older peers have jumped in n buy. No time to wait..
So what are the profiles of your colleagues like?
OK, let's just summarise by saying that this group I know (colleagues and friends) are buying for own stay. So rental yield doesn't quite apply to them, although they intend to rent out their existing housing. Some don't have a permanent place to stay. Some reasons are upgrade, some are to stake a place in Singapore (PRs and foreigners), some are to have a place near to workplace / children's schools.
The main observation I have made is that they tend to be the most proactive and top performers of their organisation. But it could also be due to the current measures only allowing the better earners to qualify. This can be interpreted whichever way one wishes. I wonder if it is my observation only.
TDSR kill all the low performers of their organisation. I am one of them.
Top performers spend too much time in their organisation to take care of themselves.
Another factor lurking in the background is that of costs of building a new development.
In relation to your title, I feel that current manpower costs (no increase in levy), transport costs (diesel and electricity) and perhaps even material (commodity costs) are moderated currently, and reasonable developers might have more leeway to reduce prices. Greedy developers are a different story though. So for the current batch under construction, the costs might be mitigated somewhat. The slowdown in release of new sites appear to help existing housing stocks to be moved.
If and when China and world economy picks up in a couple of years' time, all the costs can be expected to go up together. This will coincide with another few years of savings for those hoping to buy. Also, I am not entirely confident that we have more land to intensify the building of new developments at that juncture. Might be a very tricky proposition to buy new developments then (a few years down the road).
What do you think?
Another factor lurking in the background is that of costs of building a new development.
In relation to your title, I feel that current manpower costs (no increase in levy), transport costs (diesel and electricity) and perhaps even material (commodity costs) are moderated currently, and reasonable developers might have more leeway to reduce prices. Greedy developers are a different story though. So for the current batch under construction, the costs might be mitigated somewhat. The slowdown in release of new sites appear to help existing housing stocks to be moved.
If and when China and world economy picks up in a couple of years' time, all the costs can be expected to go up together. This will coincide with another few years of savings for those hoping to buy. Also, I am not entirely confident that we have more land to intensify the building of new developments at that juncture. Might be a very tricky proposition to buy new developments then (a few years down the road).
What do you think?
Cannot see as far as 2020 like some people anyhow wack . I feel the inflection pt is where the supply peak and the Interest rates peak . If the current Foreign inflow remain crimped. coupled with folks moving back to US as US economy is getting better. Then in the next 24 mths might be the pt where entry becomes reasonable. At the pt I might not look at new development. perhaps some firesale resale might be good consideration i.e. rentability , lower capex verses a brand new unit and no wait time etc.
The pt u see many shun the sector then it might be a good time to evaluate entry.
Cannot see as far as 2020 like some people anyhow wack . I feel the inflection pt is where the supply peak and the Interest rates peak . If the current Foreign inflow remain crimped. coupled with folks moving back to US as US economy is getting better. Then in the next 24 mths might be the pt where entry becomes reasonable. At the pt I might not look at new development. perhaps some firesale resale might be good consideration i.e. rentability , lower capex verses a brand new unit and no wait time etc.
The pt u see many shun the sector then it might be a good time to evaluate entry.
True also. For rentability. But to enter into rental market now is also a bad time. I am inclined to wait for new development if one already has a place to stay, in order to consolidate finances further as buffer, and also wait for rental market to improve. But it could also deteriorate further as well...
Residential sector is pretty much "dead" except for the rare few who still qualify, and many waiting for the drop. Much like current COE levels?
True also. For rentability. But to enter into rental market now is also a bad time. I am inclined to wait for new development if one already has a place to stay, in order to consolidate finances further as buffer, and also wait for rental market to improve. But it could also deteriorate further as well...
Residential sector is pretty much "dead" except for the rare few who still qualify, and many waiting for the drop. Much like current COE levels?
I noticed since now tenant markets, they tend to choose newer development for rent..even if it's smaller. Buying older resale resale will get lower price but lower rental returns too. So nett off.
I noticed since now tenant markets, they tend to choose newer development for rent..even if it's smaller. Buying older resale resale will get lower price but lower rental returns too. So nett off.
Its a function of quantum. TDSR also have a factor. Actually teant look at location, and if u send a few K repaint the place a 2-3 yrs place is still very attractive.
My layman types of profiles:
Got money + foresight + guts =investment
Got money + no foresight + guts = speculation
Got money + foresight + no guts = kiasu
Got money + no foresight + no guts = kiasi
No money + got foresight + guts = risk taker
No money + no foresight + guts = gambler
No money + no foresight + no guts = tangsi
and minus off the years they can take for the mortgages, getting shorter and shorter.
Got money(only for 20% deposit SGD 108k), no foresight, no guts but with God blessing got a 2 Bedroom @ Southbank in 2006.
No foresight because learn about real estate 10 years earlier still don't understand how to leverage, always want to pay in full.
No guts because don't understand what is money only know my 5 room MOP selling for 390k buy 535k top up the rest from cpf.
Spend too much time working for other no time for myself.
Only start to read about Money from 2008.
Can never get enough from the Bank.
If the Bank loan me I will still buy property.
Caspian successful launch in 2009 of 580psf average was the start of a massive price uptrend. Will we get 580psf again for OCR condos in 2019?
It won't happen again, we have to look forward and ....wait
One important area that TDSR addresses is to prevent over-leveraging.
Distributing the leveraging across the population ultimately makes the market a more stable one for everyone.
I think the top peak that "should have been" has been creamed off by the measures, so there is still much uncommitted demand - this demand is limited by ability and also a bit by the willingness to commit (who likes to pay ABSD willingly?). But the main question is when will the "first-timer" ability connect with the price again?
And Arcachon, you already have more than your fair share. Pang chance leh.
Got money(only for 20% deposit SGD 108k), no foresight, no guts but with God blessing got a 2 Bedroom @ Southbank in 2006.
No foresight because learn about real estate 10 years earlier still don't understand how to leverage, always want to pay in full.
No guts because don't understand what is money only know my 5 room MOP selling for 390k buy 535k top up the rest from cpf.
Spend too much time working for other no time for myself.
Only start to read about Money from 2008.
Can never get enough from the Bank.
If the Bank loan me I will still buy property.
It won't happen again, we have to look forward and ....wait
So confident that Singapore/Asean economy can tank low oil, low commodity, higher interest rates, carry trade unwind, post GE, MERS, WAR? LOL too early to say right!
Let me tell you, in the short term 80% chance it won't happen. In the long run (2019), it depends on the economy which affects the labor market. 200PSF is a possibility if WAR happens.
OK, let's just summarise by saying that this group I know (colleagues and friends) are buying for own stay. So rental yield doesn't quite apply to them, although they intend to rent out their existing housing. Some don't have a permanent place to stay. Some reasons are upgrade, some are to stake a place in Singapore (PRs and foreigners), some are to have a place near to workplace / children's schools.
The main observation I have made is that they tend to be the most proactive and top performers of their organisation. But it could also be due to the current measures only allowing the better earners to qualify. This can be interpreted whichever way one wishes. I wonder if it is my observation only.
I can be one of ur colleague then! I fit largely into your summary. LOL
I can be one of ur colleague then! I fit largely into your summary. LOL
So probably we are on the same page regarding what this means for future prices.
Taking the 4x annual income as a yard-stick, a $160k per year earners cannot even afford a 3-rm EC of decent size which costs much more $640k !!!
So, how can $160k per year income be HIGH-INCOME?!
So, the minister helped us to prove that minority lied again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
One thing I don't understand, why $160k per year earners cannot afford a 3-rm EC of decent size which cost >$640k. My combine household income is <100k and we are now staying in a 3 rm EC with 1,4xx sq ft costing slightly more than $600k in around Yr 1999.
One thing I don't understand, why $160k per year earners cannot afford a 3-rm EC of decent size which cost >$640k. My combine household income is <100k and we are now staying in a 3 rm EC with 1,4xx sq ft costing slightly more than $600k in around Yr 1999.
It might exceed household income ceiling of monthly 12k.
What TB was focusing on was a specific group he knew much about. I suspect he is within this bracket as well. But when policies are made, it looks across the whole spectrum and is not focused on any specific income range.
"Cannot" is if you believe in the so-called "Property price to annual income ratio" (PPIR) must be less than 4x (or 5x) for a property to be considered "affordable" and "not expensive".
This metric has been referred by MND Minister Khaw when they price HDB BTO flats and possibly used to gauge (because can't be using 2 different standards for HDB and private properties right?!) whether private property prices are "too expensive" or not (before they decide whether to remove or refine property cooling measures)...........
I don't believe in this metric, SO I am trying to point out the contradictions this so called general rule that has been USED compared to reality, which you have rightly pointed out - How can this metric be true and usable (especially in Singapore's context)?! If cannot, why are people using it in Singapore to dictate housing policies??? :tongue4:
Simple example: Household income $12k pm x12 = $144k, if x4 = S$576k. That means based on PPIR, somebody with household income of $12k pm should not buy a property costing >$576k.
However, $12k pm is the income ceiling for buying ECs, and why is government allowing EC developers to sell ECs costing >$576k, let alone >$1 MILLION????
One thing I don't understand, why $160k per year earners cannot afford a 3-rm EC of decent size which cost >$640k. My combine household income is <100k and we are now staying in a 3 rm EC with 1,4xx sq ft costing slightly more than $600k in around Yr 1999.
A $150k per-annum income will place you at the 88.3th percentile.
If you make more than $91,200, you are in the top quartile (i.e. top 25%) of all resident taxpayers.
To be among the top 10% earners, you need an annual income of $170,000 or more.
To be at the 95th percentile (i.e. top 5%), you need to make at least $264,000 a year.
As usual, please note that residents earning $20k and below do not pay tax. Hence they are not included in the above comparison.
Bro, you ever heard of people upgrading to EC from HDB? They might have 200 to 500K profits as base already.
Have you also heard of people who deliberately reduce household income (for example 1 retiree) to qualify for EC? Some of them already can pay off the whole EC with minimum or no loan.
"Cannot" is if you believe in the so-called "Property price to annual income ratio" (PPIR) must be less than 4x (or 5x) for a property to be considered "affordable" and "not expensive".
This metric has been referred by MND Minister Khaw when they price HDB BTO flats and possibly used to gauge (because can't be using 2 different standards for HDB and private properties right?!) whether private property prices are "too expensive" or not (before they decide whether to remove or refine property cooling measures)...........
I don't believe in this metric, SO I am trying to point out the contradictions this so called general rule that has been USED compared to reality, which you have rightly pointed out - How can this metric be true and usable (especially in Singapore's context)?! If cannot, why are people using it in Singapore to dictate housing policies??? :tongue4:
Simple example: Household income $12k pm x12 = $144k, if x4 = S$576k. That means based on PPIR, somebody with household income of $12k pm should not buy a property costing >$576k.
However, $12k pm is the income ceiling for buying ECs, and why is government allowing EC developers to sell ECs costing >$576k, let alone >$1 MILLION????
Bro, you ever heard of people upgrading to EC from HDB? They might have 200 to 500K profits as base already.
Have you also heard of people who deliberately reduce household income (for example 1 retiree) to qualify for EC? Some of them already can pay off the whole EC with minimum or no loan.
If have enough saving cash, use it for deposit first, the rest paid by CPF (monthly instalment), so whether have cash or not on hand, not so critical right?
If have enough saving cash, use it for deposit first, the rest paid by CPF (monthly instalment), so whether have cash or not on hand, not so critical right?
Thanks Iris. His logic was that Ministry set affordability at 4X income but price ECs at above 4X income. I was trying to explain the rationale to him. This group is likely CPF and Cash rich, so ultimately the 4X income rule need not be applied to them so strictly.
So what are you trying to tell us?
What you said has nothing to do with PPIR right?
A $150k per-annum income will place you at the 88.3th percentile.
If you make more than $91,200, you are in the top quartile (i.e. top 25%) of all resident taxpayers.
To be among the top 10% earners, you need an annual income of $170,000 or more.
To be at the 95th percentile (i.e. top 5%), you need to make at least $264,000 a year.
As usual, please note that residents earning $20k and below do not pay tax. Hence they are not included in the above comparison.
Well, what you said is immaterial because what you said has not been considered into PPIR and policy-makers only using PPIR as a reference for policy making...............
Bro, you ever heard of people upgrading to EC from HDB? They might have 200 to 500K profits as base already.
Have you also heard of people who deliberately reduce household income (for example 1 retiree) to qualify for EC? Some of them already can pay off the whole EC with minimum or no loan.
So what are you trying to tell us?
What you said has nothing to do with PPIR right?
So when buying house we can base on PPIR to bargain?
You can bargain in any way you like................
So when buying house we can base on PPIR to bargain?
Well, what you said is immaterial because what you said has not been considered into the conventional bargaining process between buyers & sellers, and policy-makers are NOT only using PPIR as a reference for policy making...............
You can bargain in any way you like................
A $150k per-annum income will place you at the 88.3th percentile.
If you make more than $91,200, you are in the top quartile (i.e. top 25%) of all resident taxpayers.
To be among the top 10% earners, you need an annual income of $170,000 or more.
To be at the 95th percentile (i.e. top 5%), you need to make at least $264,000 a year.
As usual, please note that residents earning $20k and below do not pay tax. Hence they are not included in the above comparison.
According to the Low IQ BEAR people who earn 160K a year is consider middle income. So a middle income family of 2 adult with house hold income of 320K per year is considered middle income. And these folks according to him are very disadvantaged.
minority,
Why you want to keep insisting people earning $160k a year is HIGH-INCOME and hence those Ministers earning $2,000k a year are earning OBSCENE-INCOME?????????????
Didn't I tell you that those Ministers earning $2,000k a year is just earning HIGH-INCOME?????
According to the Low IQ BEAR people who earn 160K a year is consider middle income. So a middle income family of 2 adult with house hold income of 320K per year is considered middle income. And these folks according to him are very disadvantaged.
Well, what you said is immaterial because what you said has not been considered into the conventional bargaining process between buyers & sellers, and policy-makers are NOT only using PPIR as a reference for policy making...............
Actually EC is semi-private, does not have to restrict the ratio under 4X. And if I am not wrong, if just get a 2-Bedder EC, 500+K is definitely achievable. Under 500K new EC also can find.
I kept wondering why he is talking about ratios used in HDB and EC until it finally dawned upon me. He is hoping to talk down this sector, thinking that this sector will directly affect OCR private prices. When OCR prices finally fall significantly, the total private property drop will justify the removal of CMs which will help his lagging CCR FH prices. Zun bo?
I think is very naive though if my speculation about his intention turns out to be right...
Why need to talk down property prices?
It is a FACT that private property prices have already been dropping for 7 quarters now, and with CCR already dropped 30% or more, while OCR only drop 5%+, more drop is now expected for OCR..............
No removal of property cooling measures means private property prices will continue to drop for long long time (may be until next recession)............ :rolleyes:
Actually EC is semi-private, does not have to restrict the ratio under 4X. And if I am not wrong, if just get a 2-Bedder EC, 500+K is definitely achievable. Under 500K new EC also can find.
I kept wondering why he is talking about ratios used in HDB and EC until it finally dawned upon me. He is hoping to talk down this sector, thinking that this sector will directly affect OCR private prices. When OCR prices finally fall significantly, the total private property drop will justify the removal of CMs which will help his lagging CCR FH prices. Zun bo?
I think is very naive though if my speculation about his intention turns out to be right...
Why need to talk down property prices?
It is a FACT that private property prices have already been dropping for 7 quarters now, and with CCR already dropped 30% or more, while OCR only drop 5%+, more drop is now expected for OCR..............
No removal of property cooling measures means private property prices will continue to drop for long long time (may be until next recession)............ :rolleyes:
Ouch, that must have really hurt.
I think don't remove cm better. Let all the durian hoppers rejoice.
Ouch, that must have really hurt.
I think don't remove cm better. Let all the durian hoppers rejoice.
Huat ah!
Huat ah!
Agreed… Huat ah!!!
Maintain the CM for another 10yrs!!!
Indeed, those who can wait for OCR to drop to $500 psf as long as the CM is in place for another 10yrs will HUAT big time in future!!!!!!!!
But those who buy at current price or around will lose big time (depending on which side of the fence you are now)!!!!!!!!!
Agreed… Huat ah!!!
Maintain the CM for another 10yrs!!!
watchlist88
02-08-15, 00:38
Won't drop that low one lah unless HDB BTO prices and resale flats drop severely too. For OCR to drop to $500 psf , every segment of the housing market has to drop proportionately too. I maintain the view that it will be a soft landing for housing prices but if an external event triggers a severe recession in Singapore in near future, severe housing price drop may happen. Oops .... then those with ammo can go for the Great Singapore Housing Sale .... GSHS .......
Aiyah some duchbag trying to talk the market down.. $500psf LOL!!! my toe are laughing..
Won't drop that low one lah unless HDB BTO prices and resale flats drop severely too. For OCR to drop to $500 psf , every segment of the housing market has to drop proportionately too. I maintain the view that it will be a soft landing for housing prices but if an external event triggers a severe recession in Singapore in near future, severe housing price drop may happen. Oops .... then those with ammo can go for the Great Singapore Housing Sale .... GSHS .......
and then income will have to drop. coz its a function of affordability. people can afford they will cheong it. and leverage up. unless TDSR become 80% or something.
Indeed, those who can wait for OCR to drop to $500 psf as long as the CM is in place for another 10yrs will HUAT big time in future!!!!!!!!
But those who buy at current price or around will lose big time (depending on which side of the fence you are now)!!!!!!!!!
WoW!!! Wah!!! If psf touches $500 i will sell every equity i can get my hands on throw into Property!
Might even consider pawning my Wife… LOLOL
When it happen that psf fall to $500+, many people will not rush in. Instead they will wait for it to fall further. It will not happen if many people expecting it to happen. Just like the last few crises. Sudden and least expected.
When it happen that psf fall to $500+, many people will not rush in. Instead they will wait for it to fall further. It will not happen if many people expecting it to happen. Just like the last few crises. Sudden and least expected.
Yes, they will let it fall to 300PSF. So a 3BR unit will cost 300K+, 2 BR 200K, and 1BR 100K. COE will fall back to $2. Will surely be very sudden.
Three quarters of the nation will end up underwater.
Yes, they will let it fall to 300PSF. So a 3BR unit will cost 300K+, 2 BR 200K, and 1BR 100K. COE will fall back to $2. Will surely be very sudden.
Three quarters of the nation will end up underwater.
By then many foreigners will scoop up our cheap properties n be our biggest landlords to our next generation. Sad
So did you do that in 1998?
Did you do that in 2004?
Did you do that in 2008?
So you going to sell your equity at DEPRESSED prices because equity can dropped much much more (in % terms) than property prices????
WoW!!! Wah!!! If psf touches $500 i will sell every equity i can get my hands on throw into Property!
Might even consider pawning my Wife… LOLOL
So probably we are on the same page regarding what this means for future prices.
I think we are heh
Yes, they will let it fall to 300PSF. So a 3BR unit will cost 300K+, 2 BR 200K, and 1BR 100K. COE will fall back to $2. Will surely be very sudden.
Three quarters of the nation will end up underwater.
and with that maybe 30% jobless and business are losing down. GDP shrink back to 1980s size lor. and SGP to USD 1:1.8 etc. People only think they want 1980s price but todays pay packet and today life style. :surprise::surprise::surprise:
then those with ammo can go for the Great Singapore Housing Sale .... GSHS .......
There was a fixed deposit promotion last month at CIMB. Effective rate of 1.9% for 12 months for $100,000 and above.
When i reached there, the bank was so crowded and its like a fish market.
There are still plenty of cash rich Sporeans.
There was a fixed deposit promotion last month at CIMB. Effective rate of 1.9% for 12 months for $100,000 and above.
When i reached there, the bank was so crowded and its like a fish market.
There are still plenty of cash rich Sporeans.
Many people have $$ to park donno where.. if only CPF will accept more $$$$
When it happen that psf fall to $500+, many people will not rush in. Instead they will wait for it to fall further. It will not happen if many people expecting it to happen. Just like the last few crises. Sudden and least expected.
To be honest, a sustained economic crisis does loom ahead. China stocks falling have caused several other bourses to fumble. Some of the stocks I sold a few months back have lost maybe 10-30%. Really lucky to be out of harm's way.
But if stocks continue to tumble, the next to be really hit will be COEs and housing prices.
Not too sure what the Govt stand is going to be according to what Arcachon has described, but I will rest easy at the moment.
Yes, they will let it fall to 300PSF. So a 3BR unit will cost 300K+, 2 BR 200K, and 1BR 100K. COE will fall back to $2. Will surely be very sudden.
Three quarters of the nation will end up underwater.
I find it strange that when people wish for that... They fail to realise that a lot of things are inter related. When that really happens.. Maybe they should fear for their livelihood.
Why need to talk down property prices?
It is a FACT that private property prices have already been dropping for 7 quarters now, and with CCR already dropped 30% or more, while OCR only drop 5%+, more drop is now expected for OCR..............
No removal of property cooling measures means private property prices will continue to drop for long long time (may be until next recession)............ :rolleyes:
Actually it is ironic that due to the perpetual news that prices are dropping.. Albeit slowly.. a lot of my peers are very keen to buy sec property...
I guess some are just waiting to rush in by end this year or maybe next...while others have already purchased liao.
Today my colleague who in France for the last 14 years told me he have 400k cash.
3 K salary + 2 K rental for 14 years .
He did not buy any property other than the HDB he have.
Do you think he did the right choice to do nothing.
I find it strange that when people wish for that... They fail to realise that a lot of things are inter related. When that really happens.. Maybe they should fear for their livelihood.
Very true lah. I don't believe a responsible Govt will watch that happen without doing anything.
Stability is the thing on their mind when they created the CMs to begin with. The biggest unknown is what is the price level (or other trigger point) they would step in.
And even if they don't, the queues waiting would have come in to support long before the drop is that severe.
But it has been a good durian season. Good price, great delicacies. It will not last forever though.
Today my colleague who in France for the last 14 years told me he have 400k cash.
3 K salary + 2 K rental for 14 years .
He did not buy any property other than the HDB he have.
Do you think he did the right choice to do nothing.
14 years still 3K salary? I think 100K can buy 1 property in France or am I mistaken? He rented all the way?
Depend on where you buy.
http://www.seloger.com/
Depend on where you buy.
http://www.seloger.com/
I would like to buy a 3 bedder in Paris for 100K
Why Paris when you are from city state Singapore.
Normally people from the city go for Chateau.
http://www.seloger.com/list.htm?cp=33&idtt=2&idtypebien=13
http://www.seloger.com/annonces/achat/chateau/podensac-33/99053017.htm?cp=33&idtt=2&idtypebien=13&bd=Li_LienAnn_1
14 room for 220,000 euro, 650 sqm and 950 sqm of garden.
http://f.visuels.poliris.com/b600/f/b/9/2/fb926d3d-4aa0.jpg
Why Paris when you are from city state Singapore.
Normally people from the city go for Chateau.
http://www.seloger.com/list.htm?cp=33&idtt=2&idtypebien=13
http://www.seloger.com/annonces/achat/chateau/podensac-33/99053017.htm?cp=33&idtt=2&idtypebien=13&bd=Li_LienAnn_1
14 room for 220,000 euro, 650 sqm and 950 sqm of garden.
http://f.visuels.poliris.com/b600/f/b/9/2/fb926d3d-4aa0.jpg
See already shiok. Can only buy a HDB here.
Why Paris when you are from city state Singapore.
Normally people from the city go for Chateau.
http://www.seloger.com/list.htm?cp=33&idtt=2&idtypebien=13
http://www.seloger.com/annonces/achat/chateau/podensac-33/99053017.htm?cp=33&idtt=2&idtypebien=13&bd=Li_LienAnn_1
14 room for 220,000 euro, 650 sqm and 950 sqm of garden.
http://f.visuels.poliris.com/b600/f/b/9/2/fb926d3d-4aa0.jpg
once a city person always a city person. love the zest of a city. love the activities and vibes. Chateau are for holidays. Weekend getaways to chateau can go get Pay per use from AirBIB. and city props have more value retention too.
Very true lah. I don't believe a responsible Govt will watch that happen without doing anything.
Stability is the thing on their mind when they created the CMs to begin with. The biggest unknown is what is the price level (or other trigger point) they would step in.
And even if they don't, the queues waiting would have come in to support long before the drop is that severe.
But it has been a good durian season. Good price, great delicacies. It will not last forever though.
Sighs, have coffee with a friend this morning, he told me his stocks holding has already paper lost 30% -40%. bought gold, gold price drop. buy property worry wrong timing. Buy corp bonds worry about default . So I suggested to him to put his money with banks or insurance. they will use it to invest and pay him peanut.
And he will have peace of mind.
Sighs, have coffee with a friend this morning, he told me his stocks holding has already paper lost 30% -40%. bought gold, gold price drop. buy property worry wrong timing. Buy corp bonds worry about default . So I suggested to him to put his money with banks or insurance. they will use it to invest and pay him peanut.
And he will have peace of mind.
SSB is coming. At least can protect 100K of his savings.
SSB is coming. At least can protect 100K of his savings.
Yeah, 1 of the reasons govt implement SSD is to protect ppl saving.
Yeah, 1 of the reasons govt implement SSD is to protect ppl saving.
Govt has greater responsibility to look after and protect society than Banks and financial institution.
Sighs, have coffee with a friend this morning, he told me his stocks holding has already paper lost 30% -40%. bought gold, gold price drop. buy property worry wrong timing. Buy corp bonds worry about default . So I suggested to him to put his money with banks or insurance. they will use it to invest and pay him peanut.
And he will have peace of mind.
Equity have ups n downs. as long his stretargy is right. dollar cost avg on the counters (assuming they are blue chips. ) then he should be safe. If not park it in a index ETF and dollar cost avg . That my view is still better. but if he only focus on the short term voility then he will not be able to sleep then this type of investment return is not what he can stomach.
same for property. rent it out take a long view it won't be so bad. provided he didn't over leverage and have problem with the instalment.
Gold... that is a very narrow investment. so hav to accept the risk it comes with.
If he can't take the voiltilty then take a investment in a basket of equity or a index EFT . and dollar cost avg that in loner term is still ok.
Did I heard wrongly on TV? , PM said all working citizens will b able own a house.
(HDB or Condo?) Master Bear please enlighten. Thanks
A House in Singapore is HDB.
What PM say is correct because HDB BTO is unlike the cowboy years where you can buy even if you have no income.
Nowaday to buy BTO, first you must meet MSR (my friend in Real estate have to give up to find a fixed income in order to buy HDB BTO) means not working to bad loh no House for you.
SSB is just another way of money printing, thumb up for MAS chairman to come up this idea, win win for the government and for those who have no time to understand what is money.
Once the printing start it is very hard to stop, for those who know benefit the most for those who don't complain the most.
Ever wonder why everything is so expensive nowaday.
Remove money printing and we all go back to stone age.
Replace Time in the Movie with Money.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnAkTd3u1hg
SSB is just another way of money printing, thumb up for MAS chairman to come up this idea, win win for the government and for those who have no time to understand what is money.
Once the printing start it is very hard to stop, for those who know benefit the most for those who don't complain the most.
Ever wonder why everything is so expensive nowaday.
Remove money printing and we all go back to stone age.
Replace Time in the Movie with Money.
The intent of SSB is to provide another avenue for Singaporeans to invest in a relatively risk free asset instead of putting all their savings into property because the government's economic plans have take a different path. With Singapore's economy reaching maturity, our growth will be small and slow going forward, hence having the bulk of Singaporean's savings in property is not the way forward. As such, the SSB is another asset class for the average Singaporeans to invest.
SSB is not money printing, in fact, it is a reverse of money printing. Like your CPF savings, the government is taking more money from you and in return is paying you higher interest. These are not cheap monies which can be loan out to corporates or individuals. The government will have to reinvest these monies through its investment channels to generate higher returns to pay higher interest to bond holders.
The intent of SSB is to provide another avenue for Singaporeans to invest in a relatively risk free asset instead of putting all their savings into property because the government's economic plans have take a different path. With Singapore's economy reaching maturity, our growth will be small and slow going forward, hence having the bulk of Singaporean's savings in property is not the way forward. As such, the SSB is another asset class for the average Singaporeans to invest.
SSB is not money printing, in fact, it is a reverse of money printing. Like your CPF savings, the government is taking more money from you and in return is paying you higher interest. These are not cheap monies which can be loan out to corporates or individuals. The government will have to reinvest these monies through its investment channels to generate higher returns to pay higher interest to bond holders.
I dun think their plan for SSB is to replace property investment, I believe is to save guide people from other high risk investment and scam. which govt in the world dun want people to invest in their land and property in their country? If all the people know how to park their money in Singapore property. Govt dun need SSB encouraged saving.
I dun think their plan for SSB is to replace property investment, I believe is to save guide people from other high risk investment and scam. which govt in the world dun want people to invest in their land and property in their country? If all the people know how to park their money in Singapore property. Govt dun need SSB encouraged saving.
I witnessed some of my relatives and friends who have already paid up their own stay house and with excess saving they lost in overseas investment or scam. If only they know how to invest in local property they will huat. Why govt needs to implement cooling measures? What is the real reasons?
I dun think their plan for SSB is to replace property investment, I believe is to save guide people from other high risk investment and scam. which govt in the world dun want people to invest in their land and property in their country? If all the people know how to park their money in Singapore property. Govt dun need SSB encouraged saving.
That was the intent and was part of the panel's discussions in year 2012 as the government reviewed its policy. Of course the government cannot state so officially for obvious reasons.
What, you mean HDB flats affordability has different yard-stick from private property prices??? If so, why?????
Good news, KBW just said HDB BTO going to be real affordable. Shorter lease = Lower price, dun know how it is going to affect the private property? Master Bear please enlighten. Will they also shorter the private land lease for those MTB to aboard?
Good news, KBW just said HDB BTO going to be real affordable. Shorter lease = Lower price, dun know how it is going to affect the private property? Master Bear please enlighten. Will they also shorter the private land lease for those MTB to aboard?
There is already 1 trial with Hillford. Fully sold in one day.
I think more coming after elections. I think only.
The intent of SSB is to provide another avenue for Singaporeans to invest in a relatively risk free asset instead of putting all their savings into property because the government's economic plans have take a different path. With Singapore's economy reaching maturity, our growth will be small and slow going forward, hence having the bulk of Singaporean's savings in property is not the way forward. As such, the SSB is another asset class for the average Singaporeans to invest.
SSB is not money printing, in fact, it is a reverse of money printing. Like your CPF savings, the government is taking more money from you and in return is paying you higher interest. These are not cheap monies which can be loan out to corporates or individuals. The government will have to reinvest these monies through its investment channels to generate higher returns to pay higher interest to bond holders.
What is SSB ?
Someone print a piece of paper call SSB and sell it for X dollar and pay you interest after y number of years.
What is mortgage ?
Someone let you sign a piece of paper and give you money to buy property and you pay interest for y number of years.
Are they the same, yes, both printing money.
Can they be stop, No once they start very hard to stop.
There is already 1 trial with Hillford. Fully sold in one day.
I think more coming after elections. I think only.
Those waiting for Durian to drop will have to get use to smaller Durian.
Got money put in the Bank to earn interest or buy asset.
Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance.
When government issue paper money in exchange for taking back pieces of papers that you can't exchange for goods liquidly (the papers called BONDs), that is called "QE", because they are flooding the market with more paper money in circulation.
When government do the reverse of above, i.e. issue pieces of papers (you can call that BONDs, Treasury Bills etc - SSB included) and take back paper money to reduce the amount of paper money in circulation, now you hold pieces of papers that you can't exchange for goods liquidly, that is called "Reverse QE".................
It is clear that "reverse QE" tends to cause raise in interest rates (just like "QE" tends to cause interest rates to drop).....................
Very simple theory.....................
That is true if the Govt keep it in treasury and does nothing with the collected money. But my question is what will happen if the Govt uses it to fund areas that go directly back into the economy? For example infrastructure or as collateral to allow more borrowing?
When government issue paper money in exchange for taking back pieces of papers that you can't exchange for goods liquidly (the papers called BONDs), that is called "QE", because they are flooding the market with more paper money in circulation.
When government do the reverse of above, i.e. issue pieces of papers (you can call that BONDs, Treasury Bills etc - SSB included) and take back paper money to reduce the amount of paper money in circulation, now you hold pieces of papers that you can't exchange for goods liquidly, that is called "Reverse QE".................
It is clear that "reverse QE" tends to cause raise in interest rates (just like "QE" tends to cause interest rates to drop).....................
Very simple theory.....................
Government is not bank, they don't make loans to people, so No fractional effect to increase money in circulation.........
As for spending the money on infrastructure, not as much as effect as letting people put money in banks, and banks loan out to others causing fractional monetary effects and more money into circulation............... :cheerful:
I believe you should know that whatever a government wants to reduce the money in circulation, they will always issue bonds, and SSB is just that, "bonds"!
And since the aim is to reduce the money in circulation, obviously they will not so stupid to do something with that money that causes fractional effect and hence increases money in circulation again....................
That is true if the Govt keep it in treasury and does nothing with the collected money. But my question is what will happen if the Govt uses it to fund areas that go directly back into the economy? For example infrastructure or as collateral to allow more borrowing?
Government is not bank, they don't make loans to people, so No fractional effect to increase money in circulation.........
As for spending the money on infrastructure, not as much as effect as letting people put money in banks, and banks loan out to others causing fractional monetary effects and more money into circulation............... :cheerful:
I believe you should know that whatever a government wants to reduce the money in circulation, they will always issue bonds, and SSB is just that, "bonds"!
And since the aim is to reduce the money in circulation, obviously they will not so stupid to do something with that money that causes fractional effect and hence increases money in circulation again....................
They are not sitting ducks and I believe it's not that simple.
There could be a huge number of people with spare change that cannot do much that are consolidated with the SSB.
In order for them to pay out 2%, the basic gains they are aiming for must be at least 10% if you understand the way the Govt works from day 1. My question is where can they derive this total gain and yet give illusion of huge pay out.
Just for example, don't you find it a huge coincidence that GE is in September and SSB applications start from September of the same year? Something must be hatching.
That is true if the Govt keep it in treasury and does nothing with the collected money. But my question is what will happen if the Govt uses it to fund areas that go directly back into the economy? For example infrastructure or as collateral to allow more borrowing?
This exercise is also done in tuned with the comping Sept int increase. So that they will not push up near term interest so much. the SSB are tiered to be low 1.8% for the initial years wich is inline with the interest charged in the market.
Today my colleague who in France for the last 14 years told me he have 400k cash.
3 K salary + 2 K rental for 14 years .
He did not buy any property other than the HDB he have.
Do you think he did the right choice to do nothing.
My question will be - with a 3K salary how did he even amount to have $400K cash? It cannot be from savings.
When government issue paper money in exchange for taking back pieces of papers that you can't exchange for goods liquidly (the papers called BONDs), that is called "QE", because they are flooding the market with more paper money in circulation.
When government do the reverse of above, i.e. issue pieces of papers (you can call that BONDs, Treasury Bills etc - SSB included) and take back paper money to reduce the amount of paper money in circulation, now you hold pieces of papers that you can't exchange for goods liquidly, that is called "Reverse QE".................
It is clear that "reverse QE" tends to cause raise in interest rates (just like "QE" tends to cause interest rates to drop).....................
Very simple theory.....................
Agree with the statement "When government do the reverse of above, i.e. issue pieces of papers (you can call that BONDs, Treasury Bills etc - SSB included) and take back paper money to reduce the amount of paper money in circulation, now you hold pieces of papers that you can't exchange for goods liquidity, that is called "Reverse QE".................
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2IiwstF_UE
But who is going to pay the interest for the SSB, you can't just put under the bed and money start to grow right.
Can an economic grow when you remove money in circulation.
So you don't use the SSB for infrastructure in Singapore and you loan money from the Bank to do it, do you have to pay interest.
If you loan money from the Bank isn't money created from the Bank, call print money.
I must admit I have little knowledge about money, one thing I and sure money don't grow on the tree.
Money equal Debt.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqvKjsIxT_8
When there is no debt there is no money. Can ask the bushman in the movie "The God must be crazy"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KN9BGW3NXzM
Debt is created but interest is not thus money printing cannot stop, it can only print more.
Show me a country that have less money in circulation in this World except the Bushman.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsrtB5lp60s
Bond = IOU = loan = debt = money.
When you print Bond what have you done, print money.
Did you print the interest ?
No, so you need to print more money right.
When you print more money what happen to the money you have.
The money you have can buy more thing in future because there are more money in circulation ??????
1984 I earn SGD 400 a month and I can save SGD 200.
2014 Can I still do the same with SGD 400.
Will you buy Bond from Greece, if not why buy SSB.
My question will be - with a 3K salary how did he even amount to have $400K cash? It cannot be from savings.
He is giving a simple example.
He have more than 3K salary.
3K is the salary not used for 14 years and 2K is the rental income for 14 years.
Total 3x12x14 (504K) + 2x12x14 (336K).
So when he say he have 400K cash he mean it is possible to save that amount.
He also received COLA Cost of Living Allowance when he is oversea and also part of the rent paid by the employer, so he do need to use his Singapore salary and rental income.
2006 I have little knowledge about money, but what I know is they are building MRT and cost millions.
So the land they use to build MRT must cost more and the House on the land must also cost more.
So I buy the cheapest unit I can buy with SGD 108k.
Now they are going to spend Billions on the same piece of Land called the Little Red Dot.
That Little Red Dot cannot be cheaper right.
Whether they loan from the Bank or SSB or SGS, they are going to print more money.
Agree with the statement "When government do the reverse of above, i.e. issue pieces of papers (you can call that BONDs, Treasury Bills etc - SSB included) and take back paper money to reduce the amount of paper money in circulation, now you hold pieces of papers that you can't exchange for goods liquidity, that is called "Reverse QE".................
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2IiwstF_UE
But who is going to pay the interest for the SSB, you can't just put under the bed and money start to grow right.
Can an economic grow when you remove money in circulation.
So you don't use the SSB for infrastructure in Singapore and you loan money from the Bank to do it, do you have to pay interest.
If you loan money from the Bank isn't money created from the Bank, call print money.
I must admit I have little knowledge about money, one thing I and sure money don't grow on the tree.
Money equal Debt.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqvKjsIxT_8
When there is no debt there is no money. Can ask the bushman in the movie "The God must be crazy"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KN9BGW3NXzM
Debt is created but interest is not thus money printing cannot stop, it can only print more.
Show me a country that have less money in circulation in this World except the Bushman.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsrtB5lp60s
Looks like you must have some warped understanding of QE. I think only Teddy and I have shown some understanding in money, perhaps Teddy is also a banker?
Like I've mentioned before, SSB is some form of DEBT which is what every country issues. The US calls it T-bonds and Singapore calls it Singapore Government Bonds. Like any other country, Singapore issues bonds all the time (since the founding of MAS). What does the government do with the money is anyone's guess. Roads? Maintenance? Baby bonus? SG50? There's some tough road ahead so it's prudent for the government to build up cash reserves. In return for the so called SSB, the government is removing liquidity from the market, so there's less to circulate around. Banks will be forced to increase interest rates to attract more savers, they don't "print money". Banks either borrow from the government, or from other banks.
If banks are unable to borrow from other banks, they turn to the government. Government must lend them money or the banks will go bust. That's where central banks like MAS and FED come into play. In the case of Lehmans, the FED had to print money to buy back their own bonds. This suppressed the interest rates since the FED was directly competing with institutional/sovereign investors. With the money they created out of Quantitative Easing, they are also diluting the bonds which investors are holding. That negatively affects the yield of the bond which affects the interest rates at which the market lends out money. The banks which take advantage of the low interest rates (near zero) will also pass on the savings to businesses and consumers. This has a larger effect on interest rates since it also affects government bonds, or the rate at which government borrows money. Therefore there's a saying that the FED does not set interest rates but influence interest rates using the FED funds rates. QE is directly used to set interest rates.
As with SG, we don't set interest rates so it all depends on the SGD and the amount of liquidity circulating. Lower the SGD, higher the interest rates. The interest rates they set for SSB does influence the interest rates at which banks borrow/lend since SSB has a triple A rating. However, it's doesn't directly set the rate at which government or banks borrow as it's still largely dependent on liquidity flowing in the market. With SSB, all you can be assured is a reduced amount of liquidity which may force banks to borrow/lend at higher interest rates. Higher interest rates is the result of reverse QE. This is why the FED in 2008 had to print money and buy their own bonds when there's little liquidity floating around after the crisis. The printing and buying gave the same effect as an economy with large amount of liquidity floating around. Just look at US now.
Bond = IOU = loan = debt = money.
When you print Bond what have you done, print money.
Alamak! Warped, totally warped logic. You're mixing and matching different things.
Bond = IOU to consumers (government is the debtor)
Loan = IOU to banks (consumers are debtors)
How can they be the same? LOL
Therefore, Bond cannot be print money. It's actually the reverse based on the logic above.
SGD, INTEREST RATES and STI are all linked. Go figure.
2006 I have little knowledge about money, but what I know is they are building MRT and cost millions.
So the land they use to build MRT must cost more and the House on the land must also cost more.
So I buy the cheapest unit I can buy with SGD 108k.
Now they are going to spend Billions on the same piece of Land called the Little Red Dot.
That Little Red Dot cannot be cheaper right.
Whether they loan from the Bank or SSB or SGS, they are going to print more money.
When SGD was up, there was lots of liquidity flowing in and around. I guess you can call it "printing money" but that's several years back. But now, funds are exiting SG back to US and EU. This is called tightening. It doesn't end here. More to come, though. MAS calls it easing, but I think that only applies to the exporters.
http://www.ifa.sg/singapore-saving-bonds/
Start to see a little bit of light at the end of the tunnel but still don't understand.
1. SSB is some form of DEBT, when debt equal money, no debt no money.
2. If banks are unable to borrow from other banks, they turn to the government. Government must lend them money or the banks will go bust.
SSB suck the money from the Bank and the banks are unable to borrow from other banks, they turn to the government so in the end the government print money because of SSB.
3. With SSB, all you can be assured is a reduced amount of liquidity which may force banks to borrow/lend at higher interest rates.
SGS Bond also have the same effect right why interest rate still so low.
4. As with SG, we don't set interest rates so it all depends on the SGD and the amount of liquidity circulating.
M3 money is still the same after all the SGS bond.
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/moneysupply.asp
Alamak! Warped, totally warped logic. You're mixing and matching different things.
Bond = IOU to consumers (government is the debtor)
Loan = IOU to banks (consumers are debtors)
How can they be the same? LOL
Therefore, Bond cannot be print money. It's actually the reverse based on the logic above.
SGD, INTEREST RATES and STI are all linked. Go figure.
Saw a bit of light than dark again.
Government is the debtors in Bond so they need to pay interest, so how they pay interest.
They need to use the money to generated income and so the money go into the market ????
When SGD was up, there was lots of liquidity flowing in and around. I guess you can call it "printing money" but that's several years back. But now, funds are exiting SG back to US and EU. This is called tightening. It doesn't end here. More to come, though. MAS calls it easing, but I think that only applies to the exporters.
So these funds exiting SG back to US was created out from nowhere, something like the chicken and the egg story.
If the funds was created out from nowhere than we also can create right, like Abenomics
Printed more money Yen go down, sell SGD property at the loss and exchange rate to Yen still make money ???
I was in the SAF when the economic was bad and out of the blue we have a 20 million dollar building in the Base, don't know where they get the money ??? Guess must be printed.
The Building don't generated income and need maintenance which cost money ????
Start to see a little bit of light at the end of the tunnel but still don't understand.
1. SSB is some form of DEBT, when debt equal money, no debt no money.
Debt isn't free, it comes with a price tag (interest rates). When you have lots of cheap debt (close to 0 interest rates), then it equates to QE. Higher interest rates = tightening. Which is exactly how the FED phrases it.
2. If banks are unable to borrow from other banks, they turn to the government. Government must lend them money or the banks will go bust.
SSB suck the money from the Bank and the banks are unable to borrow from other banks, they turn to the government so in the end the government print money because of SSB.
The banks are only allowed to borrow from the government in times of crisis (when it's not able to borrow from other banks). Also, government lends money at market rate so the net benefactor is still the government. When the government lends money at a discount rate (at last resort) to banks, interest rates will be suppressed and that devalues the SGD, which also increases liquidity. Banks are still required to set aside a portion of their deposits as reserves vs the loan they lend out. So when there's more liquidity, deposits are easier to come by. Net effect will be a reduction in interest rates. However, this is not happening now. Banks are still in their pink of health.
3. With SSB, all you can be assured is a reduced amount of liquidity which may force banks to borrow/lend at higher interest rates.
SGS Bond also have the same effect right why interest rate still so low.
Interest rates are climbing FYI. SGB will depend on the market take up rate. Stronger demand for SGB = higher bond = lower yield/interest rates. That's what happened during the FED QE. However, with US raising interest rates, demand for SGB will be weaker, hence higher interest rates for SG. Loosely speaking, funds will flow out of SG.
4. As with SG, we don't set interest rates so it all depends on the SGD and the amount of liquidity circulating.
M3 money is still the same after all the SGS bond.
M3 is not a true measurement for liquidity. In our environment, it all depends on demand for liquidity. It should always be matched by GDP and DEBT growth, both of which have been steadily increasing. More debt = more bank reserves = higher interest rates to suck in liquidity = less liquidity.
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/moneysupply.asp
Saw a bit of light than dark again.
Government is the debtors in Bond so they need to pay interest, so how they pay interest.
They need to use the money to generated income and so the money go into the market ????
They pay interest from their budget surplus (in our case we have lots of surplus collected from COE & taxes). Or, they can pay you using the money they raised from another bond sale (like Greece).
Thanks pmet, I begin to see a bit of light. Guess the Durian is dropping and it all depends on the effect of SSB on interest rate.
So these funds exiting SG back to US was created out from nowhere, something like the chicken and the egg story.
If the funds was created out from nowhere than we also can create right, like Abenomics
Printed more money Yen go down, sell SGD property at the loss and exchange rate to Yen still make money ???
The US printed money, not SG. If SG printed money, SGD will drop like a rock. Our triple A rating will drop straight through B. Interest rates will sky rocket. With devalued SGD, selling property at loss then converting to Yen is just suicidal. But then again, it will never happen. SG has huge surplus and printing money doesn't make sense. It's not worth risking our AAA rating and flirt with inflation/deflation.
Thanks pmet, I begin to see a bit of light. Guess the Durian is dropping and it all depends on the effect of SSB on interest rate.
Hold tight! :)
Stocks down a further 2.5% today. Wow...
I think more durians dropping soon.
Stocks down a further 2.5% today. Wow...
I think more durians dropping soon.
All Masters what do you guys mean by durians dropping? Good to buy or sell now? Stock or Property? What will happen next after Yuan devalue?
For those who holding cash now should hold tight? Those who hold stock should sell or hold? Property price drop a lot (5-10% indifferent)?
Please enlighten. Thanks
All Masters what do you guys mean by durians dropping? Good to buy or sell now? Stock or Property? What will happen next after Yuan devalue?
For those who holding cash now should hold tight? Those who hold stock should sell or hold? Property price drop a lot (5-10% indifferent)?
Please enlighten. Thanks
Not a master here.
I think the Govt is giving a full horse length for first timers with compelling reasons to buy. If you have a good reason and qualify, do go ahead. Great choices, Maoshan Wang, Butter, XO, all kinds of best durians on offer.
If cannot find reason other than nowhere to park additional cash, Govt gives you SSB and advises not to anyhow park money in overseas investments. Beware of fake and poor quality durians. Hold cash also not a bad idea as the population adjusts to the financing and pricing framework. There is risk here only for those with no properties at all.
Not a master here.
I think the Govt is giving a full horse length for first timers with compelling reasons to buy. If you have a good reason and qualify, do go ahead. Great choices, Maoshan Wang, Butter, XO, all kinds of best durians on offer.
If cannot find reason other than nowhere to park additional cash, Govt gives you SSB and advises not to anyhow park money in overseas investments. Beware of fake and poor quality durians. Hold cash also not a bad idea as the population adjusts to the financing and pricing framework. There is risk here only for those with no properties at all.
Thank you Master of masters, very direct and straight forward indeed.
When Durian drop quickly go and pick than eat it, as the time pass the Durian become bad. Got time wait for the Durian to drop, no time go 717 trading, pay a bit more to enjoy the Durian ( 1 kg SGD 28).
Property is like the Durian.
https://scontent-cdg2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t31.0-8/11224546_10205594891084530_7567175679334192643_o.jpg
https://scontent-cdg2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/t31.0-8/10986803_10205594892204558_8372083651350929058_o.jpg
Hold tight! :)
Last property sale was in 1995 when I sell my first Durian, after staying for 7 years, have being buying until now, hand very tired and itchy.
I was in the SAF when the economic was bad and out of the blue we have a 20 million dollar building in the Base, don't know where they get the money ??? Guess must be printed.
The Building don't generated income and need maintenance which cost money ????
But the building to build generated jobs. and maintenance also generated jobs. That it self is a indirect injection of $$$ back to the society to benefit the society.
They pay interest from their budget surplus (in our case we have lots of surplus collected from COE & taxes). Or, they can pay you using the money they raised from another bond sale (like Greece).
2-4% they can use the $$ to build infra , etc and they pay back in the returns over time. ??
He is giving a simple example.
He have more than 3K salary.
3K is the salary not used for 14 years and 2K is the rental income for 14 years.
Total 3x12x14 (504K) + 2x12x14 (336K).
So when he say he have 400K cash he mean it is possible to save that amount.
He also received COLA Cost of Living Allowance when he is oversea and also part of the rent paid by the employer, so he do need to use his Singapore salary and rental income.
he should have don't some equity investment using instalments . what a waste.
But the building to build generated jobs. and maintenance also generated jobs. That it self is a indirect injection of $$$ back to the society to benefit the society.
You are right, notice when there are lot of development on infrastructure. HDB building program slow down.
When they finish, they start to build HDB. Now they going back to infrastructure again.
MAS is good in this but not visible to the general public.
Then will it be a good time to buy overseas/international property then? Particularly, those with low entry point.
Then will it be a good time to buy overseas/international property then? Particularly, those with low entry point.
It depends on how much risk one can take.
Also knowledge of the country.
My Singh friend got a Singh wife from India, he invest in Shop house using little cash in India.
My Chinese Friend got a Chinese wife from China also do the same.
There is no good time or bad time buying property but there is good time or bad time gambling on property.
It depends on how much risk one can take.
Also knowledge of the country.
My Singh friend got a Singh wife from India, he invest in Shop house using little cash in India.
My Chinese Friend got a Chinese wife from China also do the same.
There is no good time or bad time buying property but there is good time or bad time gambling on property.
Master Arcachon, ideally and realistic never go hand in hand. When the market price is 900 psf for specific location my idea price is only 500psf, so never deal. When it really fell to 500psf on that location my idea is only 300psf, so again never deal. Thus it never good time to invest in property. It is all on a person mindset and financial.
If we reverse the situation and improve ourselves financially and changed our mindset it is always good time. When the market price is 900psf for that same location our idea price is also 900psf. It is a deal.
I have seen people buying super sport car without kpkb in Singapore. The car can use for 10 years only and cost more than million. And there are people who kpkb for a condo freehold for 2 million. Some even worst rather gamble away than buying property. All in the mindset.
Very close, you can call me Master sergeant retire. Master cannot still learning.
http://www.uniforminsignia.org/_s/singapore-army-everyday_09.gif
Three roof over my head, 5 room HDB, 2 Bedroom @ Southbank and 3 Bedroom PH @ Terrasse.
You are right it all depends on the mind set of each individual.
When I return to Singapore after 30 month stay in US, most of my colleague buy a car and I took public transport to work.
https://scontent-cdg2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xtf1/t31.0-8/10658893_10203522640639564_4973450536396780183_o.jpg
Some of them ask me why I took public transport should buy a car, I told them I cannot afford.
Toyota Wish cost SGD 60,000 with COE, less than the COE today.
One day overhear a colleague bought 2 Bedroom FH at Geylang Lor 37 for SGD 420,000.
And without second thought I pay cash SGD 108,000 (20%) for a 2 Bedroom @ Southbank in Jun 2006.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzvaHoeckCI
Cars in 2006-2009 were a value proposition provided the usage is divided across all members of a household, plus it can be used to gain additional income to offset the additional costs. The public transport costs for four or five members of the household combined can be higher than that of a car.
At current costs, it's very hard to justify especially for individuals who can travel off peak (earlier or later). But for some families, it's still an unavoidable expenditure due to young children or elderly who cannot travel conveniently.
Very close, you can call me Master sergeant retire. Master cannot still learning.
http://www.uniforminsignia.org/_s/singapore-army-everyday_09.gif
Three roof over my head, 5 room HDB, 2 Bedroom @ Southbank and 3 Bedroom PH @ Terrasse.
You are right it all depends on the mind set of each individual.
When I return to Singapore after 30 month stay in US, most of my colleague buy a car and I took public transport to work.
https://scontent-cdg2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xtf1/t31.0-8/10658893_10203522640639564_4973450536396780183_o.jpg
Some of them ask me why I took public transport should buy a car, I told them I cannot afford.
Toyota Wish cost SGD 60,000 with COE, less than the COE today.
One day overhear a colleague bought 2 Bedroom FH at Geylang Lor 37 for SGD 420,000.
And without second thought I pay cash SGD 108,000 (20%) for a 2 Bedroom @ Southbank in Jun 2006.
invigorated
16-08-15, 16:24
Three roof over my head, 5 room HDB, 2 Bedroom @ Southbank and 3 Bedroom PH @ Terrasse...
And without second thought I pay cash SGD 108,000 (20%) for a 2 Bedroom @ Southbank in Jun 2006.
Not sure about others but i do find your constant echoing of the houses you own quite off-putting.
I don't know how people will see someone wearing a tshirt stating the houses and assets they own and strutting on the streets, do u?
Not sure about others but i do find your constant echoing of the houses you own quite off-putting.
I don't know how people will see someone wearing a tshirt stating the houses and assets they own and strutting on the streets, do u?
I think he is just trying to share his interpretation backed by a real example.
Many of those in the know do not share, or they ask you for a fee to share.
If you read his messages carefully you will find that boasting is the last thing on his mind.
Not sure about others but i do find your constant echoing of the houses you own quite off-putting.
I don't know how people will see someone wearing a tshirt stating the houses and assets they own and strutting on the streets, do u?
You are not the first one to have this feeling.
I have a colleague who have the same feeling as you have and I tell her what another colleague do after he listen to the same message.
The other colleague immediately book a EC and sold his 4 room during the peak.
He just collected his key and when I meet him in Singapore he was very grateful for the message and show me his EC.
How one's interpret the message depends on what is in his heart.
If one's have a sharing heart, he will choose to understand the sharing message.
If one's don't have a sharing heart, he will not understand the message but instead get offended.
It is the same when I over hear my friend purchase, I chose to congrats him and happy for him and want to be like him.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u28gOa9eCLA
What did you do to the gold coin.
http://www.wordgodspells.com/2007/11/21/parable-of-the-ten-gold-coins/
They were nearing Jerusalem, where the Jews were hoping a new kingdom would be established if Jesus was truly the Messiah. Thus, Jesus told them this parable about a nobleman who went abroad to receive a kingdom and then return: Calling ten of his servants, he gave them ten gold coins, and said to them, ‘Invest these till I return.’ But his citizens hated him and sent a delegation after him, saying, ‘We do not want this man to reign over us.’ Upon his return with the kingship, he summoned the servants that he might know what they had gained by trading. The first came before him, saying, ‘Lord, your money has made ten additional ones.’ And he said to him, ‘Well done, good servant! Because you have been faithful in a very little, you shall have authority over ten cities.’ And the second came, saying, ‘Lord, your gold coins have made 5 more.’ And he said to him, ‘Come rule over five cities.’ But one came saying, ‘Lord, here is your gold coin, which I kept laid away in a napkin; for I was afraid of you, because you are a severe man; you take up what you did not lay down, and reap what you did not sow.’ He said to him, ‘Your own words have condemned you, you wicked servant! If you knew I was a severe man, then why did you not put my money in the bank, and I could have collected it with interest?’ And he said to those who stood by, ‘Take the gold coin from him, and give it to him who has the ten. I tell you, that to every one who has will more be given; but from him who has not, even what he has will be taken away. But as for these enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, bring them here and slay them before me.'” And when he had said this, he went on ahead, going up to Jerusalem.
Reflection
Jesus told this parable to illustrate four kinds of people. The first two are His true and faithful servants who make good use of the gifts He has entrusted to them, each according to his capabilities. The third type are the unreliable followers, those who just “come along for the ride” but are sadly lacking in any personal commitment or even initiative. The last kind are the worst of the lot, who reject Him as their Master, and even conspire against Him. These deserve the most severe punishment.
I believe our Lord taught this parable not so much for the benefit of His apostles and closest followers, (who gained authority over cities), nor for His enemies, (the scribes, pharisees and high priests), who rejected Him. His lesson was intended for the great masses of people who are uncommitted or lukewarm, or for some reason are afraid to take the leap of faith. Jesus seems to be telling them: “From him who has no faith, even the little that he has will be taken away.” Most Christians belong to this “third category” of Christ’s servants, who fill up His churches on Sundays and holy days of obligation, but are mostly ignorant about His Word. Their idea of God is a Severe Disciplinarian Whose rules and statutes must be strictly followed, but Whose Good News of salvation is “kept laid away” like their unopened Bible, gathering dust on a shelf. God has given each one of us a ‘gold coin’ or gift that we can use in propagating His kingdom here on earth. He does not expect that we can multiply His capital in our life five or ten times over. But at least let us give back to Him some “interest” for His investment, lest we lose our most precious possession.
Thank You, Father God, for Your gift of faith. May we use the talent that You have given us to propagate Your Good News in our community and places of work. Amen.
http://www.ccsales.com/the_richest_man_in_babylon.pdf
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2ft-C2rb8I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uyRAzEGWYrM
Not sure about others but i do find your constant echoing of the houses you own quite off-putting.
I don't know how people will see someone wearing a tshirt stating the houses and assets they own and strutting on the streets, do u?
I salute Master sergeant for his willingness to share, unlike some Masters here who are either misleading or spreading fears. 秋后孔明
You should be very fearful of the property market now, because Singapore has 1 of the hardest hitting property cooling measures!!!!!!!!!!!!
Since their introduction, property prices have been going in a down trend, for 7 straight quarters already.............. More down-side to come as the train diving towards the bottom can't be stopped, even if property cooling measures have been removed immediately! (It will take a lot lot more effort than just removing the property cooling measures to reverse the down-trend!!!!!!!!!!!) :grief:
I salute Master sergeant for his willingness to share, unlike some Masters here who are either misleading or spreading fears.
I salute Master sergeant for his willingness to share, unlike some Masters here who are either misleading or spreading fears. 秋后孔明
totally agree coz those shit smearer have agenda .
You should be very fearful of the property market now, because Singapore has 1 of the hardest hitting property cooling measures!!!!!!!!!!!!
Since their introduction, property prices have been going in a down trend, for 7 straight quarters already.............. More down-side to come as the train diving towards the bottom can't be stopped, even if property cooling measures have been removed immediately! (It will take a lot lot more effort than just removing the property cooling measures to reverse the down-trend!!!!!!!!!!!) :grief:
Agree 7 straight quarters down trend, Anyone selling 2 Bedroom 958 sqft @ Southbank for SGD 1,000,000.
http://www.propertyguru.com.sg/project-listings/southbank-91/sale/1?sort=price&order=asc
http://www.propertyguru.com.sg/listing/17824495/for-sale-southbank
You should be very fearful of the property market now, because Singapore has 1 of the hardest hitting property cooling measures!!!!!!!!!!!!
Since their introduction, property prices have been going in a down trend, for 7 straight quarters already.............. More down-side to come as the train diving towards the bottom can't be stopped, even if property cooling measures have been removed immediately! (It will take a lot lot more effort than just removing the property cooling measures to reverse the down-trend!!!!!!!!!!!) :grief:
Master Bear , I have been fearful since crisis after crisis. I started to involve in the forum so I can understand more.
I dun understand why govt wanted to push down the price than to stablise it. Perhaps u can enlighten. If that is true why after 2020 they change their policy.
First look at the fundamental.
Buy a property and you pay 20%, the rest loan.
The mortgage ++ you pay each month should be less than the rental income you collect each month, you need to add maintenance, property tax, agent fee, wear and tear, interest rate, etc into the mortgage .
When the fundamental change and mortgage ++ become more than the rental each month and people are still buying, something bad is going to happen.
When the rent raise too high, the cost is added to the cost of business and business profit start to go down. Job start to lost and tenants start to have problem to pay.
They cannot push down or raise the price of property because time will remove the effectiveness of the control measure.
All the infrastructure which cost Billion of Dollars need to come from somewhere.
When property drop, just like COE and Share it is very hard to stop.
For property they can start to remove the control measure and add measure to encourage buying, it will still take time of it to be effective, just like DPS before all the control measure.
If one can wait then it is good to wait till all the control measure is remove, but it might take 10 to 20 years or 1 to 2 years for Major crisis.
invigorated
17-08-15, 00:03
You are not the first one to have this feeling.
I have a colleague who have the same feeling as you have and I tell her what another colleague do after he listen to the same message.
The other colleague immediately book a EC and sold his 4 room during the peak.
He just collected his key and when I meet him in Singapore he was very grateful for the message and show me his EC.
It's great that you are sharing but at almost every other thread the same words are repeated. Just like you see your friend who was grateful that you shared that message, you will have a few more like myself who just see someone boasting about his properties.
I don't know you in person and perhaps I would understand you better on why you do so if i do know u. Just commenting on it as what i have read from your posts.
I only know that if many if us were to do the same in real life, we would lose a few friends and piss off a few family members. Imho, it's great to share once or twice but harping on it like a broken record is...
It's great that you are sharing but at almost every other thread the same words are repeated. Just like you see your friend who was grateful that you shared that message, you will have a few more like myself who just see someone boasting about his properties.
I don't know you in person and perhaps I would understand you better on why you do so if i do know u. Just commenting on it as what i have read from your posts.
I only know that if many if us were to do the same in real life, we would lose a few friends and piss off a few family members. Imho, it's great to share once or twice but harping on it like a broken record is...
Noted. Thks.
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