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princess_morbucks
17-06-14, 17:17
https://sg.news.yahoo.com/prs-leaving-singapore-allowed-keep-160000226.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter


What enrages you more? The fact that you can’t cash out your Central Provident Fund (CPF) account unless you renounce your citizenship, or that Singapore Permanent Residents (PRs) can withdraw all of their CPF funds AND Housing and Development Board (HDB) sales proceeds with them when they leave Singapore?
Understandably, you’re pissed off because it’s not fair that someone from another country can take part in your social security program (CPF), use it as a glorified saving account, and withdraw all of it when he/she moves back home.
Let’s not forget the property issue as well. A PR flipping his/her property before leaving Singapore can easily make several hundred thousand dollars – more than enough to buy a huge landed property in 75% of the world.
These are issues that beg the question, “Should PRs be allowed to cash out whenever it’s convenient, or should they pay their fair share?”

The CPF “Cash Out” Issue
The issue of CPF withdrawal has become an increasingly hot topic among Singaporeans. That’s because Singaporeans feel frustrated that they have little control over when and how much money they can withdraw.
In fact, an ex-CPF employee confirmed that in our article about the 3 Biggest Complaints Singaporeans Have About Their CPF Accounts. CPF is a well-intentioned social security system, but it’s not very flexible – you can’t use it if you get retrenched or have a major financial emergency, even if you have $100,000+ in your CPF account.
PRs also contribute to CPF and benefit from many of the social programs offered to Singapore citizens. However, unlike Singaporeans, they can withdraw all of their CPF account after renouncing their PR status.
Well, you can too – if you renounce your citizenship.
In a way, CPF is also like a piggy bank that gives PRs access to a “savings account” that gives them 2.5% interest, which is exponentially better than the “normal” savings account interest rate in Singapore, which is 0.01%-0.05%!
Recently, CNA reported that according to Manpower Minister Tan Chuan-Jin, over the last decade more than $4 billion dollars (avg. $426 million each year) was withdrawn from CPF members leaving Singapore.
Currently, CPF doesn’t track how much is withdrawn by PRs and former Singapore citizens. But does that really matter? After all, if there are more PRs cashing out, it shows that they’re just using CPF as a piggy that they can crack open before heading home.
And if a higher percentage of ex-Singaporeans are the ones cashing out, what does that say about the system, especially if these former citizens are leaving Singapore because of the inflexibility of CPF?

The HDB Flat “Flipping” Issue
“Flipping” property boils down to this simple definition – purchasing real estate below market value and selling the property when the market rises, usually within a short period of time. For people who flip property, their intention isn’t to live there “permanently,” but to sell it for a profit.
In terms of citizens and PRs, who do you think is more likely to buy a property and live in it on a “permanent” basis?
The answer is a no-brainer, and that’s what angers Singaporeans – the fact that PRs jumping ship to go home can just “flip” their property and leave Singapore like a bandit walking out of a bank.
Of course, Singapore does have the Seller Stamp Duty (SSD), which is meant to prevent short-term “flipping” by imposing a tax of:
16% of the price or market value (whichever is higher) if you sell within 1 year
12% of the price or market value (whichever is higher) if you sell within 2 years
8% of the price or market value (whichever is higher) if you sell within 3 years
4% of the price or market value (whichever is higher) if you sell within 4 years
However, four years isn’t a very long time. While the SSD inflicts enough financial pain to discourage short-term flipping, it won’t do much to dissuade a PR from selling his property, especially since most PRs are in Singapore for a longer period of time.

What Can Be Done to Ensure PRs Pay Their Fair Share?
“Permanent Resident,” isn’t that term ironic? Think about it, many don’t even stay and contribute to Singapore “permanently.” But this isn’t what infuriates most Singaporeans.
What really pisses Singaporeans off is how incredibly easy it is for PRs to “escape” Singapore and go back home after they’ve made their fortune. Singaporeans don’t have that option – there’s no place to escape to.
There’s no way you can ever “cash out” of the system – unless you renounce your citizenship. Where’s the fairness in giving PRs the ability to cash out without any sort of penalty?
Change has to come from the top. There’s no way around that. So what can be done to ensure there’s more “fairness” in the way the government handles PRs who choose to renounce their status?
Here are a few humble suggestions to ensure PRs pay their fair share and aren’t given “preference” over Singaporeans when it comes to their CPF accounts and property sales:
Impose a Tax on PRs Withdrawing All Their CPF (ex. 20% Withdrawal Tax)
Impose a 10% Lifetime Seller Stamp Duty (SSD) on PRs Selling Their Homes Unless They Become Citizens
Give PRs a Lower CPF OA Interest Rate Unless They Become Citizens (ex. 1% lower than Citizens)
PRs Renouncing their Status Must Sell Any Property They Own
PRs Renouncing their Status Cannot Regain It a Second Time
These are just a few suggestions that can help alleviate some of the anger Singaporeans feel about PRs who leave the country after making their fortunes.

Arcachon
17-06-14, 17:25
http://www.straitstimes.com/breaking-news/singapore/story/new-3-year-waiting-period-permanent-residents-buy-resale-flats-2013082


Three-year waiting period for PRs to buy resale flats
PUBLISHED ON AUG 27, 2013 5:30 PM 4585 248 0 12
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- See more at: http://www.straitstimes.com/breaking-news/singapore/story/new-3-year-waiting-period-permanent-residents-buy-resale-flats-2013082#sthash.4gAqBekm.dpuf

Newly-minted Singapore permanent residents will now have to wait three years before buying a resale public flat, instead of straightaway after they become PRs.

The change, announced by National Development Minister Khaw Boon Wan, applies to resale applications received on or after 5.30pm on Tuesday.

There were 51,000 Housing Board flats fully owned by permanent residents as of end June, representing 6 per cent of all HDB flats, said Mr Khaw in a written parliamentary reply this month.

This year, 130 flats were sold by PRs within three years of their purchase, while 320 were sold within four years of purchase, and 490 within five years.

http://forum.singaporeexpats.com/ntopic96959.html

Interesting. I had never tracked how much I have spent on rent so far. I just calculated.I have already spent about 75k on rent in the last 4 years. It would have been even higher had there not been brief periods(12 months) when my wife was in India for our child birth etc and I had rented a common room.

But I have also saved about 300k SGD in the last 4 years which I wouldn't have been able to if I stayed in India or been in any other country. So I am not complaining

Arcachon
17-06-14, 17:39
http://www.hdb.gov.sg/fi10/fi10321p.nsf/w/BuyResaleFlatEthnicIntegrationPolicy_EIP?OpenDocument

SPR Quota

Singapore Permanent Resident (SPR) families applying to buy a resale flat will have to meet the SPR quota, in addition to the set ethnic group proportions under EIP. The SPR quota ensures that SPR families can better integrate into the local community for social cohesion and to prevent enclaves forming in the public housing estates. The quota will only apply to non-Malaysian SPRs. Malaysian SPRs will not be subject to the SPR quota, in view of their close cultural and historical similarities with Singaporeans.

http://mycpf.cpf.gov.sg/NR/exeres/3D0D66F9-0085-4FD5-9CB5-35B55C0ADA53,frameless.htm

Year of Singapore Permanent Resident (SPR) Status


CPF contributions are payable once a foreign employee obtains SPR status.

To help the SPR employee adjust to the lower take-home pay, both the employer and SPR employee will contribute to CPF at graduated rates for the first two years. From the third year onwards, both the employer and SPR employee will contribute to CPF at full rates (i.e. rates applicable for a Singapore Citizen employee). The table below shows the start and end dates for each year of SPR status.

Arcachon
17-06-14, 17:57
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=684273344934058&set=a.267436009951129.78750.219848181376579&type=1&theater

(f) Requiring Singapore Permanent Resident Households to Wait Three Years

18 Currently, Singapore Permanent Resident (SPR) households, i.e. SPR households with no Singapore citizen owner, may buy resale HDB flats as soon as they acquire SPR status.

19 We have reviewed this policy and have decided that SPR households should wait three years from the date of obtaining SPR status, before they can buy a resale HDB flat.

20 This measure will apply to resale applications received on or after 27 Aug 2013, 5:30pm.

http://app.mnd.gov.sg/Newsroom/NewsPage.aspx?ID=4767&category=Press%20Release&year=2013&RA1=&RA2=&RA3=

minority
17-06-14, 18:01
Then the question is should singaporean even benefit from HDB sales too? Its after all housing they should not be allow to benefit from it.

Condem them to a lower class without the ability to participate in the country growth? Should that be the myopic way singaporean think?

I can't get u shan't have. Even if I can get anything thou shan't have either.

Should people behave like a narrow-minded xenpohic Singaporean?

Arcachon
17-06-14, 18:12
Everyone have a choice, choose to complain or choose to profit from it.

Peter and John was staying in a small island.

Peter choose to complain everyday about the policy the government make and John choose to profit from all the policy the government make. Both spend their time doing what they like most.

Guess who is better off.

sandbox
17-06-14, 18:17
Then the question is should singaporean even benefit from HDB sales too? Its after all housing they should not be allow to benefit from it.

Condem them to a lower class without the ability to participate in the country growth? Should that be the myopic way singaporean think?

I can't get u shan't have. Even if I can get anything thou shan't have either.

Should people behave like a narrow-minded xenpohic Singaporean?


You can't blame Singaporeans. Males have to do 2 years NS and 10 years of reservist cycle. They sacrifice their time and life for the country. Shouldn't they at least deserve some national priority or benefits compared to PR? :o

my2cents
17-06-14, 18:53
You can't blame Singaporeans. Males have to do 2 years NS and 10 years of reservist cycle. They sacrifice their time and life for the country. Shouldn't they at least deserve some national priority or benefits compared to PR? :o

Agreed but also disagreed, there are many areas PRs need to pay more, medical for a start and landed property, HDB BTO and many Sporeans national goodies etc, they are not entitle and allow to. But NS and reservist is a good point too. PRs here contributes too, not very fair to be hostile, many hv even given up their citizenship just to be in Spore.

my2cents
17-06-14, 19:01
Everyone have a choice, choose to complain or choose to profit from it.

Peter and John was staying in a small island.

Peter choose to complain everyday about the policy the government make and John choose to profit from all the policy the government make. Both spend their time doing what they like most.

Guess who is better off.

How true, recent HDB Resale price falling benefits who ? not Sporeans, Sporeans should stick to BTO and sell resales later to make good use of their asset and money, let it be upgrade, downgrade, cash out or good reason. Complain for a short sighted and wrong cause !

Kelonguni
17-06-14, 20:49
Everyone have a choice, choose to complain or choose to profit from it.

Peter and John was staying in a small island.

Peter choose to complain everyday about the policy the government make and John choose to profit from all the policy the government make. Both spend their time doing what they like most.

Guess who is better off.

The problem is that for every John there is, there are nine Peters. Petering is human nature.

Sandiwara
17-06-14, 22:37
I do not understand why some citizen hate PR so much. If we thing about PR is like guest that knock to your frond door. Then the ask, can they come in. They are like a guest, they do not come quietly in the night. Please being more objective to PR.

Arcachon
17-06-14, 22:42
I do not understand why some citizen hate PR so much. If we thing about PR is like guest that knock to your frond door. Then the ask, can they come in. They are like a guest, they do not come quietly in the night. Please being more objective to PR.

Just because of a few Vocal Minority you think Majority of the citizen hate PR ????????:doh:

Sandiwara
17-06-14, 23:10
Just because of a few Vocal Minority you think Majority of the citizen hate PR ????????:doh:

I use word some, I do not use word Majority. Please do not put word on my mouth.

Arcachon
18-06-14, 00:49
I use word some, I do not use word Majority. Please do not put word on my mouth.

Please accept my my apology for the mistake, I am glad you know some and not Majority.