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View Full Version : Is this a good strategy? Developer ABSD rebate only for buyers with >=1 properties??



sunboy77
24-05-14, 15:20
What do you guys think?

That means buyers who have not owned a property (i.e. not affected by ABSD) will not get to enjoy such discount. That means, it is not a gimmicky "ABSD rebate" that many other developers are currently using.

Heard it might happen at Prince Charles Crescent soon. For a high-end product, guess it might work because those with deeper pockets for a premium product usually would have already owned their first or second or more properties. Relieving them of ABSD might entice them to buy.

See Jonathan 96882200's dropbox for more info. (https://www.dropbox.com/sh/ax6p4qq4eb12bdz/AADuxvIxEAdgNJ5srTVJ71ula)

Kelonguni
24-05-14, 15:40
Price discrimination. Is it even legal? Then is equivalent to Govt removing ABSD. Will it even be allowed?


What do you guys think?

That means buyers who have not owned a property (i.e. not affected by ABSD) will not get to enjoy such discount. That means, it is not a gimmicky "ABSD rebate" that many other developers are currently using.

Heard it might happen at Prince Charles Crescent soon. For a high-end product, guess it might work because those with deeper pockets for a premium product usually would have already owned their first or second or more properties. Relieving them of ABSD might entice them to buy.

See Jonathan 96882200's dropbox for more info. (https://www.dropbox.com/sh/ax6p4qq4eb12bdz/AADuxvIxEAdgNJ5srTVJ71ula)

yowetan
24-05-14, 15:59
What do you guys think?

That means buyers who have not owned a property (i.e. not affected by ABSD) will not get to enjoy such discount. That means, it is not a gimmicky "ABSD rebate" that many other developers are currently using.

Heard it might happen at Prince Charles Crescent soon. For a high-end product, guess it might work because those with deeper pockets for a premium product usually would have already owned their first or second or more properties. Relieving them of ABSD might entice them to buy.

See Jonathan 96882200's dropbox for more info. (https://www.dropbox.com/sh/ax6p4qq4eb12bdz/AADuxvIxEAdgNJ5srTVJ71ula)

Is it a genuine discount or just another markup with gimmick?

sunboy77
24-05-14, 16:32
Price discrimination. Is it even legal? Then is equivalent to Govt removing ABSD. Will it even be allowed?

Hmm... isn't this what the government had wanted - to cool prices?

Anyway, selling an unit that faces the bin centre at a cheaper price over one that is facing the pool is also a kind of price differentiation ma. Different target group, different price.

It is legal as long as any discounts/ reimbursements/ etc. are declared to Controller of Housing.

sunboy77
24-05-14, 16:33
Is it a genuine discount or just another markup with gimmick?

Genuine discount. Cos those not paying ABSD will not have such a discount.

value
24-05-14, 16:58
Genuine discount. Cos those not paying ABSD will not have such a discount.

It's an excellent idea to level the playing field

Werther
24-05-14, 16:58
Is it a genuine discount or just another markup with gimmick?

Possible genuine discount. I remembered d.leedon during the launch, also give more discounts for buyers who bought their property from them before, staying within x distance and children studinging around that farrer location, all get additional discounts.

DC33_2008
24-05-14, 17:05
Developer should give loyalty card. :D

Kelonguni
24-05-14, 17:17
Hmm... isn't this what the government had wanted - to cool prices?

Anyway, selling an unit that faces the bin centre at a cheaper price over one that is facing the pool is also a kind of price differentiation ma. Different target group, different price.

It is legal as long as any discounts/ reimbursements/ etc. are declared to Controller of Housing.

That means to say second time buyers are not subjected to ABSD, which defeats the purpose of having ABSD to begin with.

Price differentiation is different from discrimination. What will first time buyers think?

DC33_2008
24-05-14, 17:22
Life is always unfair.
That means to say second time buyers are not subjected to ABSD, which defeats the purpose of having ABSD to begin with.

Price differentiation is different from discrimination. What will first time buyers think?

sunboy77
24-05-14, 18:37
That means to say second time buyers are not subjected to ABSD, which defeats the purpose of having ABSD to begin with.

Price differentiation is different from discrimination. What will first time buyers think?

Like Werther had mentioned, some developments give different discounts to different buyers - what work distance discount la, proximity discount la, distance from kids' school discount la, loyalty discount la.

This is really no different.

I guess this developer knows that most people who buy this product are mainly the 2nd or 3rd or more timers...

Kelonguni
24-05-14, 18:57
Like Werther had mentioned, some developments give different discounts to different buyers - what work distance discount la, proximity discount la, distance from kids' school discount la, loyalty discount la.

This is really no different.

I guess this developer knows that most people who buy this product are mainly the 2nd or 3rd or more timers...

Honestly I don't mind since I also benefit.

But unlikely to materialise. Developers have to fork out in advance and this will affect their cash flow.

When it comes to that, it means developers are desperate...

sunboy77
24-05-14, 18:59
But unlikely to materialise. Developers have to fork out in advance and this will affect their cash flow.


No, developer will not pay for the buyer first. Likely to be done using the method of 'reimbursement'.

Kelonguni
24-05-14, 19:37
I see. In that case it is just like a discount of 7% disguised and targeted for second time buyers. But turn off for first time buyers that's what I mean.

CCR
24-05-14, 21:01
Just indicate absorb stamp duty and absd..... so all buy at same price...... no a price discrimination, coz actual outlay of all buyers the same

teddybear
24-05-14, 21:24
ABSD itself is introduction of discrimination, like discriminate against non-first time buyers, discriminate against PRs, discriminate against foreigners! :rolleyes:


That means to say second time buyers are not subjected to ABSD, which defeats the purpose of having ABSD to begin with.

Price differentiation is different from discrimination. What will first time buyers think?

sunboy77
25-05-14, 00:00
ABSD itself is introduction of discrimination, like discriminate against non-first time buyers, discriminate against PRs, discriminate against foreigners! :rolleyes:

Wah teddy! This is so well-said!!!
*Where is the LIKE button?*

Kelonguni
25-05-14, 01:14
ABSD itself is introduction of discrimination, like discriminate against non-first time buyers, discriminate against PRs, discriminate against foreigners! :rolleyes:

There is an articulable rationale for ABSD, primarily to help first time buyers and prevent runaway prices. If discount for all still ok. But if remove only for second time buyers it seems to undo the plan... Isn't it helping the rich to get richer? Very kelong leh.

timmy
25-05-14, 01:34
There is an articulable rationale for ABSD, primarily to help first time buyers and prevent runaway prices. If discount for all still ok. But if remove only for second time buyers it seems to undo the plan... Isn't it helping the rich to get richer? Very kelong leh.

Rationale for ABSD not so clear cut. It is a money spinner for gahment. Also, Like all other forms of taxes, this introduces deadweight loss to the society. :tsk-tsk:

teddybear
25-05-14, 01:39
ABSD + TDSR together helps to eliminate many people from buying and helps the rich to get richer anyway (because only they have fire-power to buy more through re-mortgaging or through company loans and many other financing means) since ABSD+TDSR will cause property prices to drop or even crash............. :beats-me-man:

This is the same as saying implementing and raising GST is to help the poor because the rich will pay more in GST BUT rationale and in-depth calculation will show otherwise when top tier income tax has been reduced from 30% to 20/18%...................... :rolleyes:


There is an articulable rationale for ABSD, primarily to help first time buyers and prevent runaway prices. If discount for all still ok. But if remove only for second time buyers it seems to undo the plan... Isn't it helping the rich to get richer? Very kelong leh.

Kelonguni
25-05-14, 02:32
ABSD + TDSR together helps to eliminate many people from buying and helps the rich to get richer anyway (because only they have fire-power to buy more through re-mortgaging or through company loans and many other financing means) since ABSD+TDSR will cause property prices to drop or even crash............. :beats-me-man:

This is the same as saying implementing and raising GST is to help the poor because the rich will pay more in GST BUT rationale and in-depth calculation will show otherwise when top tier income tax has been reduced from 30% to 20/18%...................... :rolleyes:

I see mostly middle income groups buying in show flats leh. Bumped into some old friends. And many from this forum are also still considered middle income or started there. Of cos occasionally there is the joker who buys 10 units with suitcases of cash, but those are really rare.

The way I see it, ABSD and TDSR slows everything down so more people get a chance.

The really rich won't catch a falling knife or one that has a risk of falling. They have too many better and safer instruments available. Property play is for the average dude the way I see it.

Without the measures, everything would have gone into developers and real estate agents pockets. Nothing against them, but I feel that there is a need to level it for more.

teddybear
25-05-14, 02:41
The way you say seems to be like ABSD+TDSR has created a pit fall for the middle income groups to buy and fall into and digging a grave for themselves while the rich has many other better and safer investment instruments available? Like that ABSD looks like a trap to stop the rich from buying properties while digging a hole for the middle income groups to jump into? :beats-me-man:


I see mostly middle income groups buying in show flats leh. Bumped into some old friends. And many from this forum are also still considered middle income or started there. Of cos occasionally there is the joker who buys 10 units with suitcases of cash, but those are really rare.

The way I see it, ABSD and TDSR slows everything down so more people get a chance.

The really rich won't catch a falling knife or one that has a risk of falling. They have too many better and safer instruments available. Property play is for the average dude the way I see it.

Without the measures, everything would have gone into developers and real estate agents pockets. Nothing against them, but I feel that there is a need to level it for more.

Kelonguni
25-05-14, 10:16
The way you say seems to be like ABSD+TDSR has created a pit fall for the middle income groups to buy and fall into and digging a grave for themselves while the rich has many other better and safer investment instruments available? Like that ABSD looks like a trap to stop the rich from buying properties while digging a hole for the middle income groups to jump into? :beats-me-man:

I don't mean that. The rich has other tax free ways to access for eg hedge funds, stocks that do not incur capital gains.

Property investment entry and gains has taxes wedged in everywhere so it suits low to middle income more.

ABSD and TDSR addresses the quick gains so that the really rich and the high middle income look into other areas to invest.

Kelonguni
25-05-14, 10:35
I meant capital gains tax. The richest normal background friend I know has switched from property play into stocks since 2012 when property gains tapered. His consistent yield no matter what he is into is always more than 10%.

I think the idea is to continually measure investment amount against yields.

amk
25-05-14, 11:31
Just indicate absorb stamp duty and absd..... so all buy at same price......

HK developers have already been doing that for the past 1y in HK. Eventually this will come to SG. I mentioned several times in the various threads HK developers were doing this and wondered when SG developers will follow. FEO already started doing this for a few projects. If adopted by more big developers this will further dampen the secondary market.

august
25-05-14, 13:58
I see mostly middle income groups buying in show flats leh. Bumped into some old friends. And many from this forum are also still considered middle income or started there. Of cos occasionally there is the joker who buys 10 units with suitcases of cash, but those are really rare.

The way I see it, ABSD and TDSR slows everything down so more people get a chance.

The really rich won't catch a falling knife or one that has a risk of falling. They have too many better and safer instruments available. Property play is for the average dude the way I see it.

Without the measures, everything would have gone into developers and real estate agents pockets. Nothing against them, but I feel that there is a need to level it for more.

the really rich wont catch falling knife?
peter lim bought over 10 units of duo at one go, i wonder is that a falling knife...

yowetan
25-05-14, 15:24
the really rich wont catch falling knife?
peter lim bought over 10 units of duo at one go, i wonder is that a falling knife...

Peter Lim can afford to throw money.

Kelonguni
25-05-14, 16:32
the really rich wont catch falling knife?
peter lim bought over 10 units of duo at one go, i wonder is that a falling knife...

There may be other reasons. For own stay he has the habit of buying whole levels. Or maybe buy in company name.

If the upside is that much plus no ABSD he would have bought the whole building.

newbie11
25-05-14, 17:31
He need to buy a club and he did

teddybear
25-05-14, 17:52
Since 2012? Too slow I suppose? If he is so slow, how can he be sure he can get out at the right time? He may get out of stocks too late or get out too early again?
In this respect, properties are probably better investment for people who can't get their timing right. :beats-me-man:


I meant capital gains tax. The richest normal background friend I know has switched from property play into stocks since 2012 when property gains tapered. His consistent yield no matter what he is into is always more than 10%.

I think the idea is to continually measure investment amount against yields.

Kelonguni
25-05-14, 18:18
Since 2012? Too slow I suppose? If he is so slow, how can he be sure he can get out at the right time? He may get out of stocks too late or get out too early again?
In this respect, properties are probably better investment for people who can't get their timing right. :beats-me-man:

In an up market he earns. Down market he also earns.

Don't just depend on STI.

How I know his gains? I buy upon his recommendations.

Kelonguni
25-05-14, 18:42
Since 2012? Too slow I suppose? If he is so slow, how can he be sure he can get out at the right time? He may get out of stocks too late or get out too early again?
In this respect, properties are probably better investment for people who can't get their timing right. :beats-me-man:

Anyway he did not start in 2012. Long time back already. My message stated he switched in 2012 from property play mix to mainly stocks for yield and because of the Govt regulations.

Personally I do support some kinds of property.