View Full Version : Landed Property Owners are sitting on Gold Mine
... according to squarefoot.com.sg
"The private landed residential segment has outperformed its non‐landed counterpart for 12 consecutive quarters since 1Q10. Property prices have appreciated by 85.9% and 60.8% respectively in 4Q13 since the trough in 2Q09. However, there is more to it than just price performance when it comes to landed properties. We uncover a sub‐segment that has an unfair advantage."
Read more in https://www.squarefoot.com.sg/phocadownload/mar-14-sitting-on-goldmine.pdf
blackjack21trader
12-04-14, 07:51
Got price no buyers also no use.
有价无市。
WILL CRASH 40% BY 4 JUNE 2014.
Its important to remember that even gold also has its limit.
blackjack21trader
12-04-14, 10:23
Its important to remember that even gold also has its limit.
Yes, that is correct.
Got price no buyers also no use.
有价无市。
WILL CRASH 40% BY 4 JUNE 2014.
That's right, 英雄无用武之地 in current market conditions.
Also, landed mainly for own stay. Sell high also must buy high as a replacement.
The couple claimed that the 1997 reverse mortgage valued their house at $2.1 million, and based on a loan to valuation ratio of at most 80%, they were given $495,000 cash to pay off their previous mortgage and payments of up to $2,000 a month.
In May 2004, the couple were told the value of their house had dropped to $1.1 million and they were in breach of the 80% loan to valuation limit, based on the outstanding loan amount of $926,000.
According to the couple, they were told to top up $46,400 to bring the ratio down to the 80% limit, and their monthly payments of $2,000 were reduced in steps to $1,500 from October that year.
A year later, in October 2005, NTUC Income said the outstanding loan, at $1.014 million, exceeded the 80% limit based on the property value of $1.15 million. The couple were told they would get just $300 a month until June 2006, after which the company would 'exercise (its) right to recall the property for auction sale'. The couple could also procure a buyer on their own or find another place to stay, according to a letter from NTUC Income, the couple said.
By then, the couple had owed $1,045,802.91. On June 2006, solicitors for NTUC Income sent the couple a letter demanding repayment or else face legal proceedings.
The couple handed over possession of their property on Aug 2006. The property was later sold for just over $1 million, leaving an alleged shortfall of about $55,000, which the couple were asked to pay. They claimed that if not for NTUC Income's letter, they would not have sold the property - which in 2008 was again sold for about $1.5 million.
The case mentioned is probably a good reference for those who are thinking of taking up a reverse mortgage. If such loan is taken when the property market is buoyant, the borrower may risk having to "force sell" their property when the market turns sour. For a product touted as a retirement tool, the wife and I definitely do not think it's as safe as they are made out to be. It may well be better off for seniors to fund their retirements through proceeds from "downgrading" to a smaller/less expensive property.
As to the outcome of the lawsuit between NTUC and the couple, we are unable to find any verdict on the case. So if any of our readers know, do share!
http://sgproptalk.blogspot.fr/2012/11/reverse-mortgage-for-better-retirement.html
Like gold, despite its limited supply, consumers will only be willing to pay up to a certain price level before they start questioning its value and look for alternatives.
FH landed in prime area is buy to hold for long term. Treat it as a treasure. ;)
... according to squarefoot.com.sg
"The private landed residential segment has outperformed its non‐landed counterpart for 12 consecutive quarters since 1Q10. Property prices have appreciated by 85.9% and 60.8% respectively in 4Q13 since the trough in 2Q09. However, there is more to it than just price performance when it comes to landed properties. We uncover a sub‐segment that has an unfair advantage."
Read more in https://www.squarefoot.com.sg/phocadownload/mar-14-sitting-on-goldmine.pdf
princess_morbucks
12-04-14, 19:52
Got price no buyers also no use.
有价无市。
WILL CRASH 40% BY 4 JUNE 2014.
Bro bj, I remember you said the small landed will crash, right?
The bigger ones will not crash cos there will hardly be any sellers if the buyer doesn't give in to the seller's price.
FH landed in prime area is buy to hold for long term. Treat it as a treasure. ;)
Yes, it is a treasure not meant to be sold but to hold and pass down to future generation.:)
Got price no buyers also no use.
有价无市。
WILL CRASH 40% BY 4 JUNE 2014.
June to sept. should able to see interesting prices going down significantly
now already down abit
Lots of people cashed up waiting to buy landed though. So even if there is a drop it is likely to be moderate. A big crash will only be triggered by external events. A black swam which is extremely hard to predict.
Dunno why got so many sour grapes or wishful thinking peeps here waiting for landed property price to crash. So they can buy at price levels which they missed previously? :D
Landed are mostly bought by the towkays or senior execs, so price sustainability is there. Unless business not doing well or overall economy slips into recession, you will not see a big crash in landed prices.
Assuming there is recession, if the towkays have to force sell their landed at low prices during such difficult times to keep the businesses going, the employees who stay in condos or HDBs will suffer first (first to let go to cut costs), not the towkays. So the premium of landed over condo/HDBs is always maintained. No such thing as landed prices drop significantly and yet condos/HDBs remain intact or growing.
Have frds who sold their landed few years back and been renting condos, waiting for landed price to drop so can buy back again. They are still waiting and waiting....:)
Let me say something based on what I know : First, you have to differentiate landed as in "Good Class Bungalows" or just any tom-dick-harry type of terrace houses and Semi-Ds. The latter 2 plentiful in the olden days. I will focus on the latter 2 which is happening now:
1) Many of these properties are probably at the end of life of 1st generation or in the hand of 2nd generation.
2) Those in the hand of 1st generation when they die will pass to 2nd generation.
3) Many 2nd generation likely will sell to split the inheritance.
4) Those 2nd generation that didn't sell have little ability to rebuild the house after 40 years (because they are not rich on their own and only have that landed properties of some value) when the house is run-down and leaking everywhere. Thereafter, they will end up selling.
5) As such, there will be many many landed properties coming into the open market for sale in next 10 years.
Above I touch on supply side. Next I touch on the demand side:
a) Most younger generation now will prefer condos to landed.
b) Most younger generation has not enough money to buy landed with such big built-up area because they are just not rich enough (vs the price of landed). They can only afford properties mostly <$1.5m range.
c) Those younger generation who want landed living has no ability to buy the old landed and rebuild because of cash-flow, and now also TDSR.
d) Worst of all, people who can best afford landed don't even want to live in landed! We prefer to live in "bungalow-in-the-sky" condos!
The number of people wanting to buy landed and able to afford landed are just too small!
Looking at the supply and demand side for landed properties, the future pricing and demand for those tom-dick-harry run-of-the-mill landed properties (other than "Good-class-bungalows) are really bleak indeed! :doh:
I strongly agree with BJ21:
Got price no buyers also no use.
有价无市。
Dunno why got so many sour grapes or wishful thinking peeps here waiting for landed property price to crash. So they can buy at price levels which they missed previously? :D
Landed are mostly bought by the towkays or senior execs, so price sustainability is there. Unless business not doing well or overall economy slips into recession, you will not see a big crash in landed prices.
Assuming there is recession, if the towkays have to force sell their landed at low prices during such difficult times to keep the businesses going, the employees who stay in condos or HDBs will suffer first (first to let go to cut costs), not the towkays. So the premium of landed over condo/HDBs is always maintained. No such thing as landed prices drop significantly and yet condos/HDBs remain intact or growing.
Have frds who sold their landed few years back and been renting condos, waiting for landed price to drop so can buy back again. They are still waiting and waiting....:)
Indeed there are many sour grapes in this forum. Only time will prove them wrong. When 2040 comes, these sour grapes, still remain as sour grapes, will curse and swear why they did not buy their dream landed in 2014!
Dunno why got so many sour grapes or wishful thinking peeps here waiting for landed property price to crash. So they can buy at price levels which they missed previously? :D
Landed are mostly bought by the towkays or senior execs, so price sustainability is there. Unless business not doing well or overall economy slips into recession, you will not see a big crash in landed prices.
Assuming there is recession, if the towkays have to force sell their landed at low prices during such difficult times to keep the businesses going, the employees who stay in condos or HDBs will suffer first (first to let go to cut costs), not the towkays. So the premium of landed over condo/HDBs is always maintained. No such thing as landed prices drop significantly and yet condos/HDBs remain intact or growing.
Have frds who sold their landed few years back and been renting condos, waiting for landed price to drop so can buy back again. They are still waiting and waiting....:)
Landed property is perhaps the worst investment in Singapore at the moment. They are expensive to maintain, big utilities bills, lousy rental yield lack of facilities and high property tax and the worst of all many "landed" property doesnt even have enough land for even keep a trampoline and its hot like a furnace in Singapore weather.
For those who think that landed property can be kept and pass down forever should just look around in the family and ask which siblings or in-laws of yours would you like to live together forever and if it make any sense to be living in a house with so many families around.
creative_vitamin
05-07-14, 23:11
Landed property is perhaps the worst investment in Singapore at the moment. They are expensive to maintain, big utilities bills, lousy rental yield lack of facilities and high property tax and the worst of all many "landed" property doesnt even have enough land for even keep a trampoline and its hot like a furnace in Singapore weather.
For those who think that landed property can be kept and pass down forever should just look around in the family and ask which siblings or in-laws of yours would you like to live together forever and if it make any sense to be living in a house with so many families around.
how to calculate the maintanence fee? why will the utilties bill be expensive?
Landed property is perhaps the worst investment in Singapore at the moment. They are expensive to maintain, big utilities bills, lousy rental yield lack of facilities and high property tax and the worst of all many "landed" property doesnt even have enough land for even keep a trampoline and its hot like a furnace in Singapore weather.
For those who think that landed property can be kept and pass down forever should just look around in the family and ask which siblings or in-laws of yours would you like to live together forever and if it make any sense to be living in a house with so many families around.
If bought long time ago and well maintained, it's a different story, why high maintenance? My landed bought in 1993, almost nothing spent on maintenance, only upgrading. Cheap to live in compared to condo or hdb, yes utilities bills higher due to air-conditioning but still cheaper than or equal to condo conservancy charges plus carpark is free for two cars, in hdb that alone is worth $180. Why complain? Sour grapes?
Looking to pass down my future generations or get bigger one.
how to calculate the maintanence fee? why will the utilties bill be expensive?
A well built landed property is cheap to live in, you can see many old couples living in their landed properties even after retirement.
Set aside some money for roof tile replacement every twenty years and your good to go.
Higher electricity bill? About $200 to $300 plus is normal, stay in hdb with two cars is $180 add $90 for S&C and another $150 for electricity, total is $420 per month to live in, HDB is cheap?
If bought long time ago and well maintained, it's a different story, why high maintenance? My landed bought in 1993, almost nothing spent on maintenance, only upgrading. Cheap to live in compared to condo or hdb, yes utilities bills higher due to air-conditioning but still cheaper than or equal to condo conservancy charges plus carpark is free for two cars, in hdb that alone is worth $180. Why complain? Sour grapes?
Looking to pass down my future generations or get bigger one.
I am fully aware there are many very old and run down landed property around Singapore because the owner or would be ownerS are unable to afford to redo the entire place. e.g letting their fence rust away, junk piling up, continue drinking water from corroded water pipes which are more than 30 years old. For that reason, I do agree that you certainly dont need to spend a lot to be living in a house with no facilities landscaping etc.
As for passing down to future GENERATIONS, we all know its a fact that such practice doesnt always end up well because
a) modern families doesnt like to live with in laws
b) children will fight to cash out the assets and go on with their separate live.
c) family of today, will trade space for lifestyle, will go for quality instead of quantity. E.g. living in condo with nice view and facilities for families, near amenities etc.
And obviously if you have to go down the route of talking about "lower cost of living" in landed property then perhaps you should start questioning about what you have been missing in life.
afford to buy their own landed property to start a their own family. Its only those who cant afford will wish for inheritance. And like most cases, siblings will always fight to cash out on their inheritance because modern families doesnt like living with 2 or 3 tigress in the house.
@ringo33 My landed property is 4 stories with dual key entrances, two generations can live like as if upstairs and downstairs neighbors in complete privacy.
Most decent sized landed homes have at least 5 to 6 bedrooms, and if yours is a nice landed property you don't have to worry about the spouse not wanting to live there see Jeanne Phua pretty and willing to live with in laws. They only don't want to live with parents or in-laws if the place is old and run down but that would apply to any property not just landed.
These days most families only have two kids or less, I don't see any problem with division of assets, mine is boy and girl so no worries there, besides I have other properties too.
Don't make these issues, high rise living has views and breeze but landed has privacy, exclusiveness and space, matter of preference. Landed is just gold on earth with your own private and exclusive postal code.
@ringo33 My landed property is 4 stories with dual key entrances, two generations can live like as if upstairs and downstairs neighbors in complete privacy.
Most decent sized landed homes have at least 5 to 6 bedrooms, and if yours is a nice landed property you don't have to worry about the spouse not wanting to live there see Jeanne Phua pretty and willing to live with in laws. They only don't want to live with parents or in-laws if the place is old and run down but that would apply to any property not just landed.
These days most families only have two kids or less, I don't see any problem with division of assets, mine is boy and girl so no worries there, besides I have other properties too.
Don't make these issues, high rise living has views and breeze but landed has privacy, exclusiveness and space, matter of preference. Landed is just gold on earth with your own private and exclusive postal code.
Those 4 stories landed property are perhaps the worst. Small living area, and those top floors are hot like furnace under Singapore hot and humid weather and you will need to run your aircon full blast 1 hour before you go to bed in order to feel comfortable.
Those 4 stories landed property are perhaps the worst. Small living area, and those top floors are hot like furnace under Singapore hot and humid weather and you will need to run your aircon full blast 1 hour before you go to bed in order to feel comfortable.
No mine is not cluster house so not small living area like you say, anyway with so much space the top floor is only spare room, don't worry bro, I still have a HDB 20 floors high and facing forest in the North West, after rain smells like Cameron Highlands air, sweet!
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