View Full Version : Need advise on lease contract
Hi All Gurus,
I am a newbie here. Need your advise on this matter.
My signed a 2 years lease contract with tenant, is at 13th month now, but tenant intents to break the contract, even the Diplomatic Clause been cancelled in the TA.
Will my agent assist secure a replacement tenant for me?
Do I have a right to forfeit the tenant's 2 months deposit?
What I need to do in this case?
Appreciated any comments/advise. Thank you so much.
Best Regards,
Seasg
Usually you can get agent to find replacement tenant for you, commission for securing tenant for the period until end of tenancy should be bored by tenant. As long as new tenant not secured, you will seek rent from existing tenant. Obviously they won't pay, so hold on to the 2 months deposit loh, and give yourself 2 months to look for replacement tenant! After that 2 months, legally you have right to pursue rent from tenant. Practically it is very difficult.
Hi All Gurus,
I am a newbie here. Need your advise on this matter.
My signed a 2 years lease contract with tenant, is at 13th month now, but tenant intents to break the contract, even the Diplomatic Clause been cancelled in the TA.
Will my agent assist secure a replacement tenant for me?
Do I have a right to forfeit the tenant's 2 months deposit?
What I need to do in this case?
Appreciated any comments/advise. Thank you so much.
Best Regards,
Seasg
Thanks thanks.
Yup, practically is not easy to pursue rent from tenant after that.
Does it worth to bring the case to court? Any idea how is the process and fees involve?
Thanks,
Seasg
Usually you can get agent to find replacement tenant for you, commission for securing tenant for the period until end of tenancy should be bored by tenant. As long as new tenant not secured, you will seek rent from existing tenant. Obviously they won't pay, so hold on to the 2 months deposit loh, and give yourself 2 months to look for replacement tenant! After that 2 months, legally you have right to pursue rent from tenant. Practically it is very difficult.
thomastansb
03-10-13, 09:46
Just take the 2 months deposit and ask them to leave.
Thanks thanks.
Yup, practically is not easy to pursue rent from tenant after that.
Does it worth to bring the case to court? Any idea how is the process and fees involve?
Thanks,
Seasg
diplomatic clause usually have wordings to mean the tenant leave singapore, then can break. if tenant change job, but still in singapore, also cannot break
is it company lease, personal lease?
Not sure what you mean by diplomatic clause is cancelled in TA.
Hi,
Is a personal lease. At that time when signed contract, got mention that the lease is fix 2 years, diplomtic clause not applicable, so it was removed from the TA. Thanks.
Seasg
diplomatic clause usually have wordings to mean the tenant leave singapore, then can break. if tenant change job, but still in singapore, also cannot break
is it company lease, personal lease?
Not sure what you mean by diplomatic clause is cancelled in TA.
Hi,
Is a personal lease. At that time when signed contract, got mention that the lease is fix 2 years, diplomtic clause not applicable, so it was removed from the TA. Thanks.
Seasg
personal lease nothing much you can do unless go to court.
start monitoring whether the tenant pay on time.
usually tenant will try to save part of the 2 month deposit, by late paying the rent
instead of 2 month deposit confiscated, if late payment, only 1 month deposit confiscated.
so if late by certain days, usually 2 weeks, usually can repossess the flat, and kick the tenant, all depends on your TA. in this case, u still keep 1.5 months.
evolutionx
03-10-13, 10:25
Hi,
Is a personal lease. At that time when signed contract, got mention that the lease is fix 2 years, diplomtic clause not applicable, so it was removed from the TA. Thanks.
Seasg
the thing about personal leases (and why i absolutely hate residential tenants) is when things become messy - they tend to vent their frustrations on your property.
just tell the agent to return you half the comm (pro-rata based on what term was used - most are unwilling, but will take a haircut in finding a new tenant for you)
i strongly recommend you just ask them to leave nicely and forfeit the deposit (with rental being paid up to the day they have left. tell them once they have returned the keys, you will provide a letter acknowledging the lease is broken and NEITHER party can pursue the case any further that that. but only provide this once everything has been paid up, damages have been reinstated and you have forfeited their deposit).
legally - dont waste your time. any lawyer worth his salt will tell you its wasting money to serve notice of demand. these cases are too minor for courts and will be dragged out. come to a settlement and close the chapter and move on. i've served notice on tenants using at least 2 of the big 4 law firms ... and i normally still have to compromise and pay the legal bill, so 've learnt just to let these idiots go and find better tenants.
Thanks much for the value advise.
Seasg
personal lease nothing much you can do unless go to court.
start monitoring whether the tenant pay on time.
usually tenant will try to save part of the 2 month deposit, by late paying the rent
instead of 2 month deposit confiscated, if late payment, only 1 month deposit confiscated.
so if late by certain days, usually 2 weeks, usually can repossess the flat, and kick the tenant, all depends on your TA. in this case, u still keep 1.5 months.
evolutionx
03-10-13, 10:27
personal lease nothing much you can do unless go to court.
start monitoring whether the tenant pay on time.
usually tenant will try to save part of the 2 month deposit, by late paying the rent
instead of 2 month deposit confiscated, if late payment, only 1 month deposit confiscated.
so if late by certain days, usually 2 weeks, usually can repossess the flat, and kick the tenant, all depends on your TA. in this case, u still keep 1.5 months.
just FYI - it's a lot harder to repossess residential property because as a landlord, you cant be seen kicking people to the curb. even SP services wont allow you to cut off utilities as long as someone is in the house. hence why he should just compromise and let them go.
think there have been few cases of troublesome tenants and it takes months to evict them, and finally by then, you have a big legal / bailiff fee and a few months of no rent, and what is most likely junk you have to clear out from the place. for resi- police will also hesitate to help.
Give and take. If tenants have been nice, return the deposit less damages if they give u 2months notice. Request for at least 2 viewing slot per week to find replacement tenant. Tenant will have to pay u back the comm on pro rata basis.
Another way is for the tenant to find their own replacement tenant to take over the remaining lease. Of course, u need to specify the desired tenants profile to them.
The trickiest tenants would be defaulting on payments and refusing to go.
Thanks much for your value advise, evolutionx & rosy.
Seasg
In the past, I have a nice tenant through his agent finds me a replacement with a rental of at least the same as the company needs him to go to another country. Otherwise, he will continue to pay me until he or his agent finds the new tenant. This after the first year plus two months (advance notice).
thomastansb
03-10-13, 11:22
Actually after 7 days without rental (in usual TA), you can re-enter the unit, call for police (if they refuse to move out) and shift everything out from the unit. But this is going to get ugly but legally, you can do so.
the thing about personal leases (and why i absolutely hate residential tenants) is when things become messy - they tend to vent their frustrations on your property.
just tell the agent to return you half the comm (pro-rata based on what term was used - most are unwilling, but will take a haircut in finding a new tenant for you)
i strongly recommend you just ask them to leave nicely and forfeit the deposit (with rental being paid up to the day they have left. tell them once they have returned the keys, you will provide a letter acknowledging the lease is broken and NEITHER party can pursue the case any further that that. but only provide this once everything has been paid up, damages have been reinstated and you have forfeited their deposit).
legally - dont waste your time. any lawyer worth his salt will tell you its wasting money to serve notice of demand. these cases are too minor for courts and will be dragged out. come to a settlement and close the chapter and move on. i've served notice on tenants using at least 2 of the big 4 law firms ... and i normally still have to compromise and pay the legal bill, so 've learnt just to let these idiots go and find better tenants.
evolutionx
03-10-13, 11:31
Actually after 7 days without rental (in usual TA), you can re-enter the unit, call for police (if they refuse to move out) and shift everything out from the unit. But this is going to get ugly but legally, you can do so.
trust me - i've tried. after 7 days, you actually need to file a formal notice of demand first and serve to the tenant before re-entry to show due diligence. otherwise the re-entry can be seen as trespassing without cause ...
the problem with shifting everything out of the unit is something told to me by a lawyer that will make things *very* difficult:
he worked on a case where the tenant refused to leave and the landlord moved out all the junk out. later the tenant claimed he had some jewelry inside one of the drawers that was now missing (this is why you need a bailiff - dont stinge, but those costs a few thousand) and he was counter suing for the items lost. i think a settlement was made between both parties, but trust me - you really dont want to move the stuff there without a court order. you are opening yourself up to more problems ><
this is why i shifted into commercial properties. rent people 4 bare painted walls and expect the same when returned. plain and simple.
What if companies say they got no money to pay as they are bankrupt?
trust me - i've tried. after 7 days, you actually need to file a formal notice of demand first and serve to the tenant before re-entry to show due diligence. otherwise the re-entry can be seen as trespassing without cause ...
the problem with shifting everything out of the unit is something told to me by a lawyer that will make things *very* difficult:
he worked on a case where the tenant refused to leave and the landlord moved out all the junk out. later the tenant claimed he had some jewelry inside one of the drawers that was now missing (this is why you need a bailiff - dont stinge, but those costs a few thousand) and he was counter suing for the items lost. i think a settlement was made between both parties, but trust me - you really dont want to move the stuff there without a court order. you are opening yourself up to more problems ><
this is why i shifted into commercial properties. rent people 4 bare painted walls and expect the same when returned. plain and simple.
evolutionx
03-10-13, 11:44
What if companies say they got no money to pay as they are bankrupt?
then save your $ and move on with life and find a new (and hopefully) better tenant. sue and win is also a hollow victory if they got no money to pay you and you're out of pocket on rent AND legal fees right?
anybody still remembered this case?
http://sgpropertywatch.blogspot.com/2009/02/opera-gallery-at-ngee-ann-city-fights.html
up to now, dont know what happened later.
......
he worked on a case where the tenant refused to leave and the landlord moved out all the junk out. later the tenant claimed he had some jewelry inside one of the drawers that was now missing (this is why you need a bailiff - dont stinge, but those costs a few thousand) and he was counter suing for the items lost. i think a settlement was made between both parties, but trust me - you really dont want to move the stuff there without a court order. you are opening yourself up to more problems ><
.......
thanks for the tip.
diamond jewellery is small & expensive.
i will ask the jewelry shops to make receipts for a few 1c diamond ring.
if landlord kick me out and threw my stuff out, i will claim my diamonds are lost and i will provide the receipts as proof of purchase.
of course, to further my claim, will have a few photos of me wearing CZ rings.
It is better to enter premise after serving 2 weeks of reposession notice and change lock when nobody is at home.
What happens if tenants stay at home 24x7 and refused to budge?
thomastansb
03-10-13, 12:41
I have been lucky so far then. I thought in the TA, you have a clause that says re-entry after 7 days of rental lapse?
trust me - i've tried. after 7 days, you actually need to file a formal notice of demand first and serve to the tenant before re-entry to show due diligence. otherwise the re-entry can be seen as trespassing without cause ...
the problem with shifting everything out of the unit is something told to me by a lawyer that will make things *very* difficult:
he worked on a case where the tenant refused to leave and the landlord moved out all the junk out. later the tenant claimed he had some jewelry inside one of the drawers that was now missing (this is why you need a bailiff - dont stinge, but those costs a few thousand) and he was counter suing for the items lost. i think a settlement was made between both parties, but trust me - you really dont want to move the stuff there without a court order. you are opening yourself up to more problems ><
this is why i shifted into commercial properties. rent people 4 bare painted walls and expect the same when returned. plain and simple.
trust me - i've tried. after 7 days, you actually need to file a formal notice of demand first and serve to the tenant before re-entry to show due diligence. otherwise the re-entry can be seen as trespassing without cause ...
the problem with shifting everything out of the unit is something told to me by a lawyer that will make things *very* difficult:
he worked on a case where the tenant refused to leave and the landlord moved out all the junk out. later the tenant claimed he had some jewelry inside one of the drawers that was now missing (this is why you need a bailiff - dont stinge, but those costs a few thousand) and he was counter suing for the items lost. i think a settlement was made between both parties, but trust me - you really dont want to move the stuff there without a court order. you are opening yourself up to more problems ><
this is why i shifted into commercial properties. rent people 4 bare painted walls and expect the same when returned. plain and simple.
For commercial properties, u can move out tenants stuff without any problem? What happens if tenants refuse to clear the stuff and default on rental? Can tenant sue u for lost of valuable items too?
anybody ever seen a clause in TA for residential and/or commercial lease,
whereby when unit is re-posseseed by landlord, any personal effects, stuff belongs to the landlord?
or landlord is not responsible for any loss
For commercial properties, u can move out tenants stuff without any problem? What happens if tenants refuse to clear the stuff and default on rental? Can tenant sue u for lost of valuable items too?
ya lo, the opera art gallery has inventory of $20million.
It is better to enter premise after serving 2 weeks of reposession notice and change lock when nobody is at home.
What happens if tenants stay at home 24x7 and refused to budge?
"
In the meantime, both sides could not come to an agreement and Opera Gallery’s staff were stuck in the premises since midnight with no electricity and were unable to use the toilets.
After a 12-hour stand-off, the gallery’s staff were exhausted and left the premises."
so landlord can cut water and electricity? once tenants leave premise, they are not restricted from re-entering.
how to physically restrict people from re-entering?
evolutionx
03-10-13, 15:07
It is better to enter premise after serving 2 weeks of reposession notice and change lock when nobody is at home.
What happens if tenants stay at home 24x7 and refused to budge?
more difficult cos you cant chain up the place. even when i came with proof of ownership one time, police couldn't help. but luckily for me .. the tenant was guai lan with the police ... so the tenant wound up doing the work for me after that :D
I have been lucky so far then. I thought in the TA, you have a clause that says re-entry after 7 days of rental lapse?
standard clause lah. everybody also have. the issue is really enforcement in SG - even though SG is a pro-landlord country.
anybody ever seen a clause in TA for residential and/or commercial lease,
whereby when unit is re-posseseed by landlord, any personal effects, stuff belongs to the landlord?
or landlord is not responsible for any loss
yes it's standard, but many things can go wrong with repossession of property.
"
In the meantime, both sides could not come to an agreement and Opera Gallery’s staff were stuck in the premises since midnight with no electricity and were unable to use the toilets.
After a 12-hour stand-off, the gallery’s staff were exhausted and left the premises."
so landlord can cut water and electricity? once tenants leave premise, they are not restricted from re-entering.
how to physically restrict people from re-entering?
actually, i'm not sure in this case, but i think toshin perhaps bills the tenants for electricity? i have tried to cut off before, but was turned down by SP services when they asked if anyone was in the unit.
physical restriction is easy .. just get industrial bike chain. all my units have a loop. the chain should take more than an hour to saw through (only one person has successfully removed it ... by sawing the roller shutter instead :doh: )
can seasg just claim the 2 month deposit according to the TA break lease within stipulated period?
i heard deposit cannot be withheld.
Since seasg paid maintenance fee, perhaps just contact the security guard to stop the illegal tenant access card.
Why need to cut chain, reenter by himself...life is tough
auroraborealis
03-10-13, 16:08
This is what I have been doing in TAs:
1) ensure that late payment clause include late payment fee of $50-100 in addition to default interest
2) indicate that rent only considered paid when reflected as credit balance in designated bank account
3) re-possession clause includes re-entry "with or without notice" after 7days and re-possession cost at tenant's expense
4) verbally inform tenant that if no pay, after 7 days will enter unit, move all his stuff to temporary warehouse (space rental for 1 day to be deducted from deposit). Rental, late fee & default interest for the 7days also deducted from deposit. To release his stuff, he need to pay warehouse space rental accruing after 1st day.
Usually I tell the tenant point blank at the start of the lease and highlighted the clause in the TA so that no demand letter needs to be issued. I just get movers to shift his stuff to temporary storage, deactivate access card and change pin number.
......
actually, i'm not sure in this case, but i think toshin perhaps bills the tenants for electricity? i have tried to cut off before, but was turned down by SP services when they asked if anyone was in the unit.
physical restriction is easy .. just get industrial bike chain. all my units have a loop. the chain should take more than an hour to saw through (only one person has successfully removed it ... by sawing the roller shutter instead :doh: )
what i mean is as long as there is person inside the unit, cannot chained up right? so if persons take turns to leave and re-enter, then cannot chained up the door.
how to prevent a person from re-entering the unit? cannot touch him/her le, lagi kena accused of molest.
This is what I have been doing in TAs:
1) ensure that late payment clause include late payment fee of $50-100 in addition to default interest
2) indicate that rent only considered paid when reflected as credit balance in designated bank account
3) re-possession clause includes re-entry "with or without notice" after 7days and re-possession cost at tenant's expense
4) verbally inform tenant that if no pay, after 7 days will enter unit, move all his stuff to temporary warehouse (space rental for 1 day to be deducted from deposit). Rental, late fee & default interest for the 7days also deducted from deposit. To release his stuff, he need to pay warehouse space rental accruing after 1st day.
Usually I tell the tenant point blank at the start of the lease and highlighted the clause in the TA so that no demand letter needs to be issued. I just get movers to shift his stuff to temporary storage, deactivate access card and change pin number.
thats good point, i will bear in mind. if tenant claimed missing jewellry how?
auroraborealis
03-10-13, 17:08
hmm... No experience on such
But now that you bring up, will probably add another exclusion clause like "not responsible for damage or loss of valuables, money or property belonging to tenant during re-possession" for next round
thats good point, i will bear in mind. if tenant claimed missing jewellry how?
Thanks all for your value advise..
My TA got listed the above points 1) 2) & 3)
But came to practical, tenant did not follow. Not much we can do? Payment always came late 1-2 days, but that ok loh..acceptable.
Anyway, I now wait for agent to get a replacement as tenant unable to do so. What is time frame we should give agent? In case agent unable to find a replacement, I will need look for tenant by approaching other agents out there. Who will bear for the cost?
Many Thanks!
Seasg
This is what I have been doing in TAs:
1) ensure that late payment clause include late payment fee of $50-100 in addition to default interest
2) indicate that rent only considered paid when reflected as credit balance in designated bank account
3) re-possession clause includes re-entry "with or without notice" after 7days and re-possession cost at tenant's expense
4) verbally inform tenant that if no pay, after 7 days will enter unit, move all his stuff to temporary warehouse (space rental for 1 day to be deducted from deposit). Rental, late fee & default interest for the 7days also deducted from deposit. To release his stuff, he need to pay warehouse space rental accruing after 1st day.
Usually I tell the tenant point blank at the start of the lease and highlighted the clause in the TA so that no demand letter needs to be issued. I just get movers to shift his stuff to temporary storage, deactivate access card and change pin number.
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