View Full Version : To buy EC now or save for 2nd Property
Hi all Gurus here. Seeking your advice on which would be a better route to take.
My current situation
I currently own a 4rm HDB located at city fringe. Installments left about 98K. We bought it abt 7 yrs ago for abt 220k. Heard last unit transacted a floor above mine for $500k+
Our combine CPF (OA) is about $80k
Initially we were looking at getting a unit at Watercolors but din see any unit we liked.... (trying to look for a 4 bedrooms so parents can stay with us)
So while in the process, someone suggested that I get a 2nd property for rental since the HDB is almost paid up.... took a look at nearby PC, the likes of water bank and learn that its about $880k for a 1 bedroom.
So the question is
Should I save like hell, meaning shift back with parents and rent out my current hdb (not sure even if I do, would I make it for the down payment)
or
Just go with the EC at some far away place......
Just wanna hear the views of the gurus here......
Thks in advance
Get EC while you still can, before they revamp the scheme. You can consider dual key units since you plan to stay with your parents. :D
Here is a list of all the new EC for sale and in the pipeline.
http://www.hdb.gov.sg/fi10/fi10321p.nsf/w/BuyingNewFlatFlatsonOfferEC?OpenDocument
Here is a list of all the new EC for sale and in the pipeline.
http://www.hdb.gov.sg/fi10/fi10321p.nsf/w/BuyingNewFlatFlatsonOfferEC?OpenDocument
However, do note CM7. Especially cap on MSR @ 30%
http://www.iras.gov.sg/irasHome/page03a.aspx?id=14342
:cheers5:
However, do note CM7. Especially cap on MSR @ 30%
http://www.iras.gov.sg/irasHome/page03a.aspx?id=14342
:cheers5:
wow VERY VERY VERY difficult to buy 2nd/3rd property:doh:
if u can afford the down payment, go for the pc.
reason:
assume EC at northeast, 750psf
PC at northeast, 1050psf
3bedder (hdb 4rm) pc assuming 1000psf for easy calculation.
you save 300k for buying a EC. but bad thing is, you need to sell your hdb.
imagine u did not sell your hdb (and your parent hdb also go for rental) and u rent out your hdb. assuming 2.5k for each 4rm hdb rented out, in 10 yrs, you had 2.5x12x10x2=600K
not counting the rental of your parent flat, you get 300k from renting out your hdb which already covers your saving for buy EC. and at the end, you still have your hdb...:o
Hi all Gurus here. Seeking your advice on which would be a better route to take.
My current situation
I currently own a 4rm HDB located at city fringe. Installments left about 98K. We bought it abt 7 yrs ago for abt 220k. Heard last unit transacted a floor above mine for $500k+
Our combine CPF (OA) is about $80k
Initially we were looking at getting a unit at Watercolors but din see any unit we liked.... (trying to look for a 4 bedrooms so parents can stay with us)
So while in the process, someone suggested that I get a 2nd property for rental since the HDB is almost paid up.... took a look at nearby PC, the likes of water bank and learn that its about $880k for a 1 bedroom.
So the question is
Should I save like hell, meaning shift back with parents and rent out my current hdb (not sure even if I do, would I make it for the down payment)
or
Just go with the EC at some far away place......
Just wanna hear the views of the gurus here......
Thks in advance
if u can afford the down payment, go for the pc.
reason:
assume EC at northeast, 750psf
PC at northeast, 1050psf
3bedder (hdb 4rm) pc assuming 1000psf for easy calculation.
you save 300k for buying a EC. but bad thing is, you need to sell your hdb.
imagine u did not sell your hdb (and your parent hdb also go for rental) and u rent out your hdb. assuming 2.5k for each 4rym hdb rented out, in 10 yrs, you had 2.5x12x10x2=600K
not counting the rental of your parent flat, you get 300k from renting out your hdb which already covers your saving for buy EC. and at the end, you still have your hdb...:o
U missed out 7% absd.
if u can afford the down payment, go for the pc.
reason:
assume EC at northeast, 750psf
PC at northeast, 1050psf
3bedder (hdb 4rm) pc assuming 1000psf for easy calculation.
you save 300k for buying a EC. but bad thing is, you need to sell your hdb.
imagine u did not sell your hdb (and your parent hdb also go for rental) and u rent out your hdb. assuming 2.5k for each 4rm hdb rented out, in 10 yrs, you had 2.5x12x10x2=600K
not counting the rental of your parent flat, you get 300k from renting out your hdb which already covers your saving for buy EC. and at the end, you still have your hdb...:oThat is assuming they have the bullets for the downpayment plus ABSD for 2nd property! Very steep to get PC these days!!! :banghead:
fully pay off and keep the HDB and buy another property.
The way to play the property game is to have more than 1 property. One being the roof over your head and one or more investment property. It doesn't matter how high property prices go up if you have only 1 property. You can't cash out. You may continue to upgrade to bigger, more expensive properties, but it's not going to help you retire.
You have to decide whether property is for consumption (in the case of single property, your roof) or investment (cash-flow positive properties).
Good Luck.
exactly....bite the bullet! :D
That is assuming they have the bullets for the downpayment plus ABSD for 2nd property! Very steep to get PC these days!!! :banghead:
Get EC while you still can, before they revamp the scheme. You can consider dual key units since you plan to stay with your parents. :D
Agree... EC is exactly designed for people who wants a quick route to upgrade :D to get the same in pc needs at least $300k in cash:2cents: I love this country:D :D
Ltv gonna be pretty painful. Gotta work out ur loan / salary required if u dun intend to sell your hdb for pc.
Thks all for the kind advice.... Yes stuck on eat to do cos one wrong move will affect whole life....
Thing now is wifey not so keen to rent out place....that means it will take even longer to acquire no 2 property as passive income.....
Doing some sums now but reckon 2nd property out Liao os by the time save snuff for no. 2 prices probably doubled....loan tenure reduced.......
Haizzzz so close but yet so far.
Thks all again....appreciate it:cheers5:
Most of the time is the wife side that has a problem. They want to stay big big house, location maybe near her parent or workplace. Men anything also can, can stay in small small place. So if single can really go ahead with it and make big money.
Most of the time is the wife side that has a problem. They want to stay big big house, location maybe near her parent or workplace. Men anything also can, can stay in small small place. So if single can really go ahead with it and make big money.
Hahahaha...true.....but then again also cannot blame her.... think most people would rather just live with spouse and children......
nevermind la.....Think of other options.
Hahahaha...true.....but then again also cannot blame her.... think most people would rather just live with spouse and children......
nevermind la.....Think of other options.
cheers bro hang around this forum u will learn a lot:cheers1:
fully pay off and keep the HDB and buy another property.
The way to play the property game is to have more than 1 property. One being the roof over your head and one or more investment property. It doesn't matter how high property prices go up if you have only 1 property. You can't cash out. You may continue to upgrade to bigger, more expensive properties, but it's not going to help you retire.
You have to decide whether property is for consumption (in the case of single property, your roof) or investment (cash-flow positive properties).
Good Luck.
Very sound advice! ;)
However I found that a lot of people know what to do but when it comes for them to act, they procrastinate, take no action and let the opportunity slip by...
Case study #1
Last year, my friend had an almost paid up HDB flat (outstanding loan smaller than TS). He wanted to get a PC and rent out his HDB. So he went on to fully pay up his HDB so that he could get 80% LTV on his PC. He went on house hunting for months and finally found his ideal unit. When he was about to make an offer, he backed out hoping that the seller would lower the asking price by some 50k; but the seller simply sold his unit to the next potential buyer! Needless to say, CM7 came along and he is priced out and MTB. Till today, he is still staying in his fully paid HDB hoping that one day he could fulfill his PC and landlord dream. :sleep:
Case study #2
Another friend of mine had a fully paid up PC. She wanted to buy another PC and has been looking around for years (yes, years) since 07. To be fair to her, each time she found something ideal, her HUSBAND will say wait for price correction or for price to crash or it is safer to keep the money in the bank. :doh: Now we are already in the next property cycle and her HUSBAND is still waiting for the "perfect timing" to come... Well, CM7 came first and they will have to pay ABSD for their 2nd property now; so what to do? WAIT further lor!!!
These are just 2 egs, I know of many people who are still waiting...
Well, I could only say 一种米养百种人 . Each to his own and that is why this world is imperfect and interesting.
To TS: After reading my post, I hope you and your wife can understand what is the best decision for you to achieve passive income and move towards financial independence. GOOD LUCK!
Very sound advice! ;)
However I found that a lot of people know what to do but when it comes for them to act, they procrastinate, take no action and let the opportunity slip by...
Case study #1
Last year, my friend had an almost paid up HDB flat (outstanding loan smaller than TS). He wanted to get a PC and rent out his HDB. So he went on to fully pay up his HDB so that he could get 80% LTV on his PC. He went on house hunting for months and finally found his ideal unit. When he was about to make an offer, he backed out hoping that the seller would lower the asking price by some 50k; but the seller simply sold his unit to the next potential buyer! Needless to say, CM7 came along and he is priced out and MTB. Till today, he is still staying in his fully paid HDB hoping that one day he could fulfill his PC and landlord dream. :sleep:
Case study #2
Another friend of mine had a fully paid up PC. She wanted to buy another PC and has been looking around for years (yes, years) since 07. To be fair to her, each time she found something ideal, her HUSBAND will say wait for price correction or for price to crash or it is safer to keep the money in the bank. :doh: Now we are already in the next property cycle and her HUSBAND is still waiting for the "perfect timing" to come... Well, CM7 came first and they will have to pay ABSD for their 2nd property now; so what to do? WAIT further lor!!!
These are just 2 egs, I know of many people who are still waiting...
Well, I could only say 一种米养百种人 . Each to his own and that is why this world is imperfect and interesting.
To TS: After reading my post, I hope you and your wife can understand what is the best decision for you to achieve passive income and move towards financial independence. GOOD LUCK!
Thks for the advice........but its not my decision to make......if i can make it on my own I would...... wife also not unreasonable to wanna be contented and maintain status quo.....
everyone say a short pray for my toto dream tonight bah.....otherwise :banghead: :banghead:
Hi adriel,
Just to share with you my story as I was in your same situation 2 years ago. 2 years ago, I bit the bullet and paid off my HDB outstanding loan after I found a suitable PC in District 12. I wanted to sell off my HDB as do not have sufficient cash to pay for downpayment of PC. My parents offered to lend me some cash and advised that I should rent out my HDB.
After much consideration, I bought the PC in May 2011 and have been staying there and rented out my HDB. Looking back, really glad to make that decision as my PC has risen 20% based on recent transaction while I collect rent from HDB. In fact, my HDB has also appreciated in the last 2 years. Just remember to declare rental income and have to pay higher property tax (10% of annual value) for the HDB. It is a small price to pay. If I can rent out HDB for about 15 years, actually equals to my buying price! Of cos that was before CM7 or CM8 came into place, else I wouldn't be able to afford 2nd property.
Good luck!
Hi adriel,
Just to share with you my story as I was in your same situation 2 years ago. 2 years ago, I bit the bullet and paid off my HDB outstanding loan after I found a suitable PC in District 12. I wanted to sell off my HDB as do not have sufficient cash to pay for downpayment of PC. My parents offered to lend me some cash and advised that I should rent out my HDB.
After much consideration, I bought the PC in May 2011 and have been staying there and rented out my HDB. Looking back, really glad to make that decision as my PC has risen 20% based on recent transaction while I collect rent from HDB. In fact, my HDB has also appreciated in the last 2 years. Just remember to declare rental income and have to pay higher property tax (10% of annual value) for the HDB. It is a small price to pay. If I can rent out HDB for about 15 years, actually equals to my buying price! Of cos that was before CM7 or CM8 came into place, else I wouldn't be able to afford 2nd property.
Good luck!
Ya.....i know thats the right thing to do financially...think by renting out the flat...should be able to raise down payment amount in 2-3 yrs (inclusive of CM7 etc etc) ..... then continue to rent out another 2 yrs to buffer for (in case ) lost of rental for PC...... after that the PC should finance itself liao.............so near yet so far......
thks for sharing bro.
Hi all Gurus here. Seeking your advice on which would be a better route to take.
My current situation
I currently own a 4rm HDB located at city fringe. Installments left about 98K. We bought it abt 7 yrs ago for abt 220k. Heard last unit transacted a floor above mine for $500k+
Our combine CPF (OA) is about $80k
Initially we were looking at getting a unit at Watercolors but din see any unit we liked.... (trying to look for a 4 bedrooms so parents can stay with us)
So while in the process, someone suggested that I get a 2nd property for rental since the HDB is almost paid up.... took a look at nearby PC, the likes of water bank and learn that its about $880k for a 1 bedroom.
So the question is
Should I save like hell, meaning shift back with parents and rent out my current hdb (not sure even if I do, would I make it for the down payment)
or
Just go with the EC at some far away place......
Just wanna hear the views of the gurus here......
Thks in advance
Since you still qualify for an EC, I would presume your monthly savings will not be very substantial. To pay off your $98k loan for your existing HDB, you will wipe off your CPF $80k and you need to top up $18k in cash. Only then you will be eligible for a 20% loan on your 2nd ppty and subject to 7% absd plus the usual 3% stamp duties.
That would mean for a $1m purchase, you need to have cash total of $300k (20% downpayment + total 10% stamp duties) + $18k to pay off your HDB loan = $318k. That is a big amount.
Frankly, imho, whoever still qualify for an EC should buy the EC unless you are cash rich and have parents support.
Since you still qualify for an EC, I would presume your monthly savings will not be very substantial. To pay off your $98k loan for your existing HDB, you will wipe off your CPF $80k and you need to top up $18k in cash. Only then you will be eligible for a 20% loan on your 2nd ppty and subject to 7% absd plus the usual 3% stamp duties.
That would mean for a $1m purchase, you need to have cash total of $300k (20% downpayment + total 10% stamp duties) + $18k to pay off your HDB loan = $318k. That is a big amount.
Frankly, imho, whoever still qualify for an EC should buy the EC unless you are cash rich and have parents support.
You're right bro.....actually I planning for a max 800K unit which in all (if i calculated correctly) is $240K.....
i'm ready to "Pain Pain" for the next 3-4 years...save up like crazy, move in with parents to get rental, do part time jobs etc etc.....and should be able to just hit that amount +plus savings we have ............
Then after buy still rent out HDB for another year to buffer for "no tenancy". So all in... 5 years...... some friends say crazy.....why suffer so much???
But how i see it is its only 5 years after that its song song to jurong...... at least old no need to burden kid.......or stress where got income .....that seemed more impt to me now.....
But haizz.......think so much also no pt........cos I cannot do it myself.....and I can understand why.........
Thks all.....think we'll stop here.....thks everyone for the advice....I dun want to waste u guy's time to advice when I now know that I cannot rent out my place to start the ball rolling...... :beats-me-man: :beats-me-man:
Good house
03-06-13, 17:57
Behind every successful man is a wise woman.
The other way is also true.
This is life, just enjoy it:)
if u can afford the down payment, go for the pc.
reason:
assume EC at northeast, 750psf
PC at northeast, 1050psf
3bedder (hdb 4rm) pc assuming 1000psf for easy calculation.
you save 300k for buying a EC. but bad thing is, you need to sell your hdb.
imagine u did not sell your hdb (and your parent hdb also go for rental) and u rent out your hdb. assuming 2.5k for each 4rm hdb rented out, in 10 yrs, you had 2.5x12x10x2=600K
not counting the rental of your parent flat, you get 300k from renting out your hdb which already covers your saving for buy EC. and at the end, you still have your hdb...:o
Assuming 3bedder pc at 1000sqft, $1000psf, price= $1,000,000
5% downpayment= $50,000(cash)
Signing S&P 15%= $150,000(cash/cpf) (minimum sum $139,000 OA+SA cannot touch)
Stamp duties 10%= $100,000 (3%+7%absd)
At this point, it's only 20% stage.
Total premium outlay without existing loan = $50k+$150k+$100k+$98k(to pay off existing hdb loan)= $398,000!
With existing hdb loan, max 2nd loan cap at 50%, so another 30% is needed = $300,000(cash/cpf),so total premium outlay with existing hdb loan = $50k+$150k+$100k+$300k=$550,000!!!
So you must have at least $398,000 on hand before you can enjoy $600,000 return 10 years later.
That's the power of 7th cooling measure!
Assuming 3bedder pc at 1000sqft, $1000psf, price= $1,000,000
5% downpayment= $50,000(cash)
Signing S&P 15%= $150,000(cash/cpf) (minimum sum $139,000 OA+SA cannot touch)
Stamp duties 10%= $100,000 (3%+7%absd)
At this point, it's only 20% stage.
Total premium outlay without existing loan = $50k+$150k+$100k+$98k(to pay off existing hdb loan)= $398,000!
With existing hdb loan, max 2nd loan cap at 50%, so another 30% is needed = $300,000(cash/cpf),so total premium outlay with existing hdb loan = $50k+$150k+$100k+$300k=$600,000!!!
So you must have at least $398,000 on hand before you can enjoy $600,000 return 10 years later.
That's the power of 7th cooling measure!
Typo, should be $600,000 for 2nd scenario
Hi, this is an interesting thread.
It brings out a part of what i`m thinking of, though i made the mistake by buying BTO from the start.
On the thread starter's scenario, I`m in for paying off all and starting afresh.
For me, my BTO cost 500k and will be ready soon.
My wife and I managed to save up about 400K plus Cash + CPF.
By the time the flat comes, we should be able to fully pay it.
The option we are looking at now is to take no loan and start afresh, in hope to buy a 2nd property once MOP is over.
Hence, I would like to seek advices on how I should plan my mortgage payments.
Thanks in advance!
Hi, this is an interesting thread.
It brings out a part of what i`m thinking of, though i made the mistake by buying BTO from the start.
On the thread starter's scenario, I`m in for paying off all and starting afresh.
For me, my BTO cost 500k and will be ready soon.
My wife and I managed to save up about 400K plus Cash + CPF.
By the time the flat comes, we should be able to fully pay it.
The option we are looking at now is to take no loan and start afresh, in hope to buy a 2nd property once MOP is over.
Hence, I would like to seek advices on how I should plan my mortgage payments.
Thanks in advance!
Take max loan.... Interest rate is so low....
When your BTO finishes the MOP, then you decide to fully repay or not... Policy may change then....
:):):)
Hi, this is an interesting thread.
It brings out a part of what i`m thinking of, though i made the mistake by buying BTO from the start.
On the thread starter's scenario, I`m in for paying off all and starting afresh.
For me, my BTO cost 500k and will be ready soon.
My wife and I managed to save up about 400K plus Cash + CPF.
By the time the flat comes, we should be able to fully pay it.
The option we are looking at now is to take no loan and start afresh, in hope to buy a 2nd property once MOP is over.
Hence, I would like to seek advices on how I should plan my mortgage payments.
Thanks in advance!
Hi, did you take up bank loan or HDB loan? If you took bank loan, go for max; if HDB loan, can consider fully pay up as HDB interest rate much higher...
Then you must also consider, if fully paid, do you still have cash for downpayment + BSD + ABSD for your 2nd property if it comes along? If don't fully pay, you can only take up max 50% loan for your 2nd property, the rest have to pay in cash.
Btw, why do you think you've made a mistake by buying BTO from the start?
Hi, did you take up bank loan or HDB loan? If you took bank loan, go for max; if HDB loan, can consider fully pay up as HDB interest rate much higher...
Then you must also consider, if fully paid, do you still have cash for downpayment + BSD + ABSD for your 2nd property if it comes along? If don't fully pay, you can only take up max 50% loan for your 2nd property, the rest have to pay in cash.
Btw, why do you think you've made a mistake by buying BTO from the start?
Thanks earthling and Chestnut.
As the project is not ready yet, I have not decided. Most likely, I will be taking bank loan.
If i leave those cashflow sitting around, I probably do not know what to do with it.
If i fully paid it, I will not have any liquidity. Nonetheless, after 5 years of MOP, I should be able to afford a PC downpayment.
I made the mistake as I was attracted to some hyped BTO projects, ignoring my parents advice to go private. At that time, they had actually found a few City Fringe units which are suitable for me.
Well well... Life goes on. Henceforth, I'm planning my next step early now.
Good house
04-06-13, 17:16
Parent sometime do nag.
But sometime good to take advice from old folks to reduce the learning curve
Parent sometime do nag.
But sometime good to take advice from old folks to reduce the learning curve
That's very true...
Assuming 3bedder pc at 1000sqft, $1000psf, price= $1,000,000
5% downpayment= $50,000(cash)
Signing S&P 15%= $150,000(cash/cpf) (minimum sum $139,000 OA+SA cannot touch)
Stamp duties 10%= $100,000 (3%+7%absd)
At this point, it's only 20% stage.
Total premium outlay without existing loan = $50k+$150k+$100k+$98k(to pay off existing hdb loan)= $398,000!
With existing hdb loan, max 2nd loan cap at 50%, so another 30% is needed = $300,000(cash/cpf),so total premium outlay with existing hdb loan = $50k+$150k+$100k+$300k=$550,000!!!
So you must have at least $398,000 on hand before you can enjoy $600,000 return 10 years later.
That's the power of 7th cooling measure!
yup.....thats what I had in mind.....but mine was a $800K unit.... din dare think of 1m.....mebbe must lower expectation further.....but I need some place that can be easily rent out and enuff to cover monthly repayment of roughly $2.5K.
bro beepbeep
was reading the thread again and was trying to figure wat the portion on the cpf....the SA & OA part.....
mind to share how u got that figure????
thks
Hi adriel,
Just to share with you my story as I was in your same situation 2 years ago. 2 years ago, I bit the bullet and paid off my HDB outstanding loan after I found a suitable PC in District 12. I wanted to sell off my HDB as do not have sufficient cash to pay for downpayment of PC. My parents offered to lend me some cash and advised that I should rent out my HDB.
After much consideration, I bought the PC in May 2011 and have been staying there and rented out my HDB. Looking back, really glad to make that decision as my PC has risen 20% based on recent transaction while I collect rent from HDB. In fact, my HDB has also appreciated in the last 2 years. Just remember to declare rental income and have to pay higher property tax (10% of annual value) for the HDB. It is a small price to pay. If I can rent out HDB for about 15 years, actually equals to my buying price! Of cos that was before CM7 or CM8 came into place, else I wouldn't be able to afford 2nd property.
Good luck!
Hihi I'm in a similar situation, but have been wondering whether I'm allowed to rent out the HDB flat if I buy a PC. Does the renting out of flat require approval from HDB if you have satisfied the MOP? How does the approval process work? Thanks!
CondoInterested
04-06-13, 22:13
I find this strategy (https://www.propertykaiser.com.sg/article/how-does-a-hdb-owner-upgrade-and-own-2-private-properties-wi#.Ua306h_4JBE) will work well.
I find this strategy (https://www.propertykaiser.com.sg/article/how-does-a-hdb-owner-upgrade-and-own-2-private-properties-wi#.Ua306h_4JBE) will work well.
bro thks....but i see the link and pasted info here. sounds dodgy.....if u are the website owner.....my apologies in advance........
How does a HDB owner upgrade and own 2 private properties with little upfront cash?
"
1. Sell/Cash out of your HDB flat.
2. At the same time, buy a private residential property for own stay under husband name.
3. Buy another investment property later under wife name.
If done properly by a Professional Agent, this will help you avoid:
1. Additional Buyer Stamp Duty (ABSD) of 7% for 2nd property.
2. Avoid CPF minimum sum for 2nd residential properties
3. Enjoy 5% cash down / 15% Cash/CPF with 80% bank loan for the TWO properties
Effectively, Selling your HDB and Buying 2 private residential properties with little upfront cash (terms and conditions apply)."
CondoInterested
04-06-13, 22:31
No, I am not the owner of the website, the owner advertise (see above in home page) and I read and thought it's good in a way and also no good in another way (because I will not sell away my HDB and I also cannot sell anymore because if I sell, I am not qualify to buy back anymore :D), you see my other post in his / her advertisement you will know.
Hihi I'm in a similar situation, but have been wondering whether I'm allowed to rent out the HDB flat if I buy a PC. Does the renting out of flat require approval from HDB if you have satisfied the MOP? How does the approval process work? Thanks!
Yes still require approval from HDB after MOP. If you are Singaporean usually no problem. Just go to HDB website to apply online. Approval on the spot usually but you need to have your tenants info ready during application.
[QUOTE=adriel]bro beepbeep
was reading the thread again and was trying to figure wat the portion on the cpf....the SA & OA part.....
mind to share how u got that figure????
Amended the minor errors
Half of cpf minimum sum of $139,00 = $69,500 in OA+SA cannot touch
Bro beepbeep is correct at $139,000 if 2 names husband and wife used for 2nd property
Stamp duties 10%= (3% - $5,400 +7%absd.) = $94,600
I find this strategy (https://www.propertykaiser.com.sg/article/how-does-a-hdb-owner-upgrade-and-own-2-private-properties-wi#.Ua306h_4JBE) will work well.
I think this is workable too. Though the single applicant would have a huge loan to repay, and preferably cash rich to pay installments with partial cash as Likely scenario the CPF portion of $1150 will be max out.
I'm sorry but..... Do you really have to "invest in another property" ? ... Once upon a time, pty investment is only for the rich, or at least the well off... If you have to go to some extreme measures then personally I would say enjoying life with HDB is alright... It does not look healthy at all whn every ordinary income earner is looking at "pty investment "
Thanks earthling and Chestnut.
As the project is not ready yet, I have not decided. Most likely, I will be taking bank loan.
If i leave those cashflow sitting around, I probably do not know what to do with it.
If i fully paid it, I will not have any liquidity. Nonetheless, after 5 years of MOP, I should be able to afford a PC downpayment.
I made the mistake as I was attracted to some hyped BTO projects, ignoring my parents advice to go private. At that time, they had actually found a few City Fringe units which are suitable for me.
Well well... Life goes on. Henceforth, I'm planning my next step early now.
Frankly speaking, right now I see more potential upside for EC than BTO after all the recent HDB housing policies (such as increased supply of flats and PR having to dispose their flats if they buy private) which will dampen HDB resale prices. EC afterall can achieve "private" status after 10 years and are highly sought after currently.
Having said that, there are still some BTO at matured estates such as the 2 projects at Dawson which I think will command similar resale price in future to a EC in OCR. Pinnacle will easily hit 1 mil upon MOP. So, which will you choose, BTO at matured estate in/near Central Region or EC in OCR?
In any case, you can't go wrong whether you rent out your flat after MOP or sell it for capital appreciation. You are still in a very good position to go private. It is how you make the next move after that that is more important!
I find this strategy (https://www.propertykaiser.com.sg/article/how-does-a-hdb-owner-upgrade-and-own-2-private-properties-wi#.Ua306h_4JBE) will work well.
Sell 1 buy 2 strategy will be much more difficult after CM7 though not impossible. Having 1 name in each property (husband and wife respectively) also have its limitations and problems.
I'm sorry but..... Do you really have to "invest in another property" ? ... Once upon a time, pty investment is only for the rich, or at least the well off... If you have to go to some extreme measures then personally I would say enjoying life with HDB is alright... It does not look healthy at all whn every ordinary income earner is looking at "pty investment "
Of course there are many other types of investments. But be warned, know what you are doing and do within your means!
Frankly speaking, right now I see more potential upside for EC than BTO after all the recent HDB housing policies (such as increased supply of flats and PR having to dispose their flats if they buy private) which will dampen HDB resale prices. EC afterall can achieve "private" status after 10 years and are highly sought after currently.
Having said that, there are still some BTO at matured estates such as the 2 projects at Dawson which I think will command similar resale price in future to a EC in OCR. Pinnacle will easily hit 1 mil upon MOP. So, which will you choose, BTO at matured estate in/near Central Region or EC in OCR?
In any case, you can't go wrong whether you rent out your flat after MOP or sell it for capital appreciation. You are still in a very good position to go private. It is how you make the next move after that that is more important!
to many pte properties ownesr, EC is still an EC even after 10yrs. different class.
just like prime district vs ocr condo, different class.
to the post suggesting sell hdb, buy two pte, that will work provided husband and wife are both high income earners and can qualify for property loan individually.
to many pte properties ownesr, EC is still an EC even after 10yrs. different class.
just like prime district vs ocr condo, different class.
to the post suggesting sell hdb, buy two pte, that will work provided husband and wife are both high income earners and can qualify for property loan individually.
Yes, even within the private properties, there are many different classes. However, right now, the capital gain (in terms of percentage increase) of EC is even greater than some big quantum luxury condo in CCR (some even selling at a loss). As long as can make money, who cares what class? Unless buying for own stay and prestige, then a different story...
bro beepbeep
was reading the thread again and was trying to figure wat the portion on the cpf....the SA & OA part.....
mind to share how u got that figure????
thks
For 2nd property, u have to keep a minimum sum which comprises OA+SA in CPF untouch. Base on yr 2012, it's $69,500 individually,so if u r applying with your wife, that will be $69,500*2=$139,000.
The minimum sum will increase again in July 2013
[QUOTE=adriel]bro beepbeep
was reading the thread again and was trying to figure wat the portion on the cpf....the SA & OA part.....
mind to share how u got that figure????
Amended the minor errors
Half of cpf minimum sum of $139,00 = $69,500 in OA+SA cannot touch
Bro beepbeep is correct at $139,000 if 2 names husband and wife used for 2nd property
Stamp duties 10%= (3% - $5,400 +7%absd.) = $94,600
Bro Soundwave,
Thks for adding the $5,400 cos I feel $5,400 is not a substantial amount from $398,000 and $600,000
to many pte properties ownesr, EC is still an EC even after 10yrs. different class.
just like prime district vs ocr condo, different class.
to the post suggesting sell hdb, buy two pte, that will work provided husband and wife are both high income earners and can qualify for property loan individually.
EC privatise after 10 years and the resale price difference between EC and surrounding PCs narrows. Capital appreciation and rental yield returns is higher for EC since the premium outlay is lower than PC depending on location. Bishan Loft is one good example.
Getting a 3% rental returns is consider good for a high class PCs in prime district but for OCR condos or ECs, getting at least a 4% rental returns is just a breeze.
I'm sorry but..... Do you really have to "invest in another property" ? ... Once upon a time, pty investment is only for the rich, or at least the well off... If you have to go to some extreme measures then personally I would say enjoying life with HDB is alright... It does not look healthy at all whn every ordinary income earner is looking at "pty investment "
bro, nothing to be sorry about. just air your views......
Yes, I too was thinking just forget it la.... why make life so difficult for yourself.....thing is....for me personally......trying to get a 2nd property is something to work towards, to save more.....do more odd jobs as they come.... sure...I'm comfortable with my current lifestyle and not really short of $$$ but if I "suffer" for 3-5 years...........in exchange for a long time of passive income.....why not????
I think its not healthy to not have an aim....and work towards it..I respect your opinion although I disagree ......no offence intended.:tongue3:
bro, nothing to be sorry about. just air your views......
Yes, I too was thinking just forget it la.... why make life so difficult for yourself.....thing is....for me personally......trying to get a 2nd property is something to work towards, to save more.....do more odd jobs as they come.... sure...I'm comfortable with my current lifestyle and not really short of $$$ but if I "suffer" for 3-5 years...........in exchange for a long time of passive income.....why not????
I think its not healthy to not have an aim....and work towards it..I respect your opinion although I disagree ......no offence intended.:tongue3:
There is nothing wrong with your vision/wish/dream of owning 2nd properties and work towards it. In fact thats a positive thing. Just, instead of buy now and sink yourself into tough financial situation, maybe save up now and buy later. I believe property market has a cycle - there is always the next wave.
Consider me lucky that I was in your situation 3 yrs back and I hooted. Now with all the CM thingy cannot afford getting another one. But getting a 3rd one still my wish. Now saving up and wait lor.
I'm sorry but..... Do you really have to "invest in another property" ? ... Once upon a time, pty investment is only for the rich, or at least the well off... If you have to go to some extreme measures then personally I would say enjoying life with HDB is alright... It does not look healthy at all whn every ordinary income earner is looking at "pty investment "
Cannot like that say la. Last time university is also for the good family rich family only. Now it become a norm. Generally citizen living standard move up liao buy more property to rent to foreigners is a good thing. Hope this can become a norm also in future.
But on another hand when you say one should not take extreme measure until suffering and living in HDB also fine - that I totally agree. Just like cannot go U then study poly is perfectly OK.
Yes still require approval from HDB after MOP. If you are Singaporean usually no problem. Just go to HDB website to apply online. Approval on the spot usually but you need to have your tenants info ready during application.
Thanks gilaone! Appreciate your insights and advice :)
Just wondering is it essential to have tenant info before applying for the said approval? If it hasn't been approved yet, I shouldn't be getting tenants in the first place right? I'm rather wary of the procedures ... as if it can't be approved, I might not want to get a pte property or move out in the first place. Something like a chicken and egg issue. Also, I have always been under the impression that HDB owners are only allowed to have a PC as investment, and should not be staying in the PC if they hold on to the flat... if that's the case, why does HDB still approve renting out whole flat so easily? What am I missing here?
Thanks gilaone! Appreciate your insights and advice :)
Just wondering is it essential to have tenant info before applying for the said approval? If it hasn't been approved yet, I shouldn't be getting tenants in the first place right? I'm rather wary of the procedures ... as if it can't be approved, I might not want to get a pte property or move out in the first place. Something like a chicken and egg issue. Also, I have always been under the impression that HDB owners are only allowed to have a PC as investment, and should not be staying in the PC if they hold on to the flat... if that's the case, why does HDB still approve renting out whole flat so easily? What am I missing here?
I have the same wonder as you too. Why must secure the tenants first before applying. But my agent says there is a clause in the TA that if we can't get approval from HDB then we cannot rent them and there is no penalty on us.
As to whether you can stay in PC and rent out HDB that is also very gray. In the HDB sublet approval, there is a clause saying if after the sublet period ended and you don't get approval to continuing subletting, you need to "MOVE BACK" to the HDB. But how they enforce it? Atmost we vacant the HDB and still stay in PC, right? puzzled too.
But I remember in 1 TV interview with the KBW, he mentioned he cannot ban Singaporean from renting out their HDB. Citing some of them is depending on that to survive. So kind of him. So at least for now I think there is no risk - provided you are citizen.
I have the same wonder as you too. Why must secure the tenants first before applying. But my agent says there is a clause in the TA that if we can't get approval from HDB then we cannot rent them and there is no penalty on us.
As to whether you can stay in PC and rent out HDB that is also very gray. In the HDB sublet approval, there is a clause saying if after the sublet period ended and you don't get approval to continuing subletting, you need to "MOVE BACK" to the HDB. But how they enforce it? Atmost we vacant the HDB and still stay in PC, right? puzzled too.
But I remember in 1 TV interview with the KBW, he mentioned he cannot ban Singaporean from renting out their HDB. Citing some of them is depending on that to survive. So kind of him. So at least for now I think there is no risk - provided you are citizen.
sincere advice to all bros if possible get out of the hdb game that is buy pc or apt---- hdb u buy u pay money but still kena squueze by the balzzzz:banghead: this cannot that cannot:doh:
I have the same wonder as you too. Why must secure the tenants first before applying. But my agent says there is a clause in the TA that if we can't get approval from HDB then we cannot rent them and there is no penalty on us.
As to whether you can stay in PC and rent out HDB that is also very gray. In the HDB sublet approval, there is a clause saying if after the sublet period ended and you don't get approval to continuing subletting, you need to "MOVE BACK" to the HDB. But how they enforce it? Atmost we vacant the HDB and still stay in PC, right? puzzled too.
But I remember in 1 TV interview with the KBW, he mentioned he cannot ban Singaporean from renting out their HDB. Citing some of them is depending on that to survive. So kind of him. So at least for now I think there is no risk - provided you are citizen.
Thanks very much gilaone for sharing your insights! This is so helpful for me!! :) Appreciate it!
sincere advice to all bros if possible get out of the hdb game that is buy pc or apt---- hdb u buy u pay money but still kena squueze by the balzzzz:banghead: this cannot that cannot:doh:
I think this is always an heated argument in this forum: Get out of HDB play vs once you are out you never get in again.
Bro, if I recall correctly you used to own PC and HDB too. But you sold PC and move back to HDB. When didn't you sold your HDB given your advise? So you seriously thinking of selling HDB after your PC TOP?
I think this is always an heated argument in this forum: Get out of HDB play vs once you are out you never get in again.
Bro, if I recall correctly you used to own PC and HDB too. But you sold PC and move back to HDB. When didn't you sold your HDB given your advise? So you seriously thinking of selling HDB after your PC TOP?
thats why i say that one should leverage on hdb to go into pcs if i had done that many years back i would have a few pcs but i never i stuck to my hdb and now as i am at halfway point in life a bit too late cos of all the cms so i just hold on to what i got but my advice to someone in his 30s is DONT waste oppurtunity if u bought ur hdb cheap and make a killing offload and go into pc cos HDB got a LOT of restriction and NO freedom to suka suka do what you want anyway as usual just my 2cents advice;)
thats why i say that one should leverage on hdb to go into pcs if i had done that many years back i would have a few pcs but i never i stuck to my hdb and now as i am at halfway point in life a bit too late cos of all the cms so i just hold on to what i got but my advice to someone in his 30s is DONT waste oppurtunity if u bought ur hdb cheap and make a killing offload and go into pc cos HDB got a LOT of restriction and NO freedom to suka suka do what you want anyway as usual just my 2cents advice;)
but to "suka suka" do what you want.....would mean u require you to have 2 properties to really leverage on whats happening.....ideally (or financially constraint) it means having a hdb and a PC. having 2 PCs seem like a tall order for a family in the sandwich class......
Hi...I have a HDB flat and I am still aiming for my second property in Mt Sinai.
It can be done.
Hi...I have a HDB flat and I am still aiming for my second property in Mt Sinai.
It can be done.
we know can be done, but ...when? or after the war?
Hi...I have a HDB flat and I am still aiming for my second property in Mt Sinai.
It can be done.
Share your plan bro.....
Share your plan bro.....
Lol. Don't go there. :D
thats why i say that one should leverage on hdb to go into pcs if i had done that many years back i would have a few pcs but i never i stuck to my hdb and now as i am at halfway point in life a bit too late cos of all the cms so i just hold on to what i got but my advice to someone in his 30s is DONT waste oppurtunity if u bought ur hdb cheap and make a killing offload and go into pc cos HDB got a LOT of restriction and NO freedom to suka suka do what you want anyway as usual just my 2cents advice;)
Given the current situation, it would have been a better decision to have leveraged in the past.
Nonetheless, given the myriad types of situations that COULD HAVE arisen, holding onto HDB is not necessarily a bad choice. It gave Radha a choice to upgrade at any point of time, did it not?
Of course, going forward, it's possible that new regulations could suddenly disadvantage HDB holders in future, and they could be better off by selling today. There is no guarantee indeed.
But in actuality, the decision to hold (HDB) or to sell (and upgrade) is a complex one. It largely hinges on your views and priorities in life. For example, what is your ideal retirement age? Do you work very hard for your career or just the minimal to get by? Do you have children? How many? And what options do you want them to have in future?
So give these some thoughts. It is always easy to think with hindsight of what has already happened, that prices have gone up so much and those with higher end properties benefited the most. If I knew that my house number would strike 4-D, I would have staked my whole fortune on it. But then, on a day to day basis, I usually do not subscribe to 4-D.
Consider alternative scenarios, best case, worst case and average situations. Think about how you would feel in each, and make your call accordingly. All the best!
Lol. Don't go there. :D
I must admit my plan is not the cup of many fellow forummers here.
My plan is extraordinary uniquely proprietary to me. It is really not easy to execute the plan.
As to when will it be realize as questioned by one forummer, I won't know until the crash is hitting here Singapore.
I am smelling the storm since weeks ago, and it is impacting the stock market. It is sweeping to property soon.
good to hold on to a hdb and pc until can afford a second pc. By then may be better off to offload hdb. Once in private market, don't see the point of staying in hdb market. :D
http://sbr.com.sg/residential-property/news/condo-rents-in-singapore-dipped-06
With two PCs, rental might be an issue, especially with the mass of PCs slated to arrive in some places.
PC's higher price and smaller size are important factors that need to be factored in where rental is concerned.
Nonetheless, there are different kinds of markets, and one should familiarise himself with the market aimed for.
Lol. Don't go there. :D
loEl:D:D:D
but to "suka suka" do what you want.....would mean u require you to have 2 properties to really leverage on whats happening.....ideally (or financially constraint) it means having a hdb and a PC. having 2 PCs seem like a tall order for a family in the sandwich class......
suka suka meaning you got no restrictions when u own a pc you can do as u please no rubbish minimum occupation period no rental restrictions you can rent to who u want when u want UNLIKE hdb:cool:
I must admit my plan is not the cup of many fellow forummers here.
My plan is extraordinary uniquely proprietary to me. It is really not easy to execute the plan.
As to when will it be realize as questioned by one forummer, I won't know until the crash is hitting here Singapore.
I am smelling the storm since weeks ago, and it is impacting the stock market. It is sweeping to property soon.
Oh My God !
DJIA up more than 200 points last night !
There will be a major upsurge in our property market very soon !~
Posting the above based on some silly people's non stop chanting.
DKSG
Oh My God !
DJIA up more than 200 points last night !
There will be a major upsurge in our property market very soon !~
Posting the above based on some silly people's non stop chanting.
DKSG
HUAT AHH:D:D:D
I must admit my plan is not the cup of many fellow forummers here.
My plan is extraordinary uniquely proprietary to me. It is really not easy to execute the plan.
As to when will it be realize as questioned by one forummer, I won't know until the crash is hitting here Singapore.
I am smelling the storm since weeks ago, and it is impacting the stock market. It is sweeping to property soon.
Even if that storm arrives today, a $50K is very likely not enough.... Good luck..
[QUOTE=adriel]bro beepbeep
was reading the thread again and was trying to figure wat the portion on the cpf....the SA & OA part.....
mind to share how u got that figure????
Amended the minor errors
Half of cpf minimum sum of $139,00 = $69,500 in OA+SA cannot touch
Bro beepbeep is correct at $139,000 if 2 names husband and wife used for 2nd property
Stamp duties 10%= (3% - $5,400 +7%absd.) = $94,600
current cpf min sum of 139000 soon to be raised to 148000
[QUOTE=S0undwave]
current cpf min sum of 139000 soon to be raised to 148000
Thks.....with each passing day...the dream seems further and further away......
[quote=freesoul]
Thks.....with each passing day...the dream seems further and further away......
thats the sad reality
[quote=freesoul]
Thks.....with each passing day...the dream seems further and further away......I'm not sure if this is helpful but last time my OA plus SA add up also don't have minimum sum. I thought that if min sum keeps increasing every year, then its like fighting a losing battle coz when you almost caught up then it rises again. However, I'm wrong to make that assumption. I realized that it took only about 2.5 years before my SA alone is enough to already cover the min sum although it keeps rising. Anyway, I've been working for some years already and spent my all my cpf OA on my earlier HDB then... Hope this is an encouragement to you.
Its not the rising cpf min sum that is killing your dream. I would think its the rising home prices that is killing that dream. However, the semi good news is prices are stabalizing and the latest May report revealed that home prices are softening even http://www.businesstimes.com.sg/arch...n-may-20130608 (http://www.businesstimes.com.sg/archive/saturday/premium/singapore/prices-resale-private-apartments-down-may-20130608)... Cheers! :cheers3:
[quote=adriel]I'm not sure if this is helpful but last time my OA plus SA add up also don't have minimum sum. I thought that if min sum keeps increasing every year, then its like fighting a losing battle coz when you almost caught up then it rises again. However, I'm wrong to make that assumption. I realized that it took only about 2.5 years before my SA alone is enough to already cover the min sum although it keeps rising. Anyway, I've been working for some years already and spent my all my cpf OA on my earlier HDB then... Hope this is an encouragement to you.
ysyap is absolutely right. I observe the same facts too. Once your SA reaches 1/2 min sum, with your monthly CPF contribution + 4% interest, there is absolutely no problem in catching up the yearly increase. So there is no worry on that.
[quote=adriel]I'm not sure if this is helpful but last time my OA plus SA add up also don't have minimum sum. I thought that if min sum keeps increasing every year, then its like fighting a losing battle coz when you almost caught up then it rises again. However, I'm wrong to make that assumption. I realized that it took only about 2.5 years before my SA alone is enough to already cover the min sum although it keeps rising. Anyway, I've been working for some years already and spent my all my cpf OA on my earlier HDB then... Hope this is an encouragement to you.
Its not the rising cpf min sum that is killing your dream. I would think its the rising home prices that is killing that dream. However, the semi good news is prices are stabalizing and the latest May report revealed that home prices are softening even http://www.businesstimes.com.sg/arch...n-may-20130608 (http://www.businesstimes.com.sg/archive/saturday/premium/singapore/prices-resale-private-apartments-down-may-20130608)... Cheers! :cheers3:
Hmmmm....a silver lining.....ya...how I see it is ill just try and accumulate as much as I can.....if can buy in the next few yrs .....best...else I'm go to find some other instrument of investment.....
Hope by then prices soften......or govt changes/remove the ABSD ......only time will tell....
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