Renewal of tenancy agreement

[bergkamp]

Hi, my tenant intends to renew tenancy agreement but would like to DIY to save on agent's commission. However, I have signed CEA form that states first renewal need to pay half month rent for one year extension. Any option to overcome that? Can i still sign a new agreement without paying the agent fee?
Since i dont need agent to look for new tenant, don't feel worthwhile to pay the agent fee for renewal.

Thanks.

[delirious_jeff]

Hi, my tenant intends to renew tenancy agreement but would like to DIY to save on agent's commission. However, I have signed CEA form that states first renewal need to pay half month rent for one year extension. Any option to overcome that? Can i still sign a new agreement without paying the agent fee?
Since i dont need agent to look for new tenant, don't feel worthwhile to pay the agent fee for renewal.

Thanks.

I find that communication with tenant is key to avoiding using an agent.

If you like to play safe, you can Google for a TA, d/l and use it. TAs are similar. You need to communicate with tenant, who pays stamp fees, etc.

Always remember to pay the stamp duties.
http://www.iras.gov.sg/irasHome/page04.aspx?id=2132

And never forget to check with authorities that FT is a legal alien.

[DKSG]

Hi, my tenant intends to renew tenancy agreement but would like to DIY to save on agent's commission. However, I have signed CEA form that states first renewal need to pay half month rent for one year extension. Any option to overcome that? Can i still sign a new agreement without paying the agent fee?
Since i dont need agent to look for new tenant, don't feel worthwhile to pay the agent fee for renewal.

Thanks.

Your can extend it by 6 months first, then pay the agent off 1/4 month. Then sign a fresh one after 3 months. Hopefully, that gets the agent off your back.

And as some mentor here Jeff teach me, next time dont let agent put in the renewal clause.

DKSG

[delirious_jeff]

btw, if you intend to get agent for renewal of lease, get him/her to broker for higher rental agreement... CM7 is a great reason to increase rental!!! :cheers3:

[bergkamp]

Thanks for the advice, think i will renew for 6 months and pay quarter month to get agent of my back. Yes, i have declared rental income to IRAS.

[irisng]

If the agent has found a tenant for us but refuse to take out the renewal clause, then how?

[TMATT]

The agent got no right to demand to insert the renewal clause in, unless you had sign??

We need to pay agent for the initial fees as he/she take effort to find the tenants, pay them, but after 2yrs, when renewal, really don't see the why leh? (sorry to the property agent, but we are looking as a Landlord point of view....)


If the agent has found a tenant for us but refuse to take out the renewal clause, then how?

[teddybear]

If they help to liaise with tenant for whatever complains, ok lah right? We should reward hard-working agents... In turn, they will work hard to get higher rent for you... :beats-me-man:


The agent got no right to demand to insert the renewal clause in, unless you had sign??

We need to pay agent for the initial fees as he/she take effort to find the tenants, pay them, but after 2yrs, when renewal, really don't see the why leh? (sorry to the property agent, but we are looking as a Landlord point of view....)

[TMATT]

Bro, Your point i agree, however our few Condo Rental experience tell us that not always true :(
The agent usually never liaise with tenants for any follow up.:doh:
(or you got good agent to recommand?)

That the reason we stop all the renewal commission from last year onward.

It better to save the money, and Bro, you know .... It is really BIG saving (rental for 1yr = half month commission,
rental for 2yrs = 1mth commission,
rental for 3yrs = 1.5month commission)

imagine the few condos are rent out at total rental of $20,000 monthly,
you can handle the renewal rental by using online tenants agreement, that can be saving of close to 6 figures profit if they all renews it for 5-8yrs.

But as i said, maybe just our luck, that yet meet good property agent...:beats-me-man:


If they help to liaise with tenant for whatever complains, ok lah right? We should reward hard-working agents... In turn, they will work hard to get higher rent for you... :beats-me-man:

[Laguna]

If the agent is working hard for me during the tenancy period, I will pay them com for the renewal. If not, forget about it.

I think, it is fair to all, everyone needs to make a living.

[irisng]

I have not been a landlord before, so tenancy agreement is new to me. Mind to share where can I find the sample of the tenancy agreement? Do you all mean during the tenancy period, any problem with the tenant or repair matters, we will get the agent to talk to them on our behalf and not that we talk to them personally?

When signing the new set of tenancy agreement with the tenant, if find that some of the clauses are not in our favor, eg renewal clause, can we just cancel the clause or need to get the agent to re-print a new set of the agreement? Of course, if this agent is doing a good job during the new tenancy period, then I don't mind to pay for the renewal comm, if not, I don't think I'm willing to pay for this additional money.

[joelx]

I have not done this, just an idea. Can we let the 1st agreement lapse for 1 day. then there after take it as a new contract again, treating it like new tenant without going through agent. Eg 1st contract starts from 1/1/2010 to 1/1/2012. then i start a new contract from 3/1/2012 to 3/1/2014. This should disqualify as a RENEWAL , as there is a break of 1 day

[eng81157]

I have not done this, just an idea. Can we let the 1st agreement lapse for 1 day. then there after take it as a new contract again, treating it like new tenant without going through agent. Eg 1st contract starts from 1/1/2010 to 1/1/2012. then i start a new contract from 3/1/2012 to 3/1/2014. This should disqualify as a RENEWAL , as there is a break of 1 day

the intention of the act itself speaks otherwise. is there a possibility of the agent finding out? if he finds out, what are the consequences?

[bergkamp]

http://www.cea.gov.sg/cea/content/estate_agencies_agents/forms_docs/estateAgencyAgreement.html

Estate Agency Agreement for the Lease of Residential Property by a Landlord - With ref to para 4d of the form, please ensure this clause is removed if do not wish to pay renewal commission.

As to whether we can let the tenancy agreement (TA) lapsed and do not sign renewal TA, has any landlord/tenant done that before ? To avoid renewal commission. Can agent take the landlord to court ?

Thanks.

[Rosy]

For personal lease, i always make sure i remove the renewal clause. For corporate lease, i prefer agents to handle for me.

[joelx]

the intention of the act itself speaks otherwise. is there a possibility of the agent finding out? if he finds out, what are the consequences?

I agree that the intention of this act is obvious, but i did not breach a single term from the agreement. it will be perfectly fine to let the agent find out.

The clause do not say that i must pay the Renewal fee subsequently if i am going to rent to the same tenant in future.

Renewal = Continuous period without any lapse.

[eng81157]

I agree that the intention of this act is obvious, but i did not breach a single term from the agreement. it will be perfectly fine to let the agent find out.

The clause do not say that i must pay the Renewal fee subsequently if i am going to rent to the same tenant in future.

Renewal = Continuous period without any lapse.

if he can sue you for damages, trust me, the court will look at the intent and it won't be favourable for you. if there is no avenue for him to seek redress, then by all means proceed without fear.

[evolutionx]

If the agent is working hard for me during the tenancy period, I will pay them com for the renewal. If not, forget about it.

I think, it is fair to all, everyone needs to make a living.

had an experience where i had a good tenant (corporate lease) and the agent had a commission clause for renewal. i told the agent i wouldnt be paying this and *poof*, tenant also went with the agent who promised to find him a better place.

after that learnt my lesson - i will tell the agents i will give them 1/4 month for renewals, and so far, all have accepted, as they are able to get repeat business from me. most of the the time, they also assist to push up the rental (even a couple of % points helps)

so my advice is to not be penny wise and pound foolish.

build a relationship with them and they will always keep you in mind if they have good deals.

[evolutionx]

http://www.cea.gov.sg/cea/content/estate_agencies_agents/forms_docs/estateAgencyAgreement.html

Estate Agency Agreement for the Lease of Residential Property by a Landlord - With ref to para 4d of the form, please ensure this clause is removed if do not wish to pay renewal commission.

As to whether we can let the tenancy agreement (TA) lapsed and do not sign renewal TA, has any landlord/tenant done that before ? To avoid renewal commission. Can agent take the landlord to court ?

Thanks.

if you don't sign a new TA, how are you protected? your tenancy is not legal in the eyes of the law without stamp duty. if the tenant tries any monkey business, it will be good luck to you ...

also - most agents probably won't go the legal route, since they rather spend their time serving other landlords and making more comm. you want to sue .. can .. but remember that legal fees start in the thousands, not the hundreds :)

[joelx]

if he can sue you for damages, trust me, the court will look at the intent and it won't be favourable for you. if there is no avenue for him to seek redress, then by all means proceed without fear.

Fully agree with you that the court will look at the intent. But is a grey area. The claused should mention " rent to the same tenant within 3months from the end of contract need to pay renewal fees."

[eng81157]

Fully agree with you that the court will look at the intent. But is a grey area. The claused should mention " rent to the same tenant within 3months from the end of contract need to pay renewal fees."

i won't be able to comment on this, since i'm not privy to the terms on your agreement.

besides seeking redress legally, the agent can go behind your back and undercut you by offering a better deal to the tenant. e.g. find cheaper rent for tenant, take a commission cut is still better than nothing

[delirious_jeff]

I have not been a landlord before, so tenancy agreement is new to me. Mind to share where can I find the sample of the tenancy agreement? Do you all mean during the tenancy period, any problem with the tenant or repair matters, we will get the agent to talk to them on our behalf and not that we talk to them personally?

When signing the new set of tenancy agreement with the tenant, if find that some of the clauses are not in our favor, eg renewal clause, can we just cancel the clause or need to get the agent to re-print a new set of the agreement? Of course, if this agent is doing a good job during the new tenancy period, then I don't mind to pay for the renewal comm, if not, I don't think I'm willing to pay for this additional money.


http://www.case.org.sg/downloads/central/Model%20Tenancy%20Agreement.doc
http://www.case.org.sg/downloads/central/Model%20Tenancy%20Agreement.pdf


When you have problem such as late payment or no payment from tenant, that is when you able to gauge how good your agent is!

[DC33_2008]

It is better to have tenant landlord shout stay a distant from them. It is easier when it comes to increase rental without any attached emotion.Worth paying the commission especially those with a few properties. :D

[proud owner]

i have never been around at Handover or Takeover ...

my agent handles everything for me and she does it well ...

and i pay her for her work ... after 2 yrs... at renewal .. i would pay her as well ...

shes the only contact point between me and my tenants...

so far no problem at all ...

i dont quite understand find ways to save that money ...

even though its now removed ...we have been paying TV license for YEARS and still paying for Radio license for cars...

yet we arent questioning why are paying and instead find ways to cut agent fee ?

solid

[irisng]

http://www.case.org.sg/downloads/central/Model%20Tenancy%20Agreement.doc
http://www.case.org.sg/downloads/central/Model%20Tenancy%20Agreement.pdf


When you have problem such as late payment or no payment from tenant, that is when you able to gauge how good your agent is!

Thank you for your link, I will look into it. You mean when there is no payment or late payment, we can get our agent to chase the payment for us?

[delirious_jeff]

Thank you for your link, I will look into it. You mean when there is no payment or late payment, we can get our agent to chase the payment for us?

I think it is better that you engage a real estate salesperson. After you have encountered several kinds of tenants and agents, you know what to do and which forum to visit.

I have engaged agents before and after this CEA. All disappears after being paid, some immediately... And I have to handle the tenants myself. Agents did not reappear when TA near expiry (unlike politicians a few weeks before election). :D

[eng81157]

Thank you for your link, I will look into it. You mean when there is no payment or late payment, we can get our agent to chase the payment for us?

of course!!! that's what the commission is for.

[Shanhz]

I have a gd agent and i would rather pay her dues and get gd service.

[irisng]

Do you all normally get the same agent to help you to find the tenants or prefer to try different agents?

[teddybear]

Normally get a few agents, whoever get the tenant first and with best rental wins the agent fee... :D


Do you all normally get the same agent to help you to find the tenants or prefer to try different agents?

[irisng]

Normally get a few agents, whoever get the tenant first and with best rental wins the agent fee... :D

OIC, so normally where did you all get your agents from, call up the company or from the name cards that you receive or thru' friends' recommendation?

[teddybear]

from all sources initially... No harm right?


OIC, so normally where did you all get your agents from, call up the company or from the name cards that you receive or thru' friends' recommendation?

[irisng]

from all sources initially... No harm right?

Ya, thank you.

[xuzhenfeng]

Hi, my tenant intends to renew tenancy agreement but would like to DIY to save on agent's commission. However, I have signed CEA form that states first renewal need to pay half month rent for one year extension. Any option to overcome that? Can i still sign a new agreement without paying the agent fee?
Since i dont need agent to look for new tenant, don't feel worthwhile to pay the agent fee for renewal.

Thanks.



Do talk to your current agent about this

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