View Full Version : $250m GCB for grab...
Bro BJ, are you selling? :D
http://www.straitstimes.com/breaking-news/money/story/wing-tais-chairman-selling-nassim-road-bungalow-20130409
A NASSIM Road bungalow, owned by Wing Tai Holdings chairman Cheung Wai Keung, was put up for sale today.
If sold, the plum 85,000 sq ft site is expected to attract offers of between $250 million to $300 million and could be one of the largest bungalow deals here, sole marketing agent Jones Lang LaSalle (JLL) said.
The two-storey bungalow in one of Singapore's most exclusiive enclave is sited on elevated grounds and has a swimming pool and tennis court.
Offers of up to $300 million are expected, which works out to up to $3,529 per sq ft of land area, said Mr Karamjit Singh, JLL's head of investments and residential.
why does he want to sell?
1) wing tai have problem?
2) doesnt believe his property can go up anymore?
3) free publicity for him? now everybody know he stay in $300mil bungalow.
why does he want to sell?
1) wing tai have problem?
2) doesnt believe his property can go up anymore?
3) free publicity for him? now everybody know he stay in $300mil bungalow.
There are a few more mega GCB around Botanic Garden.
blackjack21trader
09-04-13, 19:02
Bro BJ, are you selling? :D
Good brother Ringo33, I am not selling mine although I still maintain that landed shall be crashing more than 30% while other property segments remaining healthy, CCR will be particularly strong.
Now you believe I got THIRD EYE liao bo la ?
BUY SINGAPORE RIVER NOW !
$3000psf. He can take the money and buy an entire office building in NY after he cashes out.
$3000psf. He can take the money and buy an entire office building in NY after he cashes out.
I think it's for low rise condo development if not wrong.
blackjack21trader
09-04-13, 20:22
Good brother Ringo33, I am not selling mine although I still maintain that landed shall be crashing more than 30% while other property segments remaining healthy, CCR will be particularly strong.
Now you believe I got THIRD EYE liao bo la ?
BUY SINGAPORE RIVER NOW !
However, after this handsome brother sold his GCB. I think I will also start selling mine liao. Dun want to create too much panic, you see.
So dun say I never say hor.
bargain hunter
09-04-13, 21:16
is this no. 44 nassim road? nice number. :D
However, after this handsome brother sold his GCB. I think I will also start selling mine liao. Dun want to create too much panic, you see.
So dun say I never say hor.
You selling yours at $288m?
http://www.commercialguru.com.sg/listing/9761888/for-sale-nassim-road
http://cdn-sg2.pgimgs.com/images/thumb/5/0/8/0/50807a20960533_1_V550.jpg
wow, BJ21.. that's a very nice patio u have :scared-5:
Amber Woods
10-04-13, 09:02
Is this another case of the rich cashing out now?
more likely, having the last one holding when the music stops. But then again, I would have made a bundle in 2009 and in 2011 if I was not so conservative.
So its anyone's guess how this pans out.
Is this another case of the rich cashing out now?
No. it is not another case.
given the quantum 250-300million, it takes another rich to cash in. one rich cash out, one rich cash in, net effect is 0.
and since this is landed, only singapore citizens or singapore companies (ie no foreign directors, no foreign shareholders) can buy. this rules out publicly listed companies, foreign funds, no money laundering.
and if singapore company, LTV 40% (if not wrong). so how many singapore companies going to put down $150 million cash?
i think he can only see paper profit for now (unless NTF give birth to idiots).
Amber Woods
10-04-13, 09:59
more likely, having the last one holding when the music stops. But then again, I would have made a bundle in 2009 and in 2011 if I was not so conservative.
So its anyone's guess how this pans out.
I think so too especially when the seller is also a well known property developer himself. He surely knows more than we do what is happening or going to happen to the market.
bargain hunter
10-04-13, 10:15
singapore companies is now only 20% LTV.
wing tai surging assuming he is selling it to take the company private?!
No. it is not another case.
given the quantum 250-300million, it takes another rich to cash in. one rich cash out, one rich cash in, net effect is 0.
and since this is landed, only singapore citizens or singapore companies (ie no foreign directors, no foreign shareholders) can buy. this rules out publicly listed companies, foreign funds, no money laundering.
and if singapore company, LTV 40% (if not wrong). so how many singapore companies going to put down $150 million cash?
i think he can only see paper profit for now (unless NTF give birth to idiots).
bargain hunter
10-04-13, 10:16
if he does, it only means that he feels that the gcb market is toppish. can't imply a lot about the rest of the market yet.
I think so too especially when the seller is also a well known property developer himself. He surely knows more than we do what is happening or going to happen to the market.
singapore companies is now only 20% LTV.
wing tai surging assuming he is selling it to take the company private?!
funny right? he has to buy shares at higher price if public thinks he is taking company private. cannot be like SC meh? take the market by surprise.
i dont see why his selling need to be advertised. really, how many people can afford that kind of price? agent cannot approach 1 by 1 meh? they are sole agent.
Amber Woods
10-04-13, 11:05
if he does, it only means that he feels that the gcb market is toppish. can't imply a lot about the rest of the market yet.
Yes! As a property developer himself, his cashing out now while the price is still high. That is another possibility which cannot be ruled out. He surely knows more than we do.
bargain hunter
10-04-13, 11:06
precisely. 1) he is not likely to be able to sell becoz of what u mentioned earlier. 2) he is also not likely to be privatising wing tai (he already did a partial offer around this time last year and has gained the 50% which he wanted).
funny right? he has to buy shares at higher price if public thinks he is taking company private. cannot be like SC meh? take the market by surprise.
i dont see why his selling need to be advertised. really, how many people can afford that kind of price? agent cannot approach 1 by 1 meh? they are sole agent.
bargain hunter
10-04-13, 11:09
but for reasons which bro hopeful had mentioned, will be hard to find a buyer.
Yes! As a property developer himself, his cashing out now while the price is still high. That is another possibility which cannot be ruled out. He surely knows more than we do.
Amber Woods
10-04-13, 11:14
but for reasons which bro hopeful had mentioned, will be hard to find a buyer.
At least he tried, knowing that he could well be stucked with it. Who know he may decide to sell it at a lesser price.
bargain hunter
10-04-13, 11:18
my guess was wrong. the address is 33 nassim road. how many storey apartment can this be built up to?
maybe foreigners can participate in this case?
phantom_opera
10-04-13, 11:56
Russian bidding?? Cyprus => Singapore??
or UHNWI Chinese panic about H7N9?
:p
At least he tried, knowing that he could well be stucked with it. Who know he may decide to sell it at a lesser price.
Now that it is publicised, If cannot sell at the price range, it would be a huge loss of face. People would comment critically behind his back.
Of course, he couldnt care what we think, but among this circle, tsktsk.
Amber Woods
10-04-13, 12:31
He could be holding the property for a better price until now. Perhaps, he should have cashed out in 2011/2012 even if the valuation then was lower than now. At least it was easier to find buyer.
Perhaps, it is better to sell lower when there are ready buyers than trying to sell at the peak when buyers are hard to come by. He could well have MTB (miss the boat) as a seller.
No. it is not another case.
given the quantum 250-300million, it takes another rich to cash in. one rich cash out, one rich cash in, net effect is 0.
and since this is landed, only singapore citizens or singapore companies (ie no foreign directors, no foreign shareholders) can buy. this rules out publicly listed companies, foreign funds, no money laundering.
and if singapore company, LTV 40% (if not wrong). so how many singapore companies going to put down $150 million cash?
i think he can only see paper profit for now (unless NTF give birth to idiots).
Net effect might not necessary be zero because the next buyer could be buying for redevelopment rather than own stay. Which mean the next buyer will be buying the site to split them into small plot for resale.
Amber Woods
10-04-13, 16:48
Published July 16, 2009
LANDED HOMES
In a class of their own
Some 1,000 Singaporeans are said to own the majority of Good Class Bungalows here, reports ARTHUR SIM
VERY few people live in landed homes in Singapore and even fewer live in Good Class Bungalows (GCBs), which probably explains why they are so desirable. There are about one million or so homes here. These comprise terrace houses, semi-detached houses, bungalows and of course high-rise homes - condominiums, apartments and public housing flats.
http://www.businesstimes.com.sg/mnt/media/image/launched/2009-07-16/BT_IMAGES_ASGCB1-WT0.jpg
Exclusive: While it is not inconceivable that there could be more GCB areas added in the future, given the need to intensify land use in Singapore, the likelihood is slim
But GCBs stand quite far apart from all of these in that they not only have to sit on land that is of a certain size - not less than 1,400 square metres - but also have to be located in areas that have been specially designated for them. Indeed, there are estimated to be less than 2,500 GCBs in Singapore.
GCB areas were officially gazetted in 1980 with 39 areas formally safeguarded. A spokesman for the Urban Redevelopment Authority (URA) explained that the purpose of the gazette was to 'protect the high environmental quality of these established large bungalow areas from the intrusion of more intensive forms of housing such as semi-detached or terrace houses'.
Walk or drive around these GCB areas and often you will notice not only stately houses but stately trees as well with many protected for posterity. There are two zones in Singapore under the National Parks Board's Tree Conservation Areas with the main zone covering central Singapore where most of the GCBs are located.
To control development in these areas, URA set certain guidelines for planning purposes. For instance, the minimum plot size for any newly created bungalow within the 39 GCB areas must be at least 1,400 sq m. For this reason, a GCB plot cannot be developed to accommodate more intensive forms of housing. And unless it is at least 2,800 sq m in size, it cannot be sub-divided into two GCB plots either.
Of the GCB areas, the best known are the Nassim, Cluny, Bishopsgate and White House Park estates. While it is not inconceivable that there could be more GCB areas added in the future, given the need to intensify land use in Singapore, the likelihood is slim.
URA's spokesman said: 'In drawing up our land use plans for Singapore, we aim to provide a variety of housing options for Singaporeans, from waterfront housing to garden living to city living. This includes low-density and landed housing, such as those found within existing GCB areas. The detailed housing form for future landed housing areas will be determined when the area is ready to be developed.'
URA said that there are currently no plans to release new sites or designate new areas as GCB areas. 'Nevertheless, there is scope for the number of GCB plots within existing GCB areas to increase, for example through sub-division of larger GCB plots into several GCB plots, so long as each bungalow plot meets the minimum land size of 1,400 sq m,' URA added.
Big GCB plots do not come by often. In 1994, a plum site in the Tanglin GCB area came up for sale by public tender. The 194,000 sq ft parcel was the official residence of the Australian high commissioner at White House Park/Dalvey Road. Property valuers had estimated that the site could fetch as much as $70 million, or around $400 per square foot (psf). The site eventually sold for $98 million or $505 psf.
In 1997, developer Wharf Group sold five units of the 11-unit development of GCBs at an average of $14.1 million each. Ten years later, in 2007, a house in this development sold for $28.8 million. There have been other public tenders of large sites.
In 2000, Hongkong and Shanghai Banking Corporation (HSBC) sold a 201,782 sq ft freehold bungalow site it owned since the 1960s in Jervois Road for $60 million, or slightly over $330 psf. Then in 2003, HSBC sold a 276,112 sq ft site at Bishopsgate for $69.8 million. Together, all three sites would have yielded less than 40 new GCBs.
Occasionally, individual GCB sites will come up for auction. In 2008, the Singapore Land Authority auctioned a site at Ridout Road which saw 34 bids lodged by three prospective buyers. The winning bid came in at $8.96 million or $579.55 psf. This was 22.6 per cent above the opening bid of $7.31 million or $473 psf. Being fresh government land sale sites, however, it came with a 99-year lease.
SLA also said that recently, three parcels of land have been sold under the Sale of Infill Sites programme on 99-year leases. 'The owners have to comply with URA's GCB guidelines as the land parcels are within GCB areas,' it added.
Because the environment is an important factor in GCB areas, there are guidelines that control how big the house can be. For instance, the house cannot cover more than 35 per cent of the site. This is to ensure that there are adequate green buffers between each house.
There are also more prosaic restraints - childcare centres are not allowed in GCB areas for instance. But perhaps the most important constraint on GCB ownership to note is that foreigners are not allowed to own these, thus reducing the buying pool of GCBs.
Some 1,000 Singaporeans are said to own the majority of GCBs here and are mostly intent on holding on to them as long-term investments. If you have bought one through the open market, you can count yourself lucky indeed.
I think so too especially when the seller is also a well known property developer himself. He surely knows more than we do what is happening or going to happen to the market.
He's probably referring to this -
http://www.moneynews.com/MKTnews/Market-Collapse-Predicted-by-scientist/2013/03/13/id/494569?promo_code=13001-1
Sorry hor , I am not Mr B or seletar but I do take heed of this .. :D
Amber Woods
11-04-13, 08:53
He's probably referring to this -
http://www.moneynews.com/MKTnews/Market-Collapse-Predicted-by-scientist/2013/03/13/id/494569?promo_code=13001-1
Sorry hor , I am not Mr B or seletar but I do take heed of this .. :D
Alamak! The Bulls are not going to like you here. You have just hurt their rice bowls.
Alamak! The Bulls are not going to like you here. You have just hurt their rice bowls.
Logic tells you that there are an element of truths .. if you watch the video ..and realised the way easy n irresponsible $$$ are printed in America ... things can go hey wire from now to 2016 ... Be safe is my message when tsunami come it buried you ...
He could be holding the property for a better price until now. Perhaps, he should have cashed out in 2011/2012 even if the valuation then was lower than now. At least it was easier to find buyer.
Perhaps, it is better to sell lower when there are ready buyers than trying to sell at the peak when buyers are hard to come by. He could well have MTB (miss the boat) as a seller.
The greatest investor is one who know when to unlock value at near (or pass, let you interpret) optimum time .. the signs are there already eg population white paper already out, CM8 s measures blah blah .. I am no Mr B .. But Mr B was never wrong ..It is only a matter of time ..
How rich always get richer is because they know when to exit the market.
Correction might be around the corner.
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/787/propertyindex.jpg
How rich always get richer is because they know when to exit the market.
Correction might be around the corner.
yawn...same old chart again. Now everyone knows why you started this thread in the first place.
This rich person in question is someone who hasn't exactly been spot on in his decision making.
Opinion from one forumer in relation to news article (below) on comments made by that rich person..
Wing Tai has sifted its position to become a high end property developer believing that property prices in Singapore would emulate that in Paris and London with the two IRs. It did not happen and now the boss is crying foul. Unlike most other developers with a more diversify business, Wing Tai only targets the high end segment. In business, the board would have him fired. Fortunately for him, he owns a fair share of the company and is "untouchable" despite the wrong call.
Source: Business Times – 7 June 2012
Suburban-urban price gap narrows because of MRT, amenities
SINGAPORE'S MRT network, along with a lethargic high-end market, has led to a narrowing price gap between suburban condos near MRT stations and those in the CBD/prime districts.
One way for the authorities to cool the mass segment of the private housing market would be to release more sites further away from MRT stations, reckons Wing Tai chairman Cheng Wai Keung.
He also notes that the network of MRT stations around the island has also reduced price differentiation between various suburban locations.
"The MRT transport network is so good that what is important now is not how far a property is from the centre or CBD; it (the price) is now more defined by how close you are to the MRT station.
"Two MRT stations, three stations, although you may think that it's far but in actual travelling time, it's not so much difference."
Besides MRT stations, the government has done a good job providing amenities.
"Today, living in a place like Sengkang is not so unbearable. There's an MRT station, a mall, library, everything." In some locations, there are also office buildings "so you don't have to come to town to work".
In short, shopping malls and other amenities that were in the past offered only in urban locations are now duplicated in suburban areas.
"This convenience has narrowed the price difference between urban and suburban areas, and also between the different suburban centres," Mr Cheng says.
SLP International managing director Peter Ow estimates that average launch prices for new suburban condos near MRT stations, excluding small units, are around $1,000 per square foot (psf).
Some market watchers have also commented that there was hardly a price gap between Sky Habitat in Bishan, which sold at a median price of $1,583 psf in April, and d'Leedon in the Farrer Road location, with a median price of $1,603 psf in April based on developer sales data lodged with the Urban Redevelopment Authority. Both are 99-year leasehold condos.
Mr Cheng, however, does not believe that the price gap will continue to narrow between suburban and prime locations such as Orchard because of the "perceived prestige . . . snob value".
"High-end locations still have a certain brand value."
One solution for the government to tackle the rise in property prices in the suburbs would be to release more land that is not next to MRT stations.
Land and property values for such sites are lower than those next to MRT stations.
While Mr Cheng acknowledges the motivation for government to tender out plots closer to MRT stations, to intensify land use near major transport nodes, he highlights some of the benefits of selling more land further away from MRT stations.
"You bring down the price . . . psychologically (when) you don't see at every tender, prices continuing to move up, with 15 developers going in to fight for a choice site. This will reduce the anxiety of people . . . and help to moderate the urge to quickly want to buy (a property) before price goes up."
Secondly, by selling land that is further from an MRT station, "you allow people a choice to have cheaper housing".
In exchange for this, they may be willing to give up the convenience of living closer to the MRT station. "They can walk (longer), take a transfer bus to the MRT station."
From the state's perspective too, it makes economic sense to release not-so-conveniently located sites in a hot market rather than in a dull market.
"At the end of the day, you have to release that site anyway, but if you release it in a dull market, the price will be even more depressed . . . or nobody may want it."
In the current market, there will still be some takers for such plots.
"So you also safeguard a certain value of the land. It's a good time to release more of not-so-choice sites in a hot market," Mr Cheng says.
Was reading ST today, they are wondering why Wing Tai doesnt want to redevelop this site into small plot and then sell them individually.
Was reading ST today, they are wondering why Wing Tai doesnt want to redevelop this site into small plot and then sell them individually.
GCB is owned by privately held investment vehicle of CWK and his wife and not Wing Tai.
A privately-held investment vehicle controlled by Wing Tai chairman Cheng Wai Keung and his wife Helen has put its Nassim Road bungalow on a sprawling 84,839 sq ft freehold site on the market.
Jones Lang LaSalle - the sole marketing agent appointed to handle the sale of the property by tender - said the owners, whom it did not identify, are aiming to receive offers in the region of $250-300 million. This would work out to $2,947-3,536 per square foot (psf) on the land area.
Even the lower ends of the absolute and psf price ranges, if achieved, would set record prices for Good Class Bungalows.
In terms of absolute quantum, the highest transaction in a GCB Area was for $87.5 million in 2001 involving a 291,000 sq ft parcel in Swettenham Road in an asset swop deal between Singapore Press Holdings and Lum Chang, according to JLL's head of investments and residential Karamjit Singh.
GCB is owned by privately held investment vehicle of CWK and his wife and not Wing Tai.
as chairman of wingtai he would have the experience and resources to redevelop this plot, either by himself or through his investment vehicle.
Just like how other developer such as Kheng Leong or Hong Leong Holding does them.
Whats your opinion about this sale? Do you think he will find a buyer at this price? Or do you think he is stupid to sell landed property in Singapore.
as chairman of wingtai he would have the experience and resources to redevelop this plot, either by himself or through his investment vehicle.
Just like how other developer such as Kheng Leong or Hong Leong Holding does them.
Whats your opinion about this sale? Do you think he will find a buyer at this price? Or do you think he is stupid to sell landed property in Singapore.
Potential conflict of interest if he goes into property development himself....
Potential conflict of interest if he goes into property development himself....
care to explain why so?
Do you think he is stupid to sell landed property?
care to explain why so?
Do you think he is stupid to sell landed property?
For all you know, he could just be trying to boost the value of his other Nassim road property. Who knows how many he may own in that area?
The Nassim Road site is owned by Winright Investment Pte (http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=business%2Fbloomberg&search=1&inlineLink=1&query=%22Winright+Investment+Pte%22), according to property records obtained by Bloomberg News. Cheng and his wife, Helen Chow (http://www.sfgate.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=business%2Fbloomberg&search=1&inlineLink=1&query=%22Helen+Chow%22), who list their address at another Nassim Road home, are the shareholders of Winright, a company set up for “holding of property for long-term investment purposes,” according to company records obtained by Bloomberg News.
[quote=proper-t]For all you know, he could just be trying to boost the value of his other Nassim road property. Who knows how many he may own in that area?
that has got nothing to do with conflict of interest. What conflict of interest are you talking about?
[quote=proper-t]For all you know, he could just be trying to boost the value of his other Nassim road property. Who knows how many he may own in that area?
that has got nothing to do with conflict of interest. What conflict of interest are you talking about?
Wing Tai is marketing high end property which may target the same type of clientele as a prime landed project.
[quote=Ringo33]
Wing Tai is marketing high end property which may target the same type of clientele as a prime landed project.
Wee Cho Yaw has got his privately held Kheng Leong that does property development. Kwek Leng Beng has got his privately held Hong Leong Holding that does property development as well.. What does private investment decision has got to do with what their other company does?
Wingtai is just like any other developers, they do mass market, mid end, highend etc. But I have not heard about them selling GCB in Singapore. Which GCB development did the sell in Singapore?
Wee Cho Yaw has got his privately held Kheng Leong that does property development. Kwek Leng Beng has got his privately held Hong Leong Holding that does property development as well.. What does private investment decision has got to do with what their other company does?
Wingtai is just like any other developers, they do mass market, mid end, highend etc. But I have not heard about them selling GCB in Singapore. Which GCB development did the sell in Singapore?
Ask CWK yourself. He could be very wary of flouting Companies Act and wants to avoid any potential conflict at all cost.
For all you know, he might just not want to go through the hassle of re-developing and selling the project.
Only he would know the real reason.
Ask CWK yourself. He could be very wary of flouting Companies Act and wants to avoid any potential conflict at all cost.
For all you know, he might just not want to go through the hassle of re-developing and selling the project.
Only he would know the real reason.
Yes, but what I am asking you is where is the conflict of interest if he choose to redevelop the plot himself or through his privately held investment company.
Yes, but what I am asking you is where is the conflict of interest if he choose to redevelop the plot himself or through his privately held investment company.
As long there exist a possibility (however remote) that his private company may be competing for the same customers as his public interest, then there may be a perception of a conflict which he may want to avoid at all cost.
As long there exist a possibility (however remote) that his private company may be competing for the same customers as his public interest, then there may be a perception of a conflict which he may want to avoid at all cost.
As a chairman of WingTai, he cannot sell property because potential buyers of his 250m property could possibility be a customer of WingTai?
Is that what you are saying?
As a chairman of WingTai, he cannot sell property because potential buyers of his 250m property could possibility be a customer of WingTai?
Is that what you are saying?
No, I never said that. All I pointed out was that he may not want to put himself in a position where people might perceive or say there could be a possible conflict of interest and potentially run afoul of the authorities.
No, I never said that. All I pointed out was that he may not want to put himself in a position where people might perceive or say there could be a possible conflict of interest and potentially run afoul of the authorities.
If thats not what you said, that may I know what conflict on interest are you talking about? And what is wrong with making money from redeveloping GCB?
If thats not what you said, that may I know what conflict on interest are you talking about? And what is wrong with making money from redeveloping GCB?
What if he is hosting a dinner with the super wealthy and at the table, a super rich individual says he is considering either buying a penthouse at Ardmore area or a new bungalow in a prime area and ask for his recommendations.
What would be his response?
Assuming there are shareholders of Wing Tai sitting at the same table, what do you think will be their perception if that individual eventually bought his bungalow project even though he may not have said or recommended anything at the table.
The main thing is what people perceive to be a possible conflict. As long as he wants to avoid people having such perceptions, to him, it may be better to draw a distinct line.
This could also be one of the reasons why the property is going through a public tender.
.
What if he is hosting a dinner with the super wealthy and at the table, a super rich individual says he is considering either buying a penthouse at Ardmore area or a new bungalow in a prime area and ask for his recommendations.
What would be his response?
Assuming there are shareholders of Wing Tai sitting at the same table, what do you think will be their perception if that individual eventually bought his bungalow project even though he may not have said or recommended anything at the table.
The main thing is what people perceive to be a possible conflict. As long as he wants to avoid people having such perceptions, to him, it may be better to draw a distinct line.
This could also be the reason why the property is going through a public tender.
.
So what you are saying is that as chairman of WingTai, he should not make profit from property because of conflict of interest. And the same should also apply to all employee of wingtai perhaps?
So what you are saying is that as chairman of WingTai, he should not make profit from property because of conflict of interest. And the same should also apply to all employee of wingtai perhaps?
Why are you trying so hard to put words in my mouth? Your attempts are quite laughable.
I never said he could not make money from personal property interest. All I said is that one of the reasons he may not want to embark on this GCB redevelopment is because he may be of the mind that people may perceive a potential conflict of interest with his public interest. Why are you bringing employees of Wing Tai into this? The focus should be on CWK and this GCB sale.
Why are you trying so hard to put words in my mouth? Your attempts are quite laughable.
I never said he could not make money from personal property interest. All I said is that one of the reasons he may not want to embark on this GCB redevelopment is because he may be of the mind that people may perceive a potential conflict of interest with his public interest. Why are you bringing employees of Wing Tai into this? The focus should be on CWK and this GCB sale.
You say that as chairman of WingTai there is a possible conflict of interest if he redevelop his GCB for sale because potential buyers for his GCB should also be interested i WingTai properties.
So wont that mean that ALL employee of WingTai or any developers should not sell, invest or speculate in property because potential buyers ot their propery could also be potential buyer of WingTai property?
Is this what you are implying?
You say that as chairman of WingTai there is a possible conflict of interest if he redevelop his GCB for sale because potential buyers for his GCB should also be interested i WingTai properties.
So wont that mean that ALL employee of WingTai or any developers should not sell, invest or speculate in property because potential buyers ot their propery could also be potential buyer of WingTai property?
Is this what you are implying?
Sigh.....Go read up Companies Act on Director's Duties. Are all employees of Wing Tai on the Board of Directors as well?
3.2 In addition to his usual statutory duties, a director is required to: –
(a) act in good faith in the interests of the company;
(b) act with due care and skill;
(c) avoid conflicts of interests; and
(d) use his powers for proper purposes.
Duty to act in good faith in the company’s interest
Sigh.....Go read up Companies Act on Director's Duties. Are all employees of Wing Tai on the Board of Directors as well?
Are you implying that as Director or Chairman of WingTai, investing in property is consider as conflict of interest? How do you explain Wee Cho Yaw or Kwek Leng Beng? They actually do it in massive scale. Why are they not prosecuted?
What about WingTai employment contract? I am sure in every employee's EC, there will be a clause which touch of conflict of interest isnt it?
Are you implying that as Director or Chairman of WingTai, investing in property is consider as conflict of interest? How do you explain Wee Cho Yaw or Kwek Leng Beng? They actually do it in massive scale. Why are they not prosecuted?
What about WingTai employment contract? I am sure in every employee's EC, there will be a clause which touch of conflict of interest isnt it?
Why are you still trying to put words into my mouth. Pretty pathetic attempt.
Did I say that investing in property is considered a conflict of interest?
The only point I raised is that one of the reasons why CWK may not want to embark on this GCB redevelopment is because he may be of the mind that people may perceive a potential conflict of interest with his public interest. Some people may just not want to invite any attention at all even though the possibility of a conflict is debatable.
I am not privy to Wing Tai Employment contract. Like I said, we are discussing CWK and the GCB sale, not Wing Tai employees.
Why are you still trying to put words into my mouth. Pretty pathetic attempt.
Did I say that investing in property is considered a conflict of interest?
The only point I raised is that one of the reasons why CWK may not want to embark on this GCB redevelopment is because he may be of the mind that people may perceive a potential conflict of interest with his public interest. Some people may just not want to invite any attention at all even though the possibility of a conflict is debatable.
I am not privy to Wing Tai Employment contract. Like I said, we are discussing CWK and the GCB sale, not Wing Tai employees.
Obviously there is no conflict of interest and you are just saying this because you have got nothing better to say, and the explain why you cant even explain yourself clearly.
Conflict of interest? try writing to the authority loh because Wee Cho Yaw and Kwek Leng Beng are doing it openly and in direct competition with UOL and CDL.
What say you? Wee and Kwek, are not worry about "Perceive conflict of interest"
Obviously there is no conflict of interest and you are just saying this because you have got nothing better to say, and the explain why you cant even explain yourself clearly.
Conflict of interest? try writing to the authority loh because Wee Cho Yaw and Kwek Leng Beng are doing it openly and in direct competition with UOL and CDL.
What say you? Wee and Kwek, are not worry about "Perceive conflict of interest"
You have obviously not been following the thread. I just explained the possibility of conflict in post #52.
Instead of coming up with a logical counter, all you can dish out is to accuse me of implying this and implying that.
Wee and Kwek's thinking and personality may be totally different from CWK. Why are you comparing them to CWK?
As long as there is a possibility that there could be a conflict of interest, he may be of that mind too and could be the reason why he has decided not to proceed with redevelopment of the GCB.
Unless you can prove that there is absolutely zero possibility of a conflict arising, then you cannot dispute my statement
You have obviously not been following the thread. I just explained the possibility of conflict in post #52.
Instead of coming up with a logical counter, all you can dish out is to accuse me of implying this and implying that.
Wee and Kwek's thinking and personality may be totally different from CWK. Why are you comparing them to CWK?
As long as there is a possibility that there could be a conflict of interest, he may be of that mind too and could be the reason why he has decided not to proceed with redevelopment of the GCB.
Unless you can prove that there is absolutely zero possibility of a conflict arising, then you cannot dispute my statement
1) You talk about conflict of interest. I am asking you, what conflict of interest are you talking about here when WingTai doesnt sell GCB on that scale and there is no law against it.
2) You speak about the company act for director, I am asking you does director buying and selling property in his personal capacity to make money deem as conflict of interest?
3) You mentioned that as chairman of Wingtai could be worry about "perceive potential of conflict of interest". May I know what exact are you talking about? Perceive pontential conflict of interest, does sound like you are trying to say something but it means nothing.
1) You talk about conflict of interest. I am asking you, what conflict of interest are you talking about here when WingTai doesnt sell GCB on that scale and there is no law against it.
2) You speak about the compact act for director, I am asking you does director buying and selling property in his personal capacity to make money deem as conflict of interest?
3) You mentioned that as chairman of Wingtai could be worry about "perceive potential of conflict of interest". May I know what exact are you talking about? Perceive pontential conflict of interest, does sound like you are trying to say something but it means nothing.
1. Refer to my scenario in post #52. Is there not a conflict there even though Wing Tai is not selling GCBs?
2. Firstly, there is NO compact act. There you go again trying to put words in my mouth again. Did I say that director buying and selling property in personal capacity is deemed as a conflict of interest? All I said is that in CWK's mind, he may view it as a possible conflict of interest if he redevelops and sells the GCB units as a new project.
3. Refer to my scenario in post #52. Won't people perceive that he steered that buyer to his GCB project instead of persuading that buyer to buy Wing Tai's Ardmore penthouse? Even though he may have actually tried his utmost to get the buyer to purchase the Wing Tai penthouse, the fact that the buyer bought his project instead will still give the impression that his interest was conflicted. So to avoid such perceptions, he may have decided not to embark on the redevelopment of the GCB and instead release the old property on a tender basis.
1. Refer to my scenario in post #52. Is there not a conflict there even though Wing Tai is not selling GCBs?
2. Firstly, there is NO compact act. There you go again trying to put words in my mouth again. Did I say that director buying and selling property in personal capacity is deemed as a conflict of interest? All I said is that in CWK's mind, he may view it as a possible conflict of interest if he redevelops and sells the GCB units as a new project.
3. Refer to my scenario in post #52. Won't people perceive that he steered that buyer to his GCB project instead of persuading that buyer to buy Wing Tai's Ardmore penthouse? Even though he may have actually tried his utmost to get the buyer to purchase the Wing Tai penthouse, the fact that the buyer bought his project instead will still give the impression that his interest was conflicted. So to avoid such perceptions, he may have decided not to embark on the redevelopment of the GCB and instead release the old property on a tender basis.
Do you realize that you are going round in circle conflicting your own statement.
Is WingTai chairman selling GCB consider conflict of interest? Yes?
So as chairman and employee of WingTai, no one is suppose to sell property? No?
So now you are also a mind reader huh?
Do you realize that you are going round in circle conflicting your own statement.
Is WingTai chairman selling GCB consider conflict of interest? Yes?
So as chairman and employee of WingTai, no one is suppose to sell property? No?
So now you are also a mind reader huh?
You are the one not getting the point and keep making irrelevant statements.
My scenario in post #52 clearly shows a possible potential conflict of interest should he choose to redevelop and sell the GCB as a new project. Please dispute if you can.
As long as there exist the possibility, it is also fully possible that CWK may be of the mind that such a conflict exist and it could very well be one of the reasons that he decided not to redevelop.
I am not a mind reader which is why I have stated that it could be a possible reason. You on the other hand, refused to accept it but cannot prove that such a potential conflict does not exist at all.
So who is the one going around in circles now?
You are the one not getting the point and keep making irrelevant statements.
My scenario in post #52 clearly shows a possible potential conflict of interest should he choose to redevelop and sell the GCB as a new project. Please dispute if you can.
As long as there exist the possibility, it is also fully possible that CWK may be of the mind that such a conflict exist and it could very well be one of the reasons that he decided not to redevelop.
I am not a mind reader which is why I have stated that it could be a possible reason. You on the other hand, refused to accept it but cannot prove that such a potential conflict does not exist at all.
So who is the one going around in circles now?
You can come out with 1000 stories and scenario if you wish but you will never be able to tell us why LEGALLY there is a conflict of interest. and why director or chairman of developer cannot have property interest outside their listed company.
Yes I said legally, anything else is nothing but Rubbish
You can come out with 1000 stories and scenario if you wish but you will never be able to tell us why LEGALLY there is a conflict of interest. and why director or chairman of developer cannot have property interest outside their listed company.
Yes I said legally, anything else is nothing but Rubbish
Anyone who has consulted a lawyer on conflict of interest in the Companies Act will get the same answer : its open to interpretation by the lawyers and more importantly the authorities/judiciary.
Since you say its rubbish, please enlighten all here why LEGALLY my scenario in post #52 is not admissible as a potential conflict of interest to be argued in a court of law. Please highlight the specific sections and sub-sections so that all here can learn.
Anyone who has consulted a lawyer on conflict of interest in the Companies Act will get the same answer : its open to interpretation by the lawyers and more importantly the authorities/judiciary.
Since you say its rubbish, please enlighten all here why LEGALLY my scenario in post #52 is not admissible as a potential conflict of interest to be argued in a court of law. Please highlight the specific sections and sub-sections so that all here can learn.
So based on your post #52, does it mean that as Chairman of WingTai, he should not engage in any property investment because anything that he sell in your contacts will be a conflict of interest? And if it applies to Chairman, then all employee of WingTai should not invest in property as well because it will be conflict of interest isnt it?
And how do you explain what Wee Cho Yaw and Kwek Leng Beng does with their private investment veh like Kheng Leong and HL Holdings who does sell property in direct competition with their company such as UOL and CDL. (Please talk about facts, not some colourful stories)
POST #52
What if he is hosting a dinner with the super wealthy and at the table, a super rich individual says he is considering either buying a penthouse at Ardmore area or a new bungalow in a prime area and ask for his recommendations.
What would be his response?
Assuming there are shareholders of Wing Tai sitting at the same table, what do you think will be their perception if that individual eventually bought his bungalow project even though he may not have said or recommended anything at the table.
The main thing is what people perceive to be a possible conflict. As long as he wants to avoid people having such perceptions, to him, it may be better to draw a distinct line.
This could also be one of the reasons why the property is going through a public tender.
So based on your post #52, does it mean that as Chairman of WingTai, he should not engage in any property investment because anything that he sell in your contacts will be a conflict of interest? And if it applies to Chairman, then all employee of WingTai should not invest in property as well because it will be conflict of interest isnt it?
And how do you explain what Wee Cho Yaw and Kwek Leng Beng does with their private investment veh like Kheng Leong and HL Holdings who does sell property in direct competition with their company such as UOL and CDL. (Please talk about facts, not some colourful stories)
POST #52
Please stop going around in circles and answer my question posted earlier (which is reproduced below)
Since you say its rubbish, please enlighten all here why LEGALLY my scenario in post #52 is not admissible as a potential conflict of interest to be argued in a court of law. Please highlight the specific sections and sub-sections so that all here can learn.
If you can't support your statement then my view of the possibility that CWK could be of the mind that a conflict might exist stands.
Please stop going around in circles and answer my question posted earlier (which is reproduced below)
Since you say its rubbish, please enlighten all here why LEGALLY my scenario in post #52 is not admissible as a potential conflict of interest to be argued in a court of law. Please highlight the specific sections and sub-sections so that all here can learn.
If you can't support your statement then my view of the possibility that CWK could be of the mind that a conflict might exist stands.
Many post back I have already mentioned that you are going around in circle.
On on hand you say that as Chairman of WingTai, selling property in his personal capacity is conflict of interest to WingTai.
On the other hand you dare not say that as Chairman or even employee of Wingtai, no one should engage in buying and selling of property.
So now that you have trip over on what you said, you are asking me to tell you why it is wrong to trip over?
Please dont avoid my question leh. Many post back I already ask you to explain why is it ok for Wee Cho Yaw and Kwek Leng Beng does with their private investment veh like Kheng Leong and HL Holdings who does sell property in direct competition with their company such as UOL and CDL. (Please talk about facts, not some colourful stories)
And please dont go around in circle. You should come clean and explain yourself why chairman of Wingtai should not buy and sell property.
Many post back I have already mentioned that you are going around in circle.
On on hand you say that as Chairman of WingTai, selling property in his personal capacity is conflict of interest to WingTai.
On the other hand you dare not say that as Chairman or even employee of Wingtai, no one should engage in buying and selling of property.
So now that you have trip over on what you said, you are asking me to tell you why it is wrong to trip over?
Please dont avoid my question leh. Many post back I already ask you to explain why is it ok for Wee Cho Yaw and Kwek Leng Beng does with their private investment veh like Kheng Leong and HL Holdings who does sell property in direct competition with their company such as UOL and CDL. (Please talk about facts, not some colourful stories)
And please dont go around is circle. You should come clean and explain yourself why chairman of Wingtai should not buy and sell property.
I have already answered and stated my case in post below
You are the one not getting the point and keep making irrelevant statements.
My scenario in post #52 clearly shows a possible potential conflict of interest should he choose to redevelop and sell the GCB as a new project. Please dispute if you can.
As long as there exist the possibility, it is also fully possible that CWK may be of the mind that such a conflict exist and it could very well be one of the reasons that he decided not to redevelop.
I am not a mind reader which is why I have stated that it could be a possible reason. You on the other hand, refused to accept it but cannot prove that such a potential conflict does not exist at all.
So who is the one going around in circles now?
whereby your response was that the scenario is legally 'rubbish'
You can come out with 1000 stories and scenario if you wish but you will never be able to tell us why LEGALLY there is a conflict of interest. and why director or chairman of developer cannot have property interest outside their listed company.
Yes I said legally, anything else is nothing but Rubbish
Rather than straying from the line of questioning and trying to put words in my mouth, please support your claim that the scenario is legally 'rubbish by answering the question below
Since you say its rubbish, please enlighten all here why LEGALLY my scenario in post #52 is not admissible as a potential conflict of interest to be argued in a court of law. Please highlight the specific sections and sub-sections so that all here can learn.
If you can't support your statement then my view of the possibility that CWK could be of the mind that a conflict might exist stands.
No, I never said that. All I pointed out was that he may not want to put himself in a position where people might perceive or say there could be a possible conflict of interest and potentially run afoul of the authorities.
aren't there legal ways to get around the conflict of interest?
eg have a board vote whether to buy the land, he abstain from the vote, and decision will be decided by the rest of the board.
or hold auction, he excuse himself (as above) from the tender bidding by WT.
aren't there legal ways to get around the conflict of interest?
eg have a board vote whether to buy the land, he abstain from the vote, and decision will be decided by the rest of the board.
or hold auction, he excuse himself (as above) from the tender bidding by WT.
This is a personal interest vs his public interest as Chairman of Wing Tai. I am no lawyer and there may be possible legal workarounds but as I have mentioned before, he may not even want to put himself in that position and most likely in the process, also have to disclose personal information to the Board of Wing Tai. Such resolutions may also be published in the annual report or open to public scrutiny.
All that you have done so far is telling stories like a kid on kindergarten. And keep referring back to the same story over and over again like it will become fact.
So as chairman of wing tai he should not sell his gcb at all because of potential conflict of interest. So what is he suppose to do? Give it away?
All that you have done so far is telling stories like a kid on kindergarten. And keep referring back to the same story over and over again like it will become fact.
So as chairman of wing tai he should not sell his gcb at all because of potential conflict of interest. So what is he suppose to do? Give it away?
now you are putting words, it is not either or choice of selling to WT. he could sell to other parties instead of giving it away.
now you are putting words, it is not either or choice of selling to WT. he could sell to other parties instead of giving it away.
I think the concern propert highlighted is actually 3rd party because what if the 3rd party is also interested in wing tai property? That to him is conflict of interest. So I am asking what should he do?
now you are putting words, it is not either or choice of selling to WT. he could sell to other parties instead of giving it away.
Thank you. I rest my case.
It is already reported in the news that the plot is to be sold in a tender process. The question being raised is why he did not redevelop the plot and sell it off himself as a personal venture.
I have cited some possible reasons :
1. He may want to avoid the possibility of a conflict of interest in view of his position as Chairman of Wing Tai. As you have pointed out, there may be legal workarounds but does he want to even put himself in that position, go through the hassle and in the process, disclose personal details about the project to the board?
2. He just may not want to go through the hassle of redeveloping the plot.
Someone here has just picked up on pt 1 and has been harping on it ever since endlessly trying to put words into my mouth.
Go read post 52 is you wish to know what propert is talking about
Yes, please read post #52. Someone here obviously can't comprehend it.
Yes, please read post #52. Someone here obviously can't comprehend it.
You haven't tell me what should this poor chairman do with his property since everything he sell will be conflict of interest
You haven't tell me what should this poor chairman do with his property since everything he sell will be conflict of interest
Still harping on the issue and trying to put words into my mouth?
Please go back to the line of questioning in this thread and substantiate your claim that the scenario is legally 'rubbish by answering the question below. You obviously cannot answer it which explains all your irrelevant statements and your poor attempts to implicate me.
Since you say its rubbish, please enlighten all here why LEGALLY my scenario in post #52 is not admissible as a potential conflict of interest to be argued in a court of law. Please highlight the specific sections and sub-sections so that all here can learn.
If you can't support your statement then my view of the possibility that CWK could be of the mind that a conflict might exist stands.
.....
1. He may want to avoid the possibility of a conflict of interest in view of his position as Chairman of Wing Tai. As you have pointed out, there may be legal workarounds but does he want to even put himself in that position, go through the hassle and in the process, disclose personal details about the project to the board?
.....
i always like to follow the money
$300mil for 85,000, that is about 3500psf.
from squarefoot, the highest was 2007-09-18, 32H nassim road, 1899psf for area of 13,423sf.
2nd highest was 2010-04-20, psf 1800psf.
so if market value lets say 2200psf. the difference is 1300psf.
potential profit if he sell to wingtai is $110.5milion.
assuming he owe 50% of WT, then he effectively halve his profit to $55million, since $55mil is born by WT other shareholder's and $55mil is born by him. (it would be more profit if he owe 20% of WT, )
would $55million ADDITIONAL profit (on top of his normal profit selling at 2200psf) be worth considering to him?
afterall, i think there isn't much more additional info to disclose to the board, is there? since they moved around in same circle, etc.
as long as things are done in the open, declared, govt has no case even if the ceo of the company makes lousy investments, and run company to the ground.
i always like to follow the money
$300mil for 85,000, that is about 3500psf.
from squarefoot, the highest was 2007-09-18, 32H nassim road, 1899psf for area of 13,423sf.
2nd highest was 2010-04-20, psf 1800psf.
so if market value lets say 2200psf. the difference is 1300psf.
potential profit if he sell to wingtai is $110.5milion.
assuming he owe 50% of WT, then he effectively halve his profit to $55million, since $55mil is born by WT other shareholder's and $55mil is born by him.
would $55million ADDITIONAL profit (on top of his normal profit selling at 2200psf) be worth considering to him?
afterall, i think there isn't much more additional info to disclose to the board, is there? since they moved around in same circle, etc.
as long as things are done in the open, declared, govt has no case even if the company makes lousy investments, run company to the ground.
The point being raised is not whether he should sell to WT as it is already announced that the plot is going to be sold via a tender process.
What is being being discussed is why he didn't sub-divide and re-develop the plot and sell it off as a personal GCB project.
One of the possible reasons I have mentioned could be the possibility of a potential conflict of interest if he embarks on the redevelopment route as a private venture. He may have just wanted to avoid this possible conflict and the likely hassles/disclosure accompanied by choosing to go the re-development route.
That is the point I am trying to make here.
If you are talking aout money, then its another matter.
Still harping on the issue and trying to put words into my mouth?
Please go back to the line of questioning in this thread and substantiate your claim that the scenario is legally 'rubbish by answering the question below. You obviously cannot answer it which explains all your irrelevant statements and your poor attempts to implicate me.
I am not sure what exactly you are talking about here and why you keep referring me back to your #52 post.
My first question was why didnt the chairman of wingtai try to redevelop this GCB and resell them for profit?
You comment was conflict of interest.
I am asking you what conflict of interest.
You said, that because he is does that, the potential customer of his GCBs could also be interested in WingTai property
So I am asking you now that what is this chairman going to do with his property since everything that he sell will also attract potential buyers who might also be interested in WingTai property.
I am not sure what exactly you are talking about here and why you keep referring me back to your #52 post.
My first question was why didnt the chairman of wingtai try to redevelop this GCB and resell them for profit?
You comment was conflict of interest.
I am asking you what conflict of interest.
You said, that because he is does that, the potential customer of his GCBs could also be interested in WingTai property
So I am asking you now that what is this chairman going to do with his property since everything that he sell will also attract potential buyers who might also be interested in WingTai property.
Hasn't it been announced that he is aleady selling it via public tender?
Possibly, in his mind, re-developing and selling off as a new GCB project could be perceived as a possible or more onerous conflict of interest rather than selling via public tender hence it could count as one of the possible reasons why he did not embark on the re-development route.
.....
What is being being discussed is why he didn't sub-divide and re-develop the plot and sell it off as a personal GCB project.
One of the possible reasons I have mentioned could be the possibility of a potential conflict of interest if he embarks on the redevelopment route as a private venture. He may have just wanted to avoid this possible conflict and the likely hassles/disclosure accompanied by choosing to go the re-development route.
That is the point I am trying to make here.
....
okay, beats me too why he didnt redevelop the plot or break it down in size.
possible guess would be
1) he has no intention of selling. just a publicity stunt.
2) he wants WT to buy over (if can) at high price, tender is open and above board.
3) maybe he wants to sell LH to WT, and he retain control of FH status via his investment company.?
4) more importantly, if he sell at 3500psf even for 15000sqft plot. nobody will buy?
Anybody has details of the tender documents?
lots of maybes.
but i dont really see a conflict of interest if he redeveloped the plot himself and sold each off piece by piece. caveat: i am not legally trained.
Hasn't it been announced that he is aleady selling it via public tender?
In his mind, re-developing and selling off as a new GCB project could be perceived as a possible or more onerous conflict of interest rather than selling via public tender hence it could count as one of the possible reasons why he did not embark on the re-development route.
What is stopping him from redeveloping and sell the GCB through public tender?
Like what you said in #52, what IF this chairman have dinner with potential buyer who might be interested in the public tender and also be interested in WingTai property? Is this conflict of interest?
okay, beats me too why he didnt redevelop the plot or break it down in size.
possible guess would be
1) he has no intention of selling. just a publicity stunt.
2) he wants WT to buy over (if can) at high price, tender is open and above board.
3) maybe he wants to sell LH to WT, and he retain control of FH status via his investment company.?
4) more importantly, if he sell at 3500psf even for 15000sqft plot. nobody will buy?
Anybody has details of the tender documents?
lots of maybes.
but i dont really see a conflict of interest if he redeveloped the plot himself and sold each off piece by piece. caveat: i am not legally trained.
If the intention is to sell it to Wingtai, the easiest way around it will be to use his private investment vehicle to establish a JV with WingTai to redevelop the site. He provide the land, the WingTai does the construction and marketing,
okay, beats me too why he didnt redevelop the plot or break it down in size.
possible guess would be
1) he has no intention of selling. just a publicity stunt.
2) he wants WT to buy over (if can) at high price, tender is open and above board.
3) maybe he wants to sell LH to WT, and he retain control of FH status via his investment company.?
4) more importantly, if he sell at 3500psf even for 15000sqft plot. nobody will buy?
Anybody has details of the tender documents?
lots of maybes.
but i dont really see a conflict of interest if he redeveloped the plot himself and sold each off piece by piece. caveat: i am not legally trained.
Well bloomberg did report that he does live in another Nassim road property so this sale could be to boost the price of his asset. Who knows how many he may personally own in that area.
The Nassim Road site is owned by Winright Investment Pte, according to property records obtained by Bloomberg News (http://topics.bloomberg.com/bloomberg-news/). Cheng, and his wife, Helen Chow, who list their address at another Nassim Road home, are the shareholders of Winright, a company set up in March 1995 for “holding of property for long-term investment purposes,” according to company records obtained by Bloomberg News.
The conflict could arise in the following situtation below:
What if he is hosting a dinner with the super wealthy and at the table, a super rich individual says he is considering either buying a penthouse at Ardmore area (which Wing Tai is currentl selling) or a new bungalow in a prime area and ask for his recommendations.
What would be his response?
Assuming there are shareholders of Wing Tai sitting at the same table, what do you think will be their perception if that individual eventually bought his bungalow project even though he may not have said or recommended anything at the table.
The main thing is what people perceive to be a possible conflict. As long as he wants to avoid people having such perceptions, to him, it may be better to draw a distinct line.
This could also be one of the reasons why the property is going through a public tender.
What is stopping him from redeveloping and sell the GCB through public tender?
Like what you said in #52, what IF this chairman have dinner with potential buyer who might be interested in the public tender and also be interested in WingTai property? Is this conflict of interest?
Tenders are usually called for completed projects and usually applies for old resale properties. Sale of new properties will be governed by the Housing Developer act, if applicable.
As also mentioned, he may also be reluctant to disclose the details of his re-development private venture if he is of the mind that it may constitute a possible conflict of interest and have to declare it to the Board. Better to avoid the hassle/disclosure.
Tenders are usually called for completed projects and usually applies for old resale properties. Sale of new properties will be governed by the Housing Developer act, if applicable.
As also mentioned, he may also be reluctant to disclose the details of his re-development private venture if he is of the mind that it may constitute a possible conflict of interest and have to declare it to the Board. Better to avoid the hassle/disclosure.
1) Are you saying that if he redeveloped his GCB, he cannot sell them through public tender? Can tell us which law states that? Or are you making your own law and assumptions?
2) wont selling his GCB through public tender could possibly be conflict of interest to wingtai since potential buyer could also be Wingtai potential customers?
1) Are you saying that if he redeveloped his GCB, he cannot sell them through public tender? Can tell us which law states that? Or are you making your own law and assumptions?
2) wont selling his GCB through public tender could possibly be conflict of interest to wingtai since potential buyer could also be Wingtai potential customers?
Selling of new development via public tender is a highly unusual practice. Please let me know if you come across any.
Selling of new development via public tender is a highly unusual practice. Please let me know if you come across any.
you are not answering my question.
1) Are you saying that if he redeveloped his GCB, he cannot sell them through public tender? Can tell us which law states that? Or are you making your own law and assumptions?
2) wont selling his GCB through public tender could possibly be conflict of interest to wingtai since potential buyer could also be Wingtai potential customers?
you are not answering my question.
1) Are you saying that if he redeveloped his GCB, he cannot sell them through public tender? Can tell us which law states that? Or are you making your own law and assumptions?
2) wont selling his GCB through public tender could possibly be conflict of interest to wingtai since potential buyer could also be Wingtai potential customers?
You haven't even answered my question yet.
Please go back to the line of questioning in this thread and substantiate your claim that the scenario is legally 'rubbish by answering the question below.
Since you say its rubbish, please enlighten all here why LEGALLY my scenario in post #52 is not admissible as a potential conflict of interest to be argued in a court of law. Please highlight the specific sections and sub-sections so that all here can learn.
If you can't support your statement then my view of the possibility that CWK could be of the mind that a conflict might exist stands.
First you create a silly argument about conflict of interest, then you come out with a silly assumption about chairman super rich dinner etc, and now you are asking me if legally it is wrong to be silly.
I am sorry, I dont comment on such thing.
But back to my question,
1) Are you saying that if he redeveloped his GCB, he cannot sell them through public tender? Can tell us which law states that? Or are you making your own law and assumptions?
2) wont selling his GCB through public tender could possibly be conflict of interest to wingtai since potential buyer could also be Wingtai potential customers?
I am sorry,
Apology accepted. You can run along now and hound other threads.
Apology.
aiyo...so childish arh?
aiyo...so childish arh?
Are you refering to this person who has used this multiple times in thread below.
http://forums.condosingapore.com/showthread.php?t=14929
apology accepted.
Apology accepted.
but i dont really see a conflict of interest if he redeveloped the plot himself and sold each off piece by piece. caveat: i am not legally trained.
Thats exactly why I say that wingtai chairman has to give away his property loh.. :D
chairman hosting dinner for super rich to sell GCB....hahaha.. :D
Thats exactly why I say that wingtai chairman has to give away his property loh.. :D
chairman hosting dinner for super rich to sell GCB....hahaha.. :D
u are taking his statement out of context.
proper-t did not say chairman hosting dinner for super rich for the purpose to sell GCB.
he is making an example, when he host dinner for whatever purpose, a super rich MIGHT/MAY....
his example makes sense, which is why i am keeping quiet not replying to his example yet, i am giving some thought to his example, eg like putting myself as WT shareholder, director etc.
u are taking his statement out of context.
proper-t did not say chairman hosting dinner for super rich for the purpose to sell GCB.
he is making an example, when he host dinner for whatever purpose, a super rich MIGHT/MAY....
his example makes sense, which is why i am keeping quiet not replying to his example yet, i am giving some thought to his example, eg like putting myself as WT shareholder, director etc.
1) If it make sense then wont all employees working for developers not able to buy and sell property since, whoever they sell to could potentially be a potential customer of Wingtai (especially if it is mass market condo).
2) So this lead to my next question. If this is a real concern, then what is this chairman supposed to do with his properties, since the same dinner meeting could possibly take place for whatever property he is selling, including this 300m site.
3) As I have highlighted before, Wee Cho Yaw (Kheng Leong) and Kwek Leng Beng (Hong Leong Holding) also have the own private investment vehicle that does property redevelopment which is in DIRECT competition to UOL and CDL. If what proper-T said about conflict of interest is illegal etc, then how can the company survive and prosperous for so long.
4) As a chairman of WingTai, why would he need to personally promote his own property when he has got real estate firm like JLL handle the sales for them. Even if he does, all sales will have to do through JLL anyway, so where is the conflict of interest.
Like I said before, conflict of interest in this context is rubbish, and thats why proper-t needs to create a silly scenario about a SUPER RICH DINNER PARTY meeting to make the rubbish smell like a chicken pie. Then follow up with a question like is it illegal to make rubbish smells like pie.
u are taking his statement out of context.
proper-t did not say chairman hosting dinner for super rich for the purpose to sell GCB.
he is making an example, when he host dinner for whatever purpose, a super rich MIGHT/MAY....
his example makes sense, which is why i am keeping quiet not replying to his example yet, i am giving some thought to his example, eg like putting myself as WT shareholder, director etc.
Thank you. As chairman of a public listed entity, he has to be careful about all possibilities where there may be a perception of a conflict of interest. That is why I am saying that it could be one of the reasons why he did not embark on the redevelopment of the plot. Even though people may advise him otherwise, why take the risk?
Thank you. As chairman of a public listed entity, he has to be careful about all possibilities where there may be a perception of a conflict of interest. That is why I am saying that it could be one of the reasons why he did not embark on the redevelopment of the plot. Even though people may advise him otherwise, why take the risk?
Wee Cho Yaw and Kwek Leng Beng are both chairman and directors of their respective listed companies and they do have their own private companies that does property investment and development in massive scale and very often they are selling the same class of property to their respective listed company.
So what risk are you talking about?
Conflict of interest? what interest? Wingtai sells GCB? show us which GCB WingTai is selling?
Please have some etiquette. Was I replying to your post? I was thanking hopeful. Please do not cut into other people's conversation. This is not the kind of forum that you usually frequent.
I was hoping for some sammyboy type of information. so disappointed.
Please have some etiquette. Was I replying to your post? I was thanking hopeful. Please do not cut into other people's conversation. This is not the kind of forum that you usually frequent.
Wee Cho Yaw and Kwek Leng Beng are both chairman and directors of their respective listed companies and they do have their own private companies that does property investment and development in massive scale and very often they are selling the same class of property to their respective listed company.
So what risk are you talking about?
Conflict of interest? what interest? Wingtai sells GCB? show us which GCB WingTai is selling?
Yes. Please continue to reveal to the readers here how rude and uncouth you are. Cutting into other people's conversation and trying to ram your views down people's throat. Please go back to your usual forum.
I was hoping for some sammyboy type of information. so disappointed.
Potential conflict of interest if he goes into property development himself....
May I know what rubbish you talking about?
Someone has obviously run out of anything substantive to post. Cut into people's conversation, unrepentant, try to bulldoze their views when nobody wants to pay heed and then taunt people.
Save your shenanigans for your usual forum. You will be much happier there and not be disappointed as indicated by your post below.
I was hoping for some sammyboy type of information. so disappointed.
Someone has obviously run out of anything substantive to post. Cut into people's conversation, unrepentant, try to bulldoze their views when nobody wants to pay heed and then taunt people.
Save your shennanigans for your usual forum. You will be much happier there and not be disappointed as indicated by your post below.
Better ask your dad to sell his landed and distribute the money to le you buy hdb. Landed is going down soon
Getting personal? Soon you will bring daughters into the conversation. Continue posting by all means as more and more readers will be appraised of your real colors.
this is as good as saying that you will let your daughters sleep with any millionaires because there is a good chance that they will marry your daughters and then give birth to millionaire babies.
Having said that, may I know why are you so eager to sell our FH land to NC? Self interest? Or are you hoping that your daughter will end up in a Ferrari driven by NC?
Getting personal? Soon you will bring daughters into the conversation. Continue posting by all means as more and more readers will be appraised of your real colors.
not personal lah, I just thought small kids like you should not post too many nonsense in this forum loh.
conflict of interest? most like sun will rise from the west.
dont side track leh. Tell us what should Wingtai chairman do with his property if everything he sell also conflict of interest
not personal lah, I just thought small kids like you should not post too many nonsense in this forum loh.
This coming from someone who just called himself childish....
aiyo...so childish arh?
Are you refering to this person who has used this multiple times in thread below.
http://forums.condosingapore.com/showthread.php?t=14929
apology accepted.
Apology accepted.
Why are you still trying so hard? By your statement below in bold, you have already revealed to all your true intention here.
Better ask your dad to sell his landed and distribute the money to le you buy hdb. Landed is going down soon
this thread is about WingTai chairman selling this GCB leh. why you keep talking about something else?
You said that as Wingtai chairman he cannot redevelop and sell his GCB because of conflict of interest. So I am asking what is he supposed to do with his property? Give it away?
this thread is about WingTai chairman selling this GCB leh. why you keep talking about something else?
You said that as Wingtai chairman he cannot redevelop and sell his GCB because of conflict of interest. So I am asking what is he supposed to do with his property? Give it away?
Then please explain the relevance of your post below. Pathetic attempt at recovery after you tripped over yourself and revealed to all your true intentions
Better ask your dad to sell his landed and distribute the money to le you buy hdb. Landed is going down soon
Then please explain the relevance of your post below. Pathetic attempt at recovery after you tripped over yourself and revealed to all your true intentions
I believe I have already accomplished my objectives many pages back.
So I guess there is no conflict after all huh.
I believe I have already accomplished my objectives many pages back.
So I guess there is no conflict after all huh.
If you are so confident then you should just sign off. Why are you trying so hard to press your point across? Even hopeful tends to agree with me and points out that you are taking my statement out of context and my example makes sense. Maybe you should just log off now and continue to live in denial before you make even more delusional statements.
u are taking his statement out of context.
proper-t did not say chairman hosting dinner for super rich for the purpose to sell GCB.
he is making an example, when he host dinner for whatever purpose, a super rich MIGHT/MAY....
his example makes sense, which is why i am keeping quiet not replying to his example yet, i am giving some thought to his example, eg like putting myself as WT shareholder, director etc.
If you are so confident then you should just sign off. Why are you trying so hard to press your point across? Even hopeful tends to agree with me and points out that you are taking my statement out of context and my example makes sense. Maybe you should just log off now and continue to live in denial before you make even more delusional statements.
ever thought that hopeful might just be trying to patronize you because earlier he did mention that he doesnt think that is any conflict of interest?
in fact, he actually thought that the conflict of interest you are talking about is the chairman selling the site to Wingtai. but then realize you are talking about selling the site to 3rd party..
obviously you didnt pick that up. :D
ever thought that hopeful might just be trying to patronize you because earlier he did mention that he doesnt think that is any conflict of interest?
in fact, he actually thought that the conflict of interest you are talking about is the chairman selling the site to Wingtai. but then realize you are talking about selling the site to 3rd party..
obviously you didnt pick that up. :D
Suddenly not so confident after all. If you believe you achieved your objectives, just sign off. Why bother to continue posting?
Some people have really hit the low point when they have to twist facts to feed their delusional state of mind. His quoted statement below was after I explained everything to him and cited my example in post #88. Readers here can refer to it and know the truth.
Unfortunately, some people here can't handle the truth.
u are taking his statement out of context.
proper-t did not say chairman hosting dinner for super rich for the purpose to sell GCB.
he is making an example, when he host dinner for whatever purpose, a super rich MIGHT/MAY....
his example makes sense, which is why i am keeping quiet not replying to his example yet, i am giving some thought to his example, eg like putting myself as WT shareholder, director etc.
Suddenly not so confident after all. If you believe you achieved your objectives, just sign off. Why bother to continue posting?
Some people have really hit the low point when they have to twist facts to feed their delusional state of mind. His quoted statement below was after I explained everything to him and cited my example in post #88. Readers here can refer to it and know the truth.
Unfortunately, some people here can't handle the truth.
hehe...I started this thread, you came in, talk a bunch of nonsense about conflict of interest, cannot back up what you said, create some a bunch of nonsensical dinner for super rich (#52) and now you say that I should sign off....
If you have nothing to add about conflict of interest, then i think you should stop posting. perhaps you can go back to your REAL FACT about landed property thread. it has been left very quiet for awhile
hehe...I started this thread, you came in, talk a bunch of nonsense about conflict of interest, cannot back up what you said, create some a bunch of nonsensical dinner for super rich (#52) and now you say that I should sign off....
If you have nothing to add about conflict of interest, then i think you should stop posting. perhaps you can go back to your REAL FACT about landed property thread. it has been left very quiet for awhile
Someone is resorting to personal taunts again.
Perhaps he is having self doubts about achieving his objectives here which is conflicting with his delusional state.
I suppose this is the sort of behaviour that they exhibit when faced with the truth.
P.S. I am leaving the real facts thread untouched for the moment because the last few posts was a classic fumble by you where you indirectly called another forumer 'teddybear' a sua ku.
Everyone needs a good laugh now and then in this forum.
I lived in landed before and now am staying in condo. If live in landed are sua ku, then many tycoon and many ministers are also sua ku liaw
Why live in landed properties are considered sua ku ?..to me is illogical comment.
Some landed got all full condo facilities le like swimming pool, tennis, table tennis, squash court, gym, spa, sauna. Some landed got even more facilities than condo le, like country club facilities such as mini cinema, dance studio, bowling alley, snooker and billiards & pool rooms, library swimming pool, tennis, table tennis, squash court, gym, spa, sauna etc..
The thing is how many people can afford this (<1000 people in Singapore). I doubt you have this type of landed :D
P.S. I am leaving the real facts thread untouched for the moment because that was a classic fumble by you where you indirectly called another forumer 'teddybear' a sua ku.
Everyone needs a good laugh now and then in this forum.
Bro, its ok lah, let him live in fear and never buy a landed.
In the meantime, he has to put up with condo neighbours who irritate him at his gym whilst landed owners can work out in peace and comfort at their home gym.
http://forums.condosingapore.com/showthread.php?t=17327
.
proper-T I am still waiting for you to tell us what sort of gym equipment you have at home leh. comfort and peace? maybe its Nintendo Wii?
In a down cycle, it is always better to have low transaction volume because there will be less comparables for people to whack down your price.
Is that so?
Wingtai chairman must have been looking at this chart thats why better exit the market.
Correction is near.
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/787/propertyindex.jpg
proper-T I am still waiting for you to tell us what sort of gym equipment you have at home leh. comfort and peace? maybe its Nintendo Wii?
You really are dregging the bottom of the barrel when you have to try to probe for personal details of a forumer just so that you can personally taunt or insult that person.
I suppose all that brimming self confidence in your post below has eroded into deep seated bitterness and frustration. The truth has hurt you badly.
I believe I have already accomplished my objectives many pages back.
So I guess there is no conflict after all huh.
proper-T, can tell us what you know about this chart that you posted several times in this forum? I think many guru here would like to learn something from you because most like numbers and chart.
http://blog.loanguru.com.sg/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Diagram-3.png
You really are dregging the bottom of the barrel when you have to try to probe for personal details of a forumer just so that you can personally taunt or insult that person.
I suppose all that brimming self confidence in your post below has eroded into deep seated bitterness and frustration. The truth has hurt you badly.
comfort and peace working out in your personal own gym in your landed property. Can tell us what equipment and machine you have in your gym. share share lah,,,dont be so secretive leh.
proper-T, sometime back you mention that household income is not an important factors to determine holding power for property. Care to explain?
comfort and peace working out in your personal own gym in your landed property. Can tell us what equipment and machine you have in your gym. share share lah,,,dont be so secretive leh.
Since your confidence is shattered already, please carry on with your postings. Resorting to these type of personal taunts is exactly what the readers here need to know about your true colours and your intentions in this thread. More and more is being revealed by the minute.
Since your confidence is shattered already, please carry on with your postings. Resorting to these type of personal taunts is exactly what the readers here need to know about your true colours and your intentions in this thread. More and more is being revealed by the minute.
nothing to do with confidence lah. Just asking out of curiosity, I am sure many condo owners would like to see what sort of gym you guys are using at the comfort of your home.
The truth has really hit home hard.
Looks like someone has finally shorted, blown his fuse and am resorting to asking me all the same questions from other threads over and over again.
He obviously doesn't realize how maniacal this will look to a reader of this thread.
proper-T, can tell us what you know about this chart that you posted several times in this forum? I think many guru here would like to learn something from you because most like numbers and chart.
http://blog.loanguru.com.sg/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Diagram-3.png
honestly I have very interested in this chart. How do you interpret whether what is good or bad.
Here he goes again with the post above.....scary
The truth has really hit home hard.
Looks like someone has finally shorted, blown his fuse and am resorting to asking me all the same questions from other threads over and over again.
He obviously doesn't realize how maniacal this will look to a reader of this thread.
Here he goes again with the post above.....scary
You have no answer to my question siboh? I thought mr real fact sure got answer to my questions. So disappointing
You have no answer to my question siboh? I thought mr real fact sure got answer to my questions. So disappointing
Please lie down on the couch and tell me when it all started. Did the deep disappointment first get triggered when you couldn't get gratification as explained in post below?
I was hoping for some sammyboy type of information. so disappointed.
Please lie down on the couch and tell me when it all started. Did the deep disappointment first get triggered when you couldn't get gratification as explained in post below?
This thread is in landed property section leh. So can we just stick to it. Property property please b focus.
You obviously have deep rooted problems. The continual demand for answers from other threads, the swing from talking about gym equipment back to suddenly wanting to be focused back on landed property points to borderline schizo behaviour.
I am just trying to trace it back to when you had your first deep disappointment. I know you may be ashamed to talk about it but its really for your own good so please lie down on the couch and answer truthfully. Was it triggered from the non-gratification you suffered in post below?
I was hoping for some sammyboy type of information. so disappointed.
proper-T, can tell us what you know about this chart that you posted several times in this forum? I think many guru here would like to learn something from you because most like numbers and chart.
http://blog.loanguru.com.sg/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Diagram-3.png
Did you just quote this blindly without really understanding what you are quoting and you expect to convince others people here to believe you?
Tell us more about what you quote leh. Household income is not important? really ah?
and you went on to complain that Ringo33 disrupt the peace in this forum?
aiyo...so jialat meh?
You really need help. This continuous demand for answers shows a manic-depressive state of mind which could only result from a deep trauma suffered previously. Ignoring the issue and continually pressing for answers will not redeem you.
The first step towards recovery is acknowledging that you have a problem. People cannot help you if you are unwilling to take the first step forward. Please let all here know whether the non-gratification you suffered in post below was the trigger for your current state of mind so that we can help you.
I was hoping for some sammyboy type of information. so disappointed.
You really need help. This continuous demand for answers shows a manic-depressive state of mind which could only result from a deep trauma suffered previously. Ignoring the issue and continually pressing for answers will not redeem you.
The first step towards recovery is acknowledging that you have a problem. People cannot help you if you are unwilling to take the first step forward. Please let all here know whether the non-gratification you suffered in post below was the trigger for your current state of mind so that we can help you.
[/i]
If you dont know what you are posting, next time please dont act like you know them so well that you try to convince others to believe what you said.
Again, why do you need to bring non property related discussion into this thread? are you not aware there is a section like coffeeshop?
Your behaviour is definitely not normal. Resurrecting topics fron other threads which you feel you have lost and trying to restart the discussion is a desperate cry for redemption. You have to realise that instead of redemption, readers will only come to the conclusion that you have gone over the edge
We are just trying to help you here.
Your behaviour is definitely not normal. Resurrecting topics fron other threads which you feel you have lost and trying to restart the discussion is a desperate cry for redemption. You have to realise that instead of redemption, readers will only come to the conclusion that you have gone over the edge
We are just trying to help you here.
I am not sure why do you have to waste time commenting on my behavior when you should be commenting on what you have posted in this forum.
For example, you posted this many times in this forum. So my question is, why do you know about this chart other than just reading the numbers?
http://blog.loanguru.com.sg/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Diagram-3.png
Oh, lets not forget that you also say that during a property correction cycle, it is better to have low transaction volume so that no one can whack your price down?
Can you expand on that statement please. I am sure many property investors here would like to know more about it.
awhile ago you also say that household income is not important factor will measuring holding power for property. Can you also expand on that please.
9x
This refers to the number of times you have resurrected a topic from other threads and demanded for answers in this thread alone thus far.
Your severe condition calls for desperate measures. I know it is painstaking to monitor but this is to help you. I will update this number whenever you post a similar question. When readers look at this number and realise how extreme you have become, perhaps it will shock you back to reality. Seeing what a pitiable state you are in, it may take a long time but we will eventually hit a number where you will come to your senses and hopefully your condition will improve from there on.
It is quite sad to see the deep disappointment and trauma inflicted by yourself from the post below.
I was hoping for some sammyboy type of information. so disappointed.
So chairman of WingTai cannot sell his investment property because it will be conflict of interest to WingTai.
so how lah? I think give is away also got problem because the beneficiary might also be interested in WingTai property leh.
So how? Mr. Proper-T
please enlighten us
4x
This is the 4th time you have brought up this similar line of questioning and comments again even though it has been addressed. It is very tedious but we do what we can to help you. Every time you pose the same kind of question again, we will update the number. Hopefully, the realisation that readers here become aware of how extreme your behaviour is will bring you to your senses.
Your condition is even worse than suspected. Just as I had hoped that it might have been suppressed, now it manifest itself again.
4x
This is the 4th time you have brought up this similar line of questioning and comments again even though it has been addressed. It is very tedious but we do what we can to help you. Every time you pose the same kind of question again, we will update the number. Hopefully, the realisation that readers here become aware of how extreme your behaviour is will bring you to your senses.
Your condition is even worse than suspected. Just as I had hoped that it might have been suppressed, now it manifest itself again.
Wonder why you always like to talk like there are so many READERS in this thread. Are you desperate for some kind of morle support or someon to agree with what you said. Fortunately or unfortunately there aren't many.
So are you not going Defend the real facts you said in this forum
Actually many people
Wonder why you always like to talk like there are so many READERS in this thread. Are you desperate for some kind of morle support or someon to agree with what you said. Fortunately or unfortunately there aren't many.
So are you not going Defend the real facts you said in this forum
Actually many people
If you are of the view that nobody reads this forum, then you have nothing to fear or worry about with your extremist line of questioning. Please, by all means, carry on with your line of questioning. I will do my utmost to help you by updating the count.
Can you please explain what you are trying to say by your statement in bold. People with psychological issues tend to forget what they want to say or break off in mid-sentence.
9x
Is that the number of times you have tried for avoid explaining what you have posted in this forum?
sigh....actually both ringo and proper-t are right.
the way i see it, both are talking past each other, not to each other.
for ringo, he give the example of other bosses having own private companies to show that it is not illegal to do so because others have already shown the way. thus WT boss also could have set up own private developer.
for propert, he give an example of conflict interest. this is where it get interesting. try as i might to deny, his example seems a valid. if i was an outsider hearing this at the dinner party and buyer chose his bungalow, i would definitely think this boss damn "bad" one. but then again, what is morally wrong may not be legally wrong, that's just the way the world is.
i am not a psychologist, people's fears are what usually controlled their action. his lawyer may tell him a dozen times it is legally ok, but perhaps his "fear" of being caught in "conflict of interest" situation lead him to another path, as implied by propert.
Is that the number of times you have tried for avoid explaining what you have posted in this forum?
No, it refers to the number of times you have resurrected topics from threads where you have lost or stumbled and are trying to redeem yourself.
As highlighted before, since you are of the view that very few readers frequent this thread, why should the number bother you? Please carry on with your extremist line of questioning. I will do my utmost to help you.
You also have not explained what you are trying to say in quote below. Your mental state appears to be deteriorating with these breaks or gaps.
Actually many people
sigh....actually both ringo and proper-t are right.
the way i see it, both are talking past each other, not to each other.
for ringo, he give the example of other bosses having own private companies to show that it is not illegal to do so because others have already shown the way. thus WT boss also could have set up own private developer.
for propert, he give an example of conflict interest. this is where it get interesting. try as i might to deny, his example seems a valid. if i was an outsider hearing this at the dinner party and buyer chose his bungalow, i would definitely think this boss damn "bad" one. but then again, what is morally wrong may not be legally wrong, that's just the way the world is.
i am not a psychologist, people's fears are what usually controlled their action. his lawyer may tell him a dozen times it is legally ok, but perhaps his "fear" of being caught in "conflict of interest" situation lead him to another path, as implied by propert.
If you look back this thread I think I did ask 1 simple question.
What is chairman of wingtai going to do with his property if redeveloping and selling his personal GCBs is considered as conflict of interest?
Wont any sale of property be consider as conflict of interest? In fact is chairman is concerned, then all employee of WingTai should not be investing and selling property liao loh..
So where is the logic? care to explain?
sigh....actually both ringo and proper-t are right.
the way i see it, both are talking past each other, not to each other.
for ringo, he give the example of other bosses having own private companies to show that it is not illegal to do so because others have already shown the way. thus WT boss also could have set up own private developer.
for propert, he give an example of conflict interest. this is where it get interesting. try as i might to deny, his example seems a valid. if i was an outsider hearing this at the dinner party and buyer chose his bungalow, i would definitely think this boss damn "bad" one. but then again, what is morally wrong may not be legally wrong, that's just the way the world is.
i am not a psychologist, people's fears are what usually controlled their action. his lawyer may tell him a dozen times it is legally ok, but perhaps his "fear" of being caught in "conflict of interest" situation lead him to another path, as implied by propert.
Thank you very much for acknowledging that it could be a possible reason why he did not embark on the re-development of the property as opposed to selling it via public tender. That is what I have been trying to point out but some people refused to even consider it as a possibility. Chairman and CEOs have different personalities and think in different ways and like you pointed out, some may prefer to take a more cautious approach.
4 more days to do. Have you guys submitted your bid? :D
Do you know that apart from MR B, you are being compared to Shawn in another thread? Please carry on with your postings, your infamy and 'fan' club is growing by the day. Soon, you will surpass all of them!
There is no point to carry on the thread with Shawn, wasting your time and efforts. Similarly, for those engaged in endless argument with Ringo.
Time can be used for making more money
No confirmed buyer for Mr. Wing Tai GCB.
I guess the dinner for super rich was just not good enough.
Looks like someone is reduced to petty little snipes, commenting on storage, reporting news and creating useless polls in this forum....just sad.
I think Mr. Wing Tai might have to break up his GCB and sell them in smaller plots. Perhaps might even try to redevelop the entire site.
I think Mr. Wing Tai might have to break up his GCB and sell them in smaller plots. Perhaps might even try to redevelop the entire site.
If i got $250mil... I will buy up 60 LANDED (side by side, back to back).. to live in! WOOHOO! PIPE dream..
Or Buy a land and build a 25th storey boutique development for myself..
If i got $250mil... I will buy up 60 LANDED (side by side, back to back).. to live in! WOOHOO! PIPE dream..
Or Buy a land and build a 25th storey boutique development for myself..
$250m should be able to get you a hotel. perhaps you can live in the presidential suite and survive on room service for the rest of your life :)
Haha, Ringo.....Ringo.....Why are you so concerned about Mr. Wing Tai? He is a rich man with many GCBs. This is just one of his GCBs which he is not interested in staying anymore.
I think Mr. Wing Tai might have to break up his GCB and sell them in smaller plots. Perhaps might even try to redevelop the entire site.
Haha, Ringo.....Ringo.....Why are you so concerned about Mr. Wing Tai? He is a rich man with many GCBs. This is just one of his GCBs which he is not interested in staying anymore.
there are almost 5000 views on this thread and there are also similar threads talking about the same subject. And if you are not concern, why are you following this thread in the first place?
Another pointless self contradicting post
Haha, Ringo....Ringo.....Just trying to set a bait for you to get trapped in. Also I find your thread very entertaining with plenty of rubbish stories. Do keep going....
there are almost 5000 views on this thread and there are also similar threads talking about the same subject. And if you are not concern, why are you following this thread in the first place?
Another pointless self contradicting post
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