View Full Version : I suspect the coming CM8 may have capital gains tax.
Since China implemented it, Singapore might follow.
For example, they may tell you from 1st August 2013, there will be a 20% capital gains tax. This will cause many people to rush to sell their units before the deadline.
phantom_opera
09-03-13, 09:10
ppl busy divorce loh
all these are symptoms only root cause is money printing
Since China implemented it, Singapore might follow.
For example, they may tell you from 1st August 2013, there will be a 20% capital gains tax. This will cause many people to rush to sell their units before the deadline.
With long term low interest rate and reasonable rental, people are unlikely to rush to sell their units even with 20% cap gain tax. They would rather pass it on to the next generation.
With long term low interest rate and reasonable rental, people are unlikely to rush to sell their units even with 20% cap gain tax. They would rather pass it on to the next generation.
Inflation or not, the PAP will have to face re-election in 2016. Three years, many things can happen to blow the bubble. Middle East can have another war. Oil may stop flowing.
If this happens in 2015 or 2016 with property at this level, judging from the Ponggol East results, PAP will lose at least 30-40 seats come 2016.
No one doubts that the PAP has the power to launch a CM every month until the end of this year if need to be to make prices fall.
After all, the govt has nothing to lose if prices fall - the government already sold a lot of land over the last couple of years. Falling cost of housing will make Singapore more competitive and help increase the population to the targeted 6.9 million.
Don't you think that if properties prices crash before 2016 GE, because of cooling measures, PAP may become opposition after GE 2016?
After all, >90% citizens own 1 or even more properties & every one know the crash is cause by Their CMs rather than recession?
Inflation or not, the PAP will have to face re-election in 2016. Three years, many things can happen to blow the bubble. Middle East can have another war. Oil may stop flowing.
If this happens in 2015 or 2016 with property at this level, judging from the Ponggol East results, PAP will lose at least 30-40 seats come 2016.
No one doubts that the PAP has the power to launch a CM every month until the end of this year if need to be to make prices fall.
After all, the govt has nothing to lose if prices fall - the government already sold a lot of land over the last couple of years. Falling cost of housing will make Singapore more competitive and help increase the population to the targeted 6.9 million.
Inflation or not, the PAP will have to face re-election in 2016. Three years, many things can happen to blow the bubble. Middle East can have another war. Oil may stop flowing.
If this happens in 2015 or 2016 with property at this level, judging from the Ponggol East results, PAP will lose at least 30-40 seats come 2016.
No one doubts that the PAP has the power to launch a CM every month until the end of this year if need to be to make prices fall.
After all, the govt has nothing to lose if prices fall - the government already sold a lot of land over the last couple of years. Falling cost of housing will make Singapore more competitive and help increase the population to the targeted 6.9 million.
u are suggesting the gov to crash the market? they will lost more votes.
Don't you think that if properties prices crash before 2016 GE, because of cooling measures, PAP may become opposition after GE 2016?
After all, >90% citizens own 1 or even more properties & every one know the crash is cause by Their CMs rather than recession?
Yes, but if it crashes in 2013-2014. But come 2015, PAP withdraws all cooling measures (maybe CM1-CM15 by then, god knows :D)?
The market will boom again by 2016.
1 stone hit 3 birds.
1. The PAP will be praised for being decisive and able to make hard decisions.
2. Existing holders will be glad that the property market is saved once again.
3. Young Singaporeans will be happy to be able to buy cheap condos during the downturn.
Everyone is happy.
On the other hand, if prices continue to rise, putting pressure on inflation and additional risks to the banks, only the 5% speculators will be happy. To win an election well, you need to win the 95%.
u are suggesting the gov to crash the market? they will lost more votes.
Of course the govt will not openly say they want to crash the market. The cooling measures are meant to "slow down" the market to protect the financial center.
I am hoping their CMs will crash the property market before 2016 though! Heehee!
You never know, it is easy to introduce all these cooling measures to deter buying but after all these CMs & crash then they remove, will be very difficult to get people to buy again! Look at what happened after 1997! It took 9 years & many heating measures (opposite of cooling) before buying interest come back!
Yes, but if it crashes in 2013-2014. But come 2015, PAP withdraws all cooling measures? The market will boom again by 2016.
which is a better business?
take money when u buy a unit? or take money when u sell?
already got absd, i dont tink they will go into capital gain tax.
I am hoping their CMs will crash the property market before 2016 though! Heehee!
You never know, it is easy to introduce all these cooling measures to deter buying but after all these CMs & crash then they remove, will be very difficult to get people to buy again! Look at what happened after 1997! It took 9 years & many heating measures (opposite of cooling) before buying interest come back!
Not really, this time round because of liquidity as Indomie has mentioned, a recovery can happen within 1-2 years.
Dubai property prices crashed 70% in 2010-2011 but recovered the following year and is doing very well now - http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-01-21/dubai-masseuses-return-to-economy-seeking-new-balance-for-growth.html
Dubai is a real life example that a property bust is not only not the end of the world, but can lead to a stronger economy.
Since the Singapore model is similar to Dubai, I'm sure the govt has sent people to study what happened there.
Of course, when prices fall, everyone will be complaining, so what the govt will try to avoid is the dropping market in the midst of election. 2013-2014 is the best time for a market correction in time for a 2015-2016 recovery.
Residents say it’s harder to find taxis, book restaurants or golf courses and get school places for their children, with Dubai’s economy posting the fastest growth since 2007. Home rents climbed about 17 percent last year, while air traffic and non-oil trade hit record highs.
The drivers of growth are different this time, with surging demand for services, legal and otherwise, as well as exports. That suggests any new Dubai boom won’t emulate the one that peaked in 2007, when the economy soared 18 percent and then crashed to a near-default after the global crisis of 2008.
“Hotel occupancy is up quite significantly and the airport is crazy,” said Abdul Kadir Hussain, chief executive officer at Mashreq Capital DIFC Ltd., who runs the region’s best-performing fixed-income funds as of December 2012. “If you go to Jebel Ali Free Zone, rents are up and it’s fully occupied. That part of the model is working very well and has recovered very well.”
Allthepies
09-03-13, 10:13
Property no longer for playing. Once buy you are stuck for a number of years. The anti government sentiments make a rising property market even more unlikely. With uncertain policies due to unstable political environment, you can no longer predict what will happen to property prices. Currently play the stock market, no CM yet.
So far, the market has not managed to crash yet. I had a look at resale prices of condos in Jan, Feb on URA website and they were generally up. Trilinq and Sennett also managed to sell a decent number of units.
How about if the Govt introduce CGT for non-citizens but not citizens? Another way to get more to convert to SC.
I am not sure why a government induced drop in private property price will gain more votes for PAP? It may actually lose more votes.
Most noises coming from people looking to buy a bto or resale hdb flats. It will be very wrong to demand an affordable private property from the government.
I agree more measures need to be enforce to soften the hdb resale prices to gain more votes.
The reason why so many CM on private property is to deflate the bubble.
So far, the market has not managed to crash yet. I had a look at resale prices of condos in Jan, Feb on URA website and they were generally up. Trilinq and Sennett also managed to sell a decent number of units.
How about if the Govt introduce CGT for non-citizens but not citizens? Another way to get more to convert to SC.
If CGT really introduced, it will be progressive as well and making foreigners pay the most.
So far, the market has not managed to crash yet. I had a look at resale prices of condos in Jan, Feb on URA website and they were generally up. Trilinq and Sennett also managed to sell a decent number of units.
How about if the Govt introduce CGT for non-citizens but not citizens? Another way to get more to convert to SC.
The earlier measures were half hearted. There appears to be a conflict between younger and older ministers.
While the older ministers want property prices to keep rising because they own many themselves, the younger ministers want prices to fall so they afford to buy their GCB. Even an entry level GCB at S$25 million is out of reach of an average minister's pay.
The earlier measures were half hearted. There appears to be a conflict between younger and older ministers.
While the older ministers want property prices to keep rising because they own many themselves, the younger ministers want prices to fall so they afford to buy their GCB. Even an entry level GCB at S$25 million is out of reach of an average minister's pay.
This is totally nonsense and purely your own opinion.
Allthepies
09-03-13, 10:27
WP like any good opposition party, they will use any topic to stir the emotion of the people. Rising private prices is one such issue, 85% of citizen stay in hdb, WP definitely want to target this large upgrader market to their advantages.
It just shows how desperate one can be.
There are other investment opportunities out there. Property is only one of them.
Property no longer for playing. Once buy you are stuck for a number of years. The anti government sentiments make a rising property market even more unlikely. With uncertain policies due to unstable political environment, you can no longer predict what will happen to property prices. Currently play the stock market, no CM yet.
I do not see any problem. Imo, property should held for long term. It is good to weed out all speculators.
If you are thinking of selling due to cooling measures, you could be a speculator in disguise or you are overleveraged and getting panicky.
Allthepies
09-03-13, 10:34
I do not see any problem. Imo, property should held for long term. It is good to weed out all speculators.
I have no problem too, just that currently stock gives a higher returns.
WP like any good opposition party, they will use any topic to stir the emotion of the people. Rising private prices is one such issue, 85% of citizen stay in hdb, WP definitely want to target this large upgrader market to their advantages.
when market crash they will say mis mgmt. coz many hard ship. etc. its so easy job be critic.
I have no problem too, just that currently stock gives a higher returns.
actually crash good can buy more. but those who are screaming for a crash. when it happens they might not be able to buy either. so... all depends who hav a stronger hand.
phantom_opera
09-03-13, 10:38
poperty actually underperforming gold, oil, gasoline, m3
any artificial move to depress fair price of hard assets wont be successful as long as u are an open economy and currency debasement raging nonstop
is propery in CCR really expensive relative to other cities?? think
I have no problem too, just that currently stock gives a higher returns.
hehe.....good.....divert more money away from property into stocks
Huat argh! (me vested in SGX shares for a very long time, am not a trader by nature whether in property or stocks).
I have no problem too, just that currently stock gives a higher returns.
Fyi, i speculate on equities. I constantly rebalance my equity portfolio and at times exit totally.
Since China implemented it, Singapore might follow.
For example, they may tell you from 1st August 2013, there will be a 20% capital gains tax. This will cause many people to rush to sell their units before the deadline.
Even if capital gain tax is implemented, it will only apply to those purchased from the date it is is implemented. So, no panic selling that you are hoping for. In fact, it will further motivate current owner not to sell and price will go up.
smellyfish
09-03-13, 11:06
why capital tax when you already have SSD? SSD even more blunt than CGT, gain or loss, you also have to pay...
Any measures also no use.....is a dead-lock now...seller not motivated to sell, buyer not motivated to buy....I like this situation, because I know many homeless speculators are renting, boost up the rental market
ABSD is a capital gain tax.. in a limited form
rymccondo77
09-03-13, 12:01
The earlier measures were half hearted. There appears to be a conflict between younger and older ministers.
While the older ministers want property prices to keep rising because they own many themselves, the younger ministers want prices to fall so they afford to buy their GCB. Even an entry level GCB at S$25 million is out of reach of an average minister's pay.
Perhaps some of the opposition party's members also want to sell or buy GCBs !!! ????
rymccondo77
09-03-13, 12:05
I personally don't think the current govt will impose "direct" capital gains tax - this can discourage (genuine / longer term) investments.
Whatever the govt does, we still have control over our destiny.Take time to take stock, ride out the downs, take advantage of the ups . . . enjoy peace, serenity and freedom. I am a case in point. Get a little wiser with each passing day, I hope. I have been pessimistic about the market. 2 years ago, I sold my 2nd property, when the yield was over 5%. Then prices went up and up. Any regrets? Sure. But never lost a night's sleep over it. Just this week, I picked up one on the resale market - at a price too good to miss! So my dilemma is whether to pay 7% absd or sell my current one. Even with the absd, I view it as a value buy. So even pessimists can become objective and move with the times. Yes, there may be further CMs . . . but what the hell, it's now or never!
rymccondo77
09-03-13, 12:17
Whatever the govt does, we still have control over our destiny.Take time to take stock, ride out the downs, take advantage of the ups . . . enjoy peace, serenity and freedom. I am a case in point. Get a little wiser with each passing day, I hope. I have been pessimistic about the market. 2 years ago, I sold my 2nd property, when the yield was over 5%. Then prices went up and up. Any regrets? Sure. But never lost a night's sleep over it. Just this week, I picked up one on the resale market - at a price too good to miss! So my dimemma is whether to pay 7% absd or sell my current one. Even with the absd, I view it as a value buy. So even pessimists can become objective and move with the times. Yes, there may be further CMs . . . but what the hell, it's now or never!
Congrats :) Instead of "Doom", u can now use "Bloom" (more optimistic) :) :)
Congrats :) Instead of "Doom", u can now use "Bloom" (more optimistic) :) :)
How about Boom?
Thanks! What's in a name? I know a guy called Tiny but he's actually a big 130kg fella. And the other day I had a meeting with Baby, expecting a sweet lady but it was a he - with tattoos and looking fierce. As Shakespeare says: "A rose by any other name would smell as sweet."
And what about this DuaNehNehChioBu (http://forums.condosingapore.com/member.php?u=229811)?
Wonder how HE looks like.:D:D:D
Since China implemented it, Singapore might follow.
For example, they may tell you from 1st August 2013, there will be a 20% capital gains tax. This will cause many people to rush to sell their units before the deadline.
Do you know how the chinese buy property?
http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=50142082n
ABSD is a capital gain tax.. in a limited formABSD worse than capital gain tax. Sell at a loss also need to pay ABSD.
ABSD worse than capital gain tax. Sell at a loss also need to pay ABSD.
well its a deterrent. so it works mah.
East Lover
10-03-13, 09:58
See the post from famously china blogger -capital gain tax wont work lah...出发点好，效果极差
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楼市跟国N条较了好几年劲，到这届政府告老也没给好脸，该贵的城市房价依然高，居高不下，老百姓对此怨声载道，发展商也唉声叹气。双方都在等待房价的春天，只不过百姓的春天是房价降，发展商的春天是房价涨，国N条的态度是太极。
临了（liǎo）临了国N条使出杀手锏——卖二手房获利者征收20%的所得税，试图一招制敌，最终落下一个好名声。可事与愿违，这杀手锏一出，房价非但没降，反倒上涨，令决策者措手不及。我的一个小朋友，夫妻俩咬牙买了一个二手房，71平米，正巧要过户，人家房主指着国N条这一条，坐地加收了3万元，小两口心中无底，忍气吞声地付了240多万元，背负了朋友的债务还同时背负了银行的按揭，拿他自己的话说“心中滴血”。
最新的国N条与前些日子废了的那黄灯雷同，出发点好，效果极差，一出生即死。简单的分析一下，谁买二手房？一定是没房者，刚性需求；谁卖二手房，一定是有两套房以上者，卖一套也没有住房之虞；买卖之间，谁强谁弱，谁急谁缓，一清二楚。刚性需求者，再涨也得买，除非实在买不起；卖房求利者，不达到心中利润决不会蚀本卖房；所以20%的税立刻转嫁购房者身上，推高房价。卖房者如不能获利，便会以租代售，顺势推高房租价。
百姓住房是国人的生活资料，不能成为少数人或利益集团牟取暴利的商品。可惜的是大城市的住房已沦为少数人牟利的手段，房子引发的社会问题正在侵蚀我们社会的肌体，而决策者又束手无策，出此下策，除让税务局多征一些税，丝毫撼动不了居高不下的楼市。
DuaNehNehChioBu
10-03-13, 10:07
And what about this DuaNehNehChioBu (http://forums.condosingapore.com/member.php?u=229811)?
Wonder how HE looks like.:D:D:D
Looks much better than your ( FT) wife for sure :D :D :D
Looks much better than your ( FT) wife for sure :D :D :D
Saw your PM but can't reply because you disabled receiving PM.
My sincere apology if you feel offended.
Take it easy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEzTdBJUHO8
Looks much better than your ( FT) wife for sure :D :D :D
Depends on how much the tax. If follow some europle example, 90% tax of capital gains, see can work or not.
LOL
Well, have to apply to REITs, commercial, industrial, retail, hotels, medical suites, serviced apartments also right other than private properties? :p
Depends on how much the tax. If follow some europle example, 90% tax of capital gains, see can work or not.
LOL
well its a deterrent. so it works mah.precisely, so no need for capital gain tax, which is like profit sharing.
the more the squeeze, likely the faster stocks rise.
Well, have to apply to REITs, commercial, industrial, retail, hotels, medical suites, serviced apartments also right other than private properties? :p
oh ya, next cm may well be targeted at commercial since HK already made the move. :D
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