View Full Version : Oxley chief defends shoebox units
This is hilarious. Competition can only be good for buyer.
"TELL me what is more inhuman? Giving a young person an opportunity to buy an affordable first apartment in a good location, or making people cough up $1,700 psf for a 99-year leasehold residential unit in the suburbs or HDB townships?"
That was the reaction of Oxley Holdings boss Ching Chiat Kwong when asked about recent arguments against "shoebox apartments".
Oxley has been at the forefront of "shoebox" developments, with projects in locations within the city, in the Bukit Timah and East Coast areas and elsewhere around the island.
But in recent weeks, these apartments have been the subject of heated debate and discussions within property and official circles.
Two weeks ago, CapitaLand chief executive officer Liew Mun Leong said in a Bloomberg report that Singapore should curb the increasing trend of shoebox apartments.
"I am dead against shoebox developments," he said. "The government should intervene. Singapore's land is very precious and you are wasting your scarce resources (by building shoebox apartments)."
"It's almost inhuman, it's not good for the welfare of the family to feel that constrained," said Mr Liew, who, according to the report, grew up in a one-bedroom apartment with nine people and often slept along the corridor.
A week earlier, the government said that it was concerned that shoebox apartments were mushrooming in the country as private home sales surged to a three-year high with record purchases of units that are smaller than 500 sq ft.
Mr Ching said that "when a young man or woman leaves the parent's home for the first time, they want a nice affordable pad which provides adequate personal space".
"This is a first purchase. In time, they will upgrade, as they get married, and have children. But they can leverage on this first purchase to upgrade to a larger unit. Tell me, what is inhuman about that?"
His reference to $1,700 psf properties would not have been lost on buyers of CapitaLand's Sky Habitat in Bishan.
all of them talk like they are doing social service, LOL.
phantom_opera
07-06-12, 13:47
saw an advertisement by Canon in Today ... Canon project only needs 32cm space from wall to project ... and there is a beautiful lady in a prison-like environment watching the projection
http://www.canon.com.sg/personal/products/projectors/projectors/lv-8235-ust?languageCode=EN
:-)
Wild Falcon
07-06-12, 13:56
Haha. Inhumane = $1700psf for 99LH in HDB township (i.e. Sky Habitat at Bishan).
http://www.businesstimes.com.sg/premium/companies/others/oxley-chief-defends-shoebox-units
Published June 07, 2012
Oxley chief defends shoebox units
By Ven Sreenivasan
"TELL me what is more inhuman? Giving a young person an opportunity to buy an affordable first apartment in a good location, or making people cough up $1,700 psf for a 99-year leasehold residential unit in the suburbs or HDB townships?"
That was the reaction of Oxley Holdings boss Ching Chiat Kwong when asked about recent arguments against "shoebox apartments".
Oxley has been at the forefront of "shoebox" developments, with projects in locations within the city, in the Bukit Timah and East Coast areas and elsewhere around the island.
But in recent weeks, these apartments have been the subject of heated debate and discussions within property and official circles.
Two weeks ago, CapitaLand chief executive officer Liew Mun Leong said in a Bloomberg report that Singapore should curb the increasing trend of shoebox apartments.
"I am dead against shoebox developments," he said. "The government should intervene. Singapore's land is very precious and you are wasting your scarce resources (by building shoebox apartments)."
"It's almost inhuman, it's not good for the welfare of the family to feel that constrained," said Mr Liew, who, according to the report, grew up in a one-bedroom apartment with nine people and often slept along the corridor.
A week earlier, the government said that it was concerned that shoebox apartments were mushrooming in the country as private home sales surged to a three-year high with record purchases of units that are smaller than 500 sq ft.
Mr Ching said that "when a young man or woman leaves the parent's home for the first time, they want a nice affordable pad which provides adequate personal space".
"This is a first purchase. In time, they will upgrade, as they get married, and have children. But they can leverage on this first purchase to upgrade to a larger unit. Tell me, what is inhuman about that?"
His reference to $1,700 psf properties would not have been lost on buyers of CapitaLand's Sky Habitat in Bishan.
TheOnlyGayInTheVillage
07-06-12, 14:14
saw an advertisement by Canon in Today ... Canon project only needs 32cm space from wall to project ... and there is a beautiful lady in a prison-like environment watching the projection
http://www.canon.com.sg/personal/products/projectors/projectors/lv-8235-ust?languageCode=EN
:-)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v207/mwho69/Kim%20Cheng%20St/6a7c.jpg
phantom_opera
07-06-12, 14:23
Projector for MM ... only 32cm space required
There are not much options in Singapore for singles below age 35 to buy an affordable home except MM units.
:beats-me-man:
There are not much options in Singapore for singles below age 35 to buy an affordable home except MM units.
:beats-me-man:
what if HDB tweak the rules to allow single below 35 to buy HDB flats? How will that affect MM demand?
what if HDB tweak the rules to allow single below 35 to buy HDB flats? How will that affect MM demand?
HDBs will be sold out faster than you can say ferrari and KenoBiWan will get complaints from citizens everyday about the competition for a roof over their head
HDBs will be sold out faster than you can say ferrari and KenoBiWan will get complaints from citizens everyday about the competition for a roof over their head
Not if they put a restriction that you cannot rent out the HDB even after MOP.
what if HDB tweak the rules to allow single below 35 to buy HDB flats? How will that affect MM demand?
Very unlikely. One of HDB's main objectives is to provide a roof for families. That has to remain as one of its core and central aim. In fact, if given a choice, I think MND would not have allowed singles to own flats at all.
Many of those who remain single at 35 have amassed fortunes, and they definitely can hold their own. There is no rationale to provide subsidised housing for this group.
Whether it is based on social or commercial motives, it makes sense to move this group to the private sector as far as possible.
TheOnlyGayInTheVillage
07-06-12, 15:31
Projector for MM ... only 32cm space required
Pico projectors more handy and generate less heat in such cramped spaces.
TheOnlyGayInTheVillage
07-06-12, 15:33
There are not much options in Singapore for singles below age 35 to buy an affordable home except MM units.
:beats-me-man:
Got. Old walkups in dilapidated form used to house laborers. Should have some under 600k. Freehold or 999 if lucky.
Got. Old walkups in dilapidated form used to house laborers. Should have some under 600k. Freehold or 999 if lucky.
had a family friend who bought 2 30 year-old units in Geylang, smacked in where the red-light action is. quartered the entire place into pigeon holes to rent out. proclaimed it was a good investment - where to get FH properties at $0.5m. can hold for en-bloc potential or rent out.
seemed like a good idea (though i vehemently differed) till she ran into problems of collecting rent (from shoddy tenants) and maintennance problems (plumbing, ceiling leaks)......
TheOnlyGayInTheVillage
07-06-12, 15:45
had a family friend who bought 2 30 year-old units in Geylang, smacked in where the red-light action is. quartered the entire place into pigeon holes to rent out. proclaimed it was a good investment - where to get FH properties at $0.5m. can hold for en-bloc potential or rent out.
seemed like a good idea (though i vehemently differed) till she ran into problems of collecting rent (from shoddy tenants) and maintennance problems (plumbing, ceiling leaks)......
Not very clever of her to not even realise the potential of such happening before committing to the purchase. I would have thought this is common sense.
anythingwhatever
07-06-12, 16:24
Very unlikely. One of HDB's main objectives is to provide a roof for families. That has to remain as one of its core and central aim. In fact, if given a choice, I think MND would not have allowed singles to own flats at all.
Many of those who remain single at 35 have amassed fortunes, and they definitely can hold their own. There is no rationale to provide subsidised housing for this group.
Whether it is based on social or commercial motives, it makes sense to move this group to the private sector as far as possible.
Well, the reverse may also be true that many of the singles above 35 could be struggling financially...
well, common sense was thrown out the window when she construed that the potential for capital gains and rental was too tempting
Well, the reverse may also be true that many of the singles above 35 could be struggling financially...
well, these group of people can purchase 3rm HDBs eh?
Well, the reverse may also be true that many of the singles above 35 could be struggling financially...
exactly. if single have the chance of owning a affordable hdb flat at younger age, perhaps there will be a higher chance of them finding a mate and start a family.
exactly. if single have the chance of owning a affordable hdb flat at younger age, perhaps there will be a higher chance of them finding a mate and start a family.
this is an assumption. owning a flat at a young age and getting married aren't exactly directly co-related
"TELL me what is more inhuman? Giving a young person an opportunity to buy an affordable first apartment in a good location, or making people cough up $1,700 psf for a 99-year leasehold residential unit in the suburbs or HDB townships?"
That was the reaction of Oxley Holdings boss Ching Chiat Kwong when asked about recent arguments against "shoebox apartments".
Both Mr Ching of Oxley Holdings and Mr Liew of CaptialLand are equally inhuman. Shoeboxes are inhuman and $1700 psf for a 99yr LH condo in Bishan is equally inhuman. Hope both of them rot in hell together.
good bro...both can be equally greedy.
Just like Low Crime doesn't mean No Crime and
High Salary doesn't mean No Corruption ...
Both Mr Ching of Oxley Holdings and Mr Liew of CaptialLand are equally inhuman. Shoeboxes are inhuman and $1700 psf for a 99yr LH condo in Bishan is equally inhuman. Hope both of them rot in hell together.
Both Mr Ching of Oxley Holdings and Mr Liew of CaptialLand are equally inhuman. Shoeboxes are inhuman and $1700 psf for a 99yr LH condo in Bishan is equally inhuman. Hope both of them rot in hell together.
The sad thing is that people still buy what they sell and happy with their purchases. They are actually exploiting consumers with less than desired products on the pretext of trying to appear noble.
saw an advertisement by Canon in Today ... Canon project only needs 32cm space from wall to project ... and there is a beautiful lady in a prison-like environment watching the projection
http://www.canon.com.sg/personal/products/projectors/projectors/lv-8235-ust?languageCode=EN
:-)
Very nice look... But hor... Airport leh...
exactly. if single have the chance of owning a affordable hdb flat at younger age, perhaps there will be a higher chance of them finding a mate and start a family.
not really true..it can have a negative effect as well.
reason being u will have more chances on ONS n promiscuity also...:spliff:
all will lead to unwanted pregnancies,abortions,unwed mums etc....:D :D
exactly. if single have the chance of owning a affordable hdb flat at younger age, perhaps there will be a higher chance of them finding a mate and start a family.
Perhaps and maybe doesn't work in SG. Unless have a few clauses: must get married in 3 years or HDB returned at price bought. 1 child in 6years or evidence to procreate or the same penalty applies.
Most singles either live happily ever after in their little haven or rent it out after getting. MND is aware.
Very nice look... But hor... Airport leh...
She deserves a "C" grade rather than an "A" grade :o
Both Mr Ching of Oxley Holdings and Mr Liew of CaptialLand are equally inhuman. Shoeboxes are inhuman and $1700 psf for a 99yr LH condo in Bishan is equally inhuman. Hope both of them rot in hell together.
Both are reasonable people who work on free market principles. People who take risk by supporting must not complain of losses later, but should also be rewarded based on risk taking if conditions improve.
not really true..it can have a negative effect as well.
reason being u will have more chances on ONS n promiscuity also...:spliff:
all will lead to unwanted pregnancies,abortions,unwed mums etc....:D :D
This is very debatable. But from personal experience, I move out of my parent's place when I was in my mid 20s. Rented an apartment and got married 3 years later and started a family few year after that. (just in case you think it is shotgun case :D)
This is very debatable. But from personal experience, I move out of my parent's place when I was in my mid 20s. Rented an apartment and got married 3 years later and started a family few year after that. (just in case you think it is shotgun case :D)
mine was the opposite of yours...
when i was younger in my twenties during my partying days,how i wished i was staying on my own having my own bachelor's pad..
when u are staying with parents n siblings or the hassle of checking into hotels,it will put u off inviting yr norcturnal guest to yr place..
so everything has its pros n cons...:D :D :D
mine was the opposite of yours...
when i was younger in my twenties during my partying days,how i wished i was staying on my own having my own bachelor's pad..
when u are staying with parents n siblings or the hassle of checking into hotels,it will put u off inviting yr norcturnal guest to yr place..
so everything has its pros n cons...:D :D :D
i had 3 years of that before I decided to settle down.
Maybe time for developers to build value for money no frills bare private homes. No facilities except carpark, no security guards and sell at HDB resale price with low maintance costs.
2 bedroom 350k
3 bedroom 450k
4 bedroom 550k
:rolleyes:
Both are reasonable people who work on free market principles. People who take risk by supporting must not complain of losses later, but should also be rewarded based on risk taking if conditions improve.
Whether they are reasonable is questionable. The $1700 psf SkyHabitat is not a reasonable price, shoebox is is not reasonable living space.
Let's hope they don't go complain to the Govt and lobby for polices changes when sales drop significantly. I remember one big local developer had previously complained to Govt for allowing many foreign developers into the market, driving up competition for the local developers. Can't remember exactly which developer, maybe CDL.
Why help developers to make more $ by buying MM as $PDF is more than a non Mm unit in the same development.
Why help developers to make more $ by buying MM as $PDF is more than a non Mm unit in the same development.
some might think that why get a place that is bigger than what you need?
I think whether it's the price (psf) or the size (sqft) it's pretty much transparent.
They are reasonable in the sense that this is a willing-buyer-willing-seller situation. You know how much you are buying and how big the place you are getting. Developer willingly takes the risk to bid and price, buyer willingly take the risk to buy and loan. Nobody forces anyone to make the decision.
If really unreasonable or poor decisions, market forces will play them out. That's free market. What is unreasonable?
It's highly interesting why all the chiefs have come out with their comments. First, Capitaland chief, then, Oxley and Wing Tai Chief. All at about the same time. Didn't remember any comments previously, very suspicious.
Whether they are reasonable is questionable. The $1700 psf SkyHabitat is not a reasonable price, shoebox is is not reasonable living space.
Let's hope they don't go complain to the Govt and lobby for polices changes when sales drop significantly. I remember one big local developer had previously complained to Govt for allowing many foreign developers into the market, driving up competition for the local developers. Can't remember exactly which developer, maybe CDL.
yes, if the big guys gets their way...what is going to happen next is - everyone will be forced to buy humanely big units at lagi more humanely price of perhaps $2k psf at lim chu kang
It's highly interesting why all the chiefs have come out with their comments. First, Capitaland chief, then, Oxley and Wing Tai Chief. All at about the same time. Didn't remember any comments previously, very suspicious.
Aiyoh, buy MM first la.. After a few years, sell, make money and then buy Sky Habitat lor. Like that, all happy, can?:D
Why help developers to make more $ by buying MM as $PSF is more than a non Mm unit in the same development.
1. Overall quantum is still lower
2. All that is needed are within the apartment. The developer still needs to ensure toilet n bathroom, cooking area etc are catered for.
3. Space requirement has changed. Demographic changed as well.
Developer definitely must earn and won't build for free.
$psf is only 1 measure but should not be the only one.
phantom_opera
08-06-12, 07:55
IMO there is a diff between buying MM in a boutique project with limited facilities vs buying MM in a bigger and more complete condo project if location is similar, naturally you are expected to pay relatively higher psf in a better project
example Caspian, Optima, vs say Kembangan Suite ... I would think psf will be same upon TOP although Kembangan supposed to be better located
KEMBANGAN SUITES JALAN MASJID Apartment 1 760,000 517 Strata 1,471 May-12
KEMBANGAN SUITES JALAN MASJID Apartment 1 675,000 420 Strata 1,608 May-12
KEMBANGAN SUITES JALAN MASJID Apartment 1 810,000 538 Strata 1,505 Mar-12
OPTIMA @ TANAH MERAH TANAH MERAH KECHIL AVENUE Condominium 1 690,000 484 Strata 1,425 Apr-12
OPTIMA @ TANAH MERAH TANAH MERAH KECHIL AVENUE Condominium 1 700,000 484 Strata 1,445 Apr-12
CASPIAN LAKESIDE DRIVE Condominium 1 626,888 463 Strata 1,354 May-12
TheOnlyGayInTheVillage
08-06-12, 12:24
So what ya saying... Optima can go up to 1600psf to rival KS? Given location two mrt stops diff but compensated by full facilities.
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