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irisng
14-04-12, 22:16
If you have the following jobs to choose, which one will you choose and why?
1) Pilot
2) Bank (Investment)
3) Engineering
4) Property Agent

howgozit
14-04-12, 22:18
If you have the following jobs to choose, which one will you choose and why?
1) Pilot
2) Bank (Investment)
3) Engineering
4) Property Agent

Got more choice or not... 4 only, very limited leh.....

irisng
14-04-12, 22:20
Got more choice or not... 4 only, very limited leh.....

No more already.:D

howgozit
14-04-12, 22:32
No more already.:D

Ok so how about this...

A pilot with an engineering degree that does investments in banks while moonlighting as a property agent in his free time.

august
14-04-12, 22:52
why dont have teacher, policeman? :o

azeoprop
14-04-12, 23:04
Ok so how about this...

A pilot with an engineering degree that does investments in banks while moonlighting as a property agent in his free time.


Waaa...this pilot so free one har? :scared-3:

hopeful
14-04-12, 23:40
If you have the following jobs to choose, which one will you choose and why?
1) Pilot
2) Bank (Investment)
3) Engineering
4) Property Agent
u preselecting career choices for your kids?

in order of priority
1) pilot, 2nd easiest job. no need to upgrade every year (where got new aircraft every year?). the hardest part of any flight is landing. any kid can takeoff a 747. it is the landing that is difficult.
2) bank. hardest job in terms of hours put. potentially earn the most too. however, be prepared to sacrifice family time and morality.
3) property agent, easiest job. if lucky, property sell itself. income unstable though.
4) engineering. ah, the noble engineer. every society needs engineers and toilet cleaners. engineers need to upgrade every year given the technology change. very troublesome for the salary earned.

carbuncle
15-04-12, 00:39
If you have the following jobs to choose, which one will you choose and why?
1) Pilot
2) Bank (Investment)
3) Engineering
4) Property Agent
Whatever happened to Mrs Chong?

carbuncle
15-04-12, 00:40
u preselecting career choices for your kids?

in order of priority
1) pilot, 2nd easiest job. no need to upgrade every year (where got new aircraft every year?). the hardest part of any flight is landing. any kid can takeoff a 747. it is the landing that is difficult.
2) bank. hardest job in terms of hours put. potentially earn the most too. however, be prepared to sacrifice family time and morality.
3) property agent, easiest job. if lucky, property sell itself. income unstable though.
4) engineering. ah, the noble engineer. every society needs engineers and toilet cleaners. engineers need to upgrade every year given the technology change. very troublesome for the salary earned.
Care to enlighten why bank got morality challenges?

irisng
15-04-12, 08:20
Whatever happened to Mrs Chong?

Sorry, who is Mrs Chong?

azeoprop
15-04-12, 08:23
Be the next MP for Hougang SMC. :D

irisng
15-04-12, 09:03
u preselecting career choices for your kids?

in order of priority
1) pilot, 2nd easiest job. no need to upgrade every year (where got new aircraft every year?). the hardest part of any flight is landing. any kid can takeoff a 747. it is the landing that is difficult.
2) bank. hardest job in terms of hours put. potentially earn the most too. however, be prepared to sacrifice family time and morality.
3) property agent, easiest job. if lucky, property sell itself. income unstable though.
4) engineering. ah, the noble engineer. every society needs engineers and toilet cleaners. engineers need to upgrade every year given the technology change. very troublesome for the salary earned.

Wa you are smart leh, but not that I preselect for him, it is his own selection. I forgot to add in policeman also, it is his last choice. His girlfriend wants to be a teacher. August, your 2 suggested choices are also in our list, cheers.:cheers5:

He likes to be a pilot so much but unfortunately he is short-sighted.:banghead: Next will be in the bank sector as he likes analysis of market condition but he doesn't like to go round "pulling" customers leh.:mad:

irisng
15-04-12, 09:11
Be the next MP for Hougang SMC. :D

Alamat, not so ambitions lah.:D

howgozit
15-04-12, 10:45
Haha... I think not so easy to be pilot lah...

This is what I gather from my pilot friends.

Attrition rate is very high and not many make it thru all the way. Of course Air Force more stringent than commercial ... I think for commercial at the moment it takes about 4.5 to 5 years from time of joining to appointment as a co-pilot.

You may be a doctor, lawyer or accountant before(and SQ does have quite a few of these professionals as pilots) but you still have to go thru' the whole nine yards to qualify....

The job is also under scrutiny all the time, there quarterly simulator assessment/training/tests to ensure skills and knowledge are maintained and improved upon. Failing such tests may mean your licence can be revoked and you may lose your job.

Among all the 4 jobs listed, I think the pilot has greatest direct responsibility to life. When there is engine trouble while flying over the Pacific, you just can't pull over and check it out. I also don't think any kid can take-off a 747 lah...


u preselecting career choices for your kids?

in order of priority
1) pilot, 2nd easiest job. no need to upgrade every year (where got new aircraft every year?). the hardest part of any flight is landing. any kid can takeoff a 747. it is the landing that is difficult.
2) bank. hardest job in terms of hours put. potentially earn the most too. however, be prepared to sacrifice family time and morality.
3) property agent, easiest job. if lucky, property sell itself. income unstable though.
4) engineering. ah, the noble engineer. every society needs engineers and toilet cleaners. engineers need to upgrade every year given the technology change. very troublesome for the salary earned.

shellshox
15-04-12, 11:49
u preselecting career choices for your kids?

in order of priority
1) pilot, 2nd easiest job. no need to upgrade every year (where got new aircraft every year?). the hardest part of any flight is landing. any kid can takeoff a 747. it is the landing that is difficult.
2) bank. hardest job in terms of hours put. potentially earn the most too. however, be prepared to sacrifice family time and morality.
3) property agent, easiest job. if lucky, property sell itself. income unstable though.
4) engineering. ah, the noble engineer. every society needs engineers and toilet cleaners. engineers need to upgrade every year given the technology change. very troublesome for the salary earned.


Kind of agree with this, tho i'll put doctor (can be those open clinic type) as 1st choice.... high salary, got chance to upgrade, never will be obsolete, no retrenchment, respectable.... should have listen to parents when younger and study hard to become doctor.....

carbuncle
15-04-12, 12:21
Alamat, not so ambitions lah.:D
Ambitious? I think its suicide.

carbuncle
15-04-12, 12:22
Wa you are smart leh, but not that I preselect for him, it is his own selection. I forgot to add in policeman also, it is his last choice. His girlfriend wants to be a teacher. August, your 2 suggested choices are also in our list, cheers.:cheers5:

He likes to be a pilot so much but unfortunately he is short-sighted.:banghead: Next will be in the bank sector as he likes analysis of market condition but he doesn't like to go round "pulling" customers leh.:mad:
Then be financial ANALyst lor.

carbuncle
15-04-12, 12:24
Sorry, who is Mrs Chong?
You never watch tv? MOE ad won top prize for Viewers Choice competition leh.

howgozit
15-04-12, 12:50
Kind of agree with this, tho i'll put doctor (can be those open clinic type) as 1st choice.... high salary, got chance to upgrade, never will be obsolete, no retrenchment, respectable.... should have listen to parents when younger and study hard to become doctor.....

doctor not in the choices listed leh.....

ysyap
15-04-12, 13:09
Wa you are smart leh, but not that I preselect for him, it is his own selection. I forgot to add in policeman also, it is his last choice. His girlfriend wants to be a teacher. August, your 2 suggested choices are also in our list, cheers.:cheers5:

He likes to be a pilot so much but unfortunately he is short-sighted.:banghead: Next will be in the bank sector as he likes analysis of market condition but he doesn't like to go round "pulling" customers leh.:mad:If you allow your son to be pilot with SIA (aka commercial pilot), then be prepared of the promiscuous lifestyle.

Teachers are relatively stable job but in recent times, teachers are one of the most difficult profession... low salary (compared with other professionals like doctors, dentists, bankers, property agents, etc.) but have to be an administrator, counsellor, teacher, childcare custodian all rolled into one. Not a nice job like its portrayed in TVs.

Property agents must require some form of being bashed by others everywhere. He must be thick skinned and be willing at times to tell 'lies' in order to be proficient in that job and make a sustainable living out of it. Also working hours is generally restricted to late afternoons and night time.

Bankers' cycle is high low high low high low... so its highly unpredictable but when times are good, you'll smile even in your dreams.

Engineering is subjective. Depending on which sector of engineering. Maritime engineering seem to be the next big thing in Singapore. Can consider... turn over rate is high in some sectors so must avoid those sectors. Also, Engineering is relatively versatile. Engineering degree can become any of the above profession should one decides on a mid life career switch. Banker to be engineer v difficult. Teacher to be banker also v diff, etc. You get what I mean. Engineering is my preferred choice.

:cheers5:

irisng
15-04-12, 13:45
You never watch tv? MOE ad won top prize for Viewers Choice competition leh.

Only watch 7pm show during weekdays while having dinner. Make use of the advertisement time, either drink water, wash bowls or visit toilet, kekekekekek. :D

irisng
15-04-12, 14:07
If you allow your son to be pilot with SIA (aka commercial pilot), then be prepared of the promiscuous lifestyle.

Teachers are relatively stable job but in recent times, teachers are one of the most difficult profession... low salary (compared with other professionals like doctors, dentists, bankers, property agents, etc.) but have to be an administrator, counsellor, teacher, childcare custodian all rolled into one. Not a nice job like its portrayed in TVs.

Property agents must require some form of being bashed by others everywhere. He must be thick skinned and be willing at times to tell 'lies' in order to be proficient in that job and make a sustainable living out of it. Also working hours is generally restricted to late afternoons and night time.

Bankers' cycle is high low high low high low... so its highly unpredictable but when times are good, you'll smile even in your dreams.

Engineering is subjective. Depending on which sector of engineering. Maritime engineering seem to be the next big thing in Singapore. Can consider... turn over rate is high in some sectors so must avoid those sectors. Also, Engineering is relatively versatile. Engineering degree can become any of the above profession should one decides on a mid life career switch. Banker to be engineer v difficult. Teacher to be banker also v diff, etc. You get what I mean. Engineering is my preferred choice.

:cheers5:

Actually I have discouraged him to be a pilot too, he will have lesser time with family especially to his future wife.

I don't think he is fit to be a property agent also because he is not thick skinned but that will be his last choice if he couldn't find any job.

Agree that banker has high and low time if solely depends on commission. I have a friend, didn't even completed his Sec 4, by chance recommended by his friend to sell credit card for a particular bank, can earn up to about $10K of commission per month:scared-1: + basic pay. But he worked very hard for it. Previously, he was just a construction worker supervisor earning about $1k+. I wonder with this type of commission, can he still apply for BTO (4/5 rooms) flat. Does it take commission into consideration?

My son is in the Environmental Engineering course. He did told me that if he works for a bank now, next time it will be difficult for him to switch to Engrg line again but because Bank has an uncapped salary if you worked very hard for it.

carbuncle
15-04-12, 15:59
Only watch 7pm show during weekdays while having dinner. Make use of the advertisement time, either drink water, wash bowls or visit toilet, kekekekekek. :D
That ad is really long leh. Like mini drama. You cant miss it...

http://m.youtube.com/watch?desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DGETzOHRPqus&v=GETzOHRPqus&gl=US

chiaberry
15-04-12, 16:47
My son is in the Environmental Engineering course. He did told me that if he works for a bank now, next time it will be difficult for him to switch to Engrg line again but because Bank has an uncapped salary if you worked very hard for it.

It is not easy to be a banker. It can be quite a cut-throat environment. If he is not thick-skinned and having good presentation skills, then it may not suit him. There is a lot of organizational politics as well. The older he gets, the less secure his job. There will be many younger ones out there with more energy and fresh ideas who could overthrow him. Whenever the management changes, he will have to adapt to the new people or resign. Nowadays banks can be subject to mergers and acquisitions as the financial sector is quite volatile.

The "uncapped salary" type of banker may have to do certain high-risk things to achieve it. Take the example of the lady banker who is detained in China.

You have to judge how is his character. For some people, a slow and steady job with lower pay may be more suitable than a high-flying high-stress job with tough performance indicators and demanding bosses.

price
15-04-12, 16:53
Wa you are smart leh, but not that I preselect for him, it is his own selection. I forgot to add in policeman also, it is his last choice. His girlfriend wants to be a teacher. August, your 2 suggested choices are also in our list, cheers.:cheers5:

He likes to be a pilot so much but unfortunately he is short-sighted.:banghead: Next will be in the bank sector as he likes analysis of market condition but he doesn't like to go round "pulling" customers leh.:mad:
It is not easy to become a pilot, nor a good investment banker.

price
15-04-12, 17:06
my childhood dream used to be a pilot too! but then it is really not so easy.

Since ur son is already in Uni, i'd think being a fighter pilot is out of the question (need to be in Army + selected for OCS and pass COMPASS test).

Commercial pilot like 1 of the reply above mentioned, u probably gotta get him to work for a couple of years first. SIA hires cadet officers at least 25 years of age. I myself is 1 year away from that :D .

I have investment banker friends who are doing really really well. Most bought nice fancy cars within 1-2 years of employment. Avg salary 10-20k per month depending on commission. I used to work for a bank too! :D

I'm biased against being an agent, (property or insurance). Ultimately these jobs require a certain type of character and personality to do well. You yourself mentioned that you don't think your son is good enough for these jobs. So better gain some experience else where first! since these are jobs where u can join any time in ur life :D

I know nothing much about the engineering field. 1 thing for sure, guys my age are all staying away form this field these days. Look at how local universities are trying to hard to attract engineering students these days.

during my parent's age, it was harder to get into an engineering course than a business 1. These days, students who don't do well in their studies (O/A levels, or poly) then no choice choose engineering :D:cheers5: :2cents: :2cents:

DC33_2008
15-04-12, 17:16
He is in NUS. Oil and gas engineering is the money spinner but occupational hazard. Got friends who are paid bonus of 18 months.
Actually I have discouraged him to be a pilot too, he will have lesser time with family especially to his future wife.

I don't think he is fit to be a property agent also because he is not thick skinned but that will be his last choice if he couldn't find any job.

Agree that banker has high and low time if solely depends on commission. I have a friend, didn't even completed his Sec 4, by chance recommended by his friend to sell credit card for a particular bank, can earn up to about $10K of commission per month:scared-1: + basic pay. But he worked very hard for it. Previously, he was just a construction worker supervisor earning about $1k+. I wonder with this type of commission, can he still apply for BTO (4/5 rooms) flat. Does it take commission into consideration?

My son is in the Environmental Engineering course. He did told me that if he works for a bank now, next time it will be difficult for him to switch to Engrg line again but because Bank has an uncapped salary if you worked very hard for it.

howgozit
15-04-12, 17:38
IMHO,

Your son is old enough to decide for himself what he wants to do. You should learn to let go and give him support and advice if required but not decide for him.

I can't imagine a pilot saying something like "I am a pilot because my mommy said so....", please get me of that plane immediately... I'd rather swim or walk to my destination.

Arcachon
15-04-12, 17:47
PAP did a very good programming to Singaporean, all we know is job. We love to work for others.:doh:

http://www.littlespeck.com/content/people/CTrendsPeople-060423.htm

azeoprop
15-04-12, 17:53
IMHO,

Your son is old enough to decide for himself what he wants to do. You should learn to let go and give him support and advice if required but not decide for him.

I can't imagine a pilot saying something like "I am a pilot because my mommy said so....", please get me of that plane immediately... I'd rather swim or walk to my destination.

Looks like we have a pilot here. :D

"a running graph of the progress of an airplane flight involving the distance covered, fuel consumed, and time elapsed and enabling the pilot to determine the equitime point"

:rolleyes:

howgozit
15-04-12, 18:16
Ah... good ole Google...

As bro BJ21T has mentioned I have deep interests but you'll never be able to guess my real connection to aviation.

but the self confessed pilot here is Arachon... but I bet even he does not even know about howgozit, let alone use howgozit...


Looks like we have a pilot here. :D

"a running graph of the progress of an airplane flight involving the distance covered, fuel consumed, and time elapsed and enabling the pilot to determine the equitime point"

:rolleyes:

howgozit
15-04-12, 18:22
Oh no... another gahmen basher... bashing for the sake of bashing...

you are twisting the direction of the thread of a mother concerned about a son's choice of career into a political discussion. ....sigh...


PAP did a very good programming to Singaporean, all we know is job. We love to work for others.:doh:

http://www.littlespeck.com/content/people/CTrendsPeople-060423.htm

price
15-04-12, 18:33
IMHO,

Your son is old enough to decide for himself what he wants to do. You should learn to let go and give him support and advice if required but not decide for him.

I can't imagine a pilot saying something like "I am a pilot because my mommy said so....", please get me of that plane immediately... I'd rather swim or walk to my destination.
Great point raised!

Actually I wanted to touch on this as well. I kinda feel disgusted when my friends are like mummy's boy when they are already at my age! Omg. I know this engineering grad who hates and blame his mum to the core now cause his mum made him study engineering when he wanted something else. His mum is old-fashioned and feels guys should stick to engineering. Now his much younger sis is earning so much more than him in a bank. He barely made enough for a bto after a few years working as an engineer.whereas his sis makes so much she's above income cap for bto.

But moral of the story, time for ur boy to wake up his mind! He's already an undergraduate. If he was studying overseas, all the ang mos will tease him for having u to choose his career for him.

Stop pampering him and let him experience the real world. I'm glad my parents let me be independent. Otherwise I'll never be able to own properties now :)

howgozit
15-04-12, 18:58
Well.... my point was not so much for the money actually... but more for the passion.

If you love your job... you get the feeling of amazement that you are actually being paid to do the stuff that you do. I do have this feeling when I am working...

But of course, this needs to be balanced with some pragmatism... doing the thing you love must also be able to pay for the things that you need (like food on the table). It would be a bonus if it can pay for the things that you like (like a Ferrari).


Great point raised!

Actually I wanted to touch on this as well. I kinda feel disgusted when my friends are like mummy's boy when they are already at my age! Omg. I know this engineering grad who hates and blame his mum to the core now cause his mum made him study engineering when he wanted something else. His mum is old-fashioned and feels guys should stick to engineering. Now his much younger sis is earning so much more than him in a bank. He barely made enough for a bto after a few years working as an engineer.whereas his sis makes so much she's above income cap for bto.

But moral of the story, time for ur boy to wake up his mind! He's already an undergraduate. If he was studying overseas, all the ang mos will tease him for having u to choose his career for him.

Stop pampering him and let him experience the real world. I'm glad my parents let me be independent. Otherwise I'll never be able to own properties now :)

price
15-04-12, 19:18
Well.... my point was not so much for the money actually... but more for the passion.

If you love your job... you get the feeling of amazement that you are actually being paid to do the stuff that you do. I do have this feeling when I am working...

But of course, this needs to be balanced with some pragmatism... doing the thing you love must also be able to pay for the things that you need (like food on the table). It would be a bonus if it can pay for the things that you like (like a Ferrari).
yes that's true. find a career you love. not just a job. life will be beautiful!

Arcachon
15-04-12, 19:41
Me no pilot lah, just a worker who work on Avionics from Depot to Aircraft from fighter to helicopter aircraft and now doing training aircraft result of good programming by PAP.

PAP is changing the program and parent are still stuck in the old programming set. We don't need more worker, we need more entrepreneur.

PAP is right to program us as worker during the nation building period because we are 笨.

http://www.singapore-window.org/sw06/060411ap.htm

Arcachon
15-04-12, 20:11
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mATjvcwSjrA

howgozit
15-04-12, 20:34
Me no pilot lah, just a worker who work on Avionics from Depot to Aircraft from fighter to helicopter aircraft and now doing training aircraft result of good programming by PAP.

PAP is changing the program and parent are still stuck in the old programming set. We don't need more worker, we need more entrepreneur.

PAP is right to program us as worker during the nation building period because we are 笨.

http://www.singapore-window.org/sw06/060411ap.htm

Ooops... sorry.. jumped to conclusions.... I thought you posted a picture of yourself in flying suit at what looks like Peace Vanguard.

howgozit
15-04-12, 20:36
.....................double post................ deleted......

ysyap
15-04-12, 20:55
Actually I have discouraged him to be a pilot too, he will have lesser time with family especially to his future wife.

I don't think he is fit to be a property agent also because he is not thick skinned but that will be his last choice if he couldn't find any job.

Agree that banker has high and low time if solely depends on commission. I have a friend, didn't even completed his Sec 4, by chance recommended by his friend to sell credit card for a particular bank, can earn up to about $10K of commission per month:scared-1: + basic pay. But he worked very hard for it. Previously, he was just a construction worker supervisor earning about $1k+. I wonder with this type of commission, can he still apply for BTO (4/5 rooms) flat. Does it take commission into consideration?

My son is in the Environmental Engineering course. He did told me that if he works for a bank now, next time it will be difficult for him to switch to Engrg line again but because Bank has an uncapped salary if you worked very hard for it.Environmental engineering field still has great potential for improvements and inventions. Civil Engineering, electrical engineering are already very saturated... I guess he is in a good position to have a successful career. If he is hungry, he don't need to be thick skin like property agent, work late late like property agent, always MIA for overseas assignments like pilots, he can still do well in his job scope. :cheers5:

carbuncle
15-04-12, 21:02
yes that's true. find a career you love. not just a job. life will be beautiful!

Somehow when you land your so called dream job doing what you love, due to the various people you need to answer to and stuff/staff you need to account for, as well as customer interests and ethics, it no more becomes enjoyable. Or worse - an idiot boss that makes life miserable for you. I feel that sometimes its better to leave your interest as is - an interest. You will be able to enjoy it better.

Arcachon
15-04-12, 22:05
http://andrewhallam.com/2010/05/building-your-wealth-instead-of-driving-it-into-the-ground/

Do what you love to do and make money from investing if die die must work to make others rich.

irisng
16-04-12, 08:31
IMHO,

Your son is old enough to decide for himself what he wants to do. You should learn to let go and give him support and advice if required but not decide for him.

I can't imagine a pilot saying something like "I am a pilot because my mommy said so....", please get me of that plane immediately... I'd rather swim or walk to my destination.

Don't get me wrong. Those are all his plans. I'm glad that he is willing to share with me his ideas. Decision still lies on him. I'm just curious of what type of challenges are those jobs that he mentioned, that's why I'm here to listen from all the valuable feedback.

I really appreciate all the advise but I can't decide for him, afterall it is his interest that counts and his future lies in his hands. :cheers1:

chiaberry
16-04-12, 08:54
My (pragmatic) approach to this:

Since he has the academic background of an engineer, he should apply for jobs in the engineering field and try it out for around 2 years. Get a feel of the opportunities. If he is not satisfied, then try and apply for banking. Whilst in the first (engineering) job, study financial sector topics at home and try to get some certifications if possible (? financial analyst certification). It is still possible to switch to banking after a few years in another profession if he demonstrates interest and proven aptitude in it to support his decision to switch. I know of quite a number of engineers who have switched to banking. But for those high high salary bankers, he needs to have an extrovert personality and ruthless streak in order to succeed.

roly8
16-04-12, 10:56
if you go into engineering field, you will probably want stick with govt. related companies like DSTA .. these companies hire Singaporean only and i heard you do not need to go reservist too. ;)
Pay wise, on par with the market rate & you got iron rice bowl.. + no competition with foreigners .. ;)

hopeful
16-04-12, 11:03
dont think about trying out engineering for 2 years.
Unless as one forummer has mentioned, the money is made in those difficult and dirty jobs like oil and gas exploration, mining, subsea etc.

even so, in oil and gas exploration, be a field engineer (plenty of job bonus), instead of being a maintenance engineer (no money).
Your son may think it is dangerous, not really, it is very safe.

no point being an electronics engineer, technology changes so rapidly. have to constantly upgrade.

let your son make money in oil industry while still single.

But 1 thing your son has to take note now. The diff in angmo pay and asian pay is wide. a lot of my ex-colleagues has complained about that.

Laguna
16-04-12, 11:18
pl read
http://www.salary.sg/

good coverage on jobs, networth etc

limfc
16-04-12, 11:50
eh.. why not IT leh? cos i'm in IT and always liked it and also had been in MNCs all the while... i think carbuncle is very right... environment plays a big part too...

was "happily stuck" in 1 MNC for 6 years... really enjoyed the time there, good boss, good team, good pay, good work-life balance... the only thing was work is kinda 'boring' and not 'growing' professionally...

so, backside itchy and made a switch to another MNC and now regional role and growing a lot professionally, with so-so boss, below average team, still good pay and really lousy work-life balance, sacrifice a lot of family time...

so which one is better? dunno leh... :beats-me-man:
maybe time will tell later? hee... :D

hopeful
16-04-12, 12:01
eh.. why not IT leh? cos i'm in IT and always liked it and also had been in MNCs all the while... i think carbuncle is very right... environment plays a big part too...

was "happily stuck" in 1 MNC for 6 years... really enjoyed the time there, good boss, good team, good pay, good work-life balance... the only thing was work is kinda 'boring' and not 'growing' professionally...

so, backside itchy and made a switch to another MNC and now regional role and growing a lot professionally, with so-so boss, below average team, still good pay and really lousy work-life balance, sacrifice a lot of family time...

so which one is better? dunno leh... :beats-me-man:
maybe time will tell later? hee... :D

on behalf on yowetan, what are you earning per month and how many hours you put in each week, so i can know your hourly pay (including unpaid OT etc)

limfc
16-04-12, 12:51
on behalf on yowetan, what are you earning per month and how many hours you put in each week, so i can know your hourly pay (including unpaid OT etc)

aiyo... how can ask like that... my HR said it's confidential and personal information la... :D

i'm quite lowly paid la... :o say already also pai seh... :doh: hee...

roly8
16-04-12, 12:55
on behalf on yowetan, what are you earning per month and how many hours you put in each week, so i can know your hourly pay (including unpaid OT etc)

lol



if it is regional role, should be near the $10k mark or more :D

limfc
16-04-12, 13:20
lol
if it is regional role, should be near the $10k mark or more :D

really? oh my gosh... i'm severly underpaid! :doh:

any evidence / survey / reserach figures that I can see huh? I need to speak with my boss about this... hee... :D

hopeful
16-04-12, 13:22
aiyo... how can ask like that... my HR said it's confidential and personal information la... :D

i'm quite lowly paid la... :o say already also pai seh... :doh: hee...

the thing is, the info is not for me for the Yowetan.

If it is above $7k per month, please ignore the post.
if it is below $7k per month, please highlight the salary so as to make YT feel better.
I maybe wrong, but so far, his family income is the lowest exposed so far in the forum??

anyway, hourly rate is important.
http://www.investopedia.com/articles/financialcareers/09/compensation-myths.asp#axzz1sB5m5zJW

ysyap
16-04-12, 13:26
Like what someone mentioned, 'Its how much one saves and not how much one earns that matters.' :cheers4:

chiaberry
16-04-12, 13:42
really? oh my gosh... i'm severly underpaid! :doh:

any evidence / survey / reserach figures that I can see huh? I need to speak with my boss about this... hee... :D

IMO not worth the lousy work-life balance. Time to get itchy backside again.....:rolleyes:

limfc
16-04-12, 13:49
the thing is, the info is not for me for the Yowetan.

If it is above $7k per month, please ignore the post.
if it is below $7k per month, please highlight the salary so as to make YT feel better.
I maybe wrong, but so far, his family income is the lowest exposed so far in the forum??

anyway, hourly rate is important.
http://www.investopedia.com/articles/financialcareers/09/compensation-myths.asp#axzz1sB5m5zJW

wow, why so personal? i also dunno who's YT and not really bothered about how much he or she earns leh? hee.... :D



Like what someone mentioned, 'Its how much one saves and not how much one earns that matters.' :cheers4:
Eh... true true, last time for a treat, i only eat kopi tiam fish & chips which is about $6 only... nowadays earn more liao, then upgrade to fish&co and the bloody fish & chips cost $20... but hor it's quite nice... hee... :D



IMO not worth the lousy work-life balance. Time to get itchy backside again.....:rolleyes:
oh ya... backside itchy again... but this year job market not that good leh... a lot of uncertainties... :beats-me-man: not easy to find new seat for my itch backside... hee :D

roly8
16-04-12, 14:15
fish & co where got nice?? i find hawker, aston or chargrill are better & cheaper.. :D


yowetan like to compare.... better don't let him see u post your income here :D:D:D

limfc
16-04-12, 15:32
fish & co where got nice?? i find hawker, aston or chargrill are better & cheaper.. :D


yowetan like to compare.... better don't let him see u post your income here :D:D:D

fish&co nice leh... u try the swiss fish & chips before? got melted cheese inside the cunky fish leh... wah... think of it, make me hungry again...:) hahahah....

ehh... i didnt post my income leh? also why must compare? no end to it lar... got ppl make millions every year... also got ppl make less than 20k a year... so how? :beats-me-man:

just be happy lar and if not happy, go look for higher paying job lor... huh? cannot? then go upgrade la then find better job... still cannot? alamak, then must go other country liao, where no need to work also got $$$ la... :D :D :D

irisng
16-04-12, 20:36
Great point raised!

Actually I wanted to touch on this as well. I kinda feel disgusted when my friends are like mummy's boy when they are already at my age! Omg. I know this engineering grad who hates and blame his mum to the core now cause his mum made him study engineering when he wanted something else. His mum is old-fashioned and feels guys should stick to engineering. Now his much younger sis is earning so much more than him in a bank. He barely made enough for a bto after a few years working as an engineer.whereas his sis makes so much she's above income cap for bto.

But moral of the story, time for ur boy to wake up his mind! He's already an undergraduate. If he was studying overseas, all the ang mos will tease him for having u to choose his career for him.

Stop pampering him and let him experience the real world. I'm glad my parents let me be independent. Otherwise I'll never be able to own properties now :)

As a parent, we can only guide him but decision still lies on him. During Sec 4, he said he wanted to go to Poly instead of JC because Poly life is more "lively". I asked him to go and try out the 3 months JC using his Prelim result, if he still didn't like the JC life, then go ahead with Poly after the release of his "O" level result. No point forcing him to study something that he dislikes, it might have a reverse effect.

In fact, he likes computer very much and is very good at it but our lawyer's friend and his teacher advised him not to take up his hobby as a subject (ie computer), it was better to take up something that was difficult to learn from outside to increase his knowledge. In the end he chose Chemical Engineering during his Poly life because he also likes to do different type of experiments. Environmental engineering was his 2nd choice for Uni intake, don't know how the school (NTU/NUS) choose, both school gave him Environmental Engrg course. His result was better than his classmate and yet his classmate could enter into the Chemical Engrg course while he couldn't.

Now he wants to work in computer line also cannot. Even though he knows how to do websites and programming + hardware, also no use, he doesn't have the relevant certificates.

Nowadays find job is so difficult, >100 people applying for the same job fighting for only 1 vacancy:doh:.

Laguna
16-04-12, 21:19
The lessons I can share :

1. As parents, u need to do your part and share with your children, the various professions, career prospect, income etc etc. At the age of Pre-U, 17 or 18? they dun know what they want and what is real life working like. I dun believe to leave the decision entirely to them. At the age of 17/18, they decide on what they like only without reality set in.

2. Preferably, let them talk to those who are working for a few years in the profession your children want to study and have a better understanding of what is going on or going wrong.

3. Paint the timeline longer. From time of graduation till say at the age of 35-40. What most likely they will achieve from the various professions.

I spent a few months doing research and with my children on what to study. It is worth.

DC33_2008
16-04-12, 22:28
Entry to uni is based on not only poly results, but their "O" results too.
As a parent, we can only guide him but decision still lies on him. During Sec 4, he said he wanted to go to Poly instead of JC because Poly life is more "lively". I asked him to go and try out the 3 months JC using his Prelim result, if he still didn't like the JC life, then go ahead with Poly after the release of his "O" level result. No point forcing him to study something that he dislikes, it might have a reverse effect.

In fact, he likes computer very much and is very good at it but our lawyer's friend and his teacher advised him not to take up his hobby as a subject (ie computer), it was better to take up something that was difficult to learn from outside to increase his knowledge. In the end he chose Chemical Engineering during his Poly life because he also likes to do different type of experiments. Environmental engineering was his 2nd choice for Uni intake, don't know how the school (NTU/NUS) choose, both school gave him Environmental Engrg course. His result was better than his classmate and yet his classmate could enter into the Chemical Engrg course while he couldn't.

Now he wants to work in computer line also cannot. Even though he knows how to do websites and programming + hardware, also no use, he doesn't have the relevant certificates.

Nowadays find job is so difficult, >100 people applying for the same job fighting for only 1 vacancy:doh:.

DC33_2008
16-04-12, 22:35
Just an overview on some sectors: Financial sector pays well but also very demanding and can go anytime when time is bad. Oil and Gas sector is second best. IT sector requires hard work but must be with the Bank and not with manufacturing/Engineering company in terms of pay package. Education is not bad as it is quite stable but can be stressful with demanding parents unless in University.
The lessons I can share :

1. As parents, u need to do your part and share with your children, the various professions, career prospect, income etc etc. At the age of Pre-U, 17 or 18? they dun know what they want and what is real life working like. I dun believe to leave the decision entirely to them. At the age of 17/18, they decide on what they like only without reality set in.

2. Preferably, let them talk to those who are working for a few years in the profession your children want to study and have a better understanding of what is going on or going wrong.

3. Paint the timeline longer. From time of graduation till say at the age of 35-40. What most likely they will achieve from the various professions.

I spent a few months doing research and with my children on what to study. It is worth.

carbuncle
16-04-12, 23:13
As a parent, we can only guide him but decision still lies on him. During Sec 4, he said he wanted to go to Poly instead of JC because Poly life is more "lively". I asked him to go and try out the 3 months JC using his Prelim result, if he still didn't like the JC life, then go ahead with Poly after the release of his "O" level result. No point forcing him to study something that he dislikes, it might have a reverse effect.

In fact, he likes computer very much and is very good at it but our lawyer's friend and his teacher advised him not to take up his hobby as a subject (ie computer), it was better to take up something that was difficult to learn from outside to increase his knowledge. In the end he chose Chemical Engineering during his Poly life because he also likes to do different type of experiments. Environmental engineering was his 2nd choice for Uni intake, don't know how the school (NTU/NUS) choose, both school gave him Environmental Engrg course. His result was better than his classmate and yet his classmate could enter into the Chemical Engrg course while he couldn't.

Now he wants to work in computer line also cannot. Even though he knows how to do websites and programming + hardware, also no use, he doesn't have the relevant certificates.

Nowadays find job is so difficult, >100 people applying for the same job fighting for only 1 vacancy:doh:.
Go take part time study for cert la. My degree was part time also.

limfc
17-04-12, 00:27
As a parent, we can only guide him but decision still lies on him. During Sec 4, he said he wanted to go to Poly instead of JC because Poly life is more "lively". I asked him to go and try out the 3 months JC using his Prelim result, if he still didn't like the JC life, then go ahead with Poly after the release of his "O" level result. No point forcing him to study something that he dislikes, it might have a reverse effect.

In fact, he likes computer very much and is very good at it but our lawyer's friend and his teacher advised him not to take up his hobby as a subject (ie computer), it was better to take up something that was difficult to learn from outside to increase his knowledge. In the end he chose Chemical Engineering during his Poly life because he also likes to do different type of experiments. Environmental engineering was his 2nd choice for Uni intake, don't know how the school (NTU/NUS) choose, both school gave him Environmental Engrg course. His result was better than his classmate and yet his classmate could enter into the Chemical Engrg course while he couldn't.

Now he wants to work in computer line also cannot. Even though he knows how to do websites and programming + hardware, also no use, he doesn't have the relevant certificates.

Nowadays find job is so difficult, >100 people applying for the same job fighting for only 1 vacancy:doh:.
aiyo more important to let you son choose la... for my son (still bery young though), i will let him choose whatever he likes...provided he knows what he's getting into... if he doesnt know, well, help him to find out lor... and maybe bring him to visit law firms if he want to be lawyer... bring him to fire station open house if he wants to be fireman... hee... not all can la... but those professions which can look see type, go look see first la... :D :D :D

nowadays, very competitive la... my boss just told me last month to go read the book - the world is flat... haiz... really very chiam... and quite confusing after reading... only thing i enlightened (i think) is not to stick to technical skills, especially for IT, very very commodity liao... quite scary even though I had heard before, now I double / triple confirm... haiz... :scared-3: :confused: :beats-me-man::banghead:

i need to find things that is value adding mainly due to experience and not so easily replaceable by some fresh grad from china or india... they're really very 'hiong' one... very hungry and very smart... very soon, experience based also cannot liao... then i :beats-me-man: liao... hopefully, i can save / invest enough to retire by then... :D :D :D

for my kids, too bad la... they have to learn to compete in a ever more competitive world... i just try my best to prepare them and try to let them see the real competitive world and not shield them from it.... cruel hor? bo bian la... :beats-me-man:

irisng
17-04-12, 08:24
aiyo more important to let you son choose la... for my son (still bery young though), i will let him choose whatever he likes...provided he knows what he's getting into... if he doesnt know, well, help him to find out lor... and maybe bring him to visit law firms if he want to be lawyer... bring him to fire station open house if he wants to be fireman... hee... not all can la... but those professions which can look see type, go look see first la... :D :D :D

nowadays, very competitive la... my boss just told me last month to go read the book - the world is flat... haiz... really very chiam... and quite confusing after reading... only thing i enlightened (i think) is not to stick to technical skills, especially for IT, very very commodity liao... quite scary even though I had heard before, now I double / triple confirm... haiz... :scared-3: :confused: :beats-me-man::banghead:

i need to find things that is value adding mainly due to experience and not so easily replaceable by some fresh grad from china or india... they're really very 'hiong' one... very hungry and very smart... very soon, experience based also cannot liao... then i :beats-me-man: liao... hopefully, i can save / invest enough to retire by then... :D :D :D

for my kids, too bad la... they have to learn to compete in a ever more competitive world... i just try my best to prepare them and try to let them see the real competitive world and not shield them from it.... cruel hor? bo bian la... :beats-me-man:

My son told me that some of the jobs he applied has 400 applicants:doh: but only 1 vacancy, wa so competitive.

irisng
17-04-12, 08:43
The lessons I can share :

1. As parents, u need to do your part and share with your children, the various professions, career prospect, income etc etc. At the age of Pre-U, 17 or 18? they dun know what they want and what is real life working like. I dun believe to leave the decision entirely to them. At the age of 17/18, they decide on what they like only without reality set in.

2. Preferably, let them talk to those who are working for a few years in the profession your children want to study and have a better understanding of what is going on or going wrong.

3. Paint the timeline longer. From time of graduation till say at the age of 35-40. What most likely they will achieve from the various professions.

I spent a few months doing research and with my children on what to study. It is worth.

In fact, we did sit with him to discuss on the courses to take. Most of the courses he chose was something to do laboratory and technology as this is his interest. He chose Bioxxxx as his first choice and followed with other choices, Chemical Engrg was not in his list at first but somehow last min, he changed his 3rd choice to Chemical Engrg and he got it. I still think that interest really matters, if not he would not be able to get into top 5% and had a chance to enter Uni.

The reason why he wanted to choose Pilot and Banker is because for Pilot, he likes to travel and take photographs of nice sceneries while choose banker is because he hopes to use his knowledge of computer technology to help the customers to understand the market condition.

fclim
17-04-12, 09:22
In fact, we did sit with him to discuss on the courses to take. Most of the courses he chose was something to do laboratory and technology as this is his interest. He chose Bioxxxx as his first choice and followed with other choices, Chemical Engrg was not in his list at first but somehow last min, he changed his 3rd choice to Chemical Engrg and he got it. I still think that interest really matters, if not he would not be able to get into top 5% and had a chance to enter Uni.

The reason why he wanted to choose Pilot and Banker is because for Pilot, he likes to travel and take photographs of nice sceneries while choose banker is because he hopes to use his knowledge of computer technology to help the customers to understand the market condition.

Ask him to read this book, "One Career, Many Choices" - newly released.
I have not read it yet. http://selectbooks.com.sg/getTitle.aspx?SBNum=053157

If he does eventually choose an engineering career, then after 5 years of practical experience, apply to be a Professional Engineer (PE). It is very difficult to become a PE nowadays. You need to take 2 examinations and attend a professional interview. It is at least a 2-year process. Out of about 400 who apply each year, only about 50 or so eventually make it. Many fail the examinations and interviews and mind you, these are university graduates to begin with. The average age of current PEs are 50++. So, PEs in the future will be quite limited in supply and should command better fees.

Even if he does not want to be a PE, he could join an engineering firm and aspire to be in top management. Many of the CEOs today are engineering graduates.

ysyap
17-04-12, 09:26
In fact, we did sit with him to discuss on the courses to take. Most of the courses he chose was something to do laboratory and technology as this is his interest. He chose Bioxxxx as his first choice and followed with other choices, Chemical Engrg was not in his list at first but somehow last min, he changed his 3rd choice to Chemical Engrg and he got it. I still think that interest really matters, if not he would not be able to get into top 5% and had a chance to enter Uni.

The reason why he wanted to choose Pilot and Banker is because for Pilot, he likes to travel and take photographs of nice sceneries while choose banker is because he hopes to use his knowledge of computer technology to help the customers to understand the market condition.Why do you write, 'Bioxxx'?

Helping customers under market condition using IT skills is more for IT analyst and financial adviser, not really banker leh..

roly8
17-04-12, 09:52
My son told me that some of the jobs he applied has 400 applicants:doh: but only 1 vacancy, wa so competitive.

it's true..
fight with foreigners too.. ;)

hopeful
17-04-12, 09:55
Iris, ask urself whether children is lazy or not.
if lazy then IT or other disciplines that requires life long learning is a no-no.
Because the pace of technology changes is rapid, requires updating skills every 6 mths.

Instead of choosing careers that I like the most (difficult to rank), I choose careers based on which I dislike the least (easy to rank).
So ask your children, what careers he dont want to do, then by ranking each one, easy to choose. :2cents:

ysyap
17-04-12, 11:55
Iris, ask urself whether children is lazy or not.
if lazy then IT or other disciplines that requires life long learning is a no-no.
Because the pace of technology changes is rapid, requires updating skills every 6 mths.

Instead of choosing careers that I like the most (difficult to rank), I choose careers based on which I dislike the least (easy to rank).
So ask your children, what careers he dont want to do, then by ranking each one, easy to choose. :2cents:Neat perspective to ranking... :cheers1:

howgozit
17-04-12, 20:27
Check out this article....

http://www.divaasia.com/media_photo/16560#photoDisplayDiv

I guess if you are happy, it doesn't matter what job you are doing.... I love their great smiles

irisng
18-04-12, 08:23
Why do you write, 'Bioxxx'?

Helping customers under market condition using IT skills is more for IT analyst and financial adviser, not really banker leh..

Because I can't really remember the exact name of the courses that he chose for Bio. I think it was Biomedical & Biomolecular Engrg.

I think what he means is to be a banker (investment dept), he will have the opportunity to plot up graphs to help customers with investment.

irisng
18-04-12, 08:34
Iris, ask urself whether children is lazy or not.
if lazy then IT or other disciplines that requires life long learning is a no-no.
Because the pace of technology changes is rapid, requires updating skills every 6 mths.

Instead of choosing careers that I like the most (difficult to rank), I choose careers based on which I dislike the least (easy to rank).
So ask your children, what careers he dont want to do, then by ranking each one, easy to choose. :2cents:

In fact, his computer knowledge comes from his self-learning. He already knows how to do the websites when he was 13 yrs old (Sec 1) without us knowing until he did the website for my brother's company.

He likes Chemical Engrg but unfortunately he was given a 2nd choice as an Environment Engrg which he doesn't really like it especially after his attachment. It is difficult for him to get into the govt job as his result is not so good, average only. I think govt jobs need a 1st/2nd class honour degree right?

irisng
18-04-12, 08:37
Check out this article....

http://www.divaasia.com/media_photo/16560#photoDisplayDiv

I guess if you are happy, it doesn't matter what job you are doing.... I love their great smiles

It is actually the interest that counts, not everybody share the same sentiment. If everybody are like them, then the world will be "PEACE NO WAR".

carbuncle
18-04-12, 12:35
Because I can't really remember the exact name of the courses that he chose for Bio. I think it was Biomedical & Biomolecular Engrg.

I think what he means is to be a banker (investment dept), he will have the opportunity to plot up graphs to help customers with investment.

He seems to be getting into very detail type of tasks he likes...At his age maybe hetter to keep his options open and try different things.

irisng
18-04-12, 23:01
Thank you so much everybody for your valuable advise and suggestions, really appreciate it.:)

richwang
21-04-12, 16:40
In Australia, technicians are in such a short supply. They demand good pay.
In Singapore, we are lucky to have ITE.

Will there be a day when bankers, lawyers and GPs are over supplied?

Thanks,
Richard

howgozit
23-04-12, 01:14
In Australia, technicians are in such a short supply. They demand good pay.
In Singapore, we are lucky to have ITE.

Will there be a day when bankers, lawyers and GPs are over supplied?

Thanks,
Richard

It is unlikely that doctors will ever be in an oversupply situation. This is bcoz the supply is controlled by university admissions. Dentistry admissions are even more controlled. The result is that these professions are in constant short supply requiring foreign talent to fill the deficit.

Admissions into the Law faculty is also controlled. But the difference is that it is much cheaper to study Law overseas than it is Medicine or Dentistry. So the supply situation is not as bad. However it is still quite expensive and takes a long time including pupilage. Previously Singapore allowed only LLBs with 2nd uppers honours and above to practise locally (this requirement has been rescinded since).

So it is quite an onerous task to be a doctor, dentist or lawyer in Singapore.

Banking is not a specialised proffession. Bankers do not require specific financial training. Engineers or mathematicians can be bankers and a business or economics degree is not essential. The industry is self regulating and people who don't become bankers would otherwise be something else that could be totally unrelated.

richwang
23-04-12, 22:55
Try some next generation "design" jobs. 3D printing is on its way.
Let's hope Singapore labour force stays ahead of the curve and be well prepared for it.
Otherwise we will again need to get FTs.
SUTD will be a value university to go. Never mind it's new.
When SMU was newly opened, the cut off points was lower than NUS.
But now SMU law graduates make more money than NUS law graduates.
SUTD will be the next star to beat NUS Science/Engineering.

Thanks,
Richard