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Spent sometime in analsying KL property market and sharing my findings here.
1. developers start to brand their projects with names like Ritz, Bayan Tree etc and commanding a good premium.
2. developers offer the following
option 1 : cash rebate - thus lower the down payment quantum
option 2 : discount
option 3 : interest absorption scheme
All these move the projects reasonably well as upfront load is lighter especially the cash rebate
3. bank loan LTV has reduced to 85% max, or even 70%
4. most buyers are hoping for capital gain, after project TOP, ie after 3 years of debarment period (ie cannot sell within 3 years)
5. very very high number of completed units looking for tenants...I cannot quantify the numbers, just counted a few project in Mont Kiara, Golden triangle..the number is frightening.
6. very high number of newly completed units, and many many sub sales units, some projects run onto 1000 units for sales and there will be many serivce apartments as well into thousands.
7. top end projects in KLCC less than 5 years are very much lower than the new launches.
8. financing cost is around 4.25%pa
9. Huge supply of land for the larger KL
Conclusion :
1. so call paper profit or capital gain is unlikely can be materialised
2. strong holding power needed, including loan servicing
3. huge oversupply in the sub sale market and rental market, good supply in the primary market
4. traffic condition is getting worst
5. KL is not a financial hub, govt has shifted out alr
so dun touch KL even it looks "affordable"
how about landed property ?
thanks for the good info, can i add.
CP tax 5% for less than 5 yrs ppty.
26% rental income tax, after deduct expenses.
i lost appetite.....heehee
Spent sometime in analsying KL property market and sharing my findings here.
1. developers start to brand their projects with names like Ritz, Bayan Tree etc and commanding a good premium.
2. developers offer the following
option 1 : cash rebate - thus lower the down payment quantum
option 2 : discount
option 3 : interest absorption scheme
All these move the projects reasonably well as upfront load is lighter especially the cash rebate
3. bank loan LTV has reduced to 85% max, or even 70%
4. most buyers are hoping for capital gain, after project TOP, ie after 3 years of debarment period (ie cannot sell within 3 years)
5. very very high number of completed units looking for tenants...I cannot quantify the numbers, just counted a few project in Mont Kiara, Golden triangle..the number is frightening.
6. very high number of newly completed units, and many many sub sales units, some projects run onto 1000 units for sales and there will be many serivce apartments as well into thousands.
7. top end projects in KLCC less than 5 years are very much lower than the new launches.
8. financing cost is around 4.25%pa
9. Huge supply of land for the larger KL
Conclusion :
1. so call paper profit or capital gain is unlikely can be materialised
2. strong holding power needed, including loan servicing
3. huge oversupply in the sub sale market and rental market, good supply in the primary market
4. traffic condition is getting worst
5. KL is not a financial hub, govt has shifted out alr
so dun touch KL even it looks "affordable"
I am a K.L guy,kind of agreed with u as the number of expatriats is not big enough to cater for the hugh supply of units.Moreover, infrastucture and amenities are not properly planned to enhance value of properties.
thanks for the good info, can i add.
CP tax 5% for less than 5 yrs ppty.
26% rental income tax, after deduct expenses.
i lost appetite.....heehee
26% rental income tax??... what is the incentive to invest?
I am a K.L guy,kind of agreed with u as the number of expatriats is not big enough to cater for the hugh supply of units.Moreover, infrastucture and amenities are not properly planned to enhance value of properties.
10 years ago... when I went to KL, I was really impressed with the vibrancy, nightlife and energy...
Then I didnt have the opportunities to go to KL for about 10 years...
Recently i just happen to go there...
The place have changed so much with so many malls ans luxury condos...
But the traffic and infrastucture have gotten so bad...
When I was there 10 yrs ago, i was worried that KL will catch up with Singapore as SIN was a dead place and KL was happening...
After this trip, my conclusion is that SIn had run so far ahead of our South East Asian neighbours that we are at least 15-20 years ahead in terms of infrastucture, talent, easy place to do business...
Our gahmen keep asking us to keep running faster and faster...
Keep telling us others will catch up.... but I seriously think that these last ten years we actually widen the gap between us and our ASEAN neighbours...
Ikind of agreed with u as the number of expatriats is not big enough to cater for the hugh supply of units.Moreover, infrastucture and amenities are not properly planned to enhance value of properties.
Does the same applies to Iskandar investment pty too?
Anyone got any input on iskandar? Where is a good place to invest for detach housing?
Regulators
03-02-12, 15:26
I personally think iskandar is just there to foster closer ties with our neighbors, difficult for that place to be run with the same level of efficiency as singapore coz that is after not on singapore soil. For investment, those outlying towns of kl seem the best bet, some might think klcc is better, but with the prices going for klcc properties, hard to justify those asking rents there and hard to get tenants. Supply is definitely higher than real demand in kl and malaysia generally. For condos there is also maintenance issues and when things go wrong, how is anyone going to get things done. The kopi money culture still very strong in malaysia so you can report to the authorities till the cows come home and nothing gets done. Just be careful if you are bent on investing in malaysian properties. should focus on new town developments like shah alam where capital appreciation potential is high.
thanks for the good info, can i add.
CP tax 5% for less than 5 yrs ppty.
26% rental income tax, after deduct expenses.
i lost appetite.....heehee
Need to clarify on this
1. capital gain tax is 10% if sold within first year, and 5% 2nd-5th year
2. for property under construction, no sale is allowed within 3 years from date of S&P.
how about landed property ?
I tried but failed to conclude in a meaningful way as I dun know KL that well. It is more difficult to analyse landed as compare to condo.
But for sure, the yield is extremely bad.
I would like to refer to this report, page 5, fig 5
http://www.malaysiapropertyinc.com/pdf/Property%20Quotient%20-%20MPI%20Monthly%20Report%20July%202011.pdf
I personally, feel the number of unsold unit in KL is under-stated.
I have done the work on Iskandar, will share later.
If ur interested in Malaysia property, can read their monthly newsletter
26% rental income tax??... what is the incentive to invest?
i can only think of one, price of a resale 3 rm hdb can get u nice unit in KL & hope for big capital appreciation. After Interest, tax, FX not much meat left. Buy for holiday home i think still ok bah.
So several yrs back, msians were the top foreign buyers in Spore not winout a reason. :p
Does the same applies to Iskandar investment pty too?
Anyone got any input on iskandar? Where is a good place to invest for detach housing?
Good points :
1. u can buy land at M$45 psf (Leisure Farm) to build ur dream house, double volume living / dinning rooms, 10 high ceiling bedrooms, pool etc
2. lower cost of living, and under MM2H, cheap car as well
3. lower cost of medical care.
As investor, I will not bet on this, reasons :
1. huge supply, Iskandar, 3 time the size of Singapore
2. ability to deliver, execute and sustain is yet to be proven
3. who will buy there? Singaporean? buy to stay or buy to retire and live in? what is the number we are talking here to fill the supply there
There are some other more sensitive issues, not to mention here.
I mentioned in one of the threads earlier on Iskandar, I will keep on eye on its development, perhaps 5 years time and then reassess.
I personally think iskandar is just there to foster closer ties with our neighbors, difficult for that place to be run with the same level of efficiency as singapore coz that is after not on singapore soil. For investment, those outlying towns of kl seem the best bet, some might think klcc is better, but with the prices going for klcc properties, hard to justify those asking rents there and hard to get tenants. Supply is definitely higher than real demand in kl and malaysia generally. For condos there is also maintenance issues and when things go wrong, how is anyone going to get things done. The kopi money culture still very strong in malaysia so you can report to the authorities till the cows come home and nothing gets done. Just be careful if you are bent on investing in malaysian properties. should focus on new town developments like shah
alam where capital appreciation potential is high.
I would say Subang Jaya is a better bet.Its chinese area,better amenities and infrastructure,and its run by a better municipal council.
buttercarp
03-02-12, 19:53
In 2008 wanted to buy a condo in KL.
Consulted a Malaysian friend who is in the building and construction industry who said that there will be a glut of private condos, so I did not go ahead with it..... Lucky, otherwise i would likely be stuck with it.
[quote=buttercarp]In 2008 wanted to buy a condo in KL.
Consulted a Malaysian friend who is in the building and construction industry who said that there will be a glut of private condos, so I did not go ahead with it..... Lucky, otherwise i would likely be stuck with it.[/
Actually,if you have bought into kl properties in 2008 especially the landed
one in prime location you would have made tons of monies. The rental yield is much better than in Singapore,besides capital gain.
[quote=buttercarp]In 2008 wanted to buy a condo in KL.
Consulted a Malaysian friend who is in the building and construction industry who said that there will be a glut of private condos, so I did not go ahead with it..... Lucky, otherwise i would likely be stuck with it.[/
Actually,if you have bought into kl properties in 2008 especially the landed
one in prime location you would have made tons of monies. The rental yield is much better than in Singapore,besides capital gain.
But if you would have done the same in 2008, close one eye buy any condo u point in SG u also earn to the max and and not to mention the extra money u get when u convert into ringgits. Talking about landed in SG, no need prime in SG in 2008, the gain is even more insane. Rental yield how much you talking about? >10%?
[quote=buttercarp]In 2008 wanted to buy a condo in KL.
Consulted a Malaysian friend who is in the building and construction industry who said that there will be a glut of private condos, so I did not go ahead with it..... Lucky, otherwise i would likely be stuck with it.[/
Actually,if you have bought into kl properties in 2008 especially the landed
one in prime location you would have made tons of monies. The rental yield is much better than in Singapore,besides capital gain.
Correct. KL properties, similar to Spore's, have already shot up so much in the last couple of years. Penang properties as well.
The next big move (1-2yrs) should be Nusajaya in Iskandar.
:47:
Good point, just like Stock Bull Market, buy anything also UP Up away ;)
Malaysia & Singapore, if we going to buy, sure choose Singapore, but maybe spent $1m at Malaysia for Chalet usage. anyone know of any project got sea view, 30 story high, and near to the MRT/Shopping Mall?
never touch Malaysia market before, so no idea...
[QUOTE=supermax]
But if you would have done the same in 2008, close one eye buy any condo u point in SG u also earn to the max and and not to mention the extra money u get when u convert into ringgits. Talking about landed in SG, no need prime in SG in 2008, the gain is even more insane. Rental yield how much you talking about? >10%?
ikan bilis
04-02-12, 07:59
Good point, just like Stock Bull Market, buy anything also UP Up away ;)
Malaysia & Singapore, if we going to buy, sure choose Singapore, but maybe spent $1m at Malaysia for Chalet usage. anyone know of any project got sea view, 30 story high, and near to the MRT/Shopping Mall?
never touch Malaysia market before, so no idea... .
umm.... sea view and near mrt ??...
i think even in sgp also quite hard to find sea view & near mrt... may be skyline, theSail, Marina bay suites/residences....
:D
[quote=supermax]
But if you would have done the same in 2008, close one eye buy any condo u point in SG u also earn to the max and and not to mention the extra money u get when u convert into ringgits. Talking about landed in SG, no need prime in SG in 2008, the gain is even more insane. Rental yield how much you talking about? >10%?
Easily more than 10% if you are innovative enough.My Singapore friends bought student houses at less than RM400k,designed it and rent out more than RM4000 per month.Now houses he bought transacted at twice the value.
[quote=TMATT]Good point, just like Stock Bull Market, buy anything also UP Up away ;)
Malaysia & Singapore, if we going to buy, sure choose Singapore, but maybe spent $1m at Malaysia for Chalet usage. anyone know of any project got sea view, 30 story high, and near to the MRT/Shopping Mall?
never touch Malaysia market before, so no idea...
In Malaysia,Reputation of the Developer come first when u want to buy property.A lot of incomplete projects still takes place at prime location in KL.A lot of Singaporeas get caught with Resort homes bought from pariah developers during the 1990s.
I have read in other forum on Malaysia projects and properties. It seems attractive and luring.
I am unsure how reliable is the development there, and what are the pros and cons. But, I am pretty convinced that there are indeed hordes of Singaporean moving across the causeway for the homes over there.
Now, is it really feasible and worthwhile to get a roof over there? Is there any "true" prospect for/from Iskandar project or is it just a overhype project touted by the political leader(s) between two countries to entice investors of all land to inject and fuse money into the area for whatever reason?
One immediate concern I have is the security. If all foreigners gathered in Iskandar area, wouldn't that implying the area is subjected to plouging when things (situational/politically) go wrong?
http://www.sammyboy.com/forumdisplay.php?17-A-Singaporean-s-guide-to-Living-In-JB
Basically, most of the information on Iskandar properties can be found here. Indeed, due to affordability issues, many Singaporeans have moved across the Causeway.
My personal take is that it's more suitable for home stay than investment. But to each his own.....:D
ikan bilis
04-02-12, 09:16
I have read in other forum on Malaysia projects and properties. It seems attractive and luring.
I am unsure how reliable is the development there, and what are the pros and cons. But, I am pretty convinced that there are indeed hordes of Singaporean moving across the causeway for the homes over there.
Now, is it really feasible and worthwhile to get a roof over there? Is there any "true" prospect for/from Iskandar project or is it just a overhype project touted by the political leader(s) between two countries to entice investors of all land to inject and fuse money into the area for whatever reason?
One immediate concern I have is the security. If all foreigners gathered in Iskandar area, wouldn't that implying the area is subjected to plouging when things (situational/politically) go wrong?
think must in-out at very correct time... cyberjaya (mahathir's pet project) got a lot of infrastruture built but now like all wasted... cyberjaya like mostly hosting call centres and data processing centres now.... :beats-me-man:
(google satellite image here, but photos could be a few years behind)
http://maps.google.com/?ll=2.928597,101.674347&spn=0.022158,0.038581&t=h&z=15
http://www.sammyboy.com/forumdisplay.php?17-A-Singaporean-s-guide-to-Living-In-JB
Basically, most of the information on Iskandar properties can be found here. Indeed, due to affordability issues, many Singaporeans have moved across the Causeway.
My personal take is that it's more suitable for home stay than investment. But to each his own.....:D
Thats exactly what I am thinking too. If you own a few properties in Singapore you will have the option of renting them out and live in lskandar for retirement.
think must in-out at very correct time... cyberjaya (mahathir's pet project) got a lot of infrastruture built but now like all wasted... cyberjaya like mostly hosting call centres and data processing centres now.... :beats-me-man:
(google satellite image here, but photos could be a few years behind)
http://maps.google.com/?ll=2.928597,101.674347&spn=0.022158,0.038581&t=h&z=15
This is exact reason why I am skeptical towards Malaysia's government policy and development plan.
Every change in their political scene will motivate and demotivate projects across the country. Despite re-assurance(s) from two governments across the causeway, I am still suspicious and skeptism over Iskandar project development.
Having said that, many Singaporean who bought Horizon hills, leisure farms etc will still stand to gain should their primary agenda/objective is to self-stay and/or retirement purpose. Else, the place has zero to minimum upside potential. I could be wrong in my analysis.
[quote=TMATT]Good point, just like Stock Bull Market, buy anything also UP Up away ;)
Malaysia & Singapore, if we going to buy, sure choose Singapore, but maybe spent $1m at Malaysia for Chalet usage. anyone know of any project got sea view, 30 story high, and near to the MRT/Shopping Mall?
never touch Malaysia market before, so no idea...
You can consider Danga Bay or Puteri Harbor in JB... fits your requirements except MRT not expected till 2018/20.
:47:
Maybe in 10 years time, most Singaporean will stay in JB and rent out their pty in Singapore to FT.......:)
[quote=TMATT]Good point, just like Stock Bull Market, buy anything also UP Up away ;)
Malaysia & Singapore, if we going to buy, sure choose Singapore, but maybe spent $1m at Malaysia for Chalet usage. anyone know of any project got sea view, 30 story high, and near to the MRT/Shopping Mall?
never touch Malaysia market before, so no idea...
You can consider Danga Bay or Puteri Harbor in JB... fits your requirements except MRT not expected till 2018/20.
:47:
Is the seaview in Puteri Harbor good and the water condition is prime?
I just read straitstimes and saw the advertisment on a development at Puetri Harbor priced at 290K min.
Is the harbor going to be like Punggol Marina; stale and boring?
Good points :
1. u can buy land at M$45 psf (Leisure Farm) to build ur dream house, double volume living / dinning rooms, 10 high ceiling bedrooms, pool etc
2. lower cost of living, and under MM2H, cheap car as well
3. lower cost of medical care.
As investor, I will not bet on this, reasons :
1. huge supply, Iskandar, 3 time the size of Singapore
2. ability to deliver, execute and sustain is yet to be proven
3. who will buy there? Singaporean? buy to stay or buy to retire and live in? what is the number we are talking here to fill the supply there
There are some other more sensitive issues, not to mention here.
I mentioned in one of the threads earlier on Iskandar, I will keep on eye on its development, perhaps 5 years time and then reassess.
What about those project along the coastal area?
This is exact reason why I am skeptical towards Malaysia's government policy and development plan.
Every change in their political scene will motivate and demotivate projects across the country. Despite re-assurance(s) from two governments across the causeway, I am still suspicious and skeptism over Iskandar project development.
Having said that, many Singaporean who bought Horizon hills, leisure farms etc will still stand to gain should their primary agenda/objective is to self-stay and/or retirement purpose. Else, the place has zero to minimum upside potential. I could be wrong in my analysis.
Paralysis through over-analysis.
There is no such thing as a risk-free investment or sure-make project.
If got such lobangs, please holler.
Caveat emptor.
:47:
[quote=TKT]
Is the seaview in Puteri Harbor good and the water condition is prime?
I just read straitstimes and saw the advertisment on a development at Puetri Harbor priced at 290K min.
Is the harbor going to be like Punggol Marina; stale and boring?
If I tell you YES, will you drive into JB to have a look for yourself?
You should find time to do so and find out for yourself - its less than 30mins drive from either checkpoints.
Talking about Punggol... look at Punggol today!!! :doh:
:47:
[quote=yowetan]
If I tell you YES, will you drive into JB to have a look for yourself?
You should find time to do so and find out for yourself - its less than 30mins drive from either checkpoints.
Talking about Punggol... look at Punggol today!!! :doh:
:47:
I don't have a car. I may able to drop by the presentation showcase in Orchard Grand Hotel today though.
ikan bilis
04-02-12, 09:46
Maybe in 10 years time, most Singaporean will stay in JB and rent out their pty in Singapore to FT.......:)
umm....
m'sian come to sgp and work, rent hdb/condo, build the country/economy here....
sgporeans rent out hdb/condo, collectng rent and stay in jb everyday shake legs shiok shiok....
like that hor... this country will last for how long ??...
if that situation comes... i will not rent out my hdb/condo,... will sell off all my properties and move to elsewhere... this place going to die soon... :doh:
think must in-out at very correct time... cyberjaya (mahathir's pet project) got a lot of infrastruture built but now like all wasted... cyberjaya like mostly hosting call centres and data processing centres now.... :beats-me-man:
(google satellite image here, but photos could be a few years behind)
http://maps.google.com/?ll=2.928597,101.674347&spn=0.022158,0.038581&t=h&z=15
Big difference is ... Nusajaya is right next to Singapore, the petrol is S$ Dollars and the foreign investments, bolstered by economic and population growth in Singapore.
Cyberjaya, an interesting concept at that time, was unlikely to succeed as it was federal govt-driven whereas Nusajaya is primarily private-sector driven (hopefully they have learnt some good lessons there!).
Besides, Klang Valley simply does not have the same economic vitality, growth and puchasing powers as Singapore.
Nusajaya is unabashedly aimed at Singapore and the prospects of foreign money, so wither Singapore, wither Nusajaya... I put my money on Singapore, ergo...
:47:
[quote=TKT]
I don't have a car. I may able to drop by the presentation showcase in Orchard Grand Hotel today though.
Many apparently commute daily between JB and Spore by public transport, so it is definitely do-able and not an issue for many... but personally, I wouldn't do it without a car, it is definitely tougher for sure.
Do your homework.
Hope you find something that suits you!
Good luck!
:47:
Thats exactly what I am thinking too. If you own a few properties in Singapore you will have the option of renting them out and live in lskandar for retirement.
Shake legs and collect rent sounds shiok......But the practical difficulty for younger Singaporeans who are not ready for retirement, is how to maintain their Iskandar home. This is esp so if they do not have relatives across the causeway.
My advice is to look beyond the overhyped and overpriced projects like Puteri Harbour. Because their govt is notorious for poor execution, buy those in mature towns near checkpoints (ie their Toa Payohs). These properties have the added potential of increase in valuation as Iskandar develops stronger ties with Singapore over time.
PM Lee said yesterday about the stagnation of the Japanese Economy as a result of their hostility to immigrants. He said such a stance is a choice that "we in Singapore cannot afford to make. Like it or not, unless we have more babies, we need to accept immigrants." --> Future of properties in Singapore will grow. :) QUOTE=ikan bilis]umm....
m'sian come to sgp and work, rent hdb/condo, build the country/economy here....
sgporeans rent out hdb/condo, collectng rent and stay in jb everyday shake legs shiok shiok....
like that hor... this country will last for how long ??...
if that situation comes... i will not rent out my hdb/condo,... will sell off all my properties and move to elsewhere... this place going to die soon... :doh:[/QUOTE]
ikan bilis
04-02-12, 11:11
PM Lee said yesterday about the stagnation of the Japanese Economy as a result of their hostility to immigrants. He said such a stance is a choice that "we in Singapore cannot afford to make. Like it or not, unless we have more babies, we need to accept immigrants." --> Future of properties in Singapore will grow. :)
Ooooiiii,... hello!!... bro....
i'm not complaining about FT intake...
i'm complaining about locals don't want to work, wanna collect rent and shake legs... :doh:
i will move out of this place if locals are not productive to real economy and everything rely on ft...
In a global world, we should not just rely on locals only. Just like a football team in the super league, we can the best player to win the game. Locals can leverage on FTs to do their work at different levels.
Ooooiiii,... hello!!... bro....
i'm not complaining about FT intake...
i'm complaining about locals don't want to work, wanna collect rent and shake legs... :doh:
i will move out of this place if locals are not productive to real economy and everything rely on ft...
After Malaysia, which cities shall I look into?
I still prefer HK.
HK air quality is getting from bad to worst. Better stay away from there.
After Malaysia, which cities shall I look into?
I still prefer HK.
HK air quality is getting from bad to worst. Better stay away from there.
There is no dispute on this. A number of expats refuse to go HK due its air quality and difficulties in getting into international schools. (min HK$1m donation).
If u notice the new launches in HK, u will notice the sizes of new built is, mostly real MM units hardly any in < 1000 sq ft. This is an affordability issue.
As such, if ur looking into HK, move into luxury market of > 1000 sq ft, with good harbour view. The supply is getting limited. LTv is 50% for >HK$12m property
After Malaysia, which cities shall I look into?
I still prefer HK.
Being Chinese, and having worked and lived there, for my ideal "retirement" - I'll choose to be in China... either Hangzhou, Chengdu, Suzhou, Tianjin, etc... ie one of the 2nd tier big cities.
My interests are more for cultural immersion, enjoying the food, visiting all the historical sites, doing some charity, setting small self-sustaining bizs, etc.
So maybe a few months China, a few months Spore, something like that - ideally spring/summer/early autumn in China, autumn/winter in the tropics.
Still working on it.
:47:
Being Chinese, and having worked and lived there, for my ideal "retirement" - I'll choose to be in China... either Hangzhou, Chengdu, Suzhou, Tianjin, etc... ie one of the 2nd tier big cities.
My interests are more for cultural immersion, enjoying the food, visiting all the historical sites, doing some charity, setting small self-sustaining bizs, etc.
So maybe a few months China, a few months Spore, something like that - ideally spring/summer/early autumn in China, autumn/winter in the tropics.
Still working on it.
:47:
you having worked there, what are your thoughts of the probable risk of contamination in the food and water you take there? I would consider that place as it has everything but there's this inherent fear that you don't know what some unscrupulous businessman might do.
I agree with TKT... China is of course a better choice than Malaysia..
Malaysia... the rules are too flexibile.. Remember Clob.,,, the U turns .. the sand.. the water... I berry scare when there are ever changing goal posts..:doh:
you having worked there, what are your thoughts of the probable risk of contamination in the food and water you take there? I would consider that place as it has everything but there's this inherent fear that you don't know what some unscrupulous businessman might do.
There are so many restaurants and varieties to choose from, so food never was an issue.
Normally I choose restaurants that are crowded with locals or recommended by friends or through internet reviews.
The cuisines and choices available are simply amazing - just open your minds.
Drinks are a bit different for me, as I only drink bottled water, not even tea or coffee, so can't comment much.
You cannot expect Singapore hygiene standards all the time la... but to me, the standards in China are perfectly acceptable.
:47:
I agree with TKT... China is of course a better choice than Malaysia..
Malaysia... the rules are too flexibile.. Remember Clob.,,, the U turns .. the sand.. the water... I berry scare when there are ever changing goal posts..:doh:
Sorry mate, I don't quite agree.
Personally I think Malaysia is a more stable country and rule of Law is generally more developed and easier to understand for us.
China is still developing and you'll need to have a lot more wits and a fair dose of luck, to do biz there.
I chose China, not over Malaysia ... but as the next choice, after Malaysia.
To me, when "retire", it will be Singapore/Malaysia combination as One.
China is the second home away from home, for me - for the reasons I had stated earlier.
Just my :2cents:
Between Malaysia FH and China 70 LH, it is an easy choice.
My friends from China had bought Horizon Hills 2 years ago. They project will soon TOP. They plan to move over and stay there. Driving to work (in the West) will soon be their daily living. They have a mini society there.
Thanks,
Richard
PS. I have started to watch TV1, I don't understand Malay language, but you can see the small icon with sign language.
nvr image to retire in China
all shopping malls are either completely emptied, no shops, or super crowded.
nvr like to use their public toilets
dun know what I will be eating as well
China is definitely not a place to retire.... too populated, lack of control and lack of safeguards.... food safety a big problems...
Even my Chinese friends avoid eating cause he is worried what he is eating
What about us buying land in Malaysia? Any restrictions and what to look out for?
I'm thinking if it's possible to buy land and develop it into commercial/residential properties for sale. Im thinking of trying out this new business. Anyone with insights, opinion or experience to share?
Between Malaysia FH and China 70 LH, it is an easy choice.
My friends from China had bought Horizon Hills 2 years ago. They project will soon TOP. They plan to move over and stay there. Driving to work (in the West) will soon be their daily living. They have a mini society there.
Thanks,
Richard
PS. I have started to watch TV1, I don't understand Malay language, but you can see the small icon with sign language.
HH is an excellent choice - I already have one unit there too and it may well be my retirement home many years from now.
Looking to add at least 1 more unit, maybe 2, when time is right.
There are still alot of supply coming in years to come, so there is no rush.
If becomes too expensive in future, doesnt really matter, as already have 1 unit and I only need 1 roof.
However, I wont live in JB and work in Spore though, commuting daily.
Its not a good way to live - but to each, his own.
Enjoy your time in Nusajaya JB, cheers!
:47:
nvr image to retire in China
all shopping malls are either completely emptied, no shops, or super crowded.
nvr like to use their public toilets
dun know what I will be eating as well
It is a vast country and you need to appreciate the range of experiences that you will never find in Singapore.
It is certainly not for everyone.
:47:
China is definitely not a place to retire.... too populated, lack of control and lack of safeguards.... food safety a big problems...
Even my Chinese friends avoid eating cause he is worried what he is eating
Retirement, when one is not so mobile and weaker, is certainly much better in Singapore - fully agreed and thats the plan too, for me.
However, if one could retire (or semi-retire) early and still vigorous, then you should explore what's out there outside of Singapore - and for me, that would be China. Yours could be somewhere else.
Dont worry too much, live life a little more salty, we all have to go someday.
:47:
What about us buying land in Malaysia? Any restrictions and what to look out for?
I'm thinking if it's possible to buy land and develop it into commercial/residential properties for sale. Im thinking of trying out this new business. Anyone with insights, opinion or experience to share?
If you have a lot of money to spare, there are always lots of opportunities in Malaysian property development and lots more people waiting to serve you. :D
Commercial larger-scale, you probably need influential local partners to smooth the way with local authorities.
Small-scale projects, like building half a dozen semi-Ds in a large piece of land or turn a couple of shoplots into boutique hotels, etc... all these are possible and quite easily do-able, as long as you have money to burn.
In the end, its still about location, location, location... and connections.
:47:
After Malaysia, which cities shall I look into?
I still prefer HK.
Penang is a good choice but overpriced at the moment.
With DAP, u get free internet and much safer environment.
Singaporeans can adjust to the island living with nice beachfront condos and excellent food, not to mentioned the mandarin/hokkien speaking community...
for Iskandar, the East Ledang houses are a good deal at the moment with a 15min drive to CIQ.
Penang is a good choice but overpriced at the moment.
With DAP, u get free internet and much safer environment.
Singaporeans can adjust to the island living with nice beachfront condos and excellent food, not to mentioned the mandarin/hokkien speaking community...
for Iskandar, the East Ledang houses are a good deal at the moment with a 15min drive to CIQ.
What abt Topez Residence? next to danga bay.. heard sales is brisk. Featured in the recent Msia property talk held over the weekend
Anyone gone down to the Iskandar exhibition at Marriot by HSR? Is it worth going?
anythingwhatever
08-08-17, 23:31
Retirement, when one is not so mobile and weaker, is certainly much better in Singapore - fully agreed and thats the plan too, for me.
However, if one could retire (or semi-retire) early and still vigorous, then you should explore what's out there outside of Singapore - and for me, that would be China. Yours could be somewhere else.
Dont worry too much, live life a little more salty, we all have to go someday.
:47:
To many, basically just wanted to retire safely...
Imagine being old and not so strong, yet getting robbed and injured.
Singapore still best, unless want to go some other safer countries in the West/North (though weather and culture will be big issues).
Anyone gone down to the Iskandar exhibition at Marriot by HSR? Is it worth going?
If really need to go North for retirement, RF Princess Cove one MRT stop from Singapore, not Iskandar 3x the size of Singapore.
Anyone interested can pm me, we go over by public transport visit show flat and then eat curry fish head at Wong Ah Fook Road.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1550098645261142/
https://scontent-sin6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/20545527_10155072532022408_1937805303159838390_o.jpg?oh=de0dabe4ffe948c2619e270f707f62e6&oe=59F95E60
https://www.misstamchiak.com/kam-long-curry-fish-head-jb/
https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8759/17634115070_a2c39435a9_b.jpg
Then go pack some bakery.
https://www.misstamchiak.com/hiap-joo-bakery-johor/
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5452/18014673036_2bce088673_b.jpg
tonymontana
09-08-17, 09:58
If really need to go North for retirement, RF Princess Cove one MRT stop from Singapore, not Iskandar 3x the size of Singapore.
Anyone interested can pm me, we go over by public transport visit show flat and then eat curry fish head at Wong Ah Fook Road.
]
please don't ask people buy condo in JB. massive oversupply, lousy rental, lousy location.
RF Princess cove is NOT NEAR the proposed MRT stop.
any goodu considering "alternate investment" or cheap condo just next to singapore - you have been warned here, ah.
please don't ask people buy condo in JB. massive oversupply, lousy rental, lousy location.
RF Princess cove is NOT NEAR the proposed MRT stop.
any goodu considering "alternate investment" or cheap condo just next to Singapore - you have been warned here, ah.
True, TOP end of the year for phase 1.
I was also warned about Southbank Condo near Geylang, near Golden Mile, near HDB, near the Main road.
I hope I am wrong about RF Princess Cove because I have not got a unit yet. Once I sell one of my condo sure get at least one there.
A lot of people like to stay at home to look for the property when you ask them their reply is they have not visited the place.
Can I ask how many have you visited the North?
Please don't tell me about hear say here, hear say there.
Mr LKY once filed affadavit in court saying something like Malaysia and Johor is a crime-infested place.
So, many people don't need to go there also believe, just like they all believe in him which is why he could lead Singapore from 3rd World to 1st World.
Why now you questioning LKY's statement? :scared-3:
True, TOP end of the year for phase 1.
I was also warned about Southbank Condo near Geylang, near Golden Mile, near HDB, near the Main road.
I hope I am wrong about RF Princess Cove because I have not got a unit yet. Once I sell one of my condo sure get at least one there.
A lot of people like to stay at home to look for the property when you ask them their reply is they have not visited the place.
Can I ask how many have you visited the North?
Please don't tell me about hear say here, hear say there.
Whenever everybody fear of jb properties, season investor may give a 2nd look. Buffet wisdom not applicable here issit...
new2mondrian
09-08-17, 19:32
Don't bother with buying condos in Malaysia. Freehold landed plots are within the same price point as the condos right now. If die die want to buy, look for well located FH landed that are located near amenities. Look at where the local Johoreans are buying, and not at where the China Chinese and Singaporeans are buying.
Iskandar may be big, but the supply of its ideally located landed plots is fast dwindling. Do more legwork to locate the gems, rather than to rely on the aggressively marketed developments by agents on Sgp's shores.
There is a saying that there is smart contrarian and there is also contrarian for the sake of being contrarian (the second kind always do stupid thing blindly without knowing what they are doing, just that they think they are doing different from almost everybody else means they are "contrarian" and so they dream that they deserve to be "rewarded" for doing so)........... :heart-borken:
Whenever everybody fear of jb properties, season investor may give a 2nd look. Buffet wisdom not applicable here issit...
tonymontana
09-08-17, 20:02
There is a saying that there is smart contrarian and there is also contrarian for the sake of being contrarian (the second kind always do stupid thing blindly without knowing what they are doing, just that they think they are doing different from almost everybody else means they are "contrarian" and so they dream that they deserve to be "rewarded" for doing so)........... :heart-borken:
Buffet says "buy undervalued things".
somethings may be CHEAP COMPARE TO SINGAPORE, but it is not necessarily UNDERVALUED.
there is a difference.
Don't bother with buying condos in Malaysia. Freehold landed plots are within the same price point as the condos right now. If die die want to buy, look for well located FH landed that are located near amenities. Look at where the local Johoreans are buying, and not at where the China Chinese and Singaporeans are buying.
Iskandar may be big, but the supply of its ideally located landed plots is fast dwindling. Do more legwork to locate the gems, rather than to rely on the aggressively marketed developments by agents on Sgp's shores.
Agree that it is better to buy freehold landed and where johoreans r buying. That is what I did in 2013, bought a freehold semiD in Austin Heights where there r plenty of amenities. IKEA Tebrau is the latest development near my place. I hope to semiretire there soon some day but hubby want kids to study in Sg so maybe can only retire there. But it is a good back up plan if ever we r forced to retire early ie retrenched or cannot work due to illness etc, we can still survive by moving there.
Currently, place is rented out though yield is Low, I don't really mind as I just need someone to take care of the property for us.
Mr LKY once filed affadavit in court saying something like Malaysia and Johor is a crime-infested place.
So, many people don't need to go there also believe, just like they all believe in him which is why he could lead Singapore from 3rd World to 1st World.
Why now you questioning LKY's statement? :scared-3:
Do you know what Temasek is getting up North?
I also like landed, FH, Big house, big garden but when you reach the final 10 years all the big does not matter anymore.
Do you know what will you be having when you are the house in the nursing home? I know because I see what my father have for his final 5 years at the nursing home.
I pray I will die sleeping and not wake up the next morning than to live for 5 years my father have.
I am very fortunate to see what my father have and I try not to have what he have.
Temasek? You mean Temasek leads LKY and we should follow Temasek and not LKY?????????? :heart-borken:
Anyway, Temasek is developer up North, so what is the problem?
Just like I said that if you are the developer, anytime you can also bid land price high and high and sell the properties (flip just based on paper sale) even higher!
So developers whether in Singapore or Malaysia no different!
But property buyers are STUPID to buy from the developer at that kind of price or that kind of location (like now OCR private properties at that kind of THOUSAND YEARS historical PEAK price or buy properties in Malaysia that is heavy crime-infested (according to LKY))! :devilish:
Do you know what Temasek is getting up North?
I also like landed, FH, Big house, big garden but when you reach the final 10 years all the big does not matter anymore.
Do you know what will you be having when you are the house in the nursing home? I know because I see what my father have for his final 5 years at the nursing home.
I pray I will die sleeping and not wake up the next morning than to live for 5 years my father have.
I am very fortunate to see what my father have and I try not to have what he have.
Temasek? You mean Temasek leads LKY and we should follow Temasek and not LKY?????????? :heart-borken:
Anyway, Temasek is developer up North, so what is the problem?
Just like I said that if you are the developer, anytime you can also bid land price high and high and sell the properties (flip just based on paper sale) even higher!
So developers whether in Singapore or Malaysia no different!
But property buyers are STUPID to buy from the developer at that kind of price or that kind of location (like now OCR private properties at that kind of THOUSAND YEARS historical PEAK price or buy properties in Malaysia that is heavy crime-infested (according to LKY))! :devilish:
So you don't know right. Case closed.
How to close the case when you have not even answer my question:
For you, Do you follow LKY advice or do you follow Temasek (and disregard LKY)? Which is of higher precedence to you? :hopelessness:
So you don't know right. Case closed.
How to close the case when you have not even answer my question:
For you, Do you follow LKY advice or do you follow Temasek (and disregard LKY)? Which is of higher precedence to you? :hopelessness:
LKY history, Temasek current. You should go out more often to feel what is going on up North. Until you know what Temasek is doing up North let close this topic.
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